I think he was based in U.S. Since the 70s or so for UN and only about 5 years or so back, returned to work in India
Colonialism in the subcontinent thread
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I think he was based in U.S. Since the 70s or so for UN and only about 5 years or so back, returned to work in India
One of the best, if not the best. As you said, people hate the man because he is good looking and can pull crazy snatch.
Brilliant argument. Too bad peterstorey isn't here anymore, would have loved to read his counter to Tharoor's arguments.
That is a moving speech. Churchill was a racist who couldn't care less if the entire Indian population died of starvation. As bad as Hitler.
If not worse..the vile fat bastard.
They can start the reparations by sending the Koh-i-noor diamond back. The bloody thing is gorgeous.
It is a great speech. Nicely done with humour as well in between while making very logical and valid points, backed by facts.
So hold on, these were the guys arguing for British colonialism?
Seems legit (seriously)I couldn't have drawn 3 more suitable looking people with an E-Fit wired directly to my imagination.
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Found that amazing as wellModi's got stuck in now: http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...rses-britain-paying-damages-for-colonial-rule
Some of the comments defy belief.
Modi's got stuck in now: http://www.theguardian.com/world/20...rses-britain-paying-damages-for-colonial-rule
Some of the comments defy belief.
It really is unbelievable.
This one is pretty legit though.
I mean imagine if the world today had to deal with a 7 times bigger pakistan... would be genuine hell. On the bright side, the fecking convicts wouldnt have won shit in cricket.
India would be somewhat similar to Central/Western Africa atm if not for the Brits being ruled by kings who do whatever they please. Government, Education system, transport, what not installed during the British rule.
India was a prosperous nation before the brits came and set up their extractive raj.
Thats a tall claim considering those guys had universities and trading supply chains when our ancestors here lived in the dark ages.
Just to ask you, were you actually taught these things in your schools or are you pulling it out of your arses?
These comments are entertaining, specially the aid ones. Long may it continue
Btw did anyone notice the british media didn't cover India launching there satellites into space while it had news concerning India from some obscure town.
It's wrong because of the following:
1. Bangalore didn't see Mughal rule until one of Aurangazeb's minions sold it to the Mysore kingdom.
2. This idea that all Muslims torture people and behead them is wrong. The greatest Mughal king, Akbar, was pretty tolerant. If memory serves me right, he was an advocate of Sufism.
3. The Wahhabi inspired fundamentalism is actually alien to India,even Pakistan. The fact that Pakistan today is what it is is because they've given a lot of importance to the crazies instead of sticking to Jinnah's vision of Pakistan.
I'm pretty confident that if partition hadn't occurred, what is Pakistan and Bangladesh today would have co-existed with modern day India. There would have been problems, riots, issues, yes; but there would have been co-existence. When I was in school, we had a Pakistani in our class and she was just like the rest of us. It's sad what they are going through but the world must hope the civilized part of Pakistan comes through because the crazies will destroy Pakistan first before they come to the rest of the world.
Mughals were already on there way down while the marathas and sikhs were on there way up. And pakistan has nothing to do with mughals, thats there wet dreams and your playing right into there hands.
Your argument would hold somewhat if India was like central africa before the british, it is quite clear it wasn't and was made similar to central africa by the british.
As @AshfordLad pointed out, we actually had all of those things before the British came along. One of our ancient universities, Nalanda, had people from all over the world. There is quite a lot of literature about the government of the time. This may surprise you, but in some places, the King could be dethroned. There was nothing like the divine right of kings nonsense that Europe had.
I'm re-reading Nehru's Glimpses of World History for the millionth time. There is quite a lot about ancient India for those who are interested.
These comments are entertaining, specially the aid ones. Long may it continue
Btw did anyone notice the british media didn't cover India launching there satellites into space while it had news concerning India from some obscure town.
Exactly, you knew that they didn't even bother to listen to the speech given that Tharoor killed it with his fertilizer subsidy line. I do remember the BBC reporting it, it was on my app or maybe I was wrong...
To be fair to them, the British media except the BBC seem to be purveyors of nonsense much like our media. They report on stuff based on the number of clicks they get which is a sad way for journalism to function. There's plenty of stuff that happens in India that goes on unreported by our media but the British pick it up.
They haven't been taught all this, they've been taught the revised version of the nonsensical white mans burden.
I can understand the problem they're faced with. Everybody agrees that colonialism was wrong but given that much of British history is based on colonialism, they seem to have struck a very weird balance wherein they agree that colonialism was wrong but they argue that some good came out of it. What good can come out of subjugating people for hundreds of years I fail to understand.
National pride is a curious thing. Even us Indians despite our rich history have to resort to some of the nonsense the likes of Dinanath Batra come up with.
Why hasn't @rednev joined in here? He usually never misses a chance to talk about how great the British empire was.
That is rather judgemental. Having studied in both England and Spain, I can tell you that the english education system is far fairer in its portrayal of the ills of the empire. You also need to consider the fact that if it was not the English it would have been the Portugese or even worse the french who would have invaded your country with far worse outcomes.
It was quite good actually, if you make the right comparisions and see what the Spanish and the French did. A common cold is is far better than a full on flu afterall.
Forgive me, if the UK's education system is fair in its portrayal of the empire, why do we have comments like "Indians were louts, we civilized them, innit?"; you saw some of those comments. That is no product of a system which treats the empire fairly. I don't see why modern day Britain has to be so sensitive about the Raj. It was bad, acknowledge it and we'll move on. There's no need for this ham handed defence.
As for how the French or the Spanish would have treated India, the point is moot. The French and the Portugese did invade parts of India but they never got as fair as the British did. As it stands, the consequences of the British Raj and French/Portuguese Empire in India can't be compared. To even make that comparison is unfair. It's somewhat like us Indians defending some of the nonsense that goes on in our country with "Pakistan is no better".
The compassionate British. Killing only 4 million people when the going rate was 6 million.6m? How about making entire cultures extinct.
The Guardian comments you'd assume would reflect the more liberal, well-educated segment of the population and yet it's full of vitriolic delusions . Clearly all the shit has been brushed under the carpet (stolen from the colonies obviously).
I especially love the guy about the "non-racist cost-benefit analysis". It is hilariously ignorant.
These comments are entertaining, specially the aid ones. Long may it continue
Btw did anyone notice the british media didn't cover India launching there satellites into space while it had news concerning India from some obscure town.
Did they send BBC this time too and created a documentary based on it? Maybe paying bribes along the way to gain access?
Non racist cost benefit analysis is my favorite part along with the downtown Bangalore one. very RAWKish.
I would have expected those comments in the DM , not in the guardian.. I always thought Guardian was a left leaning paper, am I wrong?
Those comments are hardly reflective of what general population thinks. Dont think anyone sensible is actually arsed, let alone be sensitive about the empire anymore to be honest. Its a bit of a non issue now really. Bad as it were those were the rules people lived by back then.
But to point out the that all other alternatives were worse does not take anything away from the fact that empire was bad for the colonies.
Guardian caters to the entire spectrum of lefties here. That includes all the loonies up north that you see in comments and all three of their educated leftie comrades.
Horseshit.
Brilliant isn't it? A wonderful justification of atrocities involving racism and murder and bleeding a population's resources dry.
"Well if I hadn't killed your family, some other bloke might have."
Right, I've just checked; there are 3287 comments on that article, I just scrolled through the first 3 pages and they're still filled with similar nonsense. So it does seem to be a popular opinion. It might be just me, but history is a very important thing for me, especially now that we in India have people who claim that plastic surgery and aircraft were invented in ancient India. We even have one guy claim that yoga and ayurveda "cures" homosexuality. So when people spout uneducated nonsense in the name of history, it's a red flag for me.
Your point on alternatives is again, neither here nor there, but I do agree that it is a bit of a non-issue as long as people don't claim the same stuff like we see in those comments.
If you're referring to that India's Daughter documentary, I will defend that forever. That should have been made compulsory viewing, some of that stuff is shocking and it shows a mirror regarding the thoughts of a large majority of our people. But being what we are, we will overreact. Anyway, guess all that is off topic so I'll end it here.
Obviously denying that their was a net loss to India or claming that it was some sort of a positive is despicable but if you think of continuity of culture and traditions English and French/Spanish rule made all the difference. I have only read the comments posted here and not clicked on the guardian link. There is a lot more loonies who read guardian than they would have you believe, its only slightly better than dailymail.
I have heard this thing about surgery as well from an Indian fella at the uni. It sounded proper legit as well, I must admit.