I don't know why but
American Cops Doing What They Do Best
- Thread starter DatIrishFella
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Now they're going after free inhabitants of Earth.
What a stupid woman.
I had to laugh when she tried to argue she had all the right of a US citizen, yet didn't have to obey any of the laws
That was priceless. I despair for the future.If we were to nuke the US I'm 100% confident that the average IQ of the worlds population would significantly increase...
Some would pay the price unnecessarily but at least we'd stop the free inhabitants from breeding
What a complete and utter feckwit.I would just like to congratulate the Police Officer on how patient he was being with that fruitcake he was dealing with. He remained polite, calm and very reasonable throughout that entire video. The woman is obviously not rowing with both oars and was obviously pushing his buttons and winding him up yet he still managed to keep his composure even when she turned nasty and started shouting abuse at him. The Police have been taking some serious shite lately and it's refreshing to see a video where one is actually very good at his job.
Is there any follow up to that video? Any explanation on why they were stopped or what happened to the driver? Or what happened after the video?
I would just like to congratulate the Police Officer on how patient he was being with that fruitcake he was dealing with. He remained polite, calm and very reasonable throughout that entire video. The woman is obviously not rowing with both oars and was obviously pushing his buttons and winding him up yet he still managed to keep his composure even when she turned nasty and started shouting abuse at him. The Police have been taking some serious shite lately and it's refreshing to see a video where one is actually very good at his job.
Is there any follow up to that video? Any explanation on why they were stopped or what happened to the driver? Or what happened after the video?
American police are all backwards, they shoot people when they have to talk to them and talk to people when they have to shoot them!
RIP to the cop who got killed during a traffic stop in Memphis. Cops are definitely between a rock and a hard place.
Good article from the New Yorker on the cop who kicked off the Ferguson riots. Pretty much sympathetic to all sides which can be refreshing in such a charged atmosphere. Seems like once again, history is the biggest villain.
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/08/10/the-cop
The Cop
Darren Wilson, the former police officer who shot and killed Michael Brown, an eighteen-year-old African-American, in Ferguson, Missouri, has been living for several months on a nondescript dead-end street on the outskirts of St. Louis. Most of the nearby houses are clad in vinyl siding; there are no sidewalks, and few cars around. Wilson, who is twenty-nine, started receiving death threats not long after the incident, in which Brown was killed in the street shortly after robbing convenience store. Although Wilson recently bought the house, his name is not on the deed, and only a few friends know where he lives. He and his wife, Barb, who is thirty-seven, and also a former Ferguson cop, rarely linger in the front yard. Because of such precautions, Wilson has been leading a very quiet life. During the past year, a series of police killings of African-Americans across the country has inspired grief, outrage, protest, and acrimonious debate. For many Americans, this discussion, though painful, has been essential. Wilson has tried, with some success, to block it out . . . (cont)
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/08/10/the-cop
The Cop
Darren Wilson, the former police officer who shot and killed Michael Brown, an eighteen-year-old African-American, in Ferguson, Missouri, has been living for several months on a nondescript dead-end street on the outskirts of St. Louis. Most of the nearby houses are clad in vinyl siding; there are no sidewalks, and few cars around. Wilson, who is twenty-nine, started receiving death threats not long after the incident, in which Brown was killed in the street shortly after robbing convenience store. Although Wilson recently bought the house, his name is not on the deed, and only a few friends know where he lives. He and his wife, Barb, who is thirty-seven, and also a former Ferguson cop, rarely linger in the front yard. Because of such precautions, Wilson has been leading a very quiet life. During the past year, a series of police killings of African-Americans across the country has inspired grief, outrage, protest, and acrimonious debate. For many Americans, this discussion, though painful, has been essential. Wilson has tried, with some success, to block it out . . . (cont)
I've not read the article you posted so apologies if repetitive. May even be the same source which I heard on NPR. Apparently the house was bought for him via donations. Something like $500k total. He and his wife (who was also a cop in the same force) lost their jobs and can no longer get jobs. They are too toxic it seems even though hundreds (I think 700) forces sent badges to him in support.
Cop draws gun on man for filming him.
This is incredible.
This is incredible.
Wooooo! I have a gun. What an absolute penis. That looked like a nice estate too.
In other news, UK Police show how it could and should be done.
http://www.policeone.com/patrol-iss...-attack-on-Ala-cop-celebrated-on-social-media
Beat the officer unconscious with his own gun, then people stand around taking pictures to put up online.
Beat the officer unconscious with his own gun, then people stand around taking pictures to put up online.
"The boots-on-the-ground officers across this country are at war, and if we do not have the help of citizens and local governments to stand behind us, we'll never win," said Birmingham police Sgt. Heath Boackle, president of the Fraternal Order of Police.
Really, is this what it´s come down to? I wonder how it ever got to this point, in of all places Birmingham, Alabama. And who´s this country at war with, and who are the citizens they need help from to win this war???
Well, something is seriously wrong if the beating of a police office by a criminal is praised in social media. War on crime, maybe?
It... it is?
The only good outcome from this incident is that no one got killed, and the alleged assaulter was caught. If he is convicted hope he goes away for a long time, and hopefully the officer gets some hazard pay and time off.
Shitty as it was, correct me if I´m wrong, but what was it, like two (2) comments and photos by two heartless idiots celebrating this? Is that really considered "social media?" Again, how did we get to the point where in of all places, Birmingham, Alabama, a couple of people could become so horribly callous toward the police force?
On the other hand, you would have entire organizations, even a political party, celebrating an African American, unarmed or not, taken down by the police force.
LAPD holds pregnant woman at gunpoint after mistaking her truck for murder suspect’s vehicle
Two small children were allegedly inside at the time of the mistaken stop.
Police said they pulled the woman over because her truck matched the description of a vehicle belonging to a suspect in a murder case.
How many times have you heard that?: "matched the description"
Two small children were allegedly inside at the time of the mistaken stop.
Police said they pulled the woman over because her truck matched the description of a vehicle belonging to a suspect in a murder case.
How many times have you heard that?: "matched the description"
Maybe they were friends of the criminal. Or not so reputable citizens themselves! Too many unknowns. I was just going by the title of the article.
As to your second para you are falling into the trap of justifying one crime by comparing it to another. Both should be condemned. One is never an excuse for the other.
LAPD holds pregnant woman at gunpoint after mistaking her truck for murder suspect’s vehicle
Two small children were allegedly inside at the time of the mistaken stop.
Police said they pulled the woman over because her truck matched the description of a vehicle belonging to a suspect in a murder case.
How many times have you heard that?: "matched the description"
And you're just way too sensitive here. Descriptions are usually vague and it's normal that there'll be many matches. As long as they identify a false positive and avoid damage it's a non story. These over enthusiastic articles only serve to dilute the real problem.
My Bad Use of Force Decision Shows You Shouldn't Second-Guess My Use of Force Decisions
AUGUST 14, 2015 BY KEN WHITE 30 COMMENTS
The Blaze, Glenn Beck's tequila-sweat dream-diary, repeats a law enforcement talking point today. The talking point — "scrutinizing use of force will kill cops" — is rarely served this explicitly or uncritically.
The story's about a Birmingham police officer who got pistol-whipped at a traffic stop. A suspect from the car he stopped approached him aggressively, cold-cocked him, and pistol-whipped him. Cold-hearted bystanders took pictures of him bleeding on the ground rather than helping. Thankfully, the officer will recover. But he's saying that he didn't use force in time to defend himself because of fear of how the media might treat him:
"A lot of officers are being too cautious because of what's going on in the media," said the officer, who asked to remain anonymous for the safety of his family. "I hesitated because I didn't want to be in the media like I am right now."
The Blaze pointedly notes:
The suspect in question, Janard Shamar Cunningham, is a black man and was seemingly unarmed during the incident.
Police — eagerly quoted by The Blaze — are using this to complain about media coverage of their actions:
Heath Boackle, a sergeant with the Birmingham Police Department and president of the city's Fraternal Order of Police, said Thursday that cops are "walking on eggshells because of how they're scrutinized in the media."
Police Chief A.C. Roper sees the episode — as well as the reaction, including celebratory and vitriolic comments posted online alongside images of the wounded officer — as symptomatic of a larger problem, in which some don't respect law enforcement.
"The nobility and integrity of policing has been challenged," Roper said. "As a profession, we have allowed popular culture to draft a narrative which is contrary to the amazing work that so many officers are doing everyday across this nation."
Here the typical subtext is closer to plain text: reporting on, scrutinizing, and criticizing officer use of force puts officers in danger by making them hesitate and second-guess themselves.
This is monstrous gibberish.
A cop made a bad use of force call. Thank God he lived. But a bad use of force call is not a good argument for less scrutiny of use of force. "I have trouble making decisions because of fear of how I will be treated in the media" does not convey "I'm capable of good judgment about the use of force, so you should trust me more."
Chief Roper complains about "popular culture" drafting a "narrative." What he means is that he's mad that there has been a mild drift away from the existing narrative — the law and order (and Law & Order), thin-blue-line narrative in which the cop is presumed to be the good guy and force is presumed to be righteous, a necessary tool for discovering truth and punishing evil, thwarted only by dishonest lawyers and publicity-hungry politicians. That narrative has been — and remains — overwhelming.
Police work is not, contra Chief Roper, an occupation of nobility and integrity, any more than any other profession is. It's a profession made up of noble and ignoble people, honest officers and liars, decent folks and utter thugs. It does not deserve the cultural free pass we've given it. The complaints here show how extensive that free pass is. Consider: the officer and his supporters aren't saying that he hesitated using deadly force on a human being because using deadly force on a human being is something to be done with great care. They're saying he hesitated — and that other officers might hesitate — because of how it might look on the news.
If "maybe I shouldn't kill this guy unless I have a good reason" isn't an adequate motivator to govern deadly force — and our history suggests that it isn't — I'm okay with "maybe I don't want to be on the news" stepping in to help.
http://popehat.com/2015/08/14/my-ba...uldnt-second-guess-my-use-of-force-decisions/
AUGUST 14, 2015 BY KEN WHITE 30 COMMENTS
The Blaze, Glenn Beck's tequila-sweat dream-diary, repeats a law enforcement talking point today. The talking point — "scrutinizing use of force will kill cops" — is rarely served this explicitly or uncritically.
The story's about a Birmingham police officer who got pistol-whipped at a traffic stop. A suspect from the car he stopped approached him aggressively, cold-cocked him, and pistol-whipped him. Cold-hearted bystanders took pictures of him bleeding on the ground rather than helping. Thankfully, the officer will recover. But he's saying that he didn't use force in time to defend himself because of fear of how the media might treat him:
"A lot of officers are being too cautious because of what's going on in the media," said the officer, who asked to remain anonymous for the safety of his family. "I hesitated because I didn't want to be in the media like I am right now."
The Blaze pointedly notes:
The suspect in question, Janard Shamar Cunningham, is a black man and was seemingly unarmed during the incident.
Police — eagerly quoted by The Blaze — are using this to complain about media coverage of their actions:
Heath Boackle, a sergeant with the Birmingham Police Department and president of the city's Fraternal Order of Police, said Thursday that cops are "walking on eggshells because of how they're scrutinized in the media."
Police Chief A.C. Roper sees the episode — as well as the reaction, including celebratory and vitriolic comments posted online alongside images of the wounded officer — as symptomatic of a larger problem, in which some don't respect law enforcement.
"The nobility and integrity of policing has been challenged," Roper said. "As a profession, we have allowed popular culture to draft a narrative which is contrary to the amazing work that so many officers are doing everyday across this nation."
Here the typical subtext is closer to plain text: reporting on, scrutinizing, and criticizing officer use of force puts officers in danger by making them hesitate and second-guess themselves.
This is monstrous gibberish.
A cop made a bad use of force call. Thank God he lived. But a bad use of force call is not a good argument for less scrutiny of use of force. "I have trouble making decisions because of fear of how I will be treated in the media" does not convey "I'm capable of good judgment about the use of force, so you should trust me more."
Chief Roper complains about "popular culture" drafting a "narrative." What he means is that he's mad that there has been a mild drift away from the existing narrative — the law and order (and Law & Order), thin-blue-line narrative in which the cop is presumed to be the good guy and force is presumed to be righteous, a necessary tool for discovering truth and punishing evil, thwarted only by dishonest lawyers and publicity-hungry politicians. That narrative has been — and remains — overwhelming.
Police work is not, contra Chief Roper, an occupation of nobility and integrity, any more than any other profession is. It's a profession made up of noble and ignoble people, honest officers and liars, decent folks and utter thugs. It does not deserve the cultural free pass we've given it. The complaints here show how extensive that free pass is. Consider: the officer and his supporters aren't saying that he hesitated using deadly force on a human being because using deadly force on a human being is something to be done with great care. They're saying he hesitated — and that other officers might hesitate — because of how it might look on the news.
If "maybe I shouldn't kill this guy unless I have a good reason" isn't an adequate motivator to govern deadly force — and our history suggests that it isn't — I'm okay with "maybe I don't want to be on the news" stepping in to help.
http://popehat.com/2015/08/14/my-ba...uldnt-second-guess-my-use-of-force-decisions/
That article is horrendous.
How so?
Care to elaborate on why you think so?
Cop gets his ass kicked and says he hesitated to use force due to fear of being torn apart in the press.
Not a great stance to take, granted, but all he said was 'hesitated to use force' from what I saw there, and they've turned that into straight up saying the only reason he didn't needlessly kill someone is because it would end up on the news.
They're one step short of saying cops just want to be able to murder people unquestioned.
I'm not saying the argument of 'stop scrutinising cops' is a good one - it's not - but that piece is so shrouded in anti cop bias it loses it's own credibility.
Not a great stance to take, granted, but all he said was 'hesitated to use force' from what I saw there, and they've turned that into straight up saying the only reason he didn't needlessly kill someone is because it would end up on the news.
They're one step short of saying cops just want to be able to murder people unquestioned.
I'm not saying the argument of 'stop scrutinising cops' is a good one - it's not - but that piece is so shrouded in anti cop bias it loses it's own credibility.
You have a point there. However, I don't think Ken White - a former federal prosecutor who's now a highly respected legal blogger - literally meant to try to impugn the character of the specific cop who got beaten, though. Hence the "cops are a mixed bag just like the rest of us" part.
He's making a larger point about the cultural narrative on use of force in America, and the Glenn Becks who are now trying to hijack this incident to advance their own anti-scrutiny narratives.
I'm not seeing much anti-cop bias in there tbh. Seems pretty even handed to me,
Perhaps it comes over worse in isolation, there's a comment left on the article which I do agree with:
The fact that 99% of articles are written from almost a political position means that they're shrouded in one sides views.
There's no easy answer to the problems with gun crime and cop shootings in America, but demonising cops even when they've done nothing is definitely not helping.
No, definitely you're right here. I read his blog pretty frequently so I'm used to his rhetorical flourishes (American lawyer, remember), but I agree they're striking and distracting sight unseen.
He's been on frontlines on both sides for a good while now, and can be pretty cynical about police based on his experiences as a federal prosecutor - one of their legal elite, if I'm translating that from American correctly. Some of his stories are genuinely unbelievable.
That's not the only good one. The good thing about Popehat is it attracts a pretty balanced commentariat with a wide range of legally-knowledgeable individuals on both sides. Here's one from yet another federal prosecutor, Patterico, who White has both crossed swords with and personally defended before:
I might try and read some more of his stuff and get a better idea of him.
Yea that's also a well written comment.
Align the incentives of cops to that of the wider community: make those police officers tortiously liable for egregious breaches of the reasonable officer standard, like the above. Dead serious.
However many millions Harris County taxpayers were on the hook for, come the inevitable lawsuit, shift it to the officer(s) involved instead. Simple.
However many millions Harris County taxpayers were on the hook for, come the inevitable lawsuit, shift it to the officer(s) involved instead. Simple.
Good, fair Vice interview of a black cop´s perspective done by this TV journalist Touré geezer.
http://www.vice.com/read/i-asked-a-cop-what-he-thinks-about-americas-police-problem-828
I Asked a Black Cop What He Thinks About America´s Policing Problem
It's easy to say feck the police. But we know we need them. We need the police to protect us, although quite often it seems like we need to be protected from the police. But when people agitate for more effective policing they are not suggesting the institution be eliminated, but demanding that police do their jobs better. But while it's important to be critical of the police, especially in the midst of a national policing crisis, we cannot escape or even comprehend our policing crisis without knowing what the police are thinking.
Earlier this year I met a black police officer who currently serves on the force of a major American police department. Each time we spoke I was impressed at how willing he is to be critical of his fellow officers, and how blunt he was in assessing the state of policing in the United States today.
Most police officers are not allowed to give interviews, which is perhaps understandable, but also a shame, because it denies people the opportunity to add their perspective. My cop friend, who I'll call Marc, agreed to let me publish one of our conversations, as long as he could remain anonymous. Below is our interview, lightly edited for clarity.
Toure: Why do you think so many shocking policing incidents have happened over the last year?
Marc: Some of it has to do with the petulance of police. What I mean by the petulance, and I've argued with some co-workers about this, we have to be held to a higher standard. We took an oath. The community didn't take an oath to protect the community—we would like them to, we would like them to be part of the solution. But they made no promises and took no oath. We did. We volunteered for this job and we are held to a higher standard.
In a lot of the situations I'm referring to, we're not talking about how police deal with criminals. We're talking about unarmed people who may have committed some basic violation, or done nothing wrong, and then things go way off the rails. That's entitlement. Remember on South Park when Cartman started talking about, 'Respect my authori-tah?' And then he starts beating people? It's an entitlement thing. You have to get back to the basic question of why do people want to do this job? And if you're not from the inner-city but you wanna police the inner-city, I kinda have to question, why do you wanna do that? Not saying that that's not honorable, but what are your motives behind that?
And I think it's an entitlement thing. It's like, 'I'm wearing this badge and you need to respect me.' So I pull you over and I expect your respect, but you've been harassed by police and disrespected and you have somewhere you want to go, so you give me a little bit of attitude. But instead of being an adult and controlling the situation and de-escalating it, now I escalate the situation and say shut your mouth. You say 'Hold on sir, I'm a grown man. I won't shut my mouth.' Now we're going back and forth and no one's de-escalating the situation, it goes from zero to 100. And I think the police's job is always to de-escalate the situation.
Like Sandra Bland,
That situation irritates me because it was a simple ticket that shouldn't even require anything. OK, she doesn't like the police. People have a right to not like you. Get over it. It's a God-given right for people to not like you. But, you can't be disorderly to the police, so people need to understand the disorderly conduct thing.
But I also think cops have to understand not to take it too personal. I'm in a confrontational job and 99 percent of the time when I deal with someone it's gonna be in a confrontational environment. Therefore it's my responsibility to de-escalate the situation at all times.
But what we hear from the police is a fear of being overpowered or having their authority lost to a particular young, unarmed black man. You hear that narrative over and over.
It would be nice if everybody who is in law enforcement were skilled marital artists and skilled fighters. But unfortunately in a job that's hard to get people to apply for anyway, there are people who are walking around this nation with a gun and a badge who have never been in a real fight. Never. Never been punched in the face before. So [they] don't have confidence in that skill. So when a person balls his fist up or comes after you, the first thing you think is, 'I know I can't fight. And I have a gun on me.' And there's a fear that you'll be overpowered and killed with my own weapon. A lot of cops have died this way.
They show you these videos in the academy. "How we die." It's not just fear of the black man, it's fear of people within itself. But then we have the perception from the media that the black man is the animal. He's stronger, bigger, faster, more aggressive. So the white person who never grew up around blacks, all he has is this perception that these individuals have this superhuman strength. And it's like, before the fight even begins I already think I'm gonna lose. And the reality is if you can beat me up and overpower me then you have the ability to take the gun off my hip and kill me with my own weapon. That's a strong possibility. And if I'm afraid for my life that's all I need to use deadly force.
We hear cops saying over and over in these incidents, 'He went for my gun, I feared for my life.' It seems like there's this playbook coming down from someone telling them, 'If something happens say this, it'll get you out of jail.' Is there some reason why we keep hearing the same story over and over?
One of the main things they focus on in the academy is liability. You have to know the liability of the law. You're carrying a tool that can end somebody's life so you have to know when you can use it and when you can't. It's taught in the academy you can only use your weapon when you fear for your life or your safety, or the safety of others. It's beat down that this is when you can use it. So officers across the nation will always say 'Well, I was in fear for my life.' You can't say anything else because there's no other reason to shoot somebody.
When you look at all these incidents which one makes you the sickest?
The Cincinnati one.
Sam Dubose.You can't put yourself in harm's way in order to use deadly force. Yes, we don't wanna chase people and yes, if somebody runs from me it sucks to chase them, but you can't just be bustin' off at cars because they drive away. Especially if it's not for something major. It's not like this person was a rapist or a killer. We're talking about a traffic stop. So that one was sickening. And South Carolina was sickening.
Walter Scott.
That was sickening. The guy's running away. That's called a chase. It's time to run. Catch up to the person, tackle 'em, and then take 'em into custody. It sucks. God knows I don't wanna run all the time but unfortunately that comes with the territory.
So this narrative of black lives being taken by cops, and then making national news so each incident becomes a big story on its own—has that had an impact on cops on the ground and how they do their job?
I think so. I truly honestly believe and think so. And I don't think it's just the movement, I think it's a combination of stuff. They don't feel like they're gonna be backed by the mayors. I think one of the things we all want in our jobs is job security and the hope that we have bosses who support us. We all want supervisors to support us. And the community doesn't support you, they never really have. If a cop dies there's no national outcry, the community doesn't really care. The mayor doesn't support you because the mayor is a politician. The mayor, the county councilmen, they want votes. They want to win. So everybody has this fear they'll set you up just to make national news and say 'See we're doing something.'
It's almost like instead of saying 'Lets get the facts,' it's, 'Nah, lets make 'em [cops] guilty and we'll figure it out later. To quiet the storm because we don't want these Black Lives Matter people protesting in our backyard so we'll hang the officer out to dry. Well who wants to be in a job where you're hung out to dry?
Are you saying cops are going out on stops and feeling extra stress and tension and anxiety and thus officers are not de-escalating incidents, and they feel an anxiety because they don't feel supported and they're growing more aggressive toward citizens? Is that what you're seeing?
Yes. I think cops are stressed out. It's a stressful job anyway. And then it's stress that your command will set you up just to appease the citizens. And the community now is more emboldened. More people are walking up to your face and sayin 'f you' and putting cameras in your face and almost becoming more disorderly. That's happening now more than ever. You still have to be in authority cuz you don't ever wanna lose authority. But you're like why am I dealing with this?
. . . (Cont)
http://www.vice.com/read/i-asked-a-cop-what-he-thinks-about-americas-police-problem-828
I Asked a Black Cop What He Thinks About America´s Policing Problem
It's easy to say feck the police. But we know we need them. We need the police to protect us, although quite often it seems like we need to be protected from the police. But when people agitate for more effective policing they are not suggesting the institution be eliminated, but demanding that police do their jobs better. But while it's important to be critical of the police, especially in the midst of a national policing crisis, we cannot escape or even comprehend our policing crisis without knowing what the police are thinking.
Earlier this year I met a black police officer who currently serves on the force of a major American police department. Each time we spoke I was impressed at how willing he is to be critical of his fellow officers, and how blunt he was in assessing the state of policing in the United States today.
Most police officers are not allowed to give interviews, which is perhaps understandable, but also a shame, because it denies people the opportunity to add their perspective. My cop friend, who I'll call Marc, agreed to let me publish one of our conversations, as long as he could remain anonymous. Below is our interview, lightly edited for clarity.
Toure: Why do you think so many shocking policing incidents have happened over the last year?
Marc: Some of it has to do with the petulance of police. What I mean by the petulance, and I've argued with some co-workers about this, we have to be held to a higher standard. We took an oath. The community didn't take an oath to protect the community—we would like them to, we would like them to be part of the solution. But they made no promises and took no oath. We did. We volunteered for this job and we are held to a higher standard.
In a lot of the situations I'm referring to, we're not talking about how police deal with criminals. We're talking about unarmed people who may have committed some basic violation, or done nothing wrong, and then things go way off the rails. That's entitlement. Remember on South Park when Cartman started talking about, 'Respect my authori-tah?' And then he starts beating people? It's an entitlement thing. You have to get back to the basic question of why do people want to do this job? And if you're not from the inner-city but you wanna police the inner-city, I kinda have to question, why do you wanna do that? Not saying that that's not honorable, but what are your motives behind that?
And I think it's an entitlement thing. It's like, 'I'm wearing this badge and you need to respect me.' So I pull you over and I expect your respect, but you've been harassed by police and disrespected and you have somewhere you want to go, so you give me a little bit of attitude. But instead of being an adult and controlling the situation and de-escalating it, now I escalate the situation and say shut your mouth. You say 'Hold on sir, I'm a grown man. I won't shut my mouth.' Now we're going back and forth and no one's de-escalating the situation, it goes from zero to 100. And I think the police's job is always to de-escalate the situation.
Like Sandra Bland,
That situation irritates me because it was a simple ticket that shouldn't even require anything. OK, she doesn't like the police. People have a right to not like you. Get over it. It's a God-given right for people to not like you. But, you can't be disorderly to the police, so people need to understand the disorderly conduct thing.
But I also think cops have to understand not to take it too personal. I'm in a confrontational job and 99 percent of the time when I deal with someone it's gonna be in a confrontational environment. Therefore it's my responsibility to de-escalate the situation at all times.
But what we hear from the police is a fear of being overpowered or having their authority lost to a particular young, unarmed black man. You hear that narrative over and over.
It would be nice if everybody who is in law enforcement were skilled marital artists and skilled fighters. But unfortunately in a job that's hard to get people to apply for anyway, there are people who are walking around this nation with a gun and a badge who have never been in a real fight. Never. Never been punched in the face before. So [they] don't have confidence in that skill. So when a person balls his fist up or comes after you, the first thing you think is, 'I know I can't fight. And I have a gun on me.' And there's a fear that you'll be overpowered and killed with my own weapon. A lot of cops have died this way.
They show you these videos in the academy. "How we die." It's not just fear of the black man, it's fear of people within itself. But then we have the perception from the media that the black man is the animal. He's stronger, bigger, faster, more aggressive. So the white person who never grew up around blacks, all he has is this perception that these individuals have this superhuman strength. And it's like, before the fight even begins I already think I'm gonna lose. And the reality is if you can beat me up and overpower me then you have the ability to take the gun off my hip and kill me with my own weapon. That's a strong possibility. And if I'm afraid for my life that's all I need to use deadly force.
We hear cops saying over and over in these incidents, 'He went for my gun, I feared for my life.' It seems like there's this playbook coming down from someone telling them, 'If something happens say this, it'll get you out of jail.' Is there some reason why we keep hearing the same story over and over?
One of the main things they focus on in the academy is liability. You have to know the liability of the law. You're carrying a tool that can end somebody's life so you have to know when you can use it and when you can't. It's taught in the academy you can only use your weapon when you fear for your life or your safety, or the safety of others. It's beat down that this is when you can use it. So officers across the nation will always say 'Well, I was in fear for my life.' You can't say anything else because there's no other reason to shoot somebody.
When you look at all these incidents which one makes you the sickest?
The Cincinnati one.
Sam Dubose.You can't put yourself in harm's way in order to use deadly force. Yes, we don't wanna chase people and yes, if somebody runs from me it sucks to chase them, but you can't just be bustin' off at cars because they drive away. Especially if it's not for something major. It's not like this person was a rapist or a killer. We're talking about a traffic stop. So that one was sickening. And South Carolina was sickening.
Walter Scott.
That was sickening. The guy's running away. That's called a chase. It's time to run. Catch up to the person, tackle 'em, and then take 'em into custody. It sucks. God knows I don't wanna run all the time but unfortunately that comes with the territory.
So this narrative of black lives being taken by cops, and then making national news so each incident becomes a big story on its own—has that had an impact on cops on the ground and how they do their job?
I think so. I truly honestly believe and think so. And I don't think it's just the movement, I think it's a combination of stuff. They don't feel like they're gonna be backed by the mayors. I think one of the things we all want in our jobs is job security and the hope that we have bosses who support us. We all want supervisors to support us. And the community doesn't support you, they never really have. If a cop dies there's no national outcry, the community doesn't really care. The mayor doesn't support you because the mayor is a politician. The mayor, the county councilmen, they want votes. They want to win. So everybody has this fear they'll set you up just to make national news and say 'See we're doing something.'
It's almost like instead of saying 'Lets get the facts,' it's, 'Nah, lets make 'em [cops] guilty and we'll figure it out later. To quiet the storm because we don't want these Black Lives Matter people protesting in our backyard so we'll hang the officer out to dry. Well who wants to be in a job where you're hung out to dry?
Are you saying cops are going out on stops and feeling extra stress and tension and anxiety and thus officers are not de-escalating incidents, and they feel an anxiety because they don't feel supported and they're growing more aggressive toward citizens? Is that what you're seeing?
Yes. I think cops are stressed out. It's a stressful job anyway. And then it's stress that your command will set you up just to appease the citizens. And the community now is more emboldened. More people are walking up to your face and sayin 'f you' and putting cameras in your face and almost becoming more disorderly. That's happening now more than ever. You still have to be in authority cuz you don't ever wanna lose authority. But you're like why am I dealing with this?
. . . (Cont)
Link at the top of the article, only one more paragraph.
That Vice interview was nice to read, especially the part about the cops being set-up by their own authorities for the sake of votes. We as people in general have lost respect for cops, I am sick of reading/hearing all that 'All cops are bastards' crap and how police are bad etc. I have never had problems with the police, not one single occasion. I always treat them with decency and they treated me with decency as well, we shouldn't take it personal if a cop asks us to stop or something. Obviously I understand the racial tension between the police and black people, that's a tough and complex problem because racist cops will always exist unfortunately.
You're a gentleman and a scholar.