Luka Modric / Signs for Real Madrid
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
There is no way he will go for £30m. I would say £40m.
Worth and actual transfer fee are not related.
Define 'value'?
The going market rate for a player like Modric is £40m+
Because we haven't made any big transfers in 3 years, or even looked like doing so, loads of you still think the market rates are what they are three years ago.
Get with the times ffs
The going market rate for a player like Modric is £40m+
Because we haven't made any big transfers in 3 years, or even looked like doing so, loads of you still think the market rates are what they are three years ago.
Get with the times ffs
I don't know why people live in this world of 2005 transfer fees. Over the last couple of seasons, Ibra's gone for the equivalent of about £65m, Ronaldo for £80, Carroll for £35m and Torres for £50m.
Basically, the price of an outstanding young talent from any league is pretty much twenty million these days - pretty much double what it was five years ago. Hazard is an example - in 2005, he's £10m, now he's closer to £25m.
Modric is going to go, if he does, for £40-50m depending on who's in for him.
EDIT - whoops, post above pretty much said what I'm saying.
Basically, the price of an outstanding young talent from any league is pretty much twenty million these days - pretty much double what it was five years ago. Hazard is an example - in 2005, he's £10m, now he's closer to £25m.
Modric is going to go, if he does, for £40-50m depending on who's in for him.
EDIT - whoops, post above pretty much said what I'm saying.
It's abundantly clear that Modric will not be leaving Spurs this summer - the evidence for this is overwhelming and there is zero evidence to the contrary.
So I don't really know why this thread exists ... except it provides something to chat about I suppose.
So I don't really know why this thread exists ... except it provides something to chat about I suppose.
This is the Transfer Forum where our muppet sides come out!
Exactly, in this market players are worth what teams are willing to pay. When you look at fees in the past couple of seasons it's clear that prices have gone up, and if you cannot get a player for £30m it means he is actually worth more.
He will leave if a proper amount of money is offered. You will not be in Champions League next season and if City do finish ahead of you then they will likely push forward with more signings that would otherwise be out of their reach with no CL football.
But I agree, it is likely he will not move because I do not see a club who would be willing to offer £40m for him - we need him the most but cannot afford it.
Fees have risen ridiculously because the likes of City, Chelsea, Barca and Real have thrown obscene amounts of cash at clubs and players and this is forcing everyone else to give in.
In fairness, I don't think it's as simple as that. I suspect he'll give Spurs at least one more season should they miss out on the CL, even if it is just in order to prove his worth to the top clubs to an even greater extent.
Yes, but if you are not going to match them you are not getting the player. We played our part in 00s too with pricey transfers.
He will stay because no one will come and pay their valuation, if someone approached them and offered them £45m or something they would accept it - just like we would sell Nani, you would sell Nasri and Fabregas etc. Everyone has his price.
Modric will definitely not force a move out though. Not now, nor anytime soon. With that I agree.
Not once have United ever set the transfer market record for a single signing. The Italians drove fees to ridiculous levels in the 90s and then Real jumped in the early 2000s.
In England we were the huge spenders though and have paid significant fees on numerous occassions. You are right that Italians began this though, on the turn of centuries mainly.
The top ones do and there's no reason why your £30 million + attacking central midfielder should not do as much as they do. If you pay that kind of money, a top attacking central midfielder better be what you're getting
You cant expect them to do it every season, but showing they can do it one season isnt too much to ask for. Scholes has shown he can do it, doesnt mean he's going to manage it every season. Modric has not shown he can score and assist regularly. He's only shown that he cant.
Wouldn't be surprised if SAF signed someone as good for £3m.
What central midfielders do assist or score goals in high numbers? The vast majority of ones that do are in fact playing in the most attacking position of a three man midfield. Obviously Xavi does, but he's arguably the best central midfielder I've ever seen plus he plays for that Barca team, so it's a bit unfair to compare to him.
You seem to be getting far too stuck on the 'attacking central midfielder' idea. In a two man midfield you never get one that is particularly attacking these days. Unless you're going back to the early days of Scholes, a player who played next to Roy Keane and had David Beckham doing an insane amount of defensive work for an attacking winger. And even then we constantly got turned over in the CL because teams would sit back and hit us on the break.
Now obviously it's fantastic if we can find a central midfielder who can assist and score a lot as well. But that's a bonus, not a priority. The main thing is that they can create attacking moves constantly for the team as a whole. Push us forward, control the team around, put the opposition on the back foot, all while not leaving us too exposed in defence. If they can bring goals and assists to the party as well, fantastic. If not, it's not a problem.
You seem to be getting far too stuck on the 'attacking central midfielder' idea. In a two man midfield you never get one that is particularly attacking these days. Unless you're going back to the early days of Scholes, a player who played next to Roy Keane and had David Beckham doing an insane amount of defensive work for an attacking winger. And even then we constantly got turned over in the CL because teams would sit back and hit us on the break.
Now obviously it's fantastic if we can find a central midfielder who can assist and score a lot as well. But that's a bonus, not a priority. The main thing is that they can create attacking moves constantly for the team as a whole. Push us forward, control the team around, put the opposition on the back foot, all while not leaving us too exposed in defence. If they can bring goals and assists to the party as well, fantastic. If not, it's not a problem.
More than twos and threes a season is high numbers? There are a bunch of central midfielders who get you 10 goals and assists (combined) a season, or at least have shown that they can do that in a season before, so could do it again.
You mentioned Iniesta... Well this season he has done that already with 7 goals and 3 assists in la liga
Actually Modric wasnt far off in his first season for Spurs. But instead of improving his productivity he's managed less and less. Mind you of course his first season at Spurs he spent most of his time playing wide.
Err, I never mentioned Iniesta. Seeing as he plays in a more attacking role (similar to how VDV plays for Spurs), he's pointless for a comparison. In fact, he's a good example of what I'm talking about. He plays in a similar position as Lampard for Chelsea and what Gerrard has played for Liverpool the last couple of years. Those two blow him out of the water in terms of goals and assists. But Iniesta is the much better player who contributes far more to the team as a whole. And that's playing in a more attacking position where there is even more emphasis on getting goals/assists.
Fletcher has scored and assisted more than Modric this season. Does that mean he's contributed more to the attack? Of course not. How much they contribute to the attack as a whole is far more important than getting a few more personal goals/assists. Especially if there has been a dozen times that Modric (or some other central midfielder) has made a brilliant pass which someone else has then got an easy assist from.
We've got plenty of players who can score the goal. We've got plenty of players who can make the final pass. What we don't have much of is somebody who can create the space and control our attacking moves around.
Fletcher has scored and assisted more than Modric this season. Does that mean he's contributed more to the attack? Of course not. How much they contribute to the attack as a whole is far more important than getting a few more personal goals/assists. Especially if there has been a dozen times that Modric (or some other central midfielder) has made a brilliant pass which someone else has then got an easy assist from.
We've got plenty of players who can score the goal. We've got plenty of players who can make the final pass. What we don't have much of is somebody who can create the space and control our attacking moves around.
Iniesta plays just as deep as Xavi and vice versa. Although you're right you didnt mention him, someone else did 
VDV played the same role at Madrid, sure. At Spurs he plays in the hole behind a forward like Ozil
VDV played the same role at Madrid, sure. At Spurs he plays in the hole behind a forward like Ozil
But if you ask any Spurs fan, they would say Modric has improved since joining yet he has been getting 'less productive'. Goals and assists from midfielder often mean they don't contribute anything else, they are almost playing as strikers in midfield, just to get goals, because they are unable to do anything except from this very well.
Assists and goals mean feck all for midfielders, wingers are supposed to deliver balls to strikers but even for them it isn't that important to have wonderful stats.
And Modric has definitely improved at Spurs.
For one I agree with Scholesy.
And Modric has definitely improved at Spurs.
For one I agree with Scholesy.
Well thats not true at all is it, especially for a player like Modric when he plays wide because he still helps control the game from there. Just not as much as centrally
Obviously Modric should be looking to improve his goals and direct assists. For someone who does get into attacking areas as much as him he probably should have more. But it's not a huge deal. The difference between a total of 5 (which is what he's on track for this season with 2 + 2 already) and a total of 10 isn't that much. If the one with 5 has a significantly better impact on his teams attacking play as a whole, I know which one I'd certainly take.
Personally I only care about a playmaker's abilty to play make. His assist and goal statistics don't matter as much.
Its a good portion of what makes a top central midfielder a top central midfielder. Its just not quite as important as being brilliant in general play.
The thing with Modric is the second part, he's had down for years. So he should have been working hard on adding to his productivity like other central midfielders have done. But as I said, its got less and less in reality. It should be a big consideration when talking about transfer fees because goals win games and make you money. As I said earlier in this thread, Modric can play the role of the current Scholes. But the question is whether thats worth £30-40 million. My opinion is no, for that money you should be looking to get a bit more of the Scholes of old, someone who could affect the scoreline and be a match winner.
Like who? I can't think of that many players that could instantly improve our midfield like Modric.
3rd on my list. And to be honest, I think there are quite a few midfielders who would instantly improve our midfield given the form of Carrick and Fletcher. Nobody is contesting that Modric would do that
It's a bit of a false stat to say that his 'productivity' has got less and less. Two seasons ago he was playing largely on the left wing in a 442. Last season he started that way as well, before moving to a central midfield berth in a 442. Then this season he's played exclusively in the centre areas, sometimes in a 442 and sometimes in a 4231. Also it has to be noted the Spurs strikers this season have been extremely poor which I'm sure has made an impact on Modric's stats.
Who would you pick before Modric? Who out there is proven to have as much impact on the entire attacking system of the team, while also having superior goals and/or assists?
Sahin, Banega, Modric - in that order for me
I'm not saying he's bad or that we shouldnt sign him. But the fees being talked about are only realistic for a buying club if the others cost a lot more, which I dont think is the case. For me the only one worth £30 million or more is Sahin.
I've barely seen anything of Sahin so I won't comment on him. Banega looked extremely good last season, but from what I've heard he's been a bit poor this season. I'm guessing he has been injured a bit as well, of the couple of times I've watched Valencia this season I've only seen him play once and that was coming off the bench. So he's basically only had one great season. An incredibly promising season, but it's still a big risk to rely on him to be able to come in and do the business straight away.
Modric is much more of a sure bet. These other players might potentially become better, but it's also more of a risk.
Modric is much more of a sure bet. These other players might potentially become better, but it's also more of a risk.
Modric hasnt had such a season. This is the point
Sahin's the best bet for me because he's the form player. But he's also at the side that can offer him trophies, and its rare that we'll sign a starter for the top team in one of the better leagues. If we were to do so, he'd surely be very expensive. But if Modric is going to be £30-40 million
then he might not be much more expensive.Banega was outstanding last season, and has found similar form since about christmas time (although he was really good for Argentina vs. Spain, in Aug or Sept). So yeah he had his injury, he was played out of position and then had a sticky patch in central midfield too. But since the turn of the year he's once again been Valencia's best player imo. Valencia will probably look to sell players again this summer and I think it'd take less than the money talked about for Modric, to tempt them into letting Banega go. I might be wrong
Modric hasnt had such a season. This is the point
Sahin's the best bet for me because he's the form player. But he's also at the side that can offer him trophies, and its rare that we'll sign a starter for the top team in one of the better leagues. If we were to do so, he'd surely be very expensive. But if Modric is going to be £30-40 million
Banega was outstanding last season, and has found similar form since about christmas time (although he was really good for Argentina vs. Spain, in Aug or Sept). So yeah he had his injury, he was played out of position and then had a sticky patch in central midfield too. But since the turn of the year he's once again been Valencia's best player imo. Valencia will probably look to sell players again this summer and I think it'd take less than the money talked about for Modric, to tempt them into letting Banega go. I might be wrong
Stop Bumming Banega!
I don't think it's fare to claim Modric can't produce a season at us like the others have done for their clubs.. With players like Carrick and Fletcher he would get more freedom.
I think i'm right in saying Banega had a falling out with the manager just after xmas and that might be the reason for his poor spell. The value for him wont be what it was last year and I also think the manager would still not have a problem in getting rid of him.
Yes he would get more freedom and hopefully be better than at Spurs. But thats the same for Sahin and Banega isnt it?
Hope we'll go for Sahin instead of Modric. Unlike of most of Croatians I don't see Modric as that special player, neither want him at United and the price tag that's on him is just crazy. Also he stated several times that he's perfectly happy at Tottenham and even thinks they'll have a chance of winning PL in years that follow. So let him stay there any enjoy that dream.
Wouldn't mind any of the three, all good players. If either Ever/Sahin are going to come cheap then they'll probably be realistic targets.
Modric is good, but not 30m good.
Modric is good, but not 30m good.
As good as he is, he doesn't score or create often enough just yet to be in that top bracket of players. You'd like to think he would make a step up if he moved to a bigger team.