Brexited | the worst threads live the longest

[afrocentricity]

From people in the centre, yes, I could see it gaining him support. All it takes in one nutter to go from milkshake to acid. The left are moving further left, the right are moving further right. It's all a giant mess, a bit like Farage's suit.

Are there still people in the center on this? How does that work then?

"We don't want out, we don't want in, we just want to sit here on the fence indefinitely..."

It takes a special kind of idiot to take these milkshake attacks as inspiration to commit an acid attack, but yea there are plenty of idiots over here right now....

Tbf though it's the Brexit crowd that seem more likely to take it to the next level, isn't that what we've been repeatedly warned about in this very thread?

"If there's no Brexit there will be anarchy" etc etc....

 

[Ubik]

Brendan Rodgers does politics.

 

[Sassy Colin]

Andrea Leadsom resigned.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-48374098

 

[Smores]

Brendan Rodgers does politics.

Was my first thought too

Kinda suggests to me that they didn't get the numbers and are trying to bluff it

 

[DavidDeSchmikes]

There will be a Brexit Party leaflet in it.

"I think there are 3 cabinet ministers who will let us down this year. Make sure you’re not the one."

 

[Jippy]

.

No deal it is then. It's the Euro elections tomorrow, then parliament goes into recess. Either May resigns or the 1922 change the rules to oust her, then Boris Johnson is fast-tracked in as new leader. He prorogues parliament so it doesn't sit again before the 31 October and we lurch over the cliff-edge into no deal. That's the rumour and it's scary as hell.

 

[Smores]

No deal it is then. It's the Euro elections tomorrow, then parliament goes into recess. Either May resigns or the 1922 change the rules to oust her, then Boris Johnson is fast-tracked in as new leader. He prorogues parliament so it doesn't sit again before the 31 October and we lurch over the cliff-edge into no deal. That's the rumour and it's scary as hell.

I'm fairly certain you can't prorogue for an extended period or at least Parlaiment can't prevent the queen from forming a new government and session. It was really only a tactic for a short timetable.

There's a few wierd convention rules because without the queen turning up herself she needs the leaders of the house of lords to declare it and that includes Labour and Lib Dem peers.

The Cooper bill should have provided for a rolling no deal eventuality really. At least with that passed it wouldn't have mattered if they closed down parliament.

 

[Jippy]

I'm fairly certain you can't prorogue for an extended period or at least Parlaiment can't prevent the queen from forming a new government and session. It was really only a tactic for a short timetable.

There's a few wierd convention rules because without the queen turning up herself she needs the leaders of the house of lords to declare it and that includes Labour and Lib Dem peers.

The Cooper bill should have provided for a rolling no deal eventuality really. At least with that passed it wouldn't have mattered if they closed down parliament.

Only the government can recall parliament from what I understand. It does seem a bonkers rule, but everyone has got their Erskine May printouts, from what I can gather.

 

[711]

No deal it is then. It's the Euro elections tomorrow, then parliament goes into recess. Either May resigns or the 1922 change the rules to oust her, then Boris Johnson is fast-tracked in as new leader. He prorogues parliament so it doesn't sit again before the 31 October and we lurch over the cliff-edge into no deal. That's the rumour and it's scary as hell.

Seems she had no chance of getting the Tory right to back her deal, but anyone else thinking it's a pity more Labour MPs didn't?

 

[Drifter]

Send in Spaceforce.

 

[4bars]

Am I the only one who doesn't find this funny?

All this kinda shit does is gain support for him. Retards.

Say what you want. but I picture it like a Monty python Gag

 

[Jippy]

Seems she had no chance of getting the Tory right to back her deal, but anyone else thinking it's a pity more Labour MPs didn't?

Her new 'bold' deal? It was so vague- even the offer of a second referendum didn't stipulate whether remain would be an option etc...The Guardian's John Crace describing her speech at PWC's offices as looking more like a hostage video made me laugh, but hit the nail on the head.

 

[sun_tzu]

Seems she had no chance of getting the Tory right to back her deal, but anyone else thinking it's a pity more Labour MPs didn't?

Something about 4d chess with unicorns and jezza playing a blinder... Meh hope I'm wrong but I could see a proper brexit nut job taking charge and if we end up with a hard brexit then yeah I think a fair few labour MP's might regret it (and also some of the close defeats before)... Arguably Corbyn might not mind a no deal so perhaps he is truly playing 4d chess if he gets away without a significant amount of labour voters blaming him

 

[Stanley Road]

He won't acknowledge your answer.

I will, i am not a fan of farage by any means nor am i a fan of remain campaign. Least of all i am not a fan of snowflakey ageism in this thread the last few pages. Sickening

 

[Cheesy]

No deal it is then. It's the Euro elections tomorrow, then parliament goes into recess. Either May resigns or the 1922 change the rules to oust her, then Boris Johnson is fast-tracked in as new leader. He prorogues parliament so it doesn't sit again before the 31 October and we lurch over the cliff-edge into no deal. That's the rumour and it's scary as hell.

Could see genuine riots if he tries to take that approach. Grim times ahead.

 

[freeurmind]

Good to see this is going well.

 

[Jippy]

Could see genuine riots if he tries to take that approach. Grim times ahead.

It's hard to see a non-disastrous outcome - even a vaguely neutral outcome is beyond all hope.

 

[ThierryHenry]

Seems she had no chance of getting the Tory right to back her deal, but anyone else thinking it's a pity more Labour MPs didn't?

While it was clearly in their own self-interests not to support her deal, I agree that they should have. Unfortunately the only way out of this mess was if labour caved. I always assumed that they would.

 

[ThierryHenry]

It's hard to see a non-disastrous outcome - even a vaguely neutral outcome is beyond all hope.

There’s no such thing as a neutral outcome with Brexit. It’s impossible to bring both sides to a consensus. Feck David Cameron.

 

[Fluctuation0161]

Wrong how? You just set a final age limit just like you have a retirement age in regards to work.

There isn't a retirement age because older people are incapable of work. It's because workers fought for the right to not work until the day they died!

To claim that a 16 year old has better decision making than a 71 year old is ridiculous.

 

[Mb194dc]

Looks like May out on Friday.

I'm assuming more leave oriented Tory will come in, probably BoJo. No deal / deal won't get past this parliament. Government would fall with the former, latter is a spineless surrender no new leader will contemplate.

Only solution I therefore see. They'll revoke article 50, call a GE, merge with Brexit party and run on a platform of renegotiating a better deal, possibly with no deal voted in the house before even negotiating again.

If they can't win a majority in parliament to do that at a GE, Brexit will be off.

 

[Buster15]

If the libs do better than labour surely Corbyn will have to look to change his brexit stance otherwise he will end up in the same doomed position as may...

Logically yes you are right. But when did logic ever come into play with politicians.
He won’t change at all because he has to follow Labour Party Conference decisions.
In other words he has to do as he is told.

 

[Penna]

There isn't a retirement age because older people are incapable of work. It's because workers fought for the right to not work until the day they died!

To claim that a 16 year old has better decision making than a 71 year old is ridiculous.

I also reserve the right to stop paying any taxes or bills when I'm age-disenfranchised, because I'm clearly no longer an adult citizen of the UK.

 

[Spark]

Logically yes you are right. But when did logic ever come into play with politicians.
He won’t change at all because he has to follow Labour Party Conference decisions.
In other words he has to do as he is told.

Conference voted on a second ref though, didn’t they? Or was it ambiguous enough of a decision to allow for permanent fence sitting?

Labour are in a perilous decision, however, by jettisoning all positions that lead to Leave, they at least align themselves with future generations (and the 18-44s).

 

[africanspur]

Are we still talking about disenfranchising the elderly in here?

Can we just.... Stop it? It's such a silly suggestion.

 

[Honest John]

Conference voted on a second ref though, didn’t they? Or was it ambiguous enough of a decision to allow for permanent fence sitting?

Labour are in a perilous decision, however, by jettisoning all positions that lead to Leave, they at least align themselves with future generations (and the 18-44s).

A reasonably stable Labour view would emerge and they would be in a very strong position if it wasn't for the couple of communists on the front bench.

 

[Jippy]

There’s no such thing as a neutral outcome with Brexit. It’s impossible to bring both sides to a consensus. Feck David Cameron.

Was having a debate with someone yesterday about whether Cameron or May was the worst ever PM. Cameron has to win that for that single catastrophic decision imo, but my friend reckons May for her complete abject ineptitude. Tough call.

 

[Raees]

There isn't a retirement age because older people are incapable of work. It's because workers fought for the right to not work until the day they died!

To claim that a 16 year old has better decision making than a 71 year old is ridiculous.

Depends on the individual. For a decision like Brexit who is going to suffer the long term ramifications of that decision and who is actually better placed to make the judgement call of the globalised nature of modern society and where Britain sits in that hierarchy. For me the older generations proved their decision making isn’t particularly great on the whole and no more to be trusted to think what is best for the country as a whole and the generations to come.

Furthermore I'm sure most people have grandparents who become more wayward in their decision making with age and not quite as sharp as they once were so it’s not extreme to say their decision making ability is somewhat comprised with age.

If not 70 then 75 or 80. The principle behind it is valid for once in a generation votes IMO.

 

[Jippy]

Looks like May out on Friday.

I'm assuming more leave oriented Tory will come in, probably BoJo. No deal / deal won't get past this parliament. Government would fall with the former, latter is a spineless surrender no new leader will contemplate.

Only solution I therefore see. They'll revoke article 50, call a GE, merge with Brexit party and run on a platform of renegotiating a better deal, possibly with no deal voted in the house before even negotiating again.

If they can't win a majority in parliament to do that at a GE, Brexit will be off.

Rees-Mogg on Peston last night said Tories will never have coalition with Brexit Party cos the situation won't arise. He says if Tories deliver Brexit, Farage et al are irrelevant. If Tories don't deliver, they'll be wiped out.
Made more sense the way he explained it (and that's a sentence I never thought I'd type out).

 

[Jippy]

Depends on the individual. For a decision like Brexit who is going to suffer the long term ramifications of that decision and who is actually better placed to make the judgement call of the globalised nature of modern society and where Britain sits in that hierarchy. For me the older generations proved their decision making isn’t particularly great on the whole and no more to be trusted to think what is best for the country as a whole and the generations to come.

Furthermore I'm sure most people have grandparents who become more wayward in their decision making with age and not quite as sharp as they once were so it’s not extreme to say they’re decision making ability is somewhat comprised with age.

If not 70 then 75 or 80. The principle behind it is valid for once in a generation votes IMO.

It's a dead end argument. Besides being patronising, misguided and obnoxious, from a dispassionate perspective, it would be a vote-killer for any party trying to enforce it.

 

[Ixion]

Looks like May out on Friday.

I'm assuming more leave oriented Tory will come in, probably BoJo. No deal / deal won't get past this parliament. Government would fall with the former, latter is a spineless surrender no new leader will contemplate.

Only solution I therefore see. They'll revoke article 50, call a GE, merge with Brexit party and run on a platform of renegotiating a better deal, possibly with no deal voted in the house before even negotiating again.

If they can't win a majority in parliament to do that at a GE, Brexit will be off.

I don't think No Deal needs to get past parliament does it? There were votes on it but May could have ignored them? If someone comes in supporting No Deal I can see it happening.

 

[Oldyella]

What if Johnson does get in as leader? Could he revoke article 50 and then call a GE but tories run on a no deal mandate and hope they get a majority?

 

[Maticmaker]

I don't think No Deal needs to get past parliament does it? There were votes on it but May could have ignored them? If someone comes in supporting No Deal I can see it happening.

The EU have said its the withdrawal deal or no deal, doesn't really matter what our MP's say then does it?

It's a dead end argument. Besides being patronising, misguided and obnoxious, from a dispassionate perspective, it would be a vote-killer for any party trying to enforce it.

Unfortunate choice of words there, but I agree with you!

Rees-Mogg on Peston last night said Tories will never have coalition with Brexit Party cos the situation won't arise. He says if Tories deliver Brexit, Farage et al are irrelevant. If Tories don't deliver, they'll be wiped out.
Made more sense the way he explained it (and that's a sentence I never thought I'd type out).

Yes JRM does have a way of explaining things well, pity about the rest of his credentials, might have made a good PM!

 

[Maticmaker]

Maybe because he wants to find out what the rest of the country think in 2019? He can speak for himself but it confuses me why some people jump to the assumption that those wanting a 2nd ref only want it if they get their preferred result.

In my mind everyone should be okay with a second vote but clearly I'm missing something...

Do you really think everyone who says they want a second referendum, would be advocating one if the result had gone their way first time...seriously?

 

[Smores]

Do you really think everyone who says they want a second referendum, would be advocating one if the result had gone their way first time...seriously?

But what situation would have occured to warrant another vote? If the EU doubled the contribution or insisted on an army then maybe perhaps you'd have justification for another.

The justification now is that we have new information.

 

[Jippy]

The EU have said its the withdrawal deal or no deal, doesn't really matter what our MP's say then does it?



Unfortunate choice of words there, but I agree with you!



Yes JRM does have a way of explaining things well, pity about the rest of his credentials, might have made a good PM!

The EU have said its the withdrawal deal or no deal, doesn't really matter what our MP's say then does it?



Unfortunate choice of words there, but I agree with you!



Yes JRM does have a way of explaining things well, pity about the rest of his credentials, might have made a good PM!

He talks well, just shame about his odious views and policies! His comment about his book being the only thing to get worse reviews than May's deal did make me chuckle though.

 

[Ekkie Thump]

Do you really think everyone who says they want a second referendum, would be advocating one if the result had gone their way first time...seriously?

Well obviously not because we wouldn't then be mired in the Slough of Despond we currently find ourselves in. We've got constitutional crises left and right, a hamstrung parliament and no obvious and deliverable way of proceeding within our current institutions. That's the situation, irrespective of motive. It's a reasonable, if not necessarily correct, position to hold that a second referendum offers a solution to the impasse, and that goes for Brexiters too.

 

[ThierryHenry]

Was having a debate with someone yesterday about whether Cameron or May was the worst ever PM. Cameron has to win that for that single catastrophic decision imo, but my friend reckons May for her complete abject ineptitude. Tough call.

I think for consistent ineptitude, and the catastrophic failure of calling the last election, May has to take that honour.

 

[Mb194dc]

I don't think No Deal needs to get past parliament does it? There were votes on it but May could have ignored them? If someone comes in supporting No Deal I can see it happening.

What if Johnson does get in as leader? Could he revoke article 50 and then call a GE but tories run on a no deal mandate and hope they get a majority?

Yes he could, BoJo is not a "hard" leaver though, despite what you might read. I expect he would try to negotiate again, with "no deal" as a backup, and try to get a majority at a GE to support that.

Question for me is when it twiggs with Tory leadership hopefuls that with the extension, the EU have the UK over a barrel. We need to revoke before we can do anything.

No deal does need to get past parliament. It can be stopped, and with our current parliament where 500~ MPs oppose leaving without a deal, that is what would happen IMO. MPs can revoke or force the (by changing PM via FTPA if absolutely needed) PM to extend if they don't want no deal, for an election or referendum. Only after that public vote would it then be a realistic outcome in my view.

 

[Fiskey]

Interested to see the results today. I was at a Eurovision party over the weekend, everyone under 30 and everyone was going to be voting for the Brexit party which isn't the narrative you get from the media.