He was an absolute beast today, his interceptions every game are a large part of our success under ole
Ander Herrera vs N'golo Kanté | Thread has gone well
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Played very well no doubt about that but I'd give my arm to replace him with Kante
Maybe if you give both, then you won't be able to type this nonsense.
Kante was pivotal in 2 PL championship winning teams. Herrera hasn't been that. Kante gets put back in his favourite position and you'll see class from him again.
At his absolute best its more than reasonable to suggest Kante's better.Its never, ever reasonable to suggest that Kante is twice the player
The difference is that Herrera's never done it over the course of a title winning season.
At their best, they're both about as good each other. But until Herrera can do it consistently with a winning team, Kante will always have the edge in the public consciousness.
I think Herrera at Leicester or for France wouldn't have weakened either side's trophy runs significantly. It's just that he's never been in a side before where he's had a properly defined role that plays to entirely to his strengths. Neither LvG nor Mourinho played him in a double pivot with quick movement and a focus on high tempo one-twos; that's what Ole is doing now and what Kante had when he was in his beast mode years.
If you look at Kante's role now, you see a player who's underperforming in the same way that Hererra has done at times in the last 4 years.
They're cut from the same cloth: two players who dominate in the right systems and wilt in the wrong ones.
At their best, they're both about as good each other. But until Herrera can do it consistently with a winning team, Kante will always have the edge in the public consciousness.
I think Herrera at Leicester or for France wouldn't have weakened either side's trophy runs significantly. It's just that he's never been in a side before where he's had a properly defined role that plays to entirely to his strengths. Neither LvG nor Mourinho played him in a double pivot with quick movement and a focus on high tempo one-twos; that's what Ole is doing now and what Kante had when he was in his beast mode years.
If you look at Kante's role now, you see a player who's underperforming in the same way that Hererra has done at times in the last 4 years.
They're cut from the same cloth: two players who dominate in the right systems and wilt in the wrong ones.
Have always said that their skill sets are pretty close to being identical, so it's not outrageous to compare the two. I just think Kante wins with his overall consistency and tackling/interceptions. Herrera is excellent at those too but peak Kante was something else.
Herrera has always been underrated with some aspects to his game though, he has a very good cross, a good first touch, and has always been a bit of a jack of all trades type.
Herrera has always been underrated with some aspects to his game though, he has a very good cross, a good first touch, and has always been a bit of a jack of all trades type.
go home, you're drunk and seeing double
Their skill sets are absolutely not close to identical. Herrera came to us as more of an energetic attacking midfielder than a defensive one. His game has changed but he still has more in his locker going forward than Kanté who himself is probably underrated in that area.
Who is better is a bit of a tossup in my opinion but using their respective records in the PL is pretty unfair. Ander has been criminally underutilized under several managers and has been here for our worst period in decades. It’s not like he was holding us back from winning titles.
Who is better is a bit of a tossup in my opinion but using their respective records in the PL is pretty unfair. Ander has been criminally underutilized under several managers and has been here for our worst period in decades. It’s not like he was holding us back from winning titles.
That's what i meant with the way Herrera has been used for the past 3 years. Both have underrated (though perhaps not exceptional) passing skills, though I agree that Herrera edges that one and the way their defensive game is about pressing and interceptions is very similar (I'd argue peak Kante is one of the best i've seen in that regard). They don't quite dominate the ball for their teams (like a Keane or a Vieira) but I think they're strengths and weaknesses are very similar. Herrera does have a bit more in his locker but I think Kante is a better player than some give him credit for.
As I said, Herrera in some ways has been a bit of a jack of all trades in his time here. His first season with LVG was mostly as a more attacking type, then he got tried as a number 10 sometimes, and I even recall a game when he played Carrick's role at a game at Stamford Bridge where we lost 1-0. His best role is the one he's doing now, which is how Kante should be playing for Chelsea IMO.
Herrera wins the ball more frequently, while Kante wins more of his duels. Kante has a higher pass completion percentage while Herrera has more end product. It’s tit for tat.
What we are seeing now is Herrera playing in a system that suits his style, and therefore his ability and contribution is more obvious. Kante has had that same luxury while playing at Leicester and Chelsea prior to Sarri’s arrival. While Herrera was playing in a disjointed set up he struggled to impact the game as much as he could’ve which is exacty what’s happening to Kante now.
What we are seeing now is Herrera playing in a system that suits his style, and therefore his ability and contribution is more obvious. Kante has had that same luxury while playing at Leicester and Chelsea prior to Sarri’s arrival. While Herrera was playing in a disjointed set up he struggled to impact the game as much as he could’ve which is exacty what’s happening to Kante now.
If you put Kante in this team and asked him to do what Herrera is doing, he’d be just as good.
Leciester would not have won the league with Herrera instead of Kante. No chance. He was pivotal for them and he is a very different player to Herrera, so the idea you could just swap them, not even accounting for Kante's vast superiority, is not at all convincing.
Wish we had both. Herrera is a poor mans Kante though.
Funny, I bet Sarri thinks the opposite and wishes he had Ander on the right side
Player swap? Those happen all the time!
He probably does. But like under Jose. Herrera would probably look like Kante in that Chelsea team.
Sure do!
Plus Ander could just leave for free if he wants to. But still, think he clearly performs better as the right sided CM than Kante
The last time he played in his "favoured" position was the first 6 games under Conte and it went so well he overhauled thd entire team structure.
Shouldn't kante be compared to matic instead of Herrera? He played the DM role under mourinho and was decent but his qualities are not really comparable as he's more of a 6/8.
I think people are getting a bit giddy. You can make great players look exceptionally average by playing them in roles they are entirely unsuited to. Just look at what happened to Pogba not 3 months ago.
Kante is Chelsea's second best player and one of the best in the league, a manager incapable of getting the best out of him doesn't change that, just like it didn't change Pogba.
Kante is Chelsea's second best player and one of the best in the league, a manager incapable of getting the best out of him doesn't change that, just like it didn't change Pogba.
Oh please don't start this again.
Come on guys, I like this about Herrera getting his shine. Last time Kante scored against us and it became clear to me he was the better player of the two, but yesterday Herrera scored so now it is even again. Seriously though, Herrera is very comparable to Kante and excuses about form can be made for both players depending on circumstances. Previously Herrera has been mismanaged a bit in my eyes, while Kante has been afforded the team to practically be built around his expertise. At the moment our setup is perfect for Herrera and not for Kante and so one player is doing amazing while the other one not so much. I still think Kante is crazy good and I would love him at United, but Herrera on current form is crazy too, he really is amazingly good.
Ander, but because he gets and loves United.
If you told me Kante would come here and show the same kind of passion, commitment and love then I'd take him.
If you told me Kante would come here and show the same kind of passion, commitment and love then I'd take him.
Spot on.
As stated by many, Kante is an awesome player when playing a certain role. He's proven that beyond argument. Herrera has struggled to find that role in our team until Ole came home. That said, he's found it, and he's playing brilliantly.
I'd want them both personally. Neither can be expected to maintain that level twice a week as they head towards 30... and playing Kante in the middle, with Herrera tucking in from the right, and Pogba bursting forward would just be a nightmare to play against.
I'd want them both personally. Neither can be expected to maintain that level twice a week as they head towards 30... and playing Kante in the middle, with Herrera tucking in from the right, and Pogba bursting forward would just be a nightmare to play against.
Don't like comparison threads, but I thought Hererra was MOTM last match, great performance.
I’d take Kante alongside Herrera and Pogba. Sadly Sarri won’t be around much longer and the next manager will play Kante where he is best.
Kante is a better Herrera on the pitch but you only come across a Herrera in the changing rooms once a decade. Fiercely intelligent and influential.
Also quite interesting that I read a few posts of “play Kante in his favored position & we’ll see etc”....basically ignoring that Herrera’s barely even been played in his favored position, or within a favored system since he’s signed for us. Let alone be consistently picked in a settled team to try and build some momentum.
I’d rate, to date, albeit they excel at a couple of different things, Kante is better (& I am a huge Herrera fan). But Herrera is also the more complete player of the 2. I.e. he can play multiple positions better than Kante can, imo.
I've always felt there wasn't much in it. Kanté has the advantage due to his ball carrying, though.
This. The one time he was played in his favoured position he won player of the season for us.
Also quite interesting that I read a few posts of “play Kante in his favored position & we’ll see etc”....basically ignoring that Herrera’s barely even been played in his favored position, or within a favored system since he’s signed for us. Let alone be consistently picked in a settled team to try and build some momentum.
I remember when Pogba was out for an extended period of time last season and Herrera was asked to step him and do his job. Despite him really not being suited to the playmaker role he was getting absolute pelters on here. Bizarrely, there's a large segment of our fans who are far more willing to forgive Kante for his poor performances than they are their own player.
Spot on. Even under LvG, when Herrera struggled to adapt - (as did most players) a lot of us who’s seen him play, knew that he just wasn’t suited to a slow build up type style.
He was at best chasing around and playing instinctively almost. But he was heavily criticized. I have no doubt the moment he goes through a bad patch of form, there’s some who just can’t wait for him to get sold again.
Its a pure lie that Herrera ever struggled to adopt. Under LVG he was constantly disrupted by injury otherwise when fit he was first choice. Under Mourinho injury caused him the sane problems
He also likes to roam on both defense and attack, which LvG and Jose don't always like, hence Jose's preference for fellaini and LvG buying another DM in his second season.