Trust me buddy I hope to feck I'm wrong about finishing 4th but this buffon has me worried that is the extent of what we will achieve with him at the helm. I could name 4-5 better qualified modern day manager's that would have us challenging, and playing much better football, than LVG. Have a good one!!
Louis Van Gaal | 2015-16 Performance Thread
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Trust me buddy I hope to feck I'm wrong about finishing 4th but this buffon has me worried that is the extent of what we will achieve with him at the helm. I could name 4-5 better qualified modern day manager's that would have us challenging, and playing much better football, than LVG. Have a good one!!
I wish we here knew what are the Board's expectations from LvG this season. Hopefully, its top 2 minimum in the league and quarters in CL. Finishing top 4 is just not enough taking into account the size of the club and finances available.
No way this is happening if the squad stays as it is.
Not a hope in hell.
LvG said he wanted to challenge for trophies. We'll come fourth and he'll come out and say it was the plan all along. I don't and won't believe it. We came fourth last season & went out easily in the cups. We should be improving. With this current squad, we'll be extremely lucky to do any better. But, hey, at least we sorted the central midfield problem.
We're one player away from this IMO.
De Gea back and settled when the window shuts.
Darmian - Smalling - Blind - Shaw - Very happy with this. Valencia as solid a right back backup as any team have, Jones and Rojo as solid as any CB backups any teams have and Blind and Rojo can cover LB.
Midfielders: Carrick, BFS, Schneiderlin and Herrera.
Attackers: Rooney, Mata, Depay, Hernandez, Young, Januzaj, Wilson and Periera - Definitely needs a talisman to either score freely or break the lines and get others in.
Our own fans are morbidly over critical on our squad and play.
I just don't understand why we're playing with two defensive midfielders. At least, I don't understand why when we're against a team like Newcastle, at home. It makes no sense.
I'm not sure it's augmented our defensive solidity, either. We've looked strong at the back, mainly, because Smalling is monstrous at the moment. There's no reason why we couldn't play a Schneiderlin-Herrera combo in the middle; I'm loth to believe that that duo would suddenly make us defensively frail.
Personally, I'd like a midfield three, but now that's been tossed out the window, I'd certainly like to see the aforementioned central midfield partnership. Chelsea play with Matic and Fabregas in the middle most games, and Fabregas contributes nothing close to Herrera, defensively.
Basically, I believe LVG is being way too cautious.
I'm not sure it's augmented our defensive solidity, either. We've looked strong at the back, mainly, because Smalling is monstrous at the moment. There's no reason why we couldn't play a Schneiderlin-Herrera combo in the middle; I'm loth to believe that that duo would suddenly make us defensively frail.
Personally, I'd like a midfield three, but now that's been tossed out the window, I'd certainly like to see the aforementioned central midfield partnership. Chelsea play with Matic and Fabregas in the middle most games, and Fabregas contributes nothing close to Herrera, defensively.
Basically, I believe LVG is being way too cautious.
My point is we could do it all right now if we would just set ourselves up properly, of that I have no doubt. Our emphasis should be improving the quality of our play not adding people right now.
Can not LvG (at least for the sake of caftards) at least once line the team up as follows:
Romero
Darmian Smalling Blind/Rojo Shaw
Herrera Schneiderlin
Januzaj Mata Memphis
Chicha
Think it would be some joy to watch...
Romero
Darmian Smalling Blind/Rojo Shaw
Herrera Schneiderlin
Januzaj Mata Memphis
Chicha
Think it would be some joy to watch...
Where are the goals going to come from ?We're one player away from this IMO.
De Gea back and settled when the window shuts.
Darmian - Smalling - Blind - Shaw - Very happy with this. Valencia as solid a right back backup as any team have, Jones and Rojo as solid as any CB backups any teams have and Blind and Rojo can cover LB.
Midfielders: Carrick, BFS, Schneiderlin and Herrera.
Attackers: Rooney, Mata, Depay, Hernandez, Young, Januzaj, Wilson and Periera - Definitely needs a talisman to either score freely or break the lines and get others in.
Our own fans are morbidly over critical on our squad and play.
memphis and juanzaj are young, one is new to the league, they shouldn't be solely depended on for goals. Rooney is just so far from form atm so that leaves us with mata.
Pedro was that signing imo, but for whatever reason LVG pulled the plug, now he's gone and had a brilliant debut giving chelsea exactly what our attack is missing and we needed him significantly more than they did. We draw 0-0 at home with newcastle and he says it is a perfect performance and that it further proves that we don't need singings, baffling. I agree people are over critical on the squad but not the play, he needs to do better with our performances stifling creativity and risk for control won't run when playing teams like newcastle at home. Brugge should be the standard not the exception. It's understandable to see why some fans lay into him, he really seems like he enjoys making life harder for himself. Pedro madness proves it.
and yes, if he truly did pull the plug on the pedro deal and fails to bring a player in with similar qualities then every lackluster attacking performance is on him, he had the opportunity to at least try and rectify it.
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I don't think the players are being criticised as such, it is one player and the manager. The defence is great, the midfield is stocked but not being utilised to it's full potential. The attack could perform if the midfield was used better and we weren't waiting for Mr. Rooney to arrive. A couple of more forward players would definitely lift us to another level though.
I fully agree, at times it feels like the players are on a leash, against Newcastle for instance I see Shaw, Darmian and Mata all get in good 1v1 situations but didn't attack it they simple passed back/sideways so they didn't risk losing possession. That has to stop and we need to take risks, we have a good solid midfield whom are more then capable of protecting the backline if we do lose possession.
EXACTLY
so it's easy to understand why some fans moan when he drops interest in pedro, lets him go to a rival (who is currently stronger) and then suggests that the squad is fine as it is after failing to score against newcastle at home.
I agree 4th isn't an acceptable finish this year but we will fight for 4th with liverpool again and we will struggle to get out of group stages in champs league.
we are still seriously lacking in some vital posititons everyone knows that apart form LVG so unless the board sort something big between now and the end of the window then we won't be doing anything this season.
We still need a ST a winger and a CB, it's common knowledge We have needed those all summer its so annoying and I'm fairly angry that we could've sorted 2 of those postions very easily Pedro and otemendi would've been perfect. Now LVG has come out saying we don't need to strengthen the squad, complete idiot.
Imho we are two players away from doing exceptionally well.
1) We need another striker. Now this is based upon LVG actually dropping Rooney but we need two top strikers and play the one in form. In 99 we rotated 4 strikers. We could use a 2nd quality option here.
2) We need some pace down the wing. Pedro was an obvious choice. Now I do not know if we will get one.
Why I am I posting this in LVG thread? Because he says we are fine at striker and despite name dropping Pedro later claims he was not wanted....
1) We need another striker. Now this is based upon LVG actually dropping Rooney but we need two top strikers and play the one in form. In 99 we rotated 4 strikers. We could use a 2nd quality option here.
2) We need some pace down the wing. Pedro was an obvious choice. Now I do not know if we will get one.
Why I am I posting this in LVG thread? Because he says we are fine at striker and despite name dropping Pedro later claims he was not wanted...
.Watching Pedro play how he did makes one even more annoyed with Van Gaal.
If I didn't fear Giggs would be our next manager I'd say I cannot wait for LVG to feck off from our club.
We finished 7th the season before last! I'm afraid that this squad is more than a season and a half and about £150m (net) away from mounting a title challenge. Especially as despite the media portraying us as being big spending we have basically spent on a par with Chelsea, City and even Liverpool
We finished 7th that year because of mental issues. It was pretty much the same squad that won the league prior to that season.
No. I don't know where this 'we need to spend £400m to mount a title challenge' narrative has came from. Lesser teams have progressed more while spending less. We've already spent £250m and while our squad is pretty good, it's still lacking a few first XI players and it doesn't help having a manager that mismanages a few of them either. The excuses made for Van Gaal would be laughed off of here if it was done for Moyes, who incidentally was one of the biggest reasons we finished 7th that season.
The manager appears clueless, he thinks we played our best game of the season against Chelsea last season and then he comes out with a corker after our most toothless performance so far with 'our attack doesn't need any reinforcing' when it's blatantly obvious to every man and his dog it is. I'm sure someone will be here to tell me that it's all part of the process though and he can't openly say he wants a striker, even though everyone knows we need one.
Nothing has changed from last season. I fully expect us to finish fourth.
I know where you are coming from, I'm not in the LVG out crowd just yet but if he doesn't add to the squad by the closure of the Transfer Window I will of lost all faith in him for this season to be honest.
His interview after the Newcastle game said it all, thankfully he only was given 3 years, because I can't wait to see the back of VG
We're one player away from this IMO.
De Gea back and settled when the window shuts.
Darmian - Smalling - Blind - Shaw - Very happy with this. Valencia as solid a right back backup as any team have, Jones and Rojo as solid as any CB backups any teams have and Blind and Rojo can cover LB.
Midfielders: Carrick, BFS, Schneiderlin and Herrera.
Attackers: Rooney, Mata, Depay, Hernandez, Young, Januzaj, Wilson and Periera - Definitely needs a talisman to either score freely or break the lines and get others in.
Our own fans are morbidly over critical on our squad and play.
This is my thinkiong, and has been since we made the four signings. Many were still insisting we need a centre half but for me, we need one special player in attack. So yea, theoretically, we are one player away, but sadly - in real life it may not be as simple. You can't help but wonder how even a Neymar or whoever would make the desired impact in such a shackled system.
The midfield options you listed are excellent, for example, but in my opinion, the reality is that the first XI is more than one player away so long as Herrera sits on the bench. So it isn't just about the squad personnel, it's about the right players and right system in the first XI.
I must concede that my sentiments are similar at the moment. He is not much different to Moyes to me. The joy has been sucked out of watching United. Perhaps I need to be more realistic, at least for now, as I've always been of the belief that hreat teams are built from the back - and our defensive record and performances so far this season have been brilliant. So we should see where it goes from now on, and if we can build a good attacking dynamic without compromising what we have built at the back.
I guess I will reserve judgement for now, but I'm concerned.
He's frustrating me, no doubt and you get the feeling that he'll need another slice of luck to land on the team selection everyone is crying out for, like he did last season. That's never a good feeling to have with a manager. Mata out wide, Januzaj behind the striker, and the two DM's against cannon fodder is baffling to say the least.
Well the money he has spent, and he can't get the best out of this squad? The way we are going a top 4 I'm starting to doubt that. He found a system that worked last year, he decides to change it, playing wingers has no10's, playing 2 DM, then when bastian comes off, he just brings on carrick when we have guys like Herrera who is more attack minded, that for me is a worrying trend.
He's just a glorified defensive manager, who clips the wings of our offensive players, because he does not like allot of them taking chances. The job of forward thinking player, is rolling the dice, they are gamblers, they do things the defensive players will not dare to do, or can't do. If VG is not allowing the creative players to role the dice, we will not score many goals.
I remember pep saying something on these lines, about the difference and balance in having enough players who pass the ball, and have that cutting edge. It seems to me, VG wants to have to many thinkers on the pitch, and not enough players with instinct to take that gamble. If we don't have enough gamblers in the final third of the pitch, the game is up. We got to have attacking players who have the freedom, or our cutting edge is going to be toothless
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I agree with all of that, and have said as much many times myself. I just think that, for teams other than Barcelona - being able to defend comes before being able to attack. It's the difference in substance between a Chelsea/City and Arsenal over the years. Again, what you have said above is true, and if it is still true in 4 or 5 months, then I'd probably say I've had enough of Van Gaal. But I am of the belief that you must fix the back first, then build offensively from there. Given we have just played 3 games, I will like to see if the caution is lessened over the coming months.
I think the Swansea game will give us a better idea of where we are. They are really dangerous at home. If we get through that then things might start being changed. If we lose will he go even more ultra defensive?
I actually think Swansea will be a good game for Van Gaal. As shown by our record against the top four last season, Van Gaal's team is well equipped to deal with sides that attack us. When there is space to play into, as there was in the first 20-30 minutes against Newcastle, we do well. We only started to plod after McClaren adjusted his team shape, closed the gap between the Newcastle lines and forced us to try and play through them. Swansea aren't defensive, they'll attack and leave spaces, and that will play into our hands.
Where Van Gaal's tactics will be tested is against teams that park the bus. There, when we need to quicken the pace and can't simply wait for our opponents to attack us and leave themselves open, will be the real test. We won't win the title if we continue to struggle to play through teams that set up to draw with us.
For the next 5 months that is not going to happen, he will persist with this system. Then when we are out of the title race he will try and do something new.
When I look at VG's United this year, he has stripped away the instinct of the flair, and he has gone with thinkers, and not enough gamblers who will role the dice. We are practically playing 6211, meaning there is a huge gap between midfield and attack, so there is not enough consistent link up play with the front 4 and the midfield, and he's deformed our attack by playing mata and Janazaj out of position, so we are already handicapped by VG's mind boggling shape of the team.
VG is like the Simpsons doctor nick, and this clip sums up VG shaping up his front 4
Can we get more ultra defensive than 6211? Because that is how I have seen us play this season, even against Newcastle at old Trafford he thought we must play 2 DM
We still managed to lose twice to them last season. For all them not being defensive.
We probably will still finish 4th, I would say the best we can hope for us a reasonably close 3rd, but rather than seeing this as a negative and proof that LvG is "clueless" we should be thanking our lucky stars we got him when we did. Our squad didn't need tweaking, it needed to be razed and re-built pretty much from scratch. As I have said on other threads, without van Gaal we wouldn't have made the Champions League last season and we would have been in real danger of 'doing a Liverpool'
I am interested to know which teams have "progressed more while spending less?" because I can't think of any. Liverpool have gone backwards from two seasons ago when the unthinkable nearly happened, City and Chelsea are strong but you would expect that as they have spent £100m+ every year season upon season for years now. Utd had that ridiculous 4/5 years of excuses like "there is no value in the market" which was obviously going to hurt us at some point. Arsenal have spent plenty of cash and still look to have the same old problems based on what I have seen so far.
What we need now is to put a proper centre forward in this team and we improve by ten points. That could be the difference between 4th and a title challenge. Unfortunately, 40 goal a season strikers are not readily available so if we don't get one I'm sure it won't be for lacking of trying or because van Gaal doesn't acknowledge we need one
Breaking down teams that park the bus is more down to the quality of the individuals than it is any tactics. The fact that we find it easier to attack in open spaces is perhaps a combination of both logic, and the fact that we don't necessarily have the best attacking unit anyway.
When a team comes to Old Trafford and sits, back, the tactics are pretty uniform. They defend, deep, and we attack. That our players are unable to break these defences down is because most of them are incapable of going past a players in such a set up. Again, they may be good enough to do it in an open space, but not in that kind of set-up. So yea, while you can still say it is Van Gaal's fault due to team selection, both with existing squad and in the market - I don't think it's the players on the pitch attacking the 'wrong way'. They just aren't that good. They can't beat anyone, so the best they can manage is to try and inflict death by 100 crosses.
Right now we are much better than arsenal and we are much more disciplined than Chelsea
Don't forget the abysmal Dutch performances in the World Cup - aside the freak thrashing of Spain, Holland were one of the most boring teams to watch. We have a lot more of this to come.
Better than Arsenal? I disagree
Yet they defeated Brazil 3-0 and won third place? They weren't boring at all. Maybe the Costa Rica game at max. And that was a very average team. If anything it shows he gets maximum from his teams.
They got spanked at home by a terrible West Ham side. So 'right now', I would say we are better than them.
their defence and midfield are non existent and they seem to depend on return of Sanchez s form. They aren't better than us at all