I think that Bale and Benzema will be out for a couple of weeks, Modric about 5 or 6. Today Marca wrote that Modric is being treated for Rafa Nadal doctor, specialist in growth hormons and quick recoveries. The objective is 3 weeks .Against Bayern or Barcelona will be very difficult, I am quite pessimistic despite winning today. If Silva and Illarra have barely played then there is no sense that they play a match of this category but with Ramos as a patch in the midfield we are not winning this.
Champions League - Quarter Finals
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
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I think Atletico will not return to anonymity, at least while is Simeone. They are being able to keep the best players or at least not to sell all of them the same year and with Simeone´s requirements they will maintain the competitive level. It will be important to have luck with purchases as in recent years.
Screw Simeone's thugs and anti football tactics, they can all do one. Patetico got what they deserved.
Chicharito got what he deserved too,he worked his balls off tonight. Hero!
Chicharito got what he deserved too,he worked his balls off tonight. Hero!
I used the Atlético, Dortmund and Juventus example to make a point about at least doing well in Europe rather than consistency. I was trying to make the point that City and Arsenal haven't even done which is the first step before they can aspire to any consistency. But I acknowledge that might have been phrased well or that it was out of context in this discussion.
I think you are contradicting with yourself there in the second paragraph. You say that you agree that spending is not the only facor and you go on to talk about those clubs prove that it is all you need so I don't know which is that you believe in. For me, as I said before, spending is an absolute necessity. You can have the odd good season or two but without spending decent money, you won't get anywhere. However, Barcelona and Bayern have done more than spend, they have a strong system in place built through years of coaching technically and tactically. They have a clear structure of where the club is going and their vision for its future. English clubs do not do that, tactically they are mediocre in comparison, they keep operating with this mentality that it is a straight formula, black and white. Buy the best players and you are magically going to find yourself with the elite. In a world where a lot of teams spend, it is small margins that make the difference and Barcelona and Bayern currently possess those small margins to make the difference for them. The rest try to make themselves feel better and put it down to simply being outspent.
That is basically Real's plan over the years.
And what is the result? Since the start of this new project when they bought Ronaldo, look at their record domestically and yes they won in Europe last year but their overall is good while never being brilliant. And before that, they couldn't get past the last 16. I had this very discussion with a Real fan on this board where we talked about the reason Real Madrid could not create a true dominant team like Barcelona or Bayern partly because of this lack of structure and planning from the management side. They function like a richer PL club which means they have a top team but not a true force in terms of dominance like ours between 2007 and 2009, Barcelona's later on and Bayern's now.
I haven't contradicted myself at all, I agree with you that spending is not the only factor,judging from their performances this season I also believe that Real,Barca and Bayern Munich are only thriving because they have papered their cracks with their business in the transfer window, they have quality players in every position - some obviously better than others but quality players nonetheless, the EPL teams as I have mentioned have spent poorly which has left them a level below Barca,Bayern and Real. Real Madrid have been crawling their way through the different stages of the CL, Bayern have produced questionable performances in some games and dominant ones in others they are definitely not the dominant force they were 2 seasons ago, Barcelona have been superb but with a front three of an in form Suarez, a vibrant Neymar and the greatest ever (my opinion) who wouldn't be? Barcelona's defence is still very fragile, they are good but far from dominant....what is my point ? Signing quality players in every position can go a long way in covering your flaws and making you look better than you actually are - A successful transfer window from Chelsea,United and Arsenal (one where they all spend on the areas they are currently lacking and I mean signing quality players ) could see those teams challenge those 3 giants next season - bold statement... I know, but I'm ready to stand by this statement if they complete the aforementioned task.
If this season is anything to go by, the so called dominant teams are only using one factor to win matches.
I agree.
They have been to the semi finals of the CL every season since Ronaldo's second season at the club.
United 06-09
Barca under pep
Bayern under Heycknes
These are teams that used all the factors to dominate, these teams didn't just rely on their quality players, they combined a lot of factors.
These days a solid transfer window or 2 is enough to get you the results you need.
Barca under pep
Bayern under Heycknes
These are teams that used all the factors to dominate, these teams didn't just rely on their quality players, they combined a lot of factors.
These days a solid transfer window or 2 is enough to get you the results you need.
I am sorry but that is an oversimplification. If an English club bought Mathieu, Rakitic and Vermaelen, every pundit in the country will be on about how "they wouldn't get into the very top sides". The Bayern side that won the CL in 2013 had one big money signing, the rest were all bought for under 20 millions. The Chelsea side that won the CL the year before had a significantly more expensive squad. What happened next? Chelsea spent even more in the following two summers than Bayern and yet we have one still dominating in Europe and the other losing to 10 men. I just think it's rich to complain about being outspent when you have these facts. Chelsea are not alone in this as you can say the same about City, ourselves and to a lesser extent Arsenal. Even Liverpool spent over 100 millions last summer and where are they now?
If you don't mean the size of spending but rather the quality, you may then have a point but that is for me impossible to measure. When you have a strong structure in place a clear tactical vision, it is easier for players to fit in. When you have a chaotic system expecting players to elevate you, well you will be more hit and miss. But I won't get into that as I think it cannot be quantified. To sum it up, I think the argument that our teams are not doing well because they don't spend enough is ridiculous considering we have 4 of at least the top 10 spenders in world football. If that wasn't your argument, well apologies then.
The result since the "galactico" system began has been two European Cups and much more international fame. Now players want to come here, for the requirement, glamour, or because some idol ten years ago also played with this shirt. The club priority is to work in the legend, that is the obsession of the president, ie: now Madrid has 10 and Milan still 7.
After all that's what matters to Madrid, to be a step above the rest, besides to keep the best players in a team is fun.
Financially speaking sign stars is the only solution. You can argue what competition is better but it is clear that the Premier League sells better internationally and generates a lot of money while Madrid needs to keep 50%adverts of players in every contract.The club is in a bubble, is necessary to increase revenue each year to keep those spending levels.The goal is to open the Asian market/Northamerica as South America is already assured. That´s why now they are playing at noon and probably one of the reasons to sign Bale
You won't get a single argument from me with any of this. Real Madrid have made it clear long ago that their aim is the glamour, fame and prestige. As you put it, the president is obsessed with working with legends. According to his standards, that has worked relatively well as the brand has grown significantly over those years and they have 10 CL titles which for the club is the most important trophy. So for the specific needs of Perez and the image he has for the club, what he is doing is pretty much the only way to do it. However, I am talking about creating a true dominant force, a team that win 3 titles in a row or a treble or something like that, something that makes it stand out. I believe in that sense, Real Madrid cannot be considered in the same category as ourselves between 2007 and 09, Barcelona or Bayern later on. Real did not even win a league and CL double for ages! I don't think you can be a truly elite team if you fail to do that which is the minimum.
Well if winning 1 domestic title and reaching the semi final of the CL every year with one win over the next 6 years. I am all for the Real model then.
Champions League is the most important competition. I agree that the stats in Liga are not brilliant from 2000 when Figo came, 5 liga titles, but I don´t think that are so bad either, considering that the team played against the best Barça ever.
My argument isn't about the teams not spending enough, it's about them buying the wrong players or not buying players for the necessary positions, take Arsenal for example, they are a really good team but they never seem to buy quality players to solve their defensive problems, we are 3/4 signings away from mounting a real challenge for the title and in Europe, Liverpool did feck all with 200m in the last 4 windows, they have still managed to play well this season albeit showcasing a too little too late push for the top 4, now imagine if they actually bought the right players for a change, Chelsea finished 3rd and as a result signed Costa and Fabregas - problem solved - champions, now they will be looking to add to their squad to challenge in Europe. Father Time has caught up with city so they might struggle after changing their whole squad, they should have done that last summer instead of signing the wrong players from Porto for ridiculous amounts.
The EPL teams have spent a lot of money on a lot of players but 75% of the money spent has not been recouped on the pitch, which is something I am hoping can change this summer, safe to say we should have built our team around Mata last summer.
In that sense I have a little envy. Despite the team won European Cups against Valencia and Leverkusen the truth is that the team was not dominant in league. Maybe a bit of patience is needed. Now it seems that with Asensio, Peeters, Odegaard, Silva,etc, the club is trying to bet on future promises. In any case I think I don´t value the national trophy as much as you.
It is most definitely not bad. But if my team breaks the world record 5 or 6 times in that period assembling the most expensive side ever, I don't expect not bad. I expect a team that rivals the best of all times, a true dominant force. That is why I feel the level of success is highly disproportionate with the investment. But like said in the other post, for what Perez intended, it is totally justified.
I hope that Pérez know what is doing. He has already created a generation of spoilt fans. This summer I don´t expect nothing less than David, Pogba and Reus/Lewandowski
That makes more sense to me even though I wouldn't put it in the black and white manner you are. We tend to have a cliché definitions of what a team needs and blame it on that when it doesn't materialize. For example, everybody said Barcelona need a tough center back and a replacement for Xavi who is getting on. They got Mathieu, Vermaelen and Rakitic. If an English team did that, we would be talking about how they're not aiming high enough and are not buying established quality. Compare that to Chelsea's business after they won the CL and they should be doing much better according to that logic. You mention Chelsea this year but are they the reference really? Sure they will win the league but they are not even close to the level we should be aiming for and that is again despite spending lavishly and wisely. So whereas spending money is gonna make you a top team, I don't think it's enough to make an elite team.
Haha spoiled indeed. You mentioned you don't care about the domestic title as much but is that a feeling you think is shared among most Real fans or are Perez's strategies rubbing people the wrong way?I hope that Pérez know what is doing. He has already created a generation of spoilt fans. This summer I don´t expect nothing less than David, Pogba and Reus/Lewandowski
I hope that Pérez know what is doing. He has already created a generation of spoilt fans. This summer I don´t expect nothing less than David, Pogba and Reus/Lewandowski
Perez has made the club a signing club not a winning club, how are the fans so spoilt when they don't even average a trophy a season ? Or is it just about the names at the back of the jersey?
Tonight's games were at least more of contest than last nights, with PSG, bar Verratti, looking like they'd given up before they even kicked off, and the Bayern buzz saw shredding Porto, although in the latter it would have been interesting has Martinez scored the chance he had directly after he made it 6-4 on aggregate.
The Madrid derby got ugly at times as the Atleti war machine crunched through the gears like the football team equivalent of a vehicle from Mad Max, but in the end the better team won. I think a key switch for Real was going more 4-3-3 in the second half with Isco coming more central, and Ramos had an excellent game as a DM.
Monaco played some nice stuff against Juve but lacked the cutting edge to really trouble Buffon. Juve were dogged and Morata's poor hold up play and decision making meant they never really got going as an attacking threat, but never looked like losing their 1-0 lead from the first leg.
The Madrid derby got ugly at times as the Atleti war machine crunched through the gears like the football team equivalent of a vehicle from Mad Max, but in the end the better team won. I think a key switch for Real was going more 4-3-3 in the second half with Isco coming more central, and Ramos had an excellent game as a DM.
Monaco played some nice stuff against Juve but lacked the cutting edge to really trouble Buffon. Juve were dogged and Morata's poor hold up play and decision making meant they never really got going as an attacking threat, but never looked like losing their 1-0 lead from the first leg.
Not the first time they tried something like that. When they signed Higuain, Gago and Marcelo back in like 2007 it was supposed to be part of a youth movement.
This is the point I have been trying to make, there is no elite team in football (currently) it's just top teams with quality players/stars bailing them out. I think United is the only top club not relying on individual quality at the moment and flourishing in a system and winning as a team....which is why we are able to score 4 goals with 4 different goal scorers when our go to guy is on the bench.
That is an interesting view. I can certainly see what you are getting at but I don't really have a strong opinion either way. I thought Bayern look like a fantastic unit, they move with such synchronization and pass with such accuracy that I think they can potentially be an elite team. And if Barcelona win a treble, they would have a pretty good shout too but I guess we will just have to wait and see
I don´t think it's so extreme. The team has won titles and fans has managed to identify with many of those players. This is the 5 consecutive semifinal in CL. Maybe is not the winning formula but not a bad one either. Many others clubs spending almost so much can not afford that.
Yes,They sold us Gago as the new Redondo. El Pipita did a good career and Marcelo is the best LB in the world. Mijatovic was in charge of the transfers, I think he did a good job in a short time.
Apzilicueta>Marcelo, probably Alaba as well.
I remember when they tried to buy the Dutch national team
Can't believe they let Robben,Sneijder,VdV and Huntelaar walk out the door just like that.
These Qtr finals have been boring as fvck except for the Bayern-Porto tie
Huntelaar didn´t adapt, Van der Vart was good but not enough. Robben wanted to be starter always, he was very firm about that. Snejder was really appreciated for the fans but he had a problem with the night , in any case probably the main reason is that Florentino wanted to eliminate any rest of Calderón, the former president
Robben has established himself as one of the best wingers ever now, brilliant player. We should have been all over him in 2009 but the problem was Ferguson never ever went for cast off players. Nothing needs to be said about Sneijder, everyone thought we was going to sign him to close the gap on Barca, worst transfer saga ever. He was the best CAM in the world in his prime.
This is a nice little breakdown.
Sneijder was only really an elite player during Inter's treble season(and the World Cup that followed that).
Kind of feel like Fergie stopped signing quality players post-ronaldo,pre-rvp.
Yes for 2 and half years at Inter he was world class. Amazing passing accuracy and vision.
The only way I can explain it is that the Glazers didn't give him any money for players, because before that he used to break transfer records all the time on quality players.
fecking hell, the envy is strong in this one. People trying to make out we're like a mix of City and Psg now, eh?
We've had some of the best teams and players in history and a trophy cabinet the rest of the world would kill for. Let's not forget that just because we haven't won a treble every year. Yeah, I know... or ever, before the smart ass comments appear.
We'll do it next year, this year we'll only be the first club ever who retains the CL.
We've had some of the best teams and players in history and a trophy cabinet the rest of the world would kill for. Let's not forget that just because we haven't won a treble every year. Yeah, I know... or ever, before the smart ass comments appear.
We'll do it next year, this year we'll only be the first club ever who retains the CL.
fecking hell, the envy is strong in this one. People trying to make out we're like a mix of City and Psg now, eh?
We've had some of the best teams and players in history and a trophy cabinet the rest of the world would kill for. Let's not forget that just because we haven't won a treble every year. Yeah, I know... or ever, before the smart ass comments appear.
We'll do it next year, this year we'll only be the first club ever who retains the CL.
No you won't. This is Juve's year.
Na srs, this is Barca's year.
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