[Keeps It tidy]

I thought that was the best the midfield and defense has looked this season. I hope that is the midfield/defensive set up and personnel we use against Sevilla.

 

[desmondisback]

a team that looked like it had a plan

...the bare minimum surely for even a sunday league team? Does Mourinho deserve credit for having a plan?

 

[royboy16]

Didn't expect a win there to be honest but we played well and deserved our win.
Thought our defense did well also.

 

[Bobski]

I thought that was the best the midfield and defense has looked this season. I hope that is the midfield/defensive set up and personnel we use against Sevilla.

Rojo needs more than one solid game against one of the worst strikers in the league to secure his place.

 

[Keeps It tidy]

Rojo needs more than one solid game against one of the worst strikers in the league to secure his place.

I was going to say have Bailly swap with Rojo.

 

[Bobski]

I was going to say have Bailly swap with Rojo.

And Valencia/Young with Lindelof. Feels like Bailly has barely played this season, Utd need him to prove that he can sustain the great impression he made last year.

 

[Android1974]

If 4-3-3 was the solution, what happened at Stoke and Basel? The difference is not so much the formation, it was the insistence on the slick short passing.

 

[cletus7]

Captains performance from pogba tonight Mata is such a waste of a space in that team.

Comfortable win in the end.

Mata played really well today. That’s very harsh on this occasion.

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

If 4-3-3 was the solution, what happened at Stoke and Basel? The difference is not so much the formation, it was the insistence on the slick short passing.

We struggled to break them down though. It was some good goals from a distance that gave us the points and also should we be honest Everton had a very poor midfield.

We get a better balance with 4-3-3 though although it will not help us break teams down.

 

[eat_grass]

Well thanks for your suggestion, but I'll do what I want thank you. My eyes and brain can easily interpret what is happening and the point I was making is that we were toothless in the first half and many others said similar. In fact there was very few people happy with the way the game was going by half time. Our game plan in the first half was pretty much non existent and it was similar to the last few games in which we created very few clear cut chances. So if you're asking if I enjoy a team that plays that way, then no is your answer. I enjoyed the feck out of the team in the second half though, a team that looked like it had a plan and took the game to the opposition. That is Manchester United. Not that first half shite we have seen in the prior 3 games.

Lol. Of course you can do what you want. Nobody's forcing you to stop listening to those doom-and-gloom'ers.

Aside from the first 20 minutes, the first half had many entertaining moments. But if you're the type that screams at the TV whenever United aren't dominating possession, then I can see why watching them have to defend would make you glum.

I enjoy watching United's defenders do what they get paid to do. Including de Gea. And there was plenty of offensive attacking as well.

So yes, the moaners and complainers at halftime, and the clueless people saying United have been shit the last three games (Southampton aside) need to just drink themselves into a deep nap and stop spreading their misery.

 

[Android1974]

What's more impressive (I mean, negatively impressive) about Mourinho's comments on the way we played today was the fact we only played this way – with the slick short passing, or “more dynamic and freedom” – because of the players missing, meaning Lukaku and Ibrahimović. Why don't we try this more often? That's when Mourinho's being pragmatic, flexible and reactive manager undermines him and the team.

 

[BluesJr]

What's more impressive (I mean, negatively impressive) about Mourinho's comments on the way we played today was the fact we only played this way – with the slick short passing, or “more dynamic and freedom” – because of the players missing, meaning Lukaku and Ibrahimović.

My feelings also. He’s honestly so frustrating.

 

[cyberman]

How shameless is this?

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/898867/Manchester-United-news-Jesse-Lingard-Everton

They managed to chop a great win into negative headlines for us.
Its impressive

 

[Ramshock]

no match of the day tonight?

 

[noodlehair]

What happened at half time, did Jose just tell the players to "try harder" and then they did? Utterly baffling how we just came out and clearly started putting more effort in.

Lots of people will no doubt clamber to ridiulous conclusions about formations now, but the main difference today was that in the second half our players were prepared to force the issue and actually play football, rather than just half arsedly run around like idiots. In the first half, with the same formation, they half arsedly ran around like idiots. Few teams will offer as little in return as Everton did too.

Lingard keeps scoring really goood goals. It's getting to the point now where it can't just be some weird fluke.


- Also, concerning that Jose was saying the other day he needs to rest Lukaku but can't. I mean, I get that he's a key player, but clearly if you NEED to rest him, you can. Jose would rather stick a clearly unfit Zlatan up top (and then, for some reason, keep Lukaku in the team anyway), than just play Martial there from time to time, who is probably good enough himself to get 20+ goals a season if he was played up top regularly. He does it because he is forced into it, which suggests a basic lack of understanding of what his own players can and can't do.

 

[The Purley King]

Said in another thread but Lingard is undroppable at the moment.
He is busy but makes intelligent runs and links things together. Also a great finisher. If he keeps up this form he may hit 20 goals as a midfielder. When was the last time a Utd player did that? Genuine question btw.
First half was average at best but 2nd half we were dominant and it could have been 3 or 4. Am 75% happy again but still not completely happy with the approach.

 

[noodlehair]

How shameless is this?

https://www.express.co.uk/sport/football/898867/Manchester-United-news-Jesse-Lingard-Everton

They managed to chop a great win into negative headlines for us.
Its impressive

Saddest thing about that article is that Henry wasn't even particularly critical. He literally just said Lingard picked the wrong option (which he did). It was Sounness who spent the whole of half time whining...and I'm pretty sure at this point he's just a robot repeating the same sentences over and over.

"I don't understand what he does"
"It's not been easy on the eye"
"He should do better there, for me"
"This isn't what you expect when you come to watch Manchester United"
etc...

This has been going on repeat for about 8 years now.

 

[Get In Scholesy]

At last.Someone who shares my sentiments.

Reading posts here you will think we have been absolutely rubbish.

Sometimes people allow frustration to cloud what really transpired. Can’t blame them though.

You said last couple of games. Our last couple of games were Burnley and Southampton. We played ok v Burnley but were absolutely dire v Southampton, hence my response.

Ah okay, I will be sure to be super accurate and precise next time I use the word ‘couple’.

Yes, we played poorly against Southampton in that run of 4 matches. And the result amidst that run had an impact on how we percieved the football on display. We probably played worse against Southampton earlier in the year but the 1-0 result hushed a lot of the displeasure.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

I missed the game earlier but reading the comments on here I expected to see a great performance.

After watching the full 90mins I think it was as much Everton being poor as anything else. But we got the three points and player confidence will increase now. Which IMO has been our biggest problem post City game.

 

[meamth]

I just love the combination of Mata and Pogba, it just intricate and sophisticated football to watch.

What more satisfying in this match is we scored 2 Fifa video game goals and it were glorious to watch.

Even more satisfying is to see Mata critics goes to cave. GGMU

 

[BluesJr]

I missed the game earlier but reading the comments on here I expected to see a great performance.

After watching the full 90mins I think it was as much Everton being poor as anything else. But we got the three points and player confidence will increase now. Which IMO has been our biggest problem post City game.

You could also say we made them poor because we controlled things.

 

[Listar]

Feels great to watch United score great goals again. More to come I hope.

 

[TheReligion]

We struggled to break them down though. It was some good goals from a distance that gave us the points and also should we be honest Everton had a very poor midfield.

We get a better balance with 4-3-3 though although it will not help us break teams down.

Don't think we struggled to break them down. Quite the opposite infact. We started slowly but even in the first half we were getting in around good areas. Come the second we were dissecting them at will.

I missed the game earlier but reading the comments on here I expected to see a great performance.

After watching the full 90mins I think it was as much Everton being poor as anything else. But we got the three points and player confidence will increase now. Which IMO has been our biggest problem post City game.

For an away performance at Goodison that performance was dominant. We also did very well not to let Everton build momentum when they pushed us for a spell before Jesse's goal.

 

[SadlerMUFC]

I think with Pogba, Lingard, Martial, Shaw all getting into good passing positions in the box this suits Lukaku

do think he will struggle a little with the nice intricate passing at times but with the service he would have gotten tonight I think he would have been licking his lips

the answer is simple really though - work on it in training - because we spent 75 million on Lukaku it doesn't mean he has to start every game though

We only crossed the ball 5 times tonight. The last few games we are averaging around 30 crosses. No Lukaku so the crosses go down and all the players are passing and moving. Lukaku comes back and I'm afraid we will resort back to crossing. Personally, I like what I saw in the second half today (not so much the first half) and I would much rather see us play more like that...

 

[LLMU]

Glad to see the focus and concentration back in the team. And what great goals those were. Seems like we have been taking shooting practice putting those balls into the top corner.

 

[cyril C]

We only crossed the ball 5 times tonight. The last few games we are averaging around 30 crosses. No Lukaku so the crosses go down and all the players are passing and moving. Lukaku comes back and I'm afraid we will resort back to crossing. Personally, I like what I saw in the second half today (not so much the first half) and I would much rather see us play more like that...

With Lukaku we tend to whip the ball to the big man every time, getting predictable at least and forgetting other aspects of the game at worst. Perhaps MK is also at fault, he was supposed to be the man who can flip and pass, offering something different to Lukaku, but he turns AWOL as you know. For us to fire at all cylinders we need to see a) Lukaku learning to make short pass / flick for teammates (and shooting without spending 30s to compute) b) someone to replace MK c) Rashford learns to play short pass / movement. Then our 9-10 attacking / MF players can make life difficult for every team.

 

[DdeGoat]

What happened at half time, did Jose just tell the players to "try harder" and then they did? Utterly baffling how we just came out and clearly started putting more effort in.

Lots of people will no doubt clamber to ridiulous conclusions about formations now, but the main difference today was that in the second half our players were prepared to force the issue and actually play football, rather than just half arsedly run around like idiots. In the first half, with the same formation, they half arsedly ran around like idiots. Few teams will offer as little in return as Everton did too.

Lingard keeps scoring really goood goals. It's getting to the point now where it can't just be some weird fluke.


- Also, concerning that Jose was saying the other day he needs to rest Lukaku but can't. I mean, I get that he's a key player, but clearly if you NEED to rest him, you can. Jose would rather stick a clearly unfit Zlatan up top (and then, for some reason, keep Lukaku in the team anyway), than just play Martial there from time to time, who is probably good enough himself to get 20+ goals a season if he was played up top regularly. He does it because he is forced into it, which suggests a basic lack of understanding of what his own players can and can't do.

It's not a conclusion drawn after a solitary performance, neither it's about formations. It's how best to utilize a player's skills and talents. Pogba is an attacking player, not a central midfielder. An attacking role has different responsibilities. The onus is on creating and scoring goals and generally create havoc in the attacking third of the pitch. That is where Pogba shines and does his best work. He is strong, can play intricate one-two's, has good dribbling ability, has excellent vision for a pass and can score goals.

A box to box central midfield role requires a different skill set. It's not all about pinging 70 yard passes to the wings. There is a reason players like Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, Zidane, Iniesta etc. excelled in attacking roles. They all had/have the ability to ping those passes but they did their best work when freed of the defensive responsibilities. I am sure Mata, Coutinho or Eriksen can play in central midfield and look good in certain games, which won't mean that they are central midfielders either. It's the same nonsense that have people think that Rooney can play in a deeper role or when they thought Gerrard could easily excel in the Pirlo role because he can hit a sweet pass.

 

[SadlerMUFC]

With Lukaku we tend to whip the ball to the big man every time, getting predictable at least and forgetting other aspects of the game at worst. Perhaps MK is also at fault, he was supposed to be the man who can flip and pass, offering something different to Lukaku, but he turns AWOL as you know. For us to fire at all cylinders we need to see a) Lukaku learning to make short pass / flick for teammates (and shooting without spending 30s to compute) b) someone to replace MK c) Rashford learns to play short pass / movement. Then our 9-10 attacking / MF players can make life difficult for every team.

In my opinion the last thing we need is someone to replace MickyT. I hate the 4-2-3-1 formation with us. It makes Pogba play too deep. The only way I would want a #10 is if it's a 4-4-2 with a diamond midfield. Other than that, I would much rather see us play a 4-3-3. But we need a better option than Fellaini or Herrara on the right side of midfield

 

[Abdou0230]

If Mourinho has half a brain he will do the following:
1- Play a midfield of 3 with more freedom for Pgoba to drive forward.
2- Play Lingard only on the flanks (whenever he plays).
3- Give Martial or Rashford a run of games as No.9 instead of Lukaku.

 

[mazhar13]

After reading so much criticism of the first half, I rewatched it. Whilst it was obviously not a good first half, it certainly wasn't a bad one as well. Everton were their most threatening on their right side, but they never created a good chance, and we thwarted any attack that they attempted in that half. Jones and Rojo didn't make any mistakes and were extremely solid, whilst Lindelöf did well on the right side. Shaw himself was imperious on the left and didn't give Vlasic an inch.

On the attack, there were a few issues that I discovered:

1. Our passing was sloppy on several occasions (Carragher pointed out the "lack of quality" in our attacks).
2. Mata coming deep and central too early, making it easier for Everton to contain us. His deliveries and final passes were also quite poor, and his willingness to play safe passes slowed down the tempo and pace of our build-up.
3. Martial's first touches were sloppy, but after the 25-minute mark, his first touch improved, and we became more of a threat on the counter in particular.

Other than that, overall, our attacks showed promise even if they were not effective.

• Our 4-3-3 shape confused Everton. There were many instances where Pogba and Herrera pivoted between picking the ball up deeper or receiving it higher up the pitch. Pogba, in particular, enjoyed this freedom in his game as he frequently drifted to the left channel, leaving Davies and Holgate confused as to who should pick him up.
• Lingard and Martial provided good movement, varying between dropping into the hole and making runs past the defensive line. Lingard, in particular, was very good at sticking next to a defender then quickly dropping back into the hole to receive a pass.
• Lingard was on form. His touches and dribbling were very effective and caused several problems for Everton on the counter.
• We didn't resort to crossing the ball into the box or hoofing the ball forward all of the time. Instead, we looked to be more patient in our attacks and methodically break them down with quick, short passes and good movement from Pogba, Lingard, and Martial.

In the second half, we improved as Mata played higher up and farther to the right instead of dropping deep and coming inside too early. This stretched Everton and made us more of a threat. Our two goals came because of what we were already doing in the first half combined with Mata being more disciplined in his movement and positioning.

Honestly, we did play the 4-3-3 before, but what made us look better was Pogba being more effective and mature in his performance, Lingard being excellent, and Herrera being more precise with his passes. It's clear that the players enjoy this setup more as it leaves us less congested, centrally, in the final third and gives Pogba more freedom in his movement.

 

[Ashley R1+O]

Second half much better than the first. Boys still look like they're getting to grips with the confidence aspect, seems to go up and down on a dime. Want to see more spine and more bollocks showed in the next few weeks because who knows, a couple of slipups from City we need to be ready to pounce regardless.

 

[marksam91]

While I do agree that a 3-man midfield is the way to go, some people are acting like we've always had the option and Mourinho just decided to ignore it. Pogba and Fellaini have been out for most of the season, while Herrera has not performed at a high level. A 3-man midfield has only been on the cards the last few games, and starting an additional attacker didn't seem like a bad option considering the teams we were facing.

Hopefully, we go with this formation for awhile, just as it seems to be working right now.

 

[Class of 63]

Said in another thread but Lingard is undroppable at the moment.
He is busy but makes intelligent runs and links things together. Also a great finisher. If he keeps up this form he may hit 20 goals as a midfielder. When was the last time a Utd player did that? Genuine question btw.
First half was average at best but 2nd half we were dominant and it could have been 3 or 4. Am 75% happy again but still not completely happy with the approach.

Not since Tom Cleverley was in his pomp, nah, Paul Scholes got 20 in the 02/03 season but can't remember anybody else, and i'm going back to the mid 70's

 

[DevilRed]

We looked very good in the second half especially. Pogba just turned on the flair and ran the show. Lingard and Martial followed suit.

Scholes was right, we need to play Pogba closer to the opposition goal where he is at his creative best. Mkhitaryan was supposed to be the one to supply creativity but I've never seen a Manchester United player's form crater so spectacularly over the span of a few months. Its almost like he has forgotten how to play football and is devoid of any confidence.

I guess the priority now would be to sign another central midfielder if Fellaini/Carrick are on the way out. It would save us having to gamble on yet another number 10. Instead we should go get a right winger to play where Mata does. As hardworking and great a guy he is, its clear to see he doesnt fit as a winger and he will never get to play the no.10.

 

[Spaniel]

Stop with this Lukaku nonsense

Plenty of others have criticised him, in this thread and others. I happen to believe that both him and Ibrahimovich are too static and our general all round play suffers as a result. If he (they) come back in and we play with the same verve then I will happily stand corrected. Until then....

 

[prath92]

If Mourinho has half a brain he will do the following:
1- Play a midfield of 3 with more freedom for Pgoba to drive forward.
2- Play Lingard only on the flanks (whenever he plays).
3- Give Martial or Rashford a run of games as No.9 instead of Lukaku.

What’s wrong with you? Why would you play a midfield 3 at home to teams that are gonna sit back? So that matic and Herrera can pass the ball amongst themselves with 9 in front of them? Mourinho isn’t the one who needs to use his brains.

Martial isn’t a 9. To play him ahead of lukaku as a 9 is laughable really

 

[Hasawi Red]

That was so much more enjoyable to watch. I really thought that midfield would be the main one when we signed Matic, but due to Jose's stubbornness and Ander's dip in form it was not used almost ever. The 3 really complement each other well and we can actually have good control of possession even against a good team.

Also, seeing Martial moving all over the place and making openings for his teammates to move into or pass to was so much refreshing then seeing us struggle to find Lukaku with his lazy movements off the ball.

This should be the blueprint going forward, if Lukaku keeps playing the way he was when he is back, this will not look as good as it did today. Should persists with this formation. The overall benefit to our play is miles ahead, Jose needs to get off his ego trip and think of the team rather then himself being vindicated.

 

[DevilRed]

You wonder if they were expecting a lot more from Everton, who after the first Big Sam glow have gone back to being not very good. Second half they upped their game as they realised they definitely had the beating of them.

Big Sam has always been kind to us

Thought they gave us a bit too much respect and just sat back alot despite being at home. However, we did open them up at will in the second half and Pogba/Lingard/Martial caused them all sorts of problems.

We are missing a right winger to replace Mata. I feel like with another top class attacker with pace and ability to stretch defences/beat defenders on the right flank, we would be a much more effective attacking force.

 

[kitress]

Martial isn’t a 9. To play him ahead of lukaku as a 9 is laughable really

Martial did nicely as a 9 in this game. Why is it laughable to play him ahead of out-of-form Lukaku? What has Lukaku done in the last 10 games he started as a 9, aside from providing assists to the other teams?

 

[noodlehair]

It's not a conclusion drawn after a solitary performance, neither it's about formations. It's how best to utilize a player's skills and talents. Pogba is an attacking player, not a central midfielder. An attacking role has different responsibilities. The onus is on creating and scoring goals and generally create havoc in the attacking third of the pitch. That is where Pogba shines and does his best work. He is strong, can play intricate one-two's, has good dribbling ability, has excellent vision for a pass and can score goals.

A box to box central midfield role requires a different skill set. It's not all about pinging 70 yard passes to the wings. There is a reason players like Lampard, Gerrard, Rooney, Zidane, Iniesta etc. excelled in attacking roles. They all had/have the ability to ping those passes but they did their best work when freed of the defensive responsibilities. I am sure Mata, Coutinho or Eriksen can play in central midfield and look good in certain games, which won't mean that they are central midfielders either. It's the same nonsense that have people think that Rooney can play in a deeper role or when they thought Gerrard could easily excel in the Pirlo role because he can hit a sweet pass.

Except we've played Pogba in this role before and he's been just as hit and miss as when he's played in central midfield.

He'll have one game whre he's the best player on the pitch, a couple of weeks later he'll be back to pratting around. It isn't anything new until he starts playing well with some hint of consistency.

His problem hasn't been his position. It's his lack of maturity in how he plays. He only seems able to focus properly for the odd game.