Berbatov | Fulham player

Yes Berbatov was clearly off when he didnt see much football last season. But he had more than enough time and chances before that. As for being a star player I think thats the key to it all. When you sign a player for £30 million you are saying that he is a star player. When you make someone your record ever signing you are saying that he is a star player. And this is exactly why its no coincidence that we sign a genuinely top quality player, a striker for £24 million at the same time as we sell Berbatov. He was in that slot as a star player. So I dont think anyone could suggest that Sir Alex didnt hold him in that high regard. He even compared him to Cantona.

But the systems we could play with Berbatov up front were much more limited due to his own limitations as a player. Thats why our forwards didnt rotate anymore and why we're able to use 3 strikers effectively now with one of them picked in a wide role. Rooney or Welbeck can be picked out there and not face 90 minutes of being on the touchline because RVP can pull left and they can go through the middle and vice versa. Berbatov just doesnt have the speed of movement and versatility to take over the left side for a phase of play with someone else taking his role in the middle.

If Berbatov is your best player like at Fulham or Spurs, the last thing you're thinking about is whether he has the speed and versatility to play a role on the left side while your left winger becomes the striker in a phase of football. Because you just need him in the box scoring some goals.
 
Ekeke said:
Yeah but he was here more than a season. And regardless of how many times he started next to Hernandez and Welbeck, and there were a fair few of those games, he was also training at United for what 4 years. You'd think if he had a good partnership with Hernandez or Welbeck the manager might have spotted it. As he's shown this season he's not against using Rooney in another role, which was a nice myth a while ago as for why Berbatov couldnt be playing in the team with Rooney.
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How many times could he have started with Welbeck?
He was frozen out last year, Welbeck was on loan at Sunderland the year before.
Berbatov brings the best out of midfield runners. We never had them or used him that way.
 
nice to see him doing so well. a class player. noticed he is talking and communicating much more on the pitch with his fulham teammates than when he was with united.
 
Still think he should've been a midfielder. Not one of the shit shovelling variety screening the back four and tidying up, but just someone amazing to base a team around in the centre of the park. There was a game during pre-season (I think) whereby he played that role, and it's one of the few times in recent years I've seen a performance from a United player that was so good it was like it was being played in a completely different dimension to everyone else. It was one of sheer perfection and brilliance whereby he was so much better than the other players to the extent it seemed that anything outside his level of quality couldn't affect him.

Granted that I can't remember who it was against and that it was probably a typically shite pre-season fixture, but it was just hilarious how good he was and it shows the talent is there. When he's in the mood and he's getting on the ball a lot (pulling off crazy flicks and passes), it's a wonderful thing to watch - complete artistry. I just don't think he's got the drive and mentality to be the best like others have. That's what the best players have that he doesn't I'm guessing: drives that overpower fears and doubts.
 
Spoony Kobayashi said:
Some players make the step up...others never look like United players. Look at RVP, he was born to be a United player, he's taken everything in his stride, whereas other players..perhap no less talented look like rabbits caught in headlights, or something...Berba, Veron et al fit into that category. Well, thankfully it's worked out for all parties concerned, we've bought a truly top class striker, and Berba has found a level where he's showcasing his obvious talent. Big fish, small pond syndrome.
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This...
 
KingEric7 said:
Still think he should've been a midfielder. Not one of the shit shovelling variety screening the back four and tidying up, but just someone amazing to base a team around in the centre of the park. There was a game during pre-season (I think) whereby he played that role, and it's one of the few times in recent years I've seen a performance from a United player that was so good it was like it was being played in a completely different dimension to everyone else. It was one of sheer perfection and brilliance whereby he was so much better than the other players to the extent it seemed that anything outside his level of quality couldn't affect him.

Granted that I can't remember who it was against and that it was probably a typically shite pre-season fixture, but it was just hilarious how good he was and it shows the talent is there. When he's in the mood and he's getting on the ball a lot (pulling off crazy flicks and passes), it's a wonderful thing to watch - complete artistry. I just don't think he's got the drive and mentality to be the best like others have. That's what the best players have that he doesn't I'm guessing: drives that overpower fears and doubts.
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The problem is that during his time here, we built the team around Rooney when we should have built it around Berbatov.
 
elmo said:
The problem is that during his time here, we built the team around Rooney when we should have built it around Berbatov.
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A player that when off form is not worth having on the pitch will never have a team built around him at United. Rooney even though he can still have long periods of being shit, puts a shift in regardless. Doesn't just stand there and throw a strop when things don't go his way.
 
fecks sake

The guy couldn't handle the pressure at United, it was freaking obvious. Did manage to use him properly against all the lesser teams at home but then against the big teams SAF did some formation voodoo?

There is no pressure at Fulham, he is free to flourish, let him be.
 
Did Wenger really said that he didn't knew Berbatov wasn't on the transfer list by United?
:lol:
 
mariachi-19 said:
A player that when off form is not worth having on the pitch will never have a team built around him at United. Rooney even though he can still have long periods of being shit, puts a shift in regardless. Doesn't just stand there and throw a strop when things don't go his way.
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Hellboy said:
That's one of the weirdest thing I read here.
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Berbatov has always played his best when given the freedom to do what he wants on the pitch and focused on creating chances or getting into scoring positions.

Rooney puts in a shift no matter whether where we play him and that's the great thing about him, he's probably the best sidekick in the world when he's only asked to either create goals or score them. It's when we want him to be both our main scoring outlet and creative force at the same time is when he so often struggles.
 
KM said:
Did Wenger really said that he didn't knew Berbatov wasn't on the transfer list by United?
:lol:
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Yes, the guy interviewing him put him on the spot. Wenger thought about it for a moment and said he never realised he was available. Which is obviously BS.

To think he could have gotten him easy enough as part of the RVP deal, should really annoy arse fans.
 
Rooney has been subbed off and dropped recently by Sir Alex in this season. He doesn't get treated differently that much. Also he's a superior player to Berbatov. Those who watched them play here for three years should recognize that fact.

I'm happy that he's playing well for Fulham and I do think he's good enough to be in Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs and Chelsea(better than Torres IMO) first XI. But let's not talk bollocks.
 
KM said:
Rooney has been subbed off and dropped recently by Sir Alex in this season. He doesn't get treated differently that much. Also he's a superior player to Berbatov. Those who watched them play here for three years should recognize that fact.

I'm happy that he's playing well for Fulham and I do think he's good enough to be in Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs and Chelsea(better than Torres IMO) first XI. But let's not talk bollocks.
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Rooney has been dropped a few times in his career.
 
Watching Berba on MOTD was fecking beautiful...

That 2nd goal for Fulham... where did he find that turn of pace? and what a cross...

Jimy_Hills_Chin said:
fecks sake

The guy couldn't handle the pressure at United, it was freaking obvious. Did manage to use him properly against all the lesser teams at home but then against the big teams SAF did some formation voodoo?

There is no pressure at Fulham, he is free to flourish, let him be.
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I don't think that's fair at all... it's not like he was shit for us (and at times, he was a class apart)... and he scored a lot of goals, including several important ones.
 
SAF thought Berba could do the job Hughes used to. Collect in a forward position, hold it and distribute it. It didn't work, primarily because, Berba doesn't get around the same as Hughes did. (If only he'd used him instead of Hernandez against Barca, who knows....)

Saf would never build a team around him, as he was too old for the long-term plan, and as said already, Rooney is the one to build a team around.
It didn't work. Get over it. He didn't fit, doesn't make him any worse than the player we bought.
 
I don't get why Wenger was so pressed about why he didn't sign Berbatov. Yes he's obviously a good player, and happened to score two against Arsenal yesterday, but the striker Wenger chose to sign also scored two goals. It wasn't like Wenger didn't bother sign Berba and then proceeded to not sign any striker to fill the void left by RVP, or infact it's not like the striker he signed is shite. Giroud is a younger, talented striker who helped to carry Montpellier to the Ligue 1 title ahead of money-whores PSG. He's taking his time adapting to a new league but has shown recently he's got the capabilities to lead the front line (despite what Piers Morgan says).

That being said, Wenger's response was horrendous. Of course he knew about Berba being transfer listed. We'd been trying to flog him for 12 months. He should have just told the truth - that they went for a younger striker who could last at the top level for a longer period of time and who also happened to score 2 goals on the day, and really didn't get enough credit for it.
 
Wenger really did a drop a clanger not getting Berbatov, passing up a striker of that quality so cheap when you were selling Van Persie to the club that owns him...
 
Never know, you may well have got him too (provided he was happy with that). I didn't foresee Hernandez putting performances like the one yesterday during the summer, that's for sure. Genuinely thought he'd really suffer and that it'd be Welbeck keeping pace with Rooney and Van Persie. I can't believe how lethal he is - he's been better than he was in his first season.
 
KingEric7 said:
Never know, you may well have got him too (provided he was happy with that). I didn't foresee Hernandez putting performances like the one yesterday during the summer, that's for sure. Genuinely thought he'd really suffer and that it'd be Welbeck keeping pace with Rooney and Van Persie. I can't believe how lethal he is - he's been better than he was in his first season.
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Much as I hate to admit it, I absolutely love Hernandez. Incredible movement, lethal finishing, and yes, he's a bit limited in some areas, but when he's on form, he's just ridiculously hard to deal with. And he's a nice bloke which makes a change from some of United's other forwards. I really thought when RVP left we'd make some kind of attempt, or at least some team would try and get him, but no-one did.
 
CentreForward said:
Unless you are not English, you'd never be able to see how Rooney gets treated differently by SAF, to put it mildly
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Oh feck off, the team has never been built around Rooney.

He plays where the manager wants him to, and does a good job of it too. That's why he's such an important player, and possibly a reason why Fergie fought to keep him, when he may have let other players go.
 
KingEric7 said:
Wenger really did a drop a clanger not getting Berbatov, passing up a striker of that quality so cheap when you were selling Van Persie to the club that owns him...
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Well we could have got Sneijder out of the Ronaldo deal. Berbatov didnt really fit Arsenal's policy and Giroud is starting to come good now.
 
elmo said:
The problem is that during his time here, we built the team around Rooney when we should have built it around Berbatov.
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I remember making the point when that stuff was said in his time here... With the players we had, how would the team change to "build it around Berbatov" ?

Pretty much the same players and tactics from Berbatov's first couple of seasons at the club would have been selected

Are you saying we needed to go out and spend another £30 million on players to make our record signing work? And drop some of our best players? Or what?
 
Berbatov would probably have done the same thing if we'd signed him...blown hot and cold and infuriated everybody. He's a class act but not what we really need. I agree with Al that Hernandez would have been better...we signed the wrong one in Vela.
 
I always thought Berbatov was a bit overwhelmed by playing in our team amongst other top class players, and was more comfortable being the big fish in the small pond. I don't think it's any co-incidence that his best form for us came whilst Rooney was out of the team dicking about with his contract. He was the main man. There's obviously nothing certain about this, it's just an impression.

I think he would've been similarly class at Arsenal had you signed him.
 
Just skipped through the thread pages from around summer. feck me, Revan really was clueless about Berbs back then. Also VoetbalWizard with his 'If we sell him, it's our first trophy' classic. Should we make a trophy parade?
 
KingEric7 said:
I always thought Berbatov was a bit overwhelmed by playing in our team amongst other top class players, and was more comfortable being the big fish in the small pond. I don't think it's any co-incidence that his best form for us came whilst Rooney was out of the team dicking about with his contract. He was the main man. There's obviously nothing certain about this, it's just an impression.

I think he would've been similarly class at Arsenal had you signed him.
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Nah, they got Giroud:drool:

Seriously, I think he would fit in well at Arsenal, but I can also understand Grinner's concerns (consistency).

EDIT: On the other hand he would have been their best and main attacking player (bar Cazorla) so I'd say it would have worked.
 
Do you not think Wenger would be against signing an older striker who moans at players around him? Kacaniclic(sp?) seems to be the new Nani and target of his mouthing. Not really sure thats for the best of Arsenal's young players.

As for Hernandez I can see why he would have been a popular replacement for RVP. Completely different to the kinds of forwards Wenger brings in though. He's either gone with the technical players or the more physical ones such as Adebayor, Bendtner or Giroud. I guess Eduardo and Podolski would be closest to Hernandez
 
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