Add one more to the "Get Scholesy the feck out of here" brigade.
Anderson
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Add one more to the "Get Scholesy the feck out of here" brigade.
By the way, does anyone still think Anderson is technically better than Guthrie (of Newcastle)?
Modric is better than both of them though
This Fletcher thing is becoming quite irritating that's true.. Since when do we match Anderson with Fletcher anyway??
To write Anderson off is beyond silly there is no need to justify this by comparing him to others.
I do i do.
So why the heck is every Tom, dick and Harry so sure Anderson can't eve become a Scholes like player once he matures? When at his age Scholes himself wasn't even a midfielder at Anderson's current age?
It worked well mainly because by his second year in the role he had Keane to play next to, sparing him any second year blues. Scholes between the age of 24-28 was basically a withdrawn forward playing in midfield, thanks to the superman he had playing alongside him. Even though he has miles better positional sense than most natural forwards. It's when Veron was bought and Keane started to decline that Scholes the play maker and midfield general emerged. Which is why I find writing off a 22 year old Anderson, who will most probably develop in a similar fashion, given the talent he posses and who is coaching him, baffling.
Fair enough.
I don't see what his goals have to do with anything in this thread frankly. Basically at age 21 Scholes was a big hit as a striker in what was far from the best league in the world. In comparison at age 19 Anderson was a big hit in his first season at United, in a side that conquered at home and in Europe. Playing in center midfield role, a role alien to him. Yet now people are writing him off because of some growing pains. It's just laughable.
Wrong. Scholes was changed from a striker aged 23 in the 97/98 season. & he never ousted Butt in his first season in the role, as Keane was out for a full season at that time.
It really isn't by much. Scholes when Veron was signed took a whole season and a half to readjust to a his former position. Yet he was a mature professional. Meanwhile people expect Anderson to take to his current new role we are converting him to, like a fish to water. While being a mere kid in comparison. Would it kill folks on here to wait and see how it all pans out instead of jumping to conclusions?
My you are thick.All I've been saying all along in this thread is folks on here should be patient rather than writing the lad off. Because due to his talent, he is more than likely to succeed in fulfilling his potential rather than fail under the manager and staff we have. But trust you to claim I've said it is a guaranteed thing he will succeed. You're good at such dumb shit.
Erm what's Scholes like player according to you? I mean Scholes had played 3 roles throughout his career. The striker's position, the attacking midfielder position and the deep playmaker's role.
The main reasons why Scholes did well in midfield where because was versatile, he wanted to play and above anything he was a truly world class player. Im sure that he benefited from having Keane at his side too but its more about the fact that with Keano we could afford of playing Scholes (a totally attacking minded midfielder who can't tackle) rather then anything else.
Of course they do. At age 21 Scholes showed that he was a fantastic talent who was capable to score 10 goals in 26 games. By the end of that year no one in the right mind was questioning whether he would have made it at OT. So comparing him with Anderson is quite laughable.
It was between 21 and 23 years of age but I do remember vividly that the change was pretty quick as Scholes adapted to it pretty quickly
In my opinion Scholes never fully re adjusted himself in his former role. In fact we ended up changing the system once again. That's something that I really can't agree with SAF on. You can't switch players roles and pretend that they will do well in them no matter what happens. Players needs consistency to improve and playing players out of position is a rather traumatic process for a player and may end up ruining/damage his career.
Scholes is aged 35 and Anderson 22.
Furthermore between age 19 and 22 Scholes was only a striker. In comparison Anderson has played Attacking midfield, center midfield, defensive midfield (alongside Scholes) and has been tried on the left flank.
Scholes did very well in midfield mainly because Keane was his partner. No other player could have afforded hm the luxuries of his earlier years.
No. I doubt there could be a better thing than playing alongside a Keane when you are not a natural midfielder. The guidance and protection he gave was matched by few in world football.
Bullshit Devlish. This thread is about Anderson becoming a midfielder like Scholes is now. Not about his goals.
Thus Scholes' goal tally aged 21 is irrelevant, for he was striker. Furthermore him being believed a bonafide OT star at 21 is irrelevant to this thread because he wasn't a midfielder at the time.
The only things about Scholes relevant to this thread are that
1) Scholes was not the play maker he is now aged 22. It took him till age 28 to achieve that. So Anderson has time to probably develop in a similar way
2) He wasn't as good a midfielder nor even a midfielder at Anderson's current age. Making the Anderson will never be a Scholes comments laughable. For Scholes wasn't the Scholes we know and love now at age 22 either.
3) Like Anderson, he did struggle at one point in his career with a positional/role change.
Anything outside that is plain laughable to bring up.
Firstly It was when when was 23. As a pretty mature player. It' no surprise it worked out well.
However later in his career a positional/ role switch didn't work as fast. A thing that should make people understand how hard such a thing is, so they should be able to cut Anderson some slack.
But that is not the redcafe way.
I strongly disagree. By the end of the 2003 season, when we had regained the league title, Scholes had just had his best season ever. Having been fantastic in his original role. Becoming our version of Bergkamp but with more goals. We only changed back to 4-4-2 because firstly, SAF decided to sell Veron and second, Keane started to decline rapidly. So we needed someone else to take over his midfield running duties. A thing Scholes was by that time fully ready for.
Bottom line Scholes did adjust. But it took him time. Even as a mature pro. So you can imagine how hard it is for this Brazilian kid of ours.
Well to be fair to hm. His role changing has not damaged many careers yet.
It can be argued it has infact made most careers better. With the glaring exception of Alan Smith.
Has Gibson been failed yet?
Chief, Scholes may have adjusted from striker to midfielder but look at his touch and passing ability. It was easy for him.
Do you feel Anderson has the same levels of technical talent? (He doesn't)
Do you feel Anderson has the same levels of technical talent? (He doesn't)
All I have to add to this thread is that Chief is right !
Oh yes. It was so easy for him that when SAF sent him back to his original position he was shit for a year and average for another half.
Without a doubt. As a teenager I've seen him do stuff Scholes couldn't do at a similar age. So he is likely to be superb when he finally matures under SAF's guidance.
In your opinion.
yes
Wrong. Below is what I rebuffed:
A point that definitely had nothing to do with this season alone. But Anderson in general.
You must have mixed my rebuff with something else. It's you not I who was referring to games this season. So my reply to the above quote was strictly about Anderson in general.
For I won't be caught on here claiming Anderson has not been blowing hot and cold since day one of this season. Game in game out. Basically ''like Liam Miller every second game this season'' as you called it. For that would be ostrich in danger behaviour.
I wasn't accusing you of that, that's for sure.Easy Chief.
I'm not going to go as far as saying Ando is Fergie's love child.
I am still convinced he will come good, more and more so I think it is going to happen at a club besides United
I think if he is going to come good then it will have to happen while at United.
Watching him play what is the biggest problem with his game? To me it's the types of passes he attempts. The West Ham game he showed he is quite capable of those slid balls for people to run on to. But, over his time here he has show the long over the top balls isn't his forte.
For him to be working those hollywood balls all the time, he must be doing them in training to attempt them on the pitch. The coaching staff must see something in it for them not to get him to cut them out completely from his game at this point.
If it's not the coaching staff then don't you think perhaps Rooney, Berbatov or Giggs is not telling him while training - hey don't put that long ball over the top or try thread that ball through a crow of players ? That's not the type of ball we want, where hardly have a chance of it reaching us.
Why is it that one of his first instincts is to play the overly ambitious ball - seems that if is being encouraged to look for those kinds of passes, then that is what he'll do. If he is being told, keep it simple, keep it short, keep it high percentage, then that is what he'll primarily do.
He shoulders a lot of the responsibility of his own development but, have to wonder what is going on in training for him to where he keeps trying things in games that never work.
. He also seems to have an eye for how he wants plays to develop but, can't translate into actual passes that come off. That kind of vision used in other ways that center around his strengths, he's strong, he's got a good ability to run at players, he can deliver a good cross and short passes range being quite good would be a better way to go.
Get him to support the wing where he himself can dribble in or release the winger or even whip in a cross. Not play the quarter back role midfielder spraying long passes around the field.
Watching him play what is the biggest problem with his game? To me it's the types of passes he attempts. The West Ham game he showed he is quite capable of those slid balls for people to run on to. But, over his time here he has show the long over the top balls isn't his forte.
For him to be working those hollywood balls all the time, he must be doing them in training to attempt them on the pitch. The coaching staff must see something in it for them not to get him to cut them out completely from his game at this point.
If it's not the coaching staff then don't you think perhaps Rooney, Berbatov or Giggs is not telling him while training - hey don't put that long ball over the top or try thread that ball through a crow of players ? That's not the type of ball we want, where hardly have a chance of it reaching us.
Why is it that one of his first instincts is to play the overly ambitious ball - seems that if is being encouraged to look for those kinds of passes, then that is what he'll do. If he is being told, keep it simple, keep it short, keep it high percentage, then that is what he'll primarily do.
He shoulders a lot of the responsibility of his own development but, have to wonder what is going on in training for him to where he keeps trying things in games that never work.
. He also seems to have an eye for how he wants plays to develop but, can't translate into actual passes that come off. That kind of vision used in other ways that center around his strengths, he's strong, he's got a good ability to run at players, he can deliver a good cross and short passes range being quite good would be a better way to go.
Get him to support the wing where he himself can dribble in or release the winger or even whip in a cross. Not play the quarter back role midfielder spraying long passes around the field.
There's not many players in the league/world that do.
What Anderson brings to the table is a level of athleticism which Scholes never had, even in his prime.
This can compensate, to an extent, and Anderson can and will improve the other aspects of his game. I don't think anyone can be certain this will make him into a player who is, overall, as effective as Scholes but I wouldn't rule it out just yet.
Spot on Chief.
Dedication is one word for it.....In the FA Cup match, Carrick set up two goals. Champions League match at Old Trafford, Carrick set up O'Shea's winner. At the Emirates Carrick kept Fabregas in his pocket.
In those 3 matches Anderson... Well, he played. But that's about it.
In those 3 matches Anderson... Well, he played. But that's about it.
I think we might be expecting too much, and too soon (see: Darren Fletcher). I think he'll more than justify his transfer fee in time.
All I've been saying all along in this thread is folks on here should be patient rather than writing the lad off. Because due to his talent, he is more than likely to succeed in fulfilling his potential rather than fail under the manager and staff we have. But trust you to claim I've said it is a guaranteed thing he will succeed. You're good at such dumb shit.
My you are such a pompous twat.
You're continually using the progress of other players and how he was better at that stage to show anyone thinking he won't become a great player is wrong. I'm proving that because you're better a certain age and other individuals have had great careers doesn't mean that always happens.
Trust you to not understand what you or others are actually saying.
If Anderson is managed correctly, by the time he's 25 he'll be fast becoming one of the best midfielders in the world. He's a beast, he has the physical, mental and technical attributes to be fantastic. He's already pretty fecking good.
Dont know why I am posting when it is Neil Cuntis but anyway here you go
ANDERSON'S long-term future at Manchester United is in doubt.
The Brazilian midfielder, 21, did not appear at training yesterday.
He is reeling after feeling the full force of boss Alex Ferguson's hairdryer and being dumped from the squad against Hull. Anderson was blasted in the dressing room for his dire display in the 2-1 Carling Cup defeat by rivals City last Tuesday.
He was then furious to be told on Saturday morning he was not even in the squad for that day's league clash with Hull.
Anderson, who insists he was fit to play, did not even stay to watch his team in action. And yesterday he did not appear for training. Anderson's form has been poor this season while the player has been upset at his lack of action.
The £18million central midfielder has not started any of the last three league games and has begun only nine of United's 23 Prem matches this season.
Anderson's last four starts ended in defeat but the tipping point for Fergie came at City when he felt Anderson failed to get a tackle in. He substituted him before saying his display was unacceptable.
Read more: Anderson in hot water after skipping Manchester United training | The Sun |Sport|Football
ANDERSON'S long-term future at Manchester United is in doubt.
The Brazilian midfielder, 21, did not appear at training yesterday.
He is reeling after feeling the full force of boss Alex Ferguson's hairdryer and being dumped from the squad against Hull. Anderson was blasted in the dressing room for his dire display in the 2-1 Carling Cup defeat by rivals City last Tuesday.
He was then furious to be told on Saturday morning he was not even in the squad for that day's league clash with Hull.
Anderson, who insists he was fit to play, did not even stay to watch his team in action. And yesterday he did not appear for training. Anderson's form has been poor this season while the player has been upset at his lack of action.
The £18million central midfielder has not started any of the last three league games and has begun only nine of United's 23 Prem matches this season.
Anderson's last four starts ended in defeat but the tipping point for Fergie came at City when he felt Anderson failed to get a tackle in. He substituted him before saying his display was unacceptable.
Read more: Anderson in hot water after skipping Manchester United training | The Sun |Sport|Football
How much do you reckon we would get?
£12-14M?
£12-14M?
He has been poor and he only has himself to blame, he is capable of so much more and hopefully he stays here to prove it
It's pretty much a non story again by the press. -sigh-
The papers are determined to write someone out of the club this year. Seems the Ronado Madrid affair has gone to their heads. Now if this is true, Anderson does only have himself to blame, I reckon though there wil end up being another disclaimer in the press soon.
This is probably (hopefully) the type of lazy journalism at which Cuntis excels.
Shit performance followed by minor injury which keeps him out of the squad for the next game and the following day's training.
Add two plus two to get five, sprinkle with a bit of sensationalism and hey presto, the article writes itself.
Shit performance followed by minor injury which keeps him out of the squad for the next game and the following day's training.
Add two plus two to get five, sprinkle with a bit of sensationalism and hey presto, the article writes itself.
and just one goal in his account. In 3 f'cking seasons, Great.
Who's next on the list then. We've had Carrick at the beginning of the season. Nani and Anderson, Evans to Madrid, Vidic to Madrid/Barcelona. Berbatov to be sold in the summer. Rooney to Madrid/Barelona etc. My Moneys on Evra being linked to Madrid/Barcelona next.
bags of potential, will he realise that potential.........NO.
has he improved as a player since he´s been at united.......NO
never looks fit and never looks like he´s bothered, lovely lad though, but being a lovely lad does not a united player make!!
has he improved as a player since he´s been at united.......NO
never looks fit and never looks like he´s bothered, lovely lad though, but being a lovely lad does not a united player make!!
That's the point all along. You can't develop a quality playmaker by making him play deep (a role which mainly consist of hassling opponents and win the ball). Anderson need to play in his natural role with two forwards in front of him, a good defensive midfielder at the back and two wingers at his side. Anyway even if he fails to become a first teamer we still need quality cover and Anderson provides that. Scholes and Giggs won't last forever and Hargreaves.......
His "natural role"?You're describing a role he never once played before signing for United.
It's also a role he's generally been a bit shit in, while he's been at United. All his best performances have been as part of a midfield three, he's never once impressed as the creative force in a midfield two.
Cesc aside, there isn't any central midfielders that spring to mind that have lit up the Premiership until they reached their mid-twenties. He is only 21, I think we just need to forget how much he cost and accept that we won't see the best out of him for another few seasons. The price tag is the first thing we think about when he is so poor in games, yet, in his position, who else at 21 stands out? As much as he annoys me to watch him at times, I think he has everything to make it as a great player.
Fingers crossed he get the time and patience to improve to show his potential.
Fingers crossed he get the time and patience to improve to show his potential.
Ouch.
Man Utd playmaker Anderson in new Fergie bust-up
26.01.10 | tribalfootball.com
Anderson is in hot water at Manchester United.
The Sun says the Brazilian midfielder, 21, did not appear at training yesterday.
He is reeling after feeling the full force of boss Alex Ferguson's hairdryer and being dumped from the squad against Hull. Anderson was blasted in the dressing room for his dire display in the 2-1 Carling Cup defeat by rivals City last Tuesday.
He was then furious to be told on Saturday morning he was not even in the squad for that day's league clash with Hull.
Anderson, who insists he was fit to play, did not even stay to watch his team in action. And yesterday he did not appear for training. Anderson's form has been poor this season while the player has been upset at his lack of action.
26.01.10 | tribalfootball.com
Anderson is in hot water at Manchester United.
The Sun says the Brazilian midfielder, 21, did not appear at training yesterday.
He is reeling after feeling the full force of boss Alex Ferguson's hairdryer and being dumped from the squad against Hull. Anderson was blasted in the dressing room for his dire display in the 2-1 Carling Cup defeat by rivals City last Tuesday.
He was then furious to be told on Saturday morning he was not even in the squad for that day's league clash with Hull.
Anderson, who insists he was fit to play, did not even stay to watch his team in action. And yesterday he did not appear for training. Anderson's form has been poor this season while the player has been upset at his lack of action.
He has only himself to blame.
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