And do tell me, where do Monaco's best players from last season currently play? Bernardo Silva and Mendy went to City, Mbappe's gone to PSG, Bakayoko has gone to Chelsea. Let's not forget Monaco also received substantial investment not too long ago. Falcao, for instance, was very important last season and he would not have been there had they not been taken over. Monaco is not a good example, and the dismantling of their squad proves my point. You need a wealthy owner or already established substantial sources of revenue to challenge meaningfully and regularly. As for the rest, Leicester were a 5000/1 shot, Spurs have won nothing, Sevilla have yet to finish above either Barca or Madrid or achieve anything in the Champions League. Atletico is the only legitimate claim, but they are an exception to the norm.
BBC Sport: La Liga asks Uefa to investigate Man City's financial fair play
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
And do tell me, where do Monaco's best players from last season currently play? Bernardo Silva and Mendy went to City, Mbappe's gone to PSG, Bakayoko has gone to Chelsea. Let's not forget Monaco also received substantial investment not too long ago. Falcao, for instance, was very important last season and he would not have been there had they not been taken over. Monaco is not a good example, and the dismantling of their squad proves my point. You need a wealthy owner or already established substantial sources of revenue to challenge meaningfully and regularly. As for the rest, Leicester were a 5000/1 shot, Spurs have won nothing, Sevilla have yet to finish above either Barca or Madrid or achieve anything in the Champions League. Atletico is the only legitimate claim, but they are an exception to the norm.
Wow
I'm fully aware of the facts, but it appears you aren't. What transfer ban? You are fake news.
Also, great detective work to deduce that I am a Manchester City fan based on my username. I mean, it is explicitly stated under my username that I support Man City, but great work nevertheless
Hold on a sec - how many other English clubs have sold players to Chinese clubs? Go on Einstein. Yet Chelsea sold not 1 but 2 players to Chinese clubs and received £100 million in return.
If you know nothing of City's investment in a state of the art academy and training ground plus the amount of land that has been acquired around the stadium on top of that with a view to further developments then you must be living on a different planet to the rest of us.
The fact is you're a hypocrite and a clueless hypocrite at that. I bet you don't even know that much about Chelsea's history. In fact, there's a fair old chance that I know more about your club than you do. You've probably only been supporting Chelsea since Abramovich bought the club and there's more chance of hell freezing over than you being able to name a single player from your line-up that won the 1986 Full Members Cup
Now I suggest you take your sanctimonious bile elsewhere and mither someone else while I'll look forward to Feyenoord away
That's true Monaco are an historical club in France and if we are honest the 2017 team is benefiting from the pre-2013 and 2013 spending sprees.
You just make it up as you go along don't you? Seriously, how many City fans do you actually know? It's funny really because I know literally hundreds and despite us being a bunch of bitter twats where United are concerned, I know of not a single one who ever complained about United's spending before we won the lottery. It was always the accepted norm that United spent big money on players even when you were almost as shit as us at certain points in the 80's and while we moaned about all sorts of other stuff going on at United, spending big money wasn't one of them. A far more accurate description would be us moaning about our own lack of spending but that wouldn't fit your narrative would it?
Wow
I'm fully aware of the facts, but it appears you aren't. What transfer ban? You are fake news.
Also, great detective work to deduce that I am a Manchester City fan based on my username. I mean, it is explicitly stated under my username that I support Man City, but great work nevertheless
Poirot's got nothing on him mate
Agree with this comment.
However, I'd be surprised if UEFA/FIFA do anything about it...
Barca/La Liga are probably sh!itting themselves over potentially losing Messi I bet
Regardless of mine opinion about PSG or City, La Liga can suck a dick, RM and Barca too. Where La Liga have been last couple of seasons, PSG and City didnt get their owners yesterday. Would take merc payers any day then cnut who come out with "lets see if X players is born to play for us".
You dont care that even with our history and superior money generating ways, City have the same chances at pulling in top players as we do simply cos they are bankrolled.
What can they do? I mean, let's face it, if there were even the slightest chance that Uefa could discover any wrong doing in these sponsorship deals they would never have gotten the go ahead. You have to assume these guys would have covered themselves from head to toe. Fools they are not.
Hope I'm wrong.
Whaddya know UEFA arent anti Arab
I don't imagine this will lead to anything. They would have to dig a lot deeper into the legitimacy of certain sponsorship deals which is an issue that I doubt they wish to confront at this point.
For me it is much like a world champion boxer who worked his entire career to develop his skills through good choices and great coaching getting beat by a journeyman pumped full of steroids. It isn't that black and white obviously but it leaves the same taste as far as how impressive I find any of their achievements.
For me it is much like a world champion boxer who worked his entire career to develop his skills through good choices and great coaching getting beat by a journeyman pumped full of steroids. It isn't that black and white obviously but it leaves the same taste as far as how impressive I find any of their achievements.
Do anything about what? An owner investing money in his property? Or companies/funds, that are ironically sponsoring most of the moaners, sponsors football clubs they are linked with?
Once again if it wasn't for PSG, I wouldn't know most of the Qatari companies and I would regularly mix them with Abu Dhabi, which is the all point of the operation. They have basically succeeded.
I never said they were. That was just your own twisted misinterpretation of what I posted.
Anyway, UEFA are still a bunch of inconsiderate twats and their shitty anthem is still getting booed by me in Rotterdam next week, and will continue to be until they reimburse our and Bayern's fans for the CSKA Moscow lock out.
Yeah I thought that was pretty harsh myself. Uefa clearly do not realise the implications of their actions, the cost of ticket to Moscow is the equivalent of 3 months salary to your average City fan from Stockport.
We can all see this, so the question is, why can't these independent accountants. It can only be due to them being lazy, incompetent or corrupt.
To be honest this is kind of the pot calling the kettle black.
PSG are starting to take the piss a little bit, 198m for a player is beyond ridiculous.
But I have no sympathy for real or barca, city getting money has happened, I just accept it now and no league or champions league win will have as much merit as far as I'm concerned.
They will win the CL at some point simply because there is a bottomless pit of cash and at some point they'll stumble across a team/manager that works, they've had the team before just not the manager.
Things could get fun if UEFA actually put in a good system, but there is far too much money being pumped into the game and likely into their pockets so they'll not give a fook
PSG are starting to take the piss a little bit, 198m for a player is beyond ridiculous.
But I have no sympathy for real or barca, city getting money has happened, I just accept it now and no league or champions league win will have as much merit as far as I'm concerned.
They will win the CL at some point simply because there is a bottomless pit of cash and at some point they'll stumble across a team/manager that works, they've had the team before just not the manager.
Things could get fun if UEFA actually put in a good system, but there is far too much money being pumped into the game and likely into their pockets so they'll not give a fook
Wow
I'm fully aware of the facts, but it appears you aren't. What transfer ban? You are fake news.
Also, great detective work to deduce that I am a Manchester City fan based on my username. I mean, it is explicitly stated under my username that I support Man City, but great work nevertheless
I do apologise for that part, my mistake. The ban that I was thinking of was to do with approaching youth prospects, which didnt happen.
Haha there isn't any mention of your team under your username, well not that I can see anyway.
I hold my hands up that I made an embarrassing glaring error. The rest of my point still stands though.
This
don't get me wrong I think people will always get away with what they can. I have no doubt that Madrid for example who already were funded by the state had arrangments with it for a long time would do the same if they could get away with it. I doubt any club would turn down the opportunity but that's why we supposedly have rules in place and if one club gets punished then all our clubs should get punished equally for doing the same or similar things.
I'm sure UEFA have done so regardless. Standard procedure when so much money is involved (at least I hope so).
I admitted I made a mistake to another guy, in that I thought there was a transfer ban. But it was that there was talk of a ban because of tapping up youth prospects. And I apologised for that.
I only know a few and they were like that, obviously I won't know as many as you. Obviously they all won't be like that, which I should have stated. The ones I know are like that though.
If it was La Liga that did this and another association report them, they will be call enemies of football.
Abolish transfers. Make all contract lengths compulsorily to be only 36 months. Players Can only be openly taped up or be approached for new contract 3 months before its due. Make wage cap. Share TV revenue equally to all divisions.
I will destroy football along with its monarches under 6 years.
I will destroy football along with its monarches under 6 years.
UEFA have responded that they shall not comply with the request.
No no.
Just a shady "State backed Loan"
All above board; just like that airport in Valencia no-one uses.
I am quite neutral in this matter. But I am just pointing out how the city of Madrid helping out Real Madrid is not quite the same as a rich prince from Qatar using PSG as his playing ground.
Fair enough mate
Thing is, I think a lot of people - and that even includes some of our own fans - have lost sight of the original reason why the anthem got booed. It started off as a joint protest with Bayern fans at our home game in 2014 as both theirs and our fans had found themselves barred from watching our respective games in Moscow through no fault of their own. To add insult to injury, at the CSKA v City game, about 350 CSKA fans managed to get in when it was the behaviour of their fans in the first place that had led to the ground closure. Now I don't expect UEFA to reimburse every fan every penny they shelled out on travel and accommodation - after all, European away trips aren't all about the football (well, for me they're not) - but some sort of recompense paid out of CSKA's fine surely could've been sorted out.
The trouble is, when it comes down to it UEFA don't give much of a shit about football fans. They don't even trust us enough to serve alcohol in any of the stadia at clubs competing in their competitions yet Heineken are one of the major sponsors of the Champions League ffs!
Spurs have come 2nd in the PL the last two years, Sevilla have regularly won the Europa League, Monaco are regularly in the CL. To me, that's success and I'm sure most football fans are the same. Is it not good enough for mighty City or something?
With La Liga being so vocal about neo-rich clubs, the other clubs in La Liga don't have much hope of being taken over by a rich owner ready to invest his own money in the club. So, all major investments will move to England, France, Italy and Germany. Both Milan clubs, Everton, Leipzig, etc have had major investment in the last few years which will benefit their league. Wolfsburg and Monaco are examples of clubs having rich owners who initially invested a lot of money but later decided to let the clubs run on their own revenue. Both of them have not been majorly affected by it and are doing quite well. The whole point of FFP is to prevent clubs from going bankrupt and not to just prevent spending. So, wouldn't La Liga's stand actually put them in a disadvantage compared to other leagues which welcome such investments? It's a disservice to the clubs in La Liga too as they will miss out on such opportunities. Only Barca and Madrid will benefit from this.
Football needs major reforms but the reforms cannot be led by other rich clubs (I include United in this). It's like Goldman Sachs leading Wall Street reforms (they have and look how that's ended).
Wolfsburg have been the third biggest spenders over the past 10 years (behind Leipzig and Bayern), I very much doubt that the club runs on its own and they did so "well" after VW pulled some investment (after Dieselgate) that they would've been relegated if it wasn't for the relegation playoff.
This model just doesn't work in German football culture, because fans don't accept it. Leverkusen for example should be a very likeable club, they strive to play attacking entertaining football, first they imported a shit load of fancy player, Brazilians in particular, (Lucio, Juan, Ze Roberto, Sergio, Emerson, Berbatov) and they had a lot of iconic players, such as Ulf Kirsten (best Bundesliga goalscorer of the 90s I believe), Ballack and Schneider who were the attacking stars of our national team back then and fading Legends like Schuster and Völler. Later they changed their approach towards signing young players and developing them.
They are basically joined second with Dortmund in the Bundesliga table of the past 20 years, they won an European cup, they made it to the CL final in style and should've won a couple of Bundesliga titles along the way.
What a nice club, they must have lots of fans - right? Wrong. Last season they had the same average attendance as Mainz and Augsburg, their next door neighbours Gladbach and Cologne almost double them. Fortuna Düsseldorf, another neighbour, averaged just 2k less. A club that had one top division season in 20 years and only made it back into the second tier in 09/10.
Hoffenheim had their coach publicly complain about their lack of support last season (which happened to be the most successful by far in their history), so did Wolfsburg, when they were playing CL football.
Leipzig might be the only exception to his, since none of the former DDR clubs managed to stay in Bundesliga after the wall went down, so there is a bit of a vaccuum in eastern Germany. At the same time they are Germany's biggest spenders, even ahead of Bayern, over the past four seasons.
I wouldn't necessarily say these clubs are good for the league either, even if they do well.
First of all Bundesliga tries to sell atmosphere and authenticity and most of these clubs are like the polar opposite of that. Secondly, because they are doomed to be unpopular those clubs stop growing at a certain point, because their success doesn't really translate into sponsorship money and fanbase growth for them. Whereas "proper" clubs could use that success and CL money and grow into a top club.
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My knowledge of Bundesliga is limited to a few clubs. So just want to know, are you saying that clubs like Wolfsburg and Hoffenheim don't get support from their own fans because they were funded by rich owners? I can understand if other fans don't like it but how can their own fans have issues with it?
I think he's being harsh there. Whatever issues he has with the way those clubs are run, there's nothing wrong with the numbers of fans they pull in compared to their natural catchment area. Cologne and Dusseldorf - both fantastic cities I might add - are 2 of the biggest cities in Germany. Wolfsburg, Leverkusen, and Hoffenheim aren't. Hoffenheim is technically a village ffs! Obviously, the football team will draw fans from other settlements in the area but for anyone to have a pop at their crowds is a bit out of order IMO. Leipzig is different to those 3 altogether, and not just because of the vacuum in the old East Germany he mentions but also because it's a far bigger city than the other 3 so their potential ceiling is much higher.
I'm saying that people in Germany basically rather watch and support a second division club than a successful club that's controlled by company or an investor (small hyperbole).
Leverkusen is basically a suburb of Cologne and 15 minutes by train away from Düsseldorf, Bonn is also nearby. There are a couple of million people living nearby who can choose freely which local club they want to support. And the most successful of the lot has (almost) the lowest attendance. I'm not even talking about support across the country here.
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Good luck with that, the formation of the European Super League will be before you finish your statement.
Hold on a sec - how many other English clubs have sold players to Chinese clubs? Go on Einstein. Yet Chelsea sold not 1 but 2 players to Chinese clubs and received £100 million in return.
If you know nothing of City's investment in a state of the art academy and training ground plus the amount of land that has been acquired around the stadium on top of that with a view to further developments then you must be living on a different planet to the rest of us.
The fact is you're a hypocrite and a clueless hypocrite at that. I bet you don't even know that much about Chelsea's history. In fact, there's a fair old chance that I know more about your club than you do. You've probably only been supporting Chelsea since Abramovich bought the club and there's more chance of hell freezing over than you being able to name a single player from your line-up that won the 1986 Full Members Cup
Now I suggest you take your sanctimonious bile elsewhere and mither someone else while I'll look forward to Feyenoord away
So what are you implying? That there's something wrong with selling players to Chinese clubs? Care to provide any proof of wrongdoing on the part of Chelsea dealing with Chinese clubs in the transfer business?
What does City's owners investment in the academy and training ground have to do with what we're discussing here? You can't answer any of the questions I've asked. How is it possible for City, despite their modest accomplishments on the pitch to keep outspending much bigger and much more successfull clubs year after year? You can't give an honest answer because you know it's a scam, there's no other logical explanation for that. So instead of admitting it you keep spouting nonsense about things that has nothing to do with the subject.
Let's say, I'm a total hypocrite and the world's biggest gloryhunter and I know nothing about Chelsea's or any other club's history. What does it change about the fact that you can't explain how City can do what they do and not get in trouble?
And would you care to provide proof that what City are doing is a "scam", "dodgy", "bent"? That's the point - you fcuking well can't. You're just another keyboard warrior spouting bollocks that you know fcuk all about. As for the second bolded bit, why don't you take it up with UEFA then you utter weapon? I'd love to meet you for a pint and see how you'd get on in a face to face discussion - I'd demolish you in seconds. The fact that you've also practically admitted that you are a glory hunter who knows fcuk all about Chelsea's history pre-Abramovich tells me all I need to know about you. If you know nothing about your own club then you sure as hell don't know anything about FFP and City's finances. No chance of getting a meet with you prior to a City v Chelsea game either at our gaff or the Bridge - you'll probably be welded to a fcuking armchair somewhere with your Sky remote. By the way, why haven't you answered my question about the Chelsea line-up in the FMC Final in 1986?