Anderson

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Maciek said:
Excuses.
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And yet you're not willing to add anything of depth to the conversation.
Sure he's not match fit at all, and has had plenty of injuries.
But, and this is a major point. He's made leaps and bounds compared to last season. I think he finds it hard to get match fit. He's a professional player who should be putting in 100% effort. He's pushed for 70 mins on average, tiring himself out, and some argue he's unfit , I personally believe he's doing more running than most on the team. Its only natural that he's going to get tired and probably needs to pace himself better.

He's an immense player,and I'm hoping this time around ( this is his chance this season and he's taken it with every bit of strength in my opinion), he paces himself well so he gets to match fitness well, without injuring himself in the process. I'm not going to come out and say I know whats going on and why he's injured, but he's definately able to contribute consistently if he gets to full match fitness. This next while is an important time for him , where he will need game time, yet he has to pace himself too, and not wreck himself on the pitch. This is a gradual process that must happen at a good quick rate, but also not to the point where he becomes tired at the 70th minute.

ie more games and training but he has to learn to pace himself on the pitch in the second half - he and Rafael are always the first to arrive at training according to SAF, so its not like he doesn't enjoy training. This is my take on the situation anyway. Feel free to disagree.
 
Crackers said:
And yet you're not willing to add anything of depth to the conversation.
Sure he's not match fit at all, and has had plenty of injuries.
But, and this is a major point. He's made leaps and bounds compared to last season. I think he finds it hard to get match fit. He's a professional player who should be putting in 100% effort. He's pushed for 70 mins on average, tiring himself out, and some argue he's unfit , I personally believe he's doing more running than most on the team. Its only natural that he's going to get tired and probably needs to pace himself better.

He's an immense player,and I'm hoping this time around ( this is his chance this season and he's taken it with every bit of strength in my opinion), he paces himself well so he gets to match fitness well, without injuring himself in the process. I'm not going to come out and say I know whats going on and why he's injured, but he's definately able to contribute consistently if he gets to full match fitness. This next while is an important time for him , where he will need game time, yet he has to pace himself too, and not wreck himself on the pitch. This is a gradual process that must happen at a good quick rate, but also not to the point where he becomes tired at the 70th minute.

ie more games and training but he has to learn to pace himself on the pitch in the second half - he and Rafael are always the first to arrive at training according to SAF, so its not like he doesn't enjoy training. This is my take on the situation anyway. Feel free to disagree.
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Nah, I agree!

Good post, mate! I think his fitness problem is vastly overrated; as many of you have stated, he runs at a fairly high pace for a majority of the time he is on the pitch, which must be more tiring than running at leisurely pace for 90 minutes - damn my English sucks today, but you get the point.

Good night:nervous:
 
Rossa said:
Nah, I agree!

Good post, mate! I think his fitness problem is vastly overrated; as many of you have stated, he runs at a fairly high pace for a majority of the time he is on the pitch, which must be more tiring than running at leisurely pace for 90 minutes - damn my English sucks today, but you get the point.

Good night:nervous:
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Finally.
Everyone here seems to be taking pot shots at each other and disagreeing with each other.
Can't we drop the arguments till after Christmas?
 
Surely if he was so unprofessional he wouldn't get himself fit enough, he wouldn't have survived at United for so long.
 
Even saying he does more work so it does t matter if he's tired towards the end is silly. Should we get a CM who's amazing for 10 mins wins all the balls but then needs to lye down for the other 80 minutes? No , that'd make him a shit CM.

A CM should play for 90 minutes. Considering the majority thinks he only plays well the odd game when not injured anyway (except his last couple spells) cements the point.

He needs to sort his stamina/fitness out.
 
steeeb said:
Even saying he does more work so it does t matter if he's tired towards the end is silly. Should we get a CM who's amazing for 10 mins wins all the balls but then needs to lye down for the other 80 minutes? No , that'd make him a shit CM.

A CM should play for 90 minutes. Considering the majority thinks he only plays well the odd game when not injured anyway (except his last couple spells) cements the point.

He needs to sort his stamina/fitness out.
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Exactly
 
Do you lads not understand what substitutions are for? For when we need to change play OR replace someone with fresh legs... what's the point in Scholes/Giggs then? They can't manage 90 minutes. They can barely manage 45.
 
One Night Only said:
Do you lads not understand what substitutions are for? For when we need to change play OR replace someone with fresh legs... what's the point in Scholes/Giggs then? They can't manage 90 minutes. They can barely manage 45.
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Yup.
But in fairness a CM his age should be able to play a full game.
He's not capable of it at the moment as I think he pushes too hard.
He needs to learn to control himself, so he can increase the pace naturally as he gets fitter through the season. I think he's been eager to prove himself this season and while that has been good, it has been detrimental to his fitness. He got fit quickly and then overstepped the boundary between pushing it to the limit and wrecking himself.

He needs a consistent match time at a good steady rate, like he has been doing,but with less pace during the matches to start off with.
 
lem8sh said:
Anderson, at 24 years of age cannot play 90 minutes of football. Its sad.
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Didn't he play 90 this season at some point? I know loads of young lads who can't actually play football at all but manage to start games. Andy Carroll for example.
 
Cold_Boy said:
Its a trend to criticize Anderson over his lack of stamina
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It's one of many myths that ghost around that fans just love to bring up for years eventhough the opposite has been proved ages ago.

The ONLY myth I really believe in is that Valencia doesnt have a left leg :D
 
Crackers said:
Finally.
Everyone here seems to be taking pot shots at each other and disagreeing with each other.
Can't we drop the arguments till after Christmas?
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Indeed. To make things clear, are you thinking Christmas as a whole, or are you talking about Christmas Day, or after Christmas Eve? Christmas is just so confusing. :D
 
Escobar said:
It's one of many myths that ghost around that fans just love to bring up for years eventhough the opposite has been proved ages ago.

The ONLY myth I really believe in is that Valencia doesnt have a left leg :D
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That is just completely inaccurate; he stands on his left leg, he runs with it and maybe crosses his legs with it? Do you think when he entered this world he came out screaming and kicking his right leg? :D
 
Rossa said:
That is just completely inaccurate; he stands on his left leg, he runs with it and maybe crosses his legs with it? Do you think when he entered this world he came out screaming and kicking his right leg? :D
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I need to see more evidence :D
 
His fitness issues are overstated by a lot of people, but he's definitely got some problems with playing CM for 90 minutes. If he's going to be fecked after 75 minutes, then he needs to reign it in a little bit and try and control the pace of the game with possession. If he can't learn to do that he's not going to make a quality, consistent CM anytime soon, but he does have plenty off assets we can use.
 
He's played 90 mins plenty of times. It's obvious he struggles with fatigue from about 70mins onward though.
 
#Carl said:
He's played 90 mins plenty of times.
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Aye, eight per season.

2007/08 - 9/38 (23%)
2008/09 - 13/38 (34%)
2009/10 - 9/23 (39%)
2010/11 - 8/30 (27%)
2011/12 - 6/16 (37%)
2012/13 - 3/14 (21%)

48 out of his 159 appearances for us: 30%.

Even if you only look at the games he started (48/115): 41.7%.
 
I'm always right said:
Obviously you only look at the games he started :lol:
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We should look at the games in which he played 90 minutes. Then he would have 100% of his 90-minute performances and we could say he's really our Iniesta, or Xavi, or whoever.

41.7% or 30% - doesn't matter. Both numbers are terribly low.
 
Maciek said:
Hehe, so funny.

Instead of admitting he's fat and unfit, laugh at Maciek, hehe.
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Kagawa regularly gets subbed out around 60-70 minutes mark. Same with Yaya Toure who runs out of gas by that time.

These guys are runners and spend a lot of time sprinting in the game and hardly play the percentage pass possession game. Even when Anderson is trying to keep possession you can always see him sprinting around playing one-two. You'll never see him dallying with the ball like Carrick or Scholes.

It's only natural for him to run out of gas but doesn't necessarily mean he is fat or unfit. I'll be very surprised if someone with that style of play can actually be not knackered by around 70-80 minutes.
 
I'll put it like this.

I'd rather have Anderson doing his thing for 70-80 minutes and then get subbed off than going with someone who won't put in as much effort and play for 90 minutes.
 
Maciek said:
Hehe, so funny.

Instead of admitting he's fat and unfit, laugh at Maciek, hehe.
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He's not fat though. There's a difference between being fat and being unfit / having fatigue issues.
 
Stating the obvious to everyone here, if a footballer breaks down at 70 minutes, he's unable to make a meaningful contribution in the last 20 minutes, which at least for United are usually the most important minutes of a football match.

He'll either have to pull in his horns somewhat for the first 70 minutes to extend his playing range or gain the fitness required of any central midfielder, in my estimation the most demanding position on the pitch. Perhaps both, but certainly the latter has to be on the table.

Keane could play a full 90, as could Vieira, Gattuso and Dunga. Wilshere too, as far as I can tell. If Ando wants to realize his potential as a United and maybe even Brasil man, he needs to deal with his conditioning.




Speaking of Dunga and Anderson, I found this interesting nugget on the web:

The latest star with the world at his feet
cbfnews.uol.com.br - June 17, 2007

Porto Alegre's Anderson Luis de Abreu Oliveira will be a more important player to Brazil than Kaka and Ronaldinho, national coach Dunga has stated.

The 19-year old, who recently signed for Manchester United for $35 million, has a combination of all of Brazil's great players as his attributes.

"He has Socrate's flair, Rivaldo's eye for goal and Ronaldinho's skill," said Dunga. "With a front three of Kaka, Anderson and Ronaldinho, no team can live with us. Who will be the best? I'd say Anderson. The other two are at their peak now but Anderson is only 19 and already their equal."

http://www.utdforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33921
 
Maciek said:
Even if you only look at the games he started (48/115): 41.7%.
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So in just under half the games that he starts he completes the full 90. Not bad at all.

What that doesn't say though is how badly his performance tails off in those last 10-20mins though.
 
Rossa said:
Indeed. To make things clear, are you thinking Christmas as a whole, or are you talking about Christmas Day, or after Christmas Eve? Christmas is just so confusing. :D
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I'm talking up to at least new years eve...
We can get back to our petty ways after then...

Seeing Ruud10's post really makes me disheartened for him, how he's falled so short of his potential, but also gives me hope as it just adds to the list of reasons why he's got the talent needed. We've said it time and time again, "this is his last chance" , for me it is. I feel this is his last chance to go out and do something brilliant.
I can't help but not like him.
 
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