Didn't Klopp get to the CL final in his 2nd season and won it in his 3rd while finishing 4th, 4th and 2nd in the league?
Or are you counting the half season when he took over for some reason?
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager
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Didn't Klopp get to the CL final in his 2nd season and won it in his 3rd while finishing 4th, 4th and 2nd in the league?
Or are you counting the half season when he took over for some reason?
What's his salary at Dortmund like?
The offer of £9m a year might suddenly make United his 'dream job'.
If you are bolding the players that were manager driven, then Mount should definitely be bolded as well. ETH obviously wanted him for the 4141 formation that he changed to this season, and he's a player that he's wanted previously at Ajax. Obviously he struggled at the start of the season and then had injury woes so he's not first choice anymore, but he was from the beginning.
Oh I'd agree mate, but I didn't include him as there's no clear and obvious Ten Hag link like the others. Ex player, ex Ajax, Dutch.
Europa and UCL points clearly!!
I don’t know why people entertain these awful stat comparisons. Theres always caveats. I mean Arteta and Klopp didn’t have a full first season.
No idea where they're getting an extra 10 games from to be honest. But yeah awful graphics with made up stats.
And we know why half seasons are being included. But you just know that Ten Hag definitely wouldn't be judged by the same people for a half season with no tranfer window or pre-season.
Not half season. He took over from week 8. 81% of the season left.
As a foreigner I don’t know much about Ratcliffe, is he the kind of overly patriotic person who’s vision would be blurred with wanting a British manager?
It's was widely reported as Club recommended signing by most credible journalists from very beginning so no it wasn't Ten Hag Suggestion .
This. As someone says, here comes the new boss…
Well it's been reported that EtH pushed hard for Kane and Hojlund is at a very different stage of his career, idk why he'd go from wanting guaranteed goals to wanting raw potential. That plus the fact that Hojlund hadn't worked with EtH before and only switched to the same agency after becoming aware of our interest makes me think it wasn't an EtH transfer.
You think it's 8/12 EtH signings but I'd say Hojlund and Eriksen are club signings, so half club and half EtH signings/suggestions.
I think Murtough was just very weak and probably under qualified for his position. Ole had a veto as well but whoever else was making recruitment decisions at that point seems to have had more authority.
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Liverpool aren't as big in PL terms and commercial terms, we are a bigger brand. But even Liverpool was a mamouth task.
The ETH out extremists are loud, aren’t they
Liverpool were also in worse shape than United. Outside of the season they placed 2nd with Suarez on insane form, they had been very mediocre for years and almost never qualified for the Champions League.
They weren't in worse shape. They had a much better footballing structure in place set up for success, which is actually why Klopp went to them and said no to us.
So he's the worst ppg of the 3 and not the bestHow exactly did Ten Hag manage 86 league games over 2 seasons when there are only 38 per season meaning 76 over two seasons?
75 points in 22-23 and 60 points in 23-24 gives Ten Hag 1.77 PPG not 1.95.
Liverpool were in worse shape by the standard of quantitative data that we can actually compare directly: league position and points over X amount of seasons. This relates directly to the quality of the players on the squad.
Immaterial when you consider a rebuild, both clubs needed an overhaul but Liverpool had a structure set up for continued success with actual footballing people in footballing roles and a superb scouting set up. Quantitative data on pitch changes very quickly if you're set up structurally.
It doesn’t matter, they had the STRUCTURE.
Not a chance Eriksen was a club signing mate. Kane was never happening so I don't know how much stock put into those rumours. Plus it was reported he wanted two strikers anyway.
Why would Hojlund switch to the same agency as Ten Hag just as he's moving to United. Complete coincidence?
So both similar situations at a huge clubs.
The team he inherited was incredibly poor. You look back at some of the players he was having to play and realise what a good job he did in getting them playing something like he wanted so early. It's not even comparable to our situation right now. Mignolet, Clyne, Lovren, Skrtel, Moreno, Milner, Henderson, Coutinho, Sturridge, Firmino, Ibe. That was something like the starting 11. What we have now is streets ahead of what Klopp had, and yet people want to draw comparisons between the two
Well, the quote that stevoc was responding to was from Giggsyking who is clearly suggesting that Liverpool's data on the pitch didn't change very quickly: "8th, 4th, 4th, no trophies."
Squad quality doesn’t really matter when you have footballing structure.The team he inherited was incredibly poor. You look back at some of the players he was having to play and realise what a good job he did in getting them playing something like he wanted so early. It's not even comparable to our situation right now. Mignolet, Clyne, Lovren, Skrtel, Moreno, Milner, Henderson, Coutinho, Sturridge, Firmino, Ibe. That was something like the starting 11. What we have now is streets ahead of what Klopp had, and yet people want to draw comparisons between the two
True but that's rarely mentioned much.
In case you miss sarcasm.
The stats are complete nonsense. It says Klopp managed 99 league games in his first two seasons, while Arteta and Ten Hag somehow managed 86. The whole thing is a load of bollocks to be fair.
United is a bigger job but yes you are correct. Both are huge for sure and Klopp is a phenom.
Yes, but klopp had the privilege to try and error almost a full season that Eric did not have. Eric was required to deliver from season 1.
My entire support for not sacking him is he needs more time. What have Arteta shown in his first 3 seasons?
Fair, United is a bigger club with more media pressure for sure.
In case you miss sarcasm.
No not at all, I love a sarcastic reply.
Klopp took a while in his first half of the season but he did get going stylistically and in results swiftly enough.
In one of his latest interviews Tom Brady shared his knowledge and experience of the pros and cons of changing HC (manager).
In essence every new manager needs patience from the owners and fans so there is time implement ideas, changing culture and build a winning mentality. Most times when you sack a HC (manager) the players has to make a mental reset, learning a new playbook (formation, tactic), building a relationship with their new boss and adapt to his visions. That takes energy and slow down the process to develop.
There’re off course times when changing HC (manager) is necessary but those organizations (clubs) who has a habit of sacking their HC (manager) after one or two bad seasons will be in a constant re building process.
From what I can see on social media the phrase “Trusting the process” has become both a buzz word for those who advocates stability and patience and something negative for those who want to achieve a faster way to success.
When it comes to United’s situation its hard to find a consensus with so much vocal fans and the British tabloids who loves to stir supporters on social media.
Most on this place and other social media platforms has a strong initial opinion and very few is willing to be open for changing circumstances and with such a huge fan base the club is vulnerable if they want to be patient with a manager. Owners, CEO’s and people behind sponsors are also humans and they will off course take notice if the media and internet is very vocal and against something.
I don’t envy our new DoF. Whatever he does he will be instantly criticized by some part of the fan base and national media who loves controversies.
In essence every new manager needs patience from the owners and fans so there is time implement ideas, changing culture and build a winning mentality. Most times when you sack a HC (manager) the players has to make a mental reset, learning a new playbook (formation, tactic), building a relationship with their new boss and adapt to his visions. That takes energy and slow down the process to develop.
There’re off course times when changing HC (manager) is necessary but those organizations (clubs) who has a habit of sacking their HC (manager) after one or two bad seasons will be in a constant re building process.
From what I can see on social media the phrase “Trusting the process” has become both a buzz word for those who advocates stability and patience and something negative for those who want to achieve a faster way to success.
When it comes to United’s situation its hard to find a consensus with so much vocal fans and the British tabloids who loves to stir supporters on social media.
Most on this place and other social media platforms has a strong initial opinion and very few is willing to be open for changing circumstances and with such a huge fan base the club is vulnerable if they want to be patient with a manager. Owners, CEO’s and people behind sponsors are also humans and they will off course take notice if the media and internet is very vocal and against something.
I don’t envy our new DoF. Whatever he does he will be instantly criticized by some part of the fan base and national media who loves controversies.
ETH's biggest achievement is ending the season with a win.
It's the most lasting memory every has and has completely swung a huge proportion of fans in his favour.
It's the most lasting memory every has and has completely swung a huge proportion of fans in his favour.
3 consecutive wins.
Glad to see more than half the supporters on the caf wants him to stay. What a comeback from Eric.
The timing was important. We approached Klopp after Moyes, while he was still at Dortmund. Childish approach by Woodward but he probably wasn't leaving in 2014 anyway.
Klopp himself said he rejected Liverpool before too but they came calling when he was out of a job after having a few months break after leaving Dortmund.
Europa and UCL points clearly!!
I don’t know why people entertain these awful stat comparisons. Theres always caveats. I mean Arteta and Klopp didn’t have a full first season.
Arteta also didn't took over a team that was in the top 4, 2 of the previous 3 seasons. We are talking about clubs that weren't in the same context.
If I remember correctly in 2014, he was approached by Real Madrid and Chelsea.
Ah yeah the good old football structure preventing a manager to properly train train his players.