Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion

spiriticon said:
Well it gave them a huge impetus to cross the line into insanity, let's just say. Of course there were plenty of other considerations too.
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If anything this event shows they should have been fastracked into NATO a long time ago, that is the only thing that would have prevented this and the only mistake I can think of on NATO's part.
 
nickm said:
The reason for the blow back is because you are wrong. Ukraine isn't being invaded because it flirted unsuccessfully with NATO. It's being invaded because Putin thinks Ukraine belongs to Russia and he won't tolerate a democratic government there. That is quite clear from Putins own words.
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Putin probably has loads of reasons he attacked Ukraine, but the one he harped on the most in the runup was NATO's expansion to the East. Am I wrong? If I am then I will happily admit it. I'm very eager to be convinced otherwise.
 
harms said:
Please do not post dead bodies anywhere in the thread. If you post social media content with battle damage (things that were destroyed), please spoiler it.
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Sure, spoilering can be done. It's far from the first post in the last few pages to do so though. And dead bodies have been posted for days? I brought it up a few days ago and got no response. [if your comment is a moderation thing] - If it's on a personal note then sure, I'll do that absolutely
 
owlo said:
@Mihai Thanks for reply before. Trying to keep up. I feel so privileged sitting in my warm home in England. Thoughts for every person in Ukraine and videos of those on the island and that young lad dying to blow up a bridge are inspiring. Fighting for something worthwhile. It's not nationalism. It's a home and a way of life.

@Shakesey If your grand strategy as head of NATO is "to give putin what he wants" to avoid war, it's just laughable.
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My grand strategy is to avoid needless suffering if one side has no chance to defeat the other.
 
Shakesey said:
That was the line he kept on peddling, but he probably just used it as an excuse. You're probably right. But if Ukraine was pro-Russian, surely he wouldn't have invaded, would he?
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Tell that to Belarus which now has thousands of Russian troops permanently parked there despite being as pro Russian as you like. Of course the reason Ukraine was not pro Russian is because that was what it's population voted for.
 
owlo said:
Sure, spoilering can be done. It's far from the first post in the last few pages to do so though. And dead bodies have been posted for days? I brought it up a few days ago and got no response. [if your comment is a moderation thing] - If it's on a personal note then sure, I'll do that absolutely
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Read the tag line on the bottom of every page.
 
How is Sean Penn in such a position to have sit down interviews with the Ukrainian president?
 
Shakesey said:
My narrative is that all politicians involved in this disgusting war is not without blame. That's it. Putin is clearly the aggressor. So, how is NATO guilty in any way? They should have given Putin the guarantees he demanded that Ukraine would never be allowed to join them. At least that way Ukrainians wouldn't be dying in a war they can't possibly win right now. That is all I'm saying. I'm not pro-Russian. I'm not pro-Putin. I'm not pro-NATO. The amount of blow back I receive on here when I criticize NATO is surreal. But, I understand why it invokes such passionate responses. This is war time, and the suspicion of treason runs deep.
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I wholeheartedly disagree with this. How, and why, should they do this? If Putin demands no further countries can join NATO, should they just accept that as well? If Putin demands that all former Soviet states have to be kicked out of NATO, or else...?
 
Zoo said:
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Hard to be too critical of India in this case, India is one of several countries that can rightfully claim to have been done dirty over the years by the West (not including the obvious colonialism). They can ill afford to be picky about who they do business with considering the state of the country and extremely high population.
 
Shakesey said:
Putin probably has loads of reasons he attacked Ukraine, but the one he harped on the most in the runup was NATO's expansion to the East. Am I wrong? If I am then I will happily admit it. I'm very eager to be convinced otherwise.
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You are wrong to digest what Putin harps on about, for starters.
 
Putin basically wants to re-establish former Russian colonial empire. The fecking tsar wants all other nations to bow down to him and acknowledge Russia's supremacy. If one does not really want his neighbout country to join a block, one ne needs to give in something as well. That is the way to go.
 
Neo_Mufc said:
What is the value in the EU if one is not part of NATO?
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The EU is a political and economic union. It's not a substitute to NATO and they don't even overlap. NATO is a military coalition and it doesn't defend the EU.
 
Shakesey said:
My grand strategy is to avoid needless suffering if one side has no chance to defeat the other.
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You sound like Neville Chamberlain. Let's give in to his demands that a Sovereign state cannot join international organisations of their own peoples choosing. Lets ignore 2014 and the fact they supplied and promoted the groups who downed a civilian airliner. Shall we make his dinner and tuck him into bed if he asks us to also?
 
Water Melon said:
Putin basically wants to re-establish former Russian colonial empire. The fecking tsar wants all other nations to bow down to him and acknowledge Russia's supremacy. If one does not really want his neighbout country to join a block, one ne needs to give in something as well. That is the way to go.
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This has just been how history has been, and forever will be. Some do it under the table, or create narratives to invade other countries (like the USA) whilst others are more upfront. Its a shame.
 
Smithy89 said:
Absolutely terrifying for Ukraine, Russia has these and Ukraine has nobody.
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This is exactly what Ukraine would become with satellite government. When Chechens had their uprising against Russia, every ounce of sanity was destroyed in Chechnya. They are now completely loyal to Putin, but it has come at an amazing price.
 
tomaldinho1 said:
Read the tag line on the bottom of every page.
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Tagline or no tagline, it's not been happening. Moderation of this thread has been non existent, with staff members perpetuating falsehoods and conspiracy theories along the way. Strange to start moderating it now.

If there are dead, the world should see it. It's not pretty, its not comfortable, nor should it be for anybody.
 
Pintu said:
If Putin can't sell the gaz, he is fecked. Europe imports about €100 billion a year from Russia's Oil & Gaz. We can't know what China has been telling Putin, but they can't buy all the goods.

We have something like a stalemate with Russia in that regard.
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Russia can finically take the hit, we can’t pull natural resources out of this air. Russian oil, gas and coal exports all over Asia, not just China.
 
Skåre Willoch said:
I wholeheartedly disagree with this. How, and why, should they do this? If Putin demands no further countries can join NATO, should they just accept that as well? If Putin demands that all former Soviet states have to be kicked out of NATO, or else...?
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If NATO is going to militarily defend the country then they should never accept his demands.
If NATO is never going to assist the country then they should accept his demands.
 
JPRouve said:
The EU is a political and economic union. It's not a substitute to NATO and they don't even overlap. NATO is a military coalition and it doesn't defend the EU.
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the EU does have defense mechanisms when a member is attacked...Art. 42 VII EUV
it is not solely a economic and political union
 
owlo said:
Tagline or no tagline, it's not been happening. Moderation of this thread has been non existent, with staff members perpetuating falsehoods and conspiracy theories along the way. Strange to start moderating it now.

If there are dead, the world should see it. It's not pretty, its not comfortable, nor should it be for anybody.
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The rules were put in place after people complained, as much as I think it's ridiculous to spoiler and hide it, because it should be seen, just follow the rules and spoiler it.
 
Relevated said:
This has just been how history has been, and forever will be. Some do it under the table, or create narratives to invade other countries (like the USA) whilst others are more upfront. Its a shame.
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This I agree with. When you take those rose tinted glasses off, it is the harsh but ultimate reality.
 
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