Cop in America doing a bad job, again

barros said:
Should be fired for a few reasons and specially when the guy went to his car, should be fired because next time he may not be that lucky. My question is how kind of training they really have? Shouldn’t they learn some form of fighting to stop the guy on his tracks, also he could shoot the guy on his leg because he was so close, anyway I hope the guy realizes not everyone has the balls to be a police officer.
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I imagine his academy teaches some basic hand to hand stuff. At the very least some PMA for getting people into cuffs or gain some control.

Even in a case like this when he’s close enough, shooting in the leg would be a bad idea just because it leaves too many avenues open for error. Hit a vein and he bleeds out. Miss and that bullet ends up who knows where. Shooting someone anywhere should be a last resort.

Hopefully it opened his eyes at least.
 
utdalltheway said:
Credit where credit is due ...but... They’re paid to do their job; “protect and serve” not shoot 1st every time they hear a noise or feel disrespected.
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That’s part of his point though. The only stories you ever hear in the news are ones about the bad. It leads to some narrative that cops are out just killing people at will and going back to the office to compare stats for who else they harmed that day.

Even in this thread, I’ve posted stories of officers going out and trying to make a difference, or stories of officers being killed, and they get ignored or downplayed entirely.

“That’s what they signed up for” isn’t a reasonable response to an officer getting executed while working, yet it’s been thrown around in here more than once.

By all means, the bad should be put on display. It doesn’t mean the good can’t be appreciated as well.
 
barros said:
We have a thread to criticize the cops only and when they do a good job or died in service people and specially the media ignores them.
This week we had a police officer who stopped a kid to cause more damage (we don’t know if his intention was killing his ex-girlfriend only) then today they stopped the bomber but the media can’t wait until another black American is killed by a cop.
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So it isn't as big new when someone does their job as it is when they kill someone? Who knew?
 
Wibble said:
So it isn't as big new when someone does their job as it is when they kill someone? Who knew?
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It seemed like he was talking more about officers who go above and beyond what’s required of them. Also, I don’t see why on-duty deaths should garner any less attention than when an officer kills someone. Especially as some of those end up being justified once all the actual evidence comes out.
 
He deserved to get shot 20 times because he didn’t show his hands, therefore he brought his death upon himself.

Are the police not trained to disarm or recover criminals who are running away?
Kill everybody first, ask questions later, get paid time off and come back to duty.

Madness.
 
vi1lain said:
He deserved to get shot 20 times because he didn’t show his hands, therefore he brought his death upon himself.

Are the police not trained to disarm or recover criminals who are running away?
Kill everybody first, ask questions later, get paid time off and come back to duty.

Madness.
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Yes, they are trained to disarm the suspect... by lethal force if in any doubt...
 
Mike Schatner said:
Not exactly sure what anyone expects there. He ran from them, ignored multiple requests to shows his hands, and the cops thought they saw something in his hands. They were fairly restrained up until the point when the officer thought he had seen a gun. The perpetrator brought that on himself IMO.
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ivaldo said:
Difficult to see. But why didn't he show them his hands, and why did he fun?
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According to this (which is probably not the best source in the world) he was standing in his own backyard minding his own business when the police started yelling at him without identifying themselves as police. There's a video from WaPo as well.
 
I'd like to know what superpower those cops have to be able to clearly see a gun in his hands in those conditions.
 
Organic Potatoes said:
Yes, they are trained to disarm the suspect... by lethal force if in any doubt...
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So they're trained to kill then? With no real repercussions after they murder someone.

Evading arrest isn't justification for murder, neither is non-compliance.
 
So this Stephon Clark shooting has me wondering. They supposedly fired 20 times and hit him with 8 shots. So 12 wayward shots in a residential neighbourhood is acceptable? I just don't understand how they can justify opening up so wildly with the risk of bullets going into unintended targets. I also don't understand how they can clearly state that he had a gun when it was dark, they were so far away and the scene was frantic.

This does not strike me as a defensible shooting in any way.
 
Grinner said:
So this Stephon Clark shooting has me wondering. They supposedly fired 20 times and hit him with 8 shots. So 12 wayward shots in a residential neighbourhood is acceptable? I just don't understand how they can justify opening up so wildly with the risk of bullets going into unintended targets. I also don't understand how they can clearly state that he had a gun when it was dark, they were so far away and the scene was frantic.

This does not strike me as a defensible shooting in any way.
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Just shows people how hard it is to shoot someone in the leg or arm to incapacitate them.

The Clark shooting is a tough one because he clearly ignored commands to stop and show his hands. The officers have to make split second decisions and the video clearly shows they believed he was armed. If it was a gun and they get in wrong by half a second one of the officer could easily have been killed.
 
Mike Schatner said:
Just shows people how hard it is to shoot someone in the leg or arm to incapacitate them.

The Clark shooting is a tough one because he clearly ignored commands to stop and show his hands. The officers have to make split second decisions and the video clearly shows they believed he was armed. If it was a gun and they get in wrong by half a second one of the officer could easily have been killed.
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The cops were clearly in the wrong here, as evidenced by the fact that they turned the body cam audio off to mask their own bewilderment that they made a fatal mistake.
 
Raoul said:
The cops were clearly in the wrong here, as evidenced by the fact that they turned the body cam audio off to mask their own bewilderment that they made a fatal mistake.
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They made a mistake for sure but so did Clark by ignoring commands to stop and show his hands. Video clearly shows the cops believed they saw a gun and at that point the shooting is inevitable. I don't think the cops acted with any malice or in an unprofessional way. If anything this highlights just how difficult their job is and incidents like this will always occur. In nearly all of the shooting I have seen the victim contributed to the final outcome.
 
Mike Schatner said:
They made a mistake for sure but so did Clark by ignoring commands to stop and show his hands. Video clearly shows the cops believed they saw a gun and at that point the shooting is inevitable. I don't think the cops acted with any malice or in an unprofessional way. If anything this highlights just how difficult their job is and incidents like this will always occur. In nearly all of the shooting I have seen the victim contributed to the final outcome.
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20 shots is still excessive, so they were clearly in the wrong. They should've known better especially in today's racially charged cop vs black suspect environment after the litany of other cases we've seen in recent years.
 
Raoul said:
20 shots is still excessive, so they were clearly in the wrong. They should've known better especially in today's racially charged cop vs black suspect environment after the litany of other cases we've seen in recent years.
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The number of shots is irrelevant. They are trained to aim for the center of mass and keep shooting until the threat is neutralized. As for your second comment what are they supposed to do....delay shooting when they genuinely thought he had a gun just because he is black? Clark ran away from them and ignored multiple commands. I don't know about you but when a cop in the US tells me to do something I comply without a second thought. To run away and ignore commands in the dark was not a smart thing to do.
 
Mike Schatner said:
The number of shots is irrelevant. They are trained to aim for the center of mass and keep shooting until the threat is neutralized. As for your second comment what are they supposed to do....delay shooting when they genuinely thought he had a gun just because he is black? Clark ran away from them and ignored multiple commands. I don't know about you but when a cop in the US tells me to do something I comply without a second thought. To run away and ignore commands in the dark was not a smart thing to do.
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That's not going to fly in this case. Everyone who has seen the video is appalled by the excessive force that was used. The fact that they muted the audio will also be taken into consideration in court. One can only hide behind the cowardice of 'he didn't follow instructions' obfuscation for so long before the public lose patience.
 
RedTiger said:
Stephon Clark's body was in such a state that his Mosque couldn't carry out the obligatory body purification. Makes you wonder how bad he was shot up.
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He was shot 6 times in the back. The cops must've felt really threatened by a black kid with his back to them.
 
Raoul said:
He was shot 6 times in the back. The cops must've felt really threatened by a black kid with his back to them.
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They were also in a good position of cover and knew that the helicopter above had eyes on him. He wasn't going anywhere.
 
Mike Schatner said:
They made a mistake for sure but so did Clark by ignoring commands to stop and show his hands. Video clearly shows the cops believed they saw a gun and at that point the shooting is inevitable. I don't think the cops acted with any malice or in an unprofessional way. If anything this highlights just how difficult their job is and incidents like this will always occur. In nearly all of the shooting I have seen the victim contributed to the final outcome.
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This is some post....
 
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