We will never win the league with Lukaku up front

We won't win the title until we can go toe to toe with the big teams in the league and win. By winning, I don't mean cowering on the edge of the penalty area and hoping to sneak a goal. We have replaced so many players, but we have an ongoing problem where the ball retention and passing is at non league level when we are put slightly under pressure. This is a training ground issue and will not change however many players we buy.
 
This thread is way to premature and if we do win the league with Lukaku I think the OP should put some money where their mouth is.

The service he gets is positively dreadful and it couldn't have been more obvious today the amount of push from midfield, the strength in wide areas and the general creativity of spurs play compared to our non-existent build up play. Put some chances on a plate for him for gods sake before you complain about his worth to the team.
 
Our players were very poor against Spurs but Lukaku is really frustrated indeed.

If you don't have technical skills, you are just not top class footballer and any good defenders can exploit the player's technical limitation. Just look at those top class striker out there, Lewandowski, Kane, Suarez, RVP, RVN, Eto'o, Rooney, Benzema they are all strikers with 3-4 times better technique than Lukaku. It's so frustrated because against Lukaku, all you need is as defenders just some muscle, stay tight with him and he will lose the ball. He has also failed to score a single goal against top 6 sides this season.

He's been one of our main problem in fact, we struggle to get the best out of him with our tactic and service and now due to his limitation, we need to spend more money to sign more players with quality service just for him!!

It's like he needs 9/10 rating of service aka Beckham and De Bruyne in order to get the best out of him but we only need 6/10 rating service in order to get the best out of Suarez & RVP aka Cleverley, Welbeck, Valencia, Henderson, Allen.
 
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People should stop with the excuse of 'he needs better service'. He's a 90m signing playing as no.1 centre forward for Manchester United, he should be able to be a menace for CBs on the field and facilitate others into play.

Some mentioned Chicharito, well for once, he played in a 2 sharing duties with another striker who can do the playmaking, and secondly even with all of his limitations, he was busy as a bee, constantly running off the shoulders of CBs. Sure, offside a shitload, but he was a damn nuisance to play against and make opponent much more apprehensive because all it takes is one instance when he got free.
 
You should've gone for Ozil over Sanchez. He'd have got the best out of Lukaku.
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
People should stop with the excuse of 'he needs better service'. He's a 90m signing playing as no.1 centre forward for Manchester United, he should be able to be a menace for CBs on the field and facilitate others into play.

Some mentioned Chicharito, well for once, he played in a 2 sharing duties with another striker who can do the playmaking, and secondly even with all of his limitations, he was busy as a bee, constantly running off the shoulders of CBs. Sure, offside a shitload, but he was a damn nuisance to play against and make opponent much more apprehensive because all it takes is one instance when he got free.
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Lukaku usually does a nice work in getting others involved as well. He set up Martial's goal vs Burnley. But yeah in a game where Pogba Martial and Lingard doesnt show up, probably every striker will have a hard time
 
I think I’ve seen enough to make a decision which is Lukaku just ain’t good enough. Sanchez coming in has upset the balance, it’s like we are shoe horning him in by sacrificing the balance. Martial is s beast on the left and just as good upfront, let’s drop Lukaku and play Martial and Sanchez on the left.
 
Will Singh said:
I think I’ve seen enough to make a decision which is Lukaku just ain’t good enough. Sanchez coming in has upset the balance, it’s like we are shoe horning him in by sacrificing the balance. Martial is s beast on the left and just as good upfront, let’s drop Lukaku and play Martial and Sanchez on the left.
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Youv'e seen enough? 18 goals and 6 assists? Lukaku is havong a fine season. Not great and could be better, but enough to be dropped? FFS. People here are going into meltdown every single time
 
MacabbiUnited said:
Youv'e seen enough? 18 goals and 6 assists? Lukaku is havong a fine season. Not great and could be better, but enough to be dropped? FFS. People here are going into meltdown every single time
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11 league goals as the sole striker at the start of February.

That's 2016 Rooney-esque level of productivity.
 
MacabbiUnited said:
Youv'e seen enough? 18 goals and 6 assists? Lukaku is havong a fine season. Not great and could be better, but enough to be dropped? FFS. People here are going into meltdown every single time
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May be we should play him against lesser team and drops him in big games because 85% of those contribution came from non big game.
 
Will Singh said:
I think I’ve seen enough to make a decision which is Lukaku just ain’t good enough. Sanchez coming in has upset the balance, it’s like we are shoe horning him in by sacrificing the balance. Martial is s beast on the left and just as good upfront, let’s drop Lukaku and play Martial and Sanchez on the left.
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It would be interesting to see a fluid front 3 play, we certainly have the players now. I don't see Mou dropping Lukaku though.
 
Kane was as isolated as Lukaku last night. One brought fouls and players into the game the other... well we all watched the game. He needs to offer more regardless of what scraps he’s getting.
 
Jose's stubbornness is really annoying. Play the right players and A) Pogba is in his favoured position, B) we get the correct balance in midfield and C) there is proper energy and fluidity in the front 3. Against top teams we should play:

Matic
Herrera - Pogba
Lingard - Alexis - Martial​

The sooner Jose realises Lukaku is useless against top opposition the better. He is the biggest flat track bully around, which isn't necessarily a bad thing when you consider how many points we've dropped against easier teams in the last 3-4 years. In games we are expected to dominate the front 6 should be either of the following (first one sacrifies legs in midfield for more creativity, second one does the opposite):

Matic - Pogba
Alexis - Mata/Lingard - Martial
Lukaku

Matic
Herrera - Pogba
Alexis - Lukaku - Martial

​
We can win the league with Lukaku as first choice vs bottom 10-12 teams. We can't win the league with Lukaku as first choice vs top teams.
 
Thread may be a bit melodramatic, but to be fair, whenever we have won the league, we've generally had a world-class striker (or partnership) in attack (Cantona, Cole & Yorke, RVN, Rooney, Ronaldo, RVP)

The only exceptions in are Sheringham (2000-01) and Berbatov (2010-11) who weren't world class, but for those individual seasons operated at a very very high level, and Lukaku is far away from being as good as either of those two, let alone the others listed.

Basically he needs to improve... we can win the league with him (as he could have a Sheringham/Berba type season) but he really needs to kick on.
 
Am I the only one thinking Lukaku was one of the few that showed some fight last night? Unlike our midfield talisman who didn't know what he was doing.
 
BringNaniBack said:
Someone needs to say it.

I'm not scapegoating Lukaku after our woeful performance against Tottenham as the whole team was atrocious but Lukaku simply isn't good enough.

Would you ever see Lukaku up front for Real Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern or even PSG now.....no you wouldn't. He isn't a good enough footballer to play for those teams. Physicality with limited footballing ability can only take you so far in football and Everton was about his level. He never performs against the big teams and isn't especially good against the rest of the league at the moment. I know having a big physical striker up front is Mourinho's style but if he wants to do that then at least find someone who can control the ball and link up play reasonably well.

I can't imagine how much better we would be with a more technically gifted striker. If Lukaku is to stay then he really shouldn't be playing in the big games unless there's a drastic improvement in his play.

No way can I see us winning the league or the Champions League with him playing up front every game.
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Pure stupidity.
 
InfiniteBoredom said:
11 league goals as the sole striker at the start of February.

That's 2016 Rooney-esque level of productivity.
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13 games to go.. Rooney 2016 finished with like 7 or 8 I think. It hasnt been a great season, but he did well. Can and WILL be better, if you'd judge people by half a season Martial and Rashford wete gone after last season
 
Our football was a bit too intricate in the final third with too many reverse passes and trying to make eye catching passes rather than playing it more simply. I think Lukaku would flourish in an old fashioned 442 when the build up is quicker and crosses are coming in for him to come on to. Currently our build up play can be a bit stilted and Lukaku often plays like he is preoccupied with staying on side rather than more instinctively which often sees strikers at their best.
 
Milan won quite a lot with Inzaghi upfront. You only need to give him service and not relying on them to provide anything apart from goals.
 
He stays up top which is partly what we wanted, his running behind or across the defence we need to make the most of. Wouldnt hurt for him to drop deeper sometimes to link the play abit more
 
Ashley R1+O said:
This thread is way to premature and if we do win the league with Lukaku I think the OP should put some money where their mouth is.

The service he gets is positively dreadful and it couldn't have been more obvious today the amount of push from midfield, the strength in wide areas and the general creativity of spurs play compared to our non-existent build up play. Put some chances on a plate for him for gods sake before you complain about his worth to the team.
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We did against Liverpool and City. He missed both big chances. I don't know why people keep defending him it's clear he isn't top level.
 
devilish said:
Milan won quite a lot with Inzaghi upfront. You only need to give him service and not relying on them to provide anything apart from goals.
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He wasn't the number 1 starter. During Milans period of success. He was always a number 2 or an option off the bench. You simply don't win anything by your number one striker being a poacher.
 
Dear god, are we going to have one of these threads for every fecking player that played last night.
 
I was 50/50 about him when he signed, but as always in these cases, you give people a chance to prove themselves. I want him to do well, but at times he just looks so awkward and cumbersome, and very rarely shows up in big games. Yes there are games when he gets little service, but against the bigger teams their defenders seem to be able to cope with him quite comfortably.
He is nowhere near someone like Kane or Aguero.
As always, I hope to be proved wrong about him.
 
J_Red 11 said:
Our players were very poor against Spurs but Lukaku is really frustrated indeed.

If you don't have technical skills, you are just not top class footballer and any good defenders can exploit the player's technical limitation. Just look at those top class striker out there, Lewandowski, Kane, Suarez, RVP, RVN, Eto'o, Rooney, Benzema they are all strikers with 3-4 times better technique than Lukaku. It's so frustrated because against Lukaku, all you need is as defenders just some muscle, stay tight with him and he will lose the ball. He has also failed to score a single goal against top 6 sides this season.
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Neither Rooney or Benzema were out-and-out strikers.....

RVN was just as limited as Lukaku except being a much more lethal finisher.

And Eto'o was never skilled on the ball...
 
Might as well have written it in the other thread about Pogba too... We will never win the league with a first team full of players who, we hope, they'll eventually become what we need them to be in our system. It doesn't work that way.

You need ready-made solutions and experience in crucial areas all around the pitch. For the ball-playing CB, the tempo-setter, the forward and the 2/3 players behind him we rely on players who may or will reach the desired level but they're not quite there yet. I lost count of how many times yesterday De Gea, Matic and Sanchez threw their hands up in the air in desperation from what was happening around them. If our plan revolves around De Gea being in God-mode every week, Matic running like crazy to cover holes and Sanchez getting on the ball and trying to figure out all by himself, we'll lose these three and we'll hamper the youngsters' careers too.

Not that Mourinho is doing them many favours TBH. I still support him wholeheartedly but sometimes, like yesterday, he saunters dangerously in LvG's territory of stubbornness. Spurs were running rings around us in the middle of the park and yet there we were trying throughout the whole game to play through their press and attack down the middle.

Lukaku is a bulky forward who also has the ability to chase first balls played into space (out wide mostly) but his hold up play isn't top-notch. He's not good at bringing others into play but he can link well with another attacker on the edge of the box and create a chance for himself. You see? Two things he's good at and two others he's not. Now, guess which two things we're telling him to do on the pitch.

If Mourinho wanted a lone forward with the whole package, he shouldn't have signed Lukaku. If he wanted someone less gifted technically but with the experience of having played at the highest level in order to get the job more neatly done and not go missing often, he should have looked elsewhere too. Now, the best thing he can do is devise a plan in which he'll get the maximum of the man he expects to score the goals. At least until Lukaku improves other aspects of his game.
 
mancan92 said:
He wasn't the number 1 starter. During Milans period of success. He was always a number 2 or an option off the bench. You simply don't win anything by your number one striker being a poacher.
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You are joking right?
 
TheRedDevil'sAdvocate said:
Might as well have written it in the other thread about Pogba too... We will never win the league with a first team full of players who, we hope, they'll eventually become what we need them to be in our system. It doesn't work that way.

You need ready-made solutions and experience in crucial areas all around the pitch. For the ball-playing CB, the tempo-setter, the forward and the 2/3 players behind him we rely on players who may or will reach the desired level but they're not quite there yet. I lost count of how many times yesterday De Gea, Matic and Sanchez threw their hands up in the air in desperation from what was happening around them. If our plan revolves around De Gea being in God-mode every week, Matic running like crazy to cover holes and Sanchez getting on the ball and trying to figure out all by himself, we'll lose these three and we'll hamper the youngsters' careers too.

Not that Mourinho is doing them many favours TBH. I still support him wholeheartedly but sometimes, like yesterday, he saunters dangerously in LvG's territory of stubbornness. Spurs were running rings around us in the middle of the park and yet there we were trying throughout the whole game to play through their press and attack down the middle.

Lukaku is a bulky forward who also has the ability to chase first balls played into space (out wide mostly) but his hold up play isn't top-notch. He's not good at bringing others into play but he can link well with another attacker on the edge of the box and create a chance for himself. You see? Two things he's good at and two others he's not. Now, guess which two things we're telling him to do on the pitch.

If Mourinho wanted a lone forward with the whole package, he shouldn't have signed Lukaku. If he wanted someone less gifted technically but with the experience of having played at the highest level in order to get the job more neatly done and not go missing often, he should have looked elsewhere too. Now, the best thing he can do is devise a plan in which he'll get the maximum of the man he expects to score the goals. At least until Lukaku improves other aspects of his game.
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Good points for me, surprised to see Smalling and Jones in central defense and Lingard in midfield against Spurs.
Lingard he rectified on 63mins.

You mention Matic racing around and this happened at Chelsea when he was paired with Kante, they were leaving big gaps and Matic was exposed.

I agree with your comments on Lukaku and think Pogba is important for creating chances for him as you have few players giving him service.
 
El Pasillo said:
Neither Rooney or Benzema were out-and-out strikers.....

RVN was just as limited as Lukaku except being a much more lethal finisher.

And Eto'o was never skilled on the ball...
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Both Rooney & Benzema are complete striker who can be out and out strikers. The Rooney 2009/2010 and Benzema's Lyon were out and out striker.

You don't need to be as skillful as Ronaldo, just simple technique with bit of flair to help the player knows how to build up play during counter and hold the ball, just make sure don't give the ball away to opposition. Rooney, Benzema, RVN, Eto'o were clearly better than Lukaku in technique.
 
Well next year it's make or break for mourinho I think. We need to win it or at be realistically challenging until the end. I can see another big spend especially midfield. A more mobile striker than lukaku may be better but cant see mouriho getting shut of him, especially as he bought him. Really we could do with an upgrade on smelling and valencia as well. If de gea goes then who will replace the best goalie in the world?
 
El Pasillo said:
Neither Rooney or Benzema were out-and-out strikers.....

RVN was just as limited as Lukaku except being a much more lethal finisher.

And Eto'o was never skilled on the ball...
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What? You either didn't watch Ruud or don't know what the term technical refers to. Total insult to the man to put his technique on Lukaku's.
 
spiriticon said:
Lukaku needs to be less like Chicharito and more like Drogba/Shearer.
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If he can score in big matches like Chicharito, then all is good. Hernandez scored 5 or so goals against Chelsea, and scored against Liverpool. He scored in all stages of UCL bar final.

Lukaku is obviously better, but when it comes to big matches, I would choose Hernandez of 2010-2013 every time ahead of Lukaku.
 
BringNaniBack said:
I agree he his worse. No idea how Fergie pulled that one off.
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Chicharito wasn't our one and only striker like Lukaku is now. We don't have another striker to rotate with Lukaku or at least Jose isn't giving someone else the chance. Maybe if Zlatan was fit it would be different but as things stand now no one.
 
Ive actually been impressed with Lukaku's play these last few months. His holdup play and build up play has greatly improved since the beginning of the year. He has been doing good things for the team even when he isn't scoring. Of course when the players behind him are playing poorly it is going to affect him profoundly, making his mistakes or lack of touches more noticeable. I thought the game against Spurs he did as well as he could, same with Lingard and Sanchez. Pogba, Jones, and Smalling were the poor ones in that game and with them being in the central parts of the pitch, we became overrun.
 
devilish said:
You are joking right?
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Please do your research or you will look silly. Shevchenko was the main striker during that period who is an all round striker and was the main number 1 striker. Inzaghi was injured alot and played in a front two with Shevchenko when he did play and was never number 1 striker in the club. So yes you cannot win the league with a poacher as your main striker its been shown again and again.
 
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