Cop in America doing a bad job, again

TheReligion said:
I’ve mentioned it before but the way they Police in the States is a direct result of the gun culture in the country.

I genuinely think if they addressed that then they’d see positive change within policing.
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Absolutely no doubt about it.
 
TheReligion said:
I’ve mentioned it before but the way they Police in the States is a direct result of the gun culture in the country.

I genuinely think if they addressed that then they’d see positive change within policing.
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https://ktla.com/news/local-news/riverside-county-sheriffs-deputy-shot-in-jurupa-valley/amp/
Yup. Got a very close friend that works at Riverside sheriff’s dept and this hit close to home. This scumbag shot and killed a motor officer (just recently graduated motor school) today on a traffic stop. After causing a pursuit he was shot and killed. Access to guns is the biggest problem imo.
 
berbatrick said:
Number of Philly cops out injured drops 31% after Inquirer investigation uncovers abuse
Doctors picked by the police union had diagnosed several hundred officers as being so injured that they couldn’t even testify in court.

https://www.inquirer.com/news/phila...-claims-heart-lung-abuse-reform-20221220.html
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This is a problem in many departments including mine. It’s hard to enforce because of the medical HIPAA laws. Mix that with the physical nature of the job, and the labor laws in place, and you have an environment where abuse of workers comp is relatively easy to carry out.
 
choiboyx012 said:
https://ktla.com/news/local-news/riverside-county-sheriffs-deputy-shot-in-jurupa-valley/amp/
Yup. Got a very close friend that works at Riverside sheriff’s dept and this hit close to home. This scumbag shot and killed a motor officer (just recently graduated motor school) today on a traffic stop. After causing a pursuit he was shot and killed. Access to guns is the biggest problem imo.
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100% agree. It’s why I have never understood why your profession has never been in the vanguard of the fight for gun control.
 
Skizzo said:
most policies come into play because of prior incidents, some just become implemented. You never know how someone will react to being arrested, taken to jail etc, so everyone under arrest goes in handcuffs. If handcuffs spark a resistance in someone before they go on, that’s probably someone that would resist when they get to jail too…so I’d rather them be in handcuffs to avoid that issue arising. I also wouldn’t want to be driving someone to jail that is under arrest for whatever It may be, and sat in a car with them unrestrained. Lots of people are chill until they find out they’re about to go to jail, or until the reality sets in as we get there.

and by policy I mean anyone that’s arrested goes in handcuffs. If you’re old, injured, or visibly pregnant, the handcuffs can go in front, otherwise it’s behind the back.
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I understand (even id i dont like it) to be handcuffed just in case and if there is reasonable suspition of a crime at a office discretion but Isnt being handcuffed in a vehicle dangerous? Wasnt a guy killed or paralized because he was handcuffed and on a sharp break from the van he fell knocked his head breaking his neck as he couldnt out his hands in front to protect himself?
 
4bars said:
I understand (even id i dont like it) to be handcuffed just in case and if there is reasonable suspition of a crime at a office discretion but Isnt being handcuffed in a vehicle dangerous? Wasnt a guy killed or paralized because he was handcuffed and on a sharp break from the van he fell knocked his head breaking his neck as he couldnt out his hands in front to protect himself?
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For us, we transport to jail in the regular patrol vehicle (charger, tahoe, or explorer) and they’ll usually be placed in the right rear seat (if the vehicle is equipped with a cage) and then they have their seatbelt put on to avoid issues like that. If I remember correctly, there were other issues with that incident you mentioned…mainly no seatbelts, and then horrendous medical care (or lack of) by placing him on the floor and leaving him in the cell when he was already complaining of being unable to move.
 
I believe there may be a large exodus occurring with Officers leaving the job over in the US. There have also been similar issues here in Australia, recruitment can't keep up with those leaving.

Why would you want to do that job over in the US? Dangerous, poorly trained, inadequately equipped, the pay is average, it seems that the majority of the population has some level of distrust to outright hatred, thanks to the actions of a (inexcusable) minority.
 
cesc's_mullet said:
I believe there may be a large exodus occurring with Officers leaving the job over in the US. There have also been similar issues here in Australia, recruitment can't keep up with those leaving.

Why would you want to do that job over in the US? Dangerous, poorly trained, inadequately equipped, the pay is average, it seems that the majority of the population has some level of distrust to outright hatred, thanks to the actions of a (inexcusable) minority.
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The pay and benefits is actually pretty good and an attractive factor in recruitment. You’re obviously not getting former aerospace engineers or doctors, but for everyone else in the middle to lower class spectrum, getting into entry-level law enforcement is an attractive and attainable option if you have an interest. And the majority of those who apply are not in careers making 6 figures or working long dead-end jobs to make ends meet. It can be a long and arduous process to get hired, but the requirements to apply are very basic (20.5 years old, high school diploma). As long as you can pass the rest of the process you’re looking at a rewarding career doing something more exciting than sitting in a cubicle or whatever part-time gigs you were doing before.

but you are correct that hiring isn’t keeping up with the retirements and those leaving the field. Just look at any department website and most of them are offering $5000-25000 signing bonuses to recruits and experienced officers. My own department has not kept up with inflation and cost of living, and we lost around 50 officers in the last 2-3 years. Most were newer officers that were enticed by these higher paying departments offering these incentives and other bonuses that ours doesn’t. City politics and internal department drama also play a role in job dissatisfaction and officers leaving. I honestly don’t think the whole anti-police rhetoric is a factor in recruitment and retention, though it may be used for fear mongering and media posturing.There will always be people that hate cops, but there will always be those that are attracted to the job too.
 
choiboyx012 said:
The pay and benefits is actually pretty good and an attractive factor in recruitment. You’re obviously not getting former aerospace engineers or doctors, but for everyone else in the middle to lower class spectrum, getting into entry-level law enforcement is an attractive and attainable option if you have an interest. And the majority of those who apply are not in careers making 6 figures or working long dead-end jobs to make ends meet. It can be a long and arduous process to get hired, but the requirements to apply are very basic (20.5 years old, high school diploma). As long as you can pass the rest of the process you’re looking at a rewarding career doing something more exciting than sitting in a cubicle or whatever part-time gigs you were doing before.

but you are correct that hiring isn’t keeping up with the retirements and those leaving the field. Just look at any department website and most of them are offering $5000-25000 signing bonuses to recruits and experienced officers. My own department has not kept up with inflation and cost of living, and we lost around 50 officers in the last 2-3 years. Most were newer officers that were enticed by these higher paying departments offering these incentives and other bonuses that ours doesn’t. City politics and internal department drama also play a role in job dissatisfaction and officers leaving. I honestly don’t think the whole anti-police rhetoric is a factor in recruitment and retention, though it may be used for fear mongering and media posturing.There will always be people that hate cops, but there will always be those that are attracted to the job too.
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This is mind boggling. This is the breakdown of the last 3 cities I have lived in by their state

- Alabama: 30% of total city budget
- Wisconsin: 31% of total city budget
- NC: 28% of total city budget

Where the hell are those millions of dollars going?
 
WI_Red said:
This is mind boggling. This is the breakdown of the last 3 cities I have lived in by their state

- Alabama: 30% of total city budget
- Wisconsin: 31% of total city budget
- NC: 28% of total city budget

Where the hell are those millions of dollars going?
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30% of the city budget on... police?! That seems bafflingly high.
 
WI_Red said:
This is mind boggling. This is the breakdown of the last 3 cities I have lived in by their state

- Alabama: 30% of total city budget
- Wisconsin: 31% of total city budget
- NC: 28% of total city budget

Where the hell are those millions of dollars going?
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policing ain't cheap. A city could always contract its law enforcement services with the Sheriff's Dept to be more cost-efficient.
 
choiboyx012 said:
policing ain't cheap. A city could always contract its law enforcement services with the Sheriff's Dept to be more cost-efficient.
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It’s still outrageous. In WI our street was in rough shape, as were many residential streets, but the entire public works budget was 9% of the budget. Health and Human Services? 2%.
Lots of new police SUV’s every year though, so at least they had good suspensions when traversing the hundreds of potholes.
 
WI_Red said:
It’s still outrageous. In WI our street was in rough shape, as were many residential streets, but the entire public works budget was 9% of the budget. Health and Human Services? 2%.
Lots of new police SUV’s every year though, so at least they had good suspensions when traversing the hundreds of potholes.
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Well my way in MO the local populace determine the levels of spending on things like police vehicles thru taxes, sometimes you get what you're willing to pay for
 
Red in STL said:
Well my way in MO the local populace determine the levels of spending on things like police vehicles thru taxes, sometimes you get what you're willing to pay for
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Tax revenue was not the problem. We paid double in WI than what we are currently paying in NC and our house here cost quite a bit more.

Anyways, the budget of the city in WI we lived in was developed by the mayor and voted by the city council, The only input the local populace had was to talk to their council people or address the council during community inpu hours. So around your way in MO the citizens determine on how the budget is spent? How do you do that (votes/resolutions/etc.)? I would be interested in knowing as it would be an interesting concept to look into.
 
WI_Red said:
Tax revenue was not the problem. We paid double in WI than what we are currently paying in NC and our house here cost quite a bit more.

Anyways, the budget of the city in WI we lived in was developed by the mayor and voted by the city council, The only input the local populace had was to talk to their council people or address the council during community inpu hours. So around your way in MO the citizens determine on how the budget is spent? How do you do that (votes/resolutions/etc.)? I would be interested in knowing as it would be an interesting concept to look into.
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Some spending issues are voted on by propositions, not all of it or even most of it, in my city, which is a small one, there's an additional tax on tag renewal and car purchases that goes towards a specific thing (can't remember what) - it was voted for by a proposition and lasts for a set period of time, I've seen other propositions like that for specific equipment for schools and the parks dept.

Not sure how widespread this is but it's a common thing in MO, every election there are propositions at city, county and state level for specific funding, some pass and some don't.
 
TheReligion said:
It’s very different here in it UK in terms of that.

There’s no handcuffing policy and you’d be required to give justification for doing so.

I simply feel the moment you start trying to make certain things mandatory is the moment officers stop thinking for themselves. That said policy can be broken as people often forget. I certainly wouldn’t be handcuffing a frail elderly person or a young child.
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It’s been a while… I was in Lothian and Borders down in the Borders (Hawick/Gala etc). Detaining folks no. Arresting we usually did cuff someone unless reasons not too (young, elderly, sick etc).
 
lonelyred said:
But why is it a policy? Looks unnecessary in so many cases. It sometimes feels there are arrests that even would not provoke "resistance" if the cuffs were not involved (I believe there are examples of some other countries showing that)

Also, when you say it's a policy, does it mean it's just a kind of customary/recommended practice or is it a regulated, mandatory procedure?

(Anyway, thanks for replying to my pretty old post.)
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In the US it's common sense given that anyone they arrest could be armed
 
cesc's_mullet said:
I believe there may be a large exodus occurring with Officers leaving the job over in the US. There have also been similar issues here in Australia, recruitment can't keep up with those leaving.

Why would you want to do that job over in the US? Dangerous, poorly trained, inadequately equipped, the pay is average, it seems that the majority of the population has some level of distrust to outright hatred, thanks to the actions of a (inexcusable) minority.
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Here in Indonesia people bribe to become a policeman (the amount of bribe is equal to my 4 year income).
 
nimic said:
They shouldn't have anyway. Besides, we've got a thousand examples of cops getting new jobs in law enforcement basically immediately after getting fired, and on top of that it's a job-seeker's labour market right now.
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If only life was a simple as that
 
nimic said:
Sometimes it has to be hard, if you want to make the right decision.
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When it comes to making the right decision you put your family first - not every one can afford to be principled when it comes to their job, and irrespective of the circumstances and the pointlessness of this case the law as being broken, as an LEO you don't usually get to choose which ones you enforce or don't enforce if your bosses orders you to
 
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