Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less

Raoul said:
Thats between those involved in the conflict. The Houthis are not one of the parties and them attempting to insert themselves into it will only result in their own destruction by way of military action inside Yemen.
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I think this is an overestimation of what the US or UK are prepared to do inside Yemen. Nothing indicates that there'll be any scale of US/UK action that could lead to the destruction of the Houthis. That'd be a substantial jump from what's being currently being planned.
 
jadaba said:
I think this is an overestimation of what the US or UK are prepared to do inside Yemen. Nothing indicates that there'll be any scale of US/UK action that could lead to the destruction of the Houthis. That'd be a substantial jump from what's being currently being planned.
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I agree that it won’t escalate if things are generally kept low key tit for tat. But the moment a ship goes down or someone dies the gloves are likely to come off.
 
Bosnian_fan said:
They are bad, but USA and western world have no moral high ground from which to shout at Russia and China. The only freedom and democracy they are protecting is the one that serves their interests. Which kind of makes them Russian and Chinese equals.
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No arguments from me. I've always suspected the west are the apex oppressors, this has just clarified it.
 
Tibs said:
So by by delaying shipments, whilst killing nobody, Yemeni people will be butchered, just like the people of Gaza.

But the same countries crying over delayed shipments, are totally fine with the massacre in Gaza.

Make it make sense
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We have been ignoring at least 7 ongoing genocides at the moment.
 
maniak said:
What Raoul means is that these guys are costing us money, so they have to be dealt with, they're automatically terrorists. The guys butchering children by the thousands in yemen are, of course, strategic partners. Such as israel, strategic partner in the middle east. Gazans are terrorist supporting muslims, so it's not pretty but they brought it on themselves.

People like Raoul look at all of this as big strategy videogame where you make some decisions here and there, you slide a few bars here and there and then you get a positive outcome for your country or your allies. Of course in a videogame you get a little pop up saying your decision caused the deaths of a few thousand people, but you click and move on. In reality you have to justify it by saying "it's realpolitiks baby" and that's why some argue in a way that paints people pointing out the hypocrisy as naive, virtue signalling social media addicts or just plain ignorant about how "the real world" works.

Americans and westerners in general live completely isolated from the horror these decisions cause in some parts of the world and analyze political decisions based on the outcome for their country. In the end, some houthis will be slaughtered, saudi arabia will bomb a few more children, maybe gazans will be exterminated, but our politicians will go on tv saying we're much safer, maybe the price of gas will drop a bit and our amazon orders will always arrive on time. How is that not a positive outcome?

Sure, lots will suffer, but hasn't the world been like that since the dawn of time. What are you gonna do? I bet you even use stuff made in china, so just shut up, you hypocrite. And after all, they hate us anyway, because they hate freedom, so feck them.

Sigh.
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Very true, killing 1000's of women and children is OK for these assholes but as soon as you mess with the money the bombs will drop . In a way I think it's a good thing, eventually actions like these will have a consequence and will hopefully one day lead to the cnuts influence being reduced in the region. It won't be easy but eventually they will go out albeit kicking and screaming.
 
maniak said:
What Raoul means is that these guys are costing us money, so they have to be dealt with, they're automatically terrorists. The guys butchering children by the thousands in yemen are, of course, strategic partners. Such as israel, strategic partner in the middle east. Gazans are terrorist supporting muslims, so it's not pretty but they brought it on themselves.

People like Raoul look at all of this as big strategy videogame where you make some decisions here and there, you slide a few bars here and there and then you get a positive outcome for your country or your allies. Of course in a videogame you get a little pop up saying your decision caused the deaths of a few thousand people, but you click and move on. In reality you have to justify it by saying "it's realpolitiks baby" and that's why some argue in a way that paints people pointing out the hypocrisy as naive, virtue signalling social media addicts or just plain ignorant about how "the real world" works.

Americans and westerners in general live completely isolated from the horror these decisions cause in some parts of the world and analyze political decisions based on the outcome for their country. In the end, some houthis will be slaughtered, saudi arabia will bomb a few more children, maybe gazans will be exterminated, but our politicians will go on tv saying we're much safer, maybe the price of gas will drop a bit and our amazon orders will always arrive on time. How is that not a positive outcome?

Sure, lots will suffer, but hasn't the world been like that since the dawn of time. What are you gonna do? I bet you even use stuff made in china, so just shut up, you hypocrite. And after all, they hate us anyway, because they hate freedom, so feck them.

Sigh.
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Great post.
 
Dirty Schwein said:


Crazy that not a single one stepped up.
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Their morality compass swings in the direction of their own interests. It would've surprised me that one of the freedom merchants actually did step up.

Whatever the outcome, this hearing is still a historic moment. No one dared to so openly stand against Israel, the blow to the reputation of the latter is absolutely massive, and the Palestinian question isn't going away anytime soon.

There's never been case of ongoing genocide that's been so explicitly stated by the perpetrator and so well documented. It will also be the final nail in the western credibility's coffin if Israel is cleared.
 
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It's funny how Piers Morgan kept asking his pro Palestine guests where the "Nelson Mandela" figure is in all of this war (obviously the white-washed version of him), and here we have Nelson Mandela's grandsons in an international trial where they oppose the atrocities that are happening right now.
 
I find it funny how people have no problem with party x using the stick to get what they want but then cry foul when the people with big sticks come in the room to get what they came for.
 
Abizzz said:
I find it funny how people have no problem with party x using the stick to get what they want but then cry foul when the people with big sticks come in the room to get what they came for.
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Is it something specific that's entertaining you so much right now, or is it more like a general observation?
 
Abizzz said:
I find it funny how people have no problem with party x using the stick to get what they want but then cry foul when the people with big sticks come in the room to get what they came for.
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That is one of the most disingenuous and most repulsive takes I've read in this thread.
 
Abizzz said:
I find it funny how people have no problem with party x using the stick to get what they want but then cry foul when the people with big sticks come in the room to get what they came for.
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Said the master, with his whip, to his slave.
 
NotThatSoph said:
Is it something specific that's entertaining you so much right now, or is it more like a general observation?
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It's a general observation. For some it's always ok to use might as long as no one mightier shows up... even recommendable to some. Then when someone else uses their tactic with more capability it's suddenly bloody murder.
 
Abizzz said:
It's a general observation. For some it's always ok to use might as long as no one mightier shows up... even recommendable to some. Then when someone else uses their tactic with more capability it's suddenly bloody murder.
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Ah.

Why did you feel the need to share that in this thread, what's the relevance to either the Israel-Palestine conflift generally or this thread specifically?
 
maniak said:
What Raoul means is that these guys are costing us money, so they have to be dealt with, they're automatically terrorists. The guys butchering children by the thousands in yemen are, of course, strategic partners. Such as israel, strategic partner in the middle east. Gazans are terrorist supporting muslims, so it's not pretty but they brought it on themselves.

People like Raoul look at all of this as big strategy videogame where you make some decisions here and there, you slide a few bars here and there and then you get a positive outcome for your country or your allies. Of course in a videogame you get a little pop up saying your decision caused the deaths of a few thousand people, but you click and move on. In reality you have to justify it by saying "it's realpolitiks baby" and that's why some argue in a way that paints people pointing out the hypocrisy as naive, virtue signalling social media addicts or just plain ignorant about how "the real world" works.

Americans and westerners in general live completely isolated from the horror these decisions cause in some parts of the world and analyze political decisions based on the outcome for their country. In the end, some houthis will be slaughtered, saudi arabia will bomb a few more children, maybe gazans will be exterminated, but our politicians will go on tv saying we're much safer, maybe the price of gas will drop a bit and our amazon orders will always arrive on time. How is that not a positive outcome?

Sure, lots will suffer, but hasn't the world been like that since the dawn of time. What are you gonna do? I bet you even use stuff made in china, so just shut up, you hypocrite. And after all, they hate us anyway, because they hate freedom, so feck them.

Sigh.
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Stellar post. It's beyond repulsive seeing the thought processes of some posters on here.
 
NotThatSoph said:
Ah.

Why did you feel the need to share that in this thread, what's the relevance to either the Israel-Palestine conflift generally or this thread specifically?
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It was in reference to those claiming the UK/US have no moral right to protect their shipping interests from houthi missiles and helicopters.

Perhaps the wrong thread to make that statement but it was what was being discussed right before my post.
 
Abizzz said:
I find it funny how people have no problem with party x using the stick to get what they want but then cry foul when the people with big sticks come in the room to get what they came for.
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Like this particular post. Just zero factual basis, nonsense strung together from their parent's basement.
 
Abizzz said:
It was in reference to those claiming the UK/US have no moral right to protect their shipping interests from houthi missiles and helicopters.

Perhaps the wrong thread to make that statement but it was what was being discussed right before my post.
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Who has claimed that the UK/US have no moral right to protect their shipping interests?

During the last decade, hundreds of thousands of people have died due to the Yemeni civil war. Millions displaced. Some people seem to be worried that the US and the UK getting more involved than they already are will make things even worse for the already suffering civilian population. I don't really see the comedy in that.
 
NotThatSoph said:
Who has claimed that the UK/US have no moral right to protect their shipping interests?

During the last decade, hundreds of thousands of people have died due to the Yemeni civil war. Millions displaced. Some people seem to be worried that the US and the UK getting more involved than they already are will make things even worse for the already suffering civilian population. I don't really see the comedy in that.
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I mean it's on the previous page of this very thread...

And yes, I didn't say it was a comedy that people are dying. I made my observation about people who have no problem with random civilians being attacked as long as it's somehow marginally in their interest. But thanks for clarifying your own point of view.
 
Abizzz said:
I mean it's on the previous page of this very thread...

And yes, I didn't say it was a comedy that people are dying. I made my observation about people who have no problem with random civilians being attacked as long as it's somehow marginally in their interest. But thanks for clarifying your own point of view.
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No one on the previous page said that the ship attacks were ok, or that the UK and US aren't allowed to defend themselves.
 
maniak said:
What Raoul means is that these guys are costing us money, so they have to be dealt with, they're automatically terrorists. The guys butchering children by the thousands in yemen are, of course, strategic partners. Such as israel, strategic partner in the middle east. Gazans are terrorist supporting muslims, so it's not pretty but they brought it on themselves.

People like Raoul look at all of this as big strategy videogame where you make some decisions here and there, you slide a few bars here and there and then you get a positive outcome for your country or your allies. Of course in a videogame you get a little pop up saying your decision caused the deaths of a few thousand people, but you click and move on. In reality you have to justify it by saying "it's realpolitiks baby" and that's why some argue in a way that paints people pointing out the hypocrisy as naive, virtue signalling social media addicts or just plain ignorant about how "the real world" works.

Americans and westerners in general live completely isolated from the horror these decisions cause in some parts of the world and analyze political decisions based on the outcome for their country. In the end, some houthis will be slaughtered, saudi arabia will bomb a few more children, maybe gazans will be exterminated, but our politicians will go on tv saying we're much safer, maybe the price of gas will drop a bit and our amazon orders will always arrive on time. How is that not a positive outcome?

Sure, lots will suffer, but hasn't the world been like that since the dawn of time. What are you gonna do? I bet you even use stuff made in china, so just shut up, you hypocrite. And after all, they hate us anyway, because they hate freedom, so feck them.

Sigh.
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It borders on sociopathy for me.

Excellent post, like others have already said.
 
The airstrikes feel very conveniently timed to knock claims of Israeli genocide off the front page don't they. Just a coincide I'm sure.
 
Sweet Square said:
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I'm genuinely surprised that Israel decided to defend the claim of genocide, as their argument that it isn't one was always going to be ridiculous. Assumed they'd take the US/Russia stance of ignoring the ICJ/ICC (even if Israel are signatory to it).

Not like a move like that could discredit them further.
 
Israel is delusional, the whole country is mentally ill. The accusations they make are just insane.
 
Spark said:
I'm genuinely surprised that Israel decided to defend the claim of genocide, as their argument that it isn't one was always going to be ridiculous. Assumed they'd take the US/Russia stance of ignoring the ICJ/ICC (even if Israel are signatory to it).

Not like a move like that could discredit them further.
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It's only the most lovely countries that don't recognise the court. China, Russia, Qatar, Israel and the US. Thing is that if the court should rule a cease fire the other countries that do accept and recognise the court can not and should not stand by their support of Israel, that is what I am hoping for. I know Israel won't give a shit about any ruling.
 
There was a Jewish, genocide/holocaust professor on CNN yesterday that basically obliterated any Israeli argument.
Unfortunately, he said a verdict in favour of South Africa was still unlikely.
Even the former Israeli emissary to the UN blasted Netanyahu and co.
 
Denis79 said:
It's only the most lovely countries that don't recognise the court. China, Russia, Qatar, Israel and the US. Thing is that if the court should rule a cease fire the other countries that do accept and recognise the court can not and should not stand by their support of Israel, that is what I am hoping for. I know Israel won't give a shit about any ruling.
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I think Israel does? If they don’t and still went then it’s even more perplexing.

Also don’t think the court will rule for a ceasefire, but rather whether Israel is guilty of genocide. Sadly I think the final judgement might take years.


Agree overall though, hopefully something happens quickly to make moral support of Israel impossible for governments (actual genocide not withstanding).
 
Spark said:
I think Israel does? If they don’t and still went then it’s even more perplexing.

Also don’t think the court will rule for a ceasefire, but rather whether Israel is guilty of genocide. Sadly I think the final judgement might take years.


Agree overall though, hopefully something happens quickly to make moral support of Israel impossible for governments (actual genocide not withstanding).
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Only 6 countries do not recognise the court from what I've read, Israelis one of them. The others are US, China, Russia, Libya, Qatar,
 
maniak said:
What Raoul means is that these guys are costing us money, so they have to be dealt with, they're automatically terrorists. The guys butchering children by the thousands in yemen are, of course, strategic partners. Such as israel, strategic partner in the middle east. Gazans are terrorist supporting muslims, so it's not pretty but they brought it on themselves.

People like Raoul look at all of this as big strategy videogame where you make some decisions here and there, you slide a few bars here and there and then you get a positive outcome for your country or your allies. Of course in a videogame you get a little pop up saying your decision caused the deaths of a few thousand people, but you click and move on. In reality you have to justify it by saying "it's realpolitiks baby" and that's why some argue in a way that paints people pointing out the hypocrisy as naive, virtue signalling social media addicts or just plain ignorant about how "the real world" works.

Americans and westerners in general live completely isolated from the horror these decisions cause in some parts of the world and analyze political decisions based on the outcome for their country. In the end, some houthis will be slaughtered, saudi arabia will bomb a few more children, maybe gazans will be exterminated, but our politicians will go on tv saying we're much safer, maybe the price of gas will drop a bit and our amazon orders will always arrive on time. How is that not a positive outcome?

Sure, lots will suffer, but hasn't the world been like that since the dawn of time. What are you gonna do? I bet you even use stuff made in china, so just shut up, you hypocrite. And after all, they hate us anyway, because they hate freedom, so feck them.

Sigh.
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Without wanting to personalize, absolutely agree
 
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