Has political correctness actually gone mad?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...vate-school-disappointed-teachers-expose.html

I haven't seen this before. The list of things banned at this school are ridiculous. It is lower down in the article.

Not allowed to say mom, dad, or parent. Have to say grown-ups, folks, family, or guardians.

Not allowed to say boys, girls, guys, ladies, gentlemen. Have to say people, folks, friends, readers, mathematicians.

Husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend. Banned. Now, spouse, partner, significant other.

Not allowed to talk about a boy or girl on a page in a book. It must be person, child, character.

There are others which are just as bad on there.
 
MU655 said:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...vate-school-disappointed-teachers-expose.html

I haven't seen this before. The list of things banned at this school are ridiculous. It is lower down in the article.

Not allowed to say mom, dad, or parent. Have to say grown-ups, folks, family, or guardians.

Not allowed to say boys, girls, guys, ladies, gentlemen. Have to say people, folks, friends, readers, mathematicians.

Husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend. Banned. Now, spouse, partner, significant other.

Not allowed to talk about a boy or girl on a page in a book. It must be person, child, character.

There are others which are just as bad on there.
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Those words aren’t banned.
 
MU655 said:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...vate-school-disappointed-teachers-expose.html

I haven't seen this before. The list of things banned at this school are ridiculous. It is lower down in the article.

Not allowed to say mom, dad, or parent. Have to say grown-ups, folks, family, or guardians.

Not allowed to say boys, girls, guys, ladies, gentlemen. Have to say people, folks, friends, readers, mathematicians.

Husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend. Banned. Now, spouse, partner, significant other.

Not allowed to talk about a boy or girl on a page in a book. It must be person, child, character.

There are others which are just as bad on there.
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its best to ignore the DM for stuff like this

well, for everything really
 
Jippy said:
Im1Sd3Q.jpg
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It's probably more speciesist really.
 
Cascarino said:
Those words aren’t banned.
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Maybe not banned perse, but it is leaning towards it. Even as guidance, it is ridiculous.

Tarrou said:
its best to ignore the DM for stuff like this

well, for everything really
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Usually, I don't bother with newspaper websites. But, to be fair, this does seem to be real. It was part of the school's inclusive language guide.

And it is addressed on the schools website.
 
MU655 said:
Maybe not banned perse, but it is leaning towards it. Even as guidance, it is ridiculous.



Usually, I don't bother with newspaper websites. But, to be fair, this does seem to be real. It was part of the school's inclusive language guide.

And it is addressed on the schools website.
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I read the guide. That's what it is, a guide. Absolutely no mention of words getting banned, just suggested language that they deem more inclusive.
 
Tarrou said:
I read the guide. That's what it is, a guide. Absolutely no mention of words getting banned, just suggested language that they deem more inclusive.
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What's not inclusive about "mom" and "dad" though?
 
Another lefty free market hating newspaper attacking the independence of wealth creators.

Once again it show how much the left hates freedom.
 
VorZakone said:
What's not inclusive about "mom" and "dad" though?
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Some pupils don't have a mom or a dad. Some have them, but also have stepfamilies who have custody. Constant references to parents might impact them negatively, while referencing "family" or "guardians"
or "folks" won't impact anyone else negatively. It's not more nefarious than that, which is the point of inclusive language.
 
VorZakone said:
What's not inclusive about "mom" and "dad" though?
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Not sure but I'd guess the school feel that kids without a mom and/or dad would feel left out. I don't see much benefit to it myself, but if we're going to have a conversation about this stuff we should talk about the facts and not what the DM has invented. Spinning it into the school has banned the words mom and dad gives it quite a sinister feeling which isn't based in anything real.
 
Sorry but that’s actually ridiculous. Inclusive language, Jesus get a grip. The worlds not a particularly nice place, the last thing we need is to tackle Is kids calling their parents mum and dad, Jesus wept. I really think we are heading for a future where many many common phrases and words become ‘banned’ without much cause.
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
Sorry but that’s actually ridiculous. Inclusive language, Jesus get a grip. The worlds not a particularly nice place, the last thing we need is to tackle Is kids calling their parents mum and dad, Jesus wept. I really think we are heading for a future where many many common phrases and words become ‘banned’ without much cause.
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The point is that they will advise staff not to use “mum” and “dad” when talking to kids in case those kids don’t have one.

AKA - “what would your mum and dad think of your behaviour?” when talking to a kid would become “what would your family say?”. My friend as a kid had his Mum pass away when he was around 13. It used to be really awkward when a teacher would say “Did your mother raise you to act this way?”
 
Wumminator said:
The point is that they will advise staff not to use “mum” and “dad” when talking to kids in case those kids don’t have one.

AKA - “what would your mum and dad think of your behaviour?” when talking to a kid would become “what would your family say?”. My friend as a kid had his Mum pass away when he was around 13. It used to be really awkward when a teacher would say “Did your mother raise you to act this way?”
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I’m sure it would be awkward the first occasion but I’m sure the teacher then didn’t do it again if it was pointed out. Obviously it’s horrible to lose a parent and I wouldn’t wish that on anyone, especially a child, but a tiny moment of awkwardness will have caused him absolutely zero trouble in his life. What if someone said ‘your family raised you badly’ without knowing you were adopted into a horrible abusive one, that would be awkward too.
 
There’s nothing more on brand for this thread (or indeed the phrase it’s named for) than right leaning weirdos desperate to be annoyed by something getting riled up by a half understood nonsense Daily Mail article.

It’s the reassuring constants in life that keep you going, don’t you think?
 
People can read here what school says regarding it all
https://www.gcschool.org/statement-on-inclusive-language-guide

For what its worth I don't think words like mum and dad are at at threat, in any way in common language or in schools/nurseries.
I really really need people who are outraged at cancel culture type of things to notice the obvious how controversy is being so desperately tried to be ginned up to get us all in some cultural war. Its so friggin obvious man.
 
Mockney said:
There’s nothing more on brand for this thread (or indeed the phrase it’s named for) than right leaning weirdos desperate to be annoyed by something getting riled up by a half understood nonsense Daily Mail article.

It’s the reassuring constants in life that keep you going, don’t you think?
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You don’t think some of the stories in this thread of over the top and problematic? I’m as left leaning as they come but it’s not ‘right wing’ to think some things can be taken way too far and actually affect society negatively.
 
Tarrou said:
Not sure but I'd guess the school feel that kids without a mom and/or dad would feel left out. I don't see much benefit to it myself, but if we're going to have a conversation about this stuff we should talk about the facts and not what the DM has invented. Spinning it into the school has banned the words mom and dad gives it quite a sinister feeling which isn't based in anything real.
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Is that the real reason (not hurting kids from single parent households) or do they just wanna avoid gendered language at all times?
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
You don’t think some of the stories in this thread of over the top and problematic? I’m as left leaning as they come but it’s not ‘right wing’ to think some things can be taken way too far and actually affect society negatively.
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No I don’t. In fact in the vast majority of instances, just a tiny bit more research not viewed through the prism of tabloid headlines show that theyre frequently merely guidelines or other such low level inconsequentialities, often suggested for quite reasonable reasons... and as @Wolverine already pointed out, only serve to be reported like this to deliberately to rile people up into outrage... For example, you have managed to get suitably annoyed by it, that when a plausible reason is offered to you, you’ve had to default to the argument that “why should kids with dead parents be treated with compassion, it’s a tough world!” and decided it could have dire ramifications for society, like we live in fecking Sparta or something!... come on man.

I could just as easy argue that since we live in a cruel world (something Id wager a child whose lost a parent would probably already be well aware of - regardless of what proper nouns a teacher decided to use) why not try and encourage a happy and welcoming environment for, you know, fecking children in a school!?

The exact same arguments were used about getting rid of caning FFS, and this is just “maybe use some more inclusive words if you can?”.

What D’you think is going to happen if a teacher does use mum or dad? (Which obviously, they still will)... they’re not going to be thrown in jail, are they? What’s the actual issue here?

It strikes me as getting annoyed at change, however incremental, for the sheer sake of it, which is a very Conservative tendency. Which is why most of these things inevitably boil down to “look at this small well meaning thing the progressives are trying to do now!! We didn’t do that!! And we all turned out brilliantly didn’t we? I mean, just look at how normal and thriving the UK is!!? Now hold my pint whilst I get angry at an article I haven’t read.”
 
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TrustInJanuzaj said:
I’m sure it would be awkward the first occasion but I’m sure the teacher then didn’t do it again if it was pointed out. Obviously it’s horrible to lose a parent and I wouldn’t wish that on anyone, especially a child, but a tiny moment of awkwardness will have caused him absolutely zero trouble in his life. What if someone said ‘your family raised you badly’ without knowing you were adopted into a horrible abusive one, that would be awkward too.
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So we have acknowledged that there is a negative for some people when these phrases are used; where is the negative for anyone, if we try to not use them? You're just basically not arsed having to do it? Why would you care about something so inconsequential, do you realise how upsetting a simple sentence like that can be to someone who has had one of their parents die?
 
As long as change is for the better, right? Incremental or rapid. And we're kind to children. Can't go wrong with that.
 
Wumminator said:
The point is that they will advise staff not to use “mum” and “dad” when talking to kids in case those kids don’t have one.

AKA - “what would your mum and dad think of your behaviour?” when talking to a kid would become “what would your family say?”. My friend as a kid had his Mum pass away when he was around 13. It used to be really awkward when a teacher would say “Did your mother raise you to act this way?”
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Sparing kids feelings omitting words which have been used for centuries is going a long way to making them too sensitive to survive in the harsh world we live in. We arent doing them any favours. So far it's more or less controlled but carry on in the vein we're going and in 10 years we'll be churning out kids not fit for purpose.

My Dad died when I was 11. Admittedly the first couple of weeks after his death when I heard the word Dad I welled up but then human nature takes over which strengthens resolve and you learn to deal with things on a different level. Kids are stronger than we think. Swerving issues is a lot more detrimental to growth than actually dealing with them.
 
"Mom" should definitely be banned, along with movie, when referring to film, season, when referring to a series.

Down the the americanisation / down right bastatdisation of the English language!
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
You don’t think some of the stories in this thread of over the top and problematic? I’m as left leaning as they come but it’s not ‘right wing’ to think some things can be taken way too far and actually affect society negatively.
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Not nice things happen as you pointed out. I believe your advice was to just handle it.
 
Mockney said:
No I don’t. In fact in the vast majority of instances, just a tiny bit more research not viewed through the prism of tabloid headlines show that theyre frequently merely guidelines or other such low level inconsequentialities, often suggested for quite reasonable reasons... and as @Wolverine already pointed out, only serve to be reported like this to deliberately to rile people up into outrage... For example, you have managed to get suitably annoyed by it, that when a plausible reason is offered to you, you’ve had to default to the argument that “why should kids with dead parents be treated with compassion, it’s a tough world!” and decided it could have dire ramifications for society, like we live in fecking Sparta or something!... come on man.

I could just as easy argue that since we live in a cruel world (something Id wager a child whose lost a parent would probably already be well aware of - regardless of what proper nouns a teacher decided to use) why not try and encourage a happy and welcoming environment for, you know, fecking children in a school!?

The exact same arguments were used about getting rid of caning FFS, and this is just “maybe use some more inclusive words if you can?”.

What D’you think is going to happen if a teacher does use mum or dad? (Which obviously, they still will)... they’re not going to be thrown in jail, are they? What’s the actual issue here?

It strikes me as getting annoyed at change, however incremental, for the sheer sake of it, which is a very Conservative tendency. Which is why most of these things inevitably boil down to “look at this small well meaning thing the progressives are trying to do now!! We didn’t do that!! And we all turned out brilliantly didn’t we? I mean, just look at how normal and thriving the UK is!!? Now hold my pint whilst I get angry at an article I haven’t read.”
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If 'well-meaning' and 'progressive' mean dumb, then you are on the right track. You can't spend your whole life fearing whether someone will find something offensive. And that is what you seem to want; you seem to want to create fear around the possibility of anything being offensive. It is creating an issue where one does not exist. There are things which are clearly offensive, and then there are things that people can inadvertently get upset over. If it does, you apologise and move one, but you can't be expecting people to be so tentative as to not even be able to use such common words as mum, dad, boys, or girls.

You are wrong about this, anyway. This is about getting rid of genders. As I said in my post, it is also 'boys' and 'girls' being advised not to be used at the school. I'm shocked there are some people don't find this ridiculous. It has pretty much been branded as right wing in here to use mom/mum, dad, boy, or girl.
 
Forevergiggs1 said:
Sparing kids feelings omitting words which have been used for centuries is going a long way to making them too sensitive to survive in the harsh world we live in. We arent doing them any favours. So far it's more or less controlled but carry on in the vein we're going and in 10 years we'll be churning out kids not fit for purpose.

My Dad died when I was 11. Admittedly the first couple of weeks after his death when I heard the word Dad I welled up but then human nature takes over which strengthens resolve and you learn to deal with things on a different level. Kids are stronger than we think. Swerving issues is a lot more detrimental to growth than actually dealing with them.
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Alternatively some kids might use it as an opening to argue back. So regardless of the point the teacher is trying to make "what would your parents think of you setting fire to the school and stealing everyone's gym bags" the kid latches on to the part where the teacher was wrong as a means to ignore the question. By using more inclusive language it helps to avoid such bullshit.

I'm sort of on the fence about the whole cotton wool wrapping that happens with a lot of kids nowadays. Especially the "everyone gets a medal" approach to sports days. But with those things that I don't quite understand I don't really feel a reason to complain about them. I just accept that it's something I don't entirely see from the other person's viewpoint yet. Unless it's related to TV shows or games, at which point I become a snotty arsehole who thinks everyone is wrong except me.
 
Mr Pigeon said:
Alternatively some kids might use it as an opening to argue back. So regardless of the point the teacher is trying to make "what would your parents think of you setting fire to the school and stealing everyone's gym bags" the kid latches on to the part where the teacher was wrong as a means to ignore the question. By using more inclusive language it helps to avoid such bullshit.

I'm sort of on the fence about the whole cotton wool wrapping that happens with a lot of kids nowadays. Especially the "everyone gets a medal" approach to sports days. But with those things that I don't quite understand I don't really feel a reason to complain about them. I just accept that it's something I don't entirely see from the other person's viewpoint yet. Unless it's related to TV shows or games, at which point I become a snotty arsehole who thinks everyone is wrong except me.
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I agree this is where perceptions change. Unfortunately I'm more old school and was brought up with the, there's no such thing as a bad experience/there are no mistakes in life, only lessons kind of mentality and I feel this method has served me well for adulthood. If we lived in a Utopia then I could understand trying to molly coddle our kids but unfortunately we don't. Far from it. Too much change too fast normally isn't a good thing.

Political correctness, although it's been around for a long time has really started spiralling out of control the last 5-10 years or so and while change is good I can't help but wonder where we're going to be in another 10 years. Probably with some new breed of spoilt kids (am I allowed to say that?) who've decided that they don't need any oldies (anyone over 30) in their lives and sends them off to the desert to see out the rest of their lives. So for all you kids out there today a big feck you in advance *middlefinger*
 
Mockney said:
No I don’t. In fact in the vast majority of instances, just a tiny bit more research not viewed through the prism of tabloid headlines show that theyre frequently merely guidelines or other such low level inconsequentialities, often suggested for quite reasonable reasons... and as @Wolverine already pointed out, only serve to be reported like this to deliberately to rile people up into outrage... For example, you have managed to get suitably annoyed by it, that when a plausible reason is offered to you, you’ve had to default to the argument that “why should kids with dead parents be treated with compassion, it’s a tough world!” and decided it could have dire ramifications for society, like we live in fecking Sparta or something!... come on man.

I could just as easy argue that since we live in a cruel world (something Id wager a child whose lost a parent would probably already be well aware of - regardless of what proper nouns a teacher decided to use) why not try and encourage a happy and welcoming environment for, you know, fecking children in a school!?

The exact same arguments were used about getting rid of caning FFS, and this is just “maybe use some more inclusive words if you can?”.

What D’you think is going to happen if a teacher does use mum or dad? (Which obviously, they still will)... they’re not going to be thrown in jail, are they? What’s the actual issue here?

It strikes me as getting annoyed at change, however incremental, for the sheer sake of it, which is a very Conservative tendency. Which is why most of these things inevitably boil down to “look at this small well meaning thing the progressives are trying to do now!! We didn’t do that!! And we all turned out brilliantly didn’t we? I mean, just look at how normal and thriving the UK is!!? Now hold my pint whilst I get angry at an article I haven’t read.”
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:lol:This country really struggles to throw off the shackles of the Victorian era.
 
TrustInJanuzaj said:
I’m sure it would be awkward the first occasion but I’m sure the teacher then didn’t do it again if it was pointed out. Obviously it’s horrible to lose a parent and I wouldn’t wish that on anyone, especially a child, but a tiny moment of awkwardness will have caused him absolutely zero trouble in his life. What if someone said ‘your family raised you badly’ without knowing you were adopted into a horrible abusive one, that would be awkward too.
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Why would you ever tell a pupil his family raised him badly? I hope you're not a teacher. There's no positive outcome there, even if you happen to be correct.
 
For me a lot of so called 'political correctness' is about trying to stop individuals feeling like shit, because someone has deliberately or inadvertently said or done something that upsets them, riles, them or affects their feelings of self worth.
Deliberately upsetting people is usually frowned upon because of the negatives, but I have to say when I was a thirteen year old, and well overweight kid, a few strong words hit home with me from people who were not trying to help but were trying to rile me and they did.

After almost welling up in tears and threatening to bash a few heads together, I did neither but went home and thought about it, the fact is they were right I was overweight I did look like a 'humpty-dumpty'.
I came up with three solutions;

1) I could find another way home from school to avoid these b******ds
2) I could gather a few mates and go looking for them
3) I could start to cut out sweets etc. even try a diet

I chose 1)

We all have to face adversity sometime and it makes us choose, not always wisely, but we have to stop and think and usually that does do us some good and can help get things in perspective. 'Every cloud etc....'
 
Off topicish...we've got Greater Manchester mayor elections in May. Three of the six candidates are right wing - they want to take back control, one wants to allow cultural banter, the other wants to make England great again and another wants to reform the UK by giving folk their freedoms back. And then you've got a flipping Tory candidate. I mean what's wrong with this place? Majority of the country has become so right wing, (this forum wasn't as right leaning years back and all). Thanks to the media, the sentiment has changed but I suspect it was always there anyway. But yeah political correctness gone mental.
 
Spoony said:
Off topicish...we've got Greater Manchester mayor elections in May. Three of the six candidates are right wing - they want to take back control, one wants to allow cultural banter, the other wants to make England great again and another wants to reform the UK by giving folk their freedoms back. And then you've got a flipping Tory candidate. I mean what's wrong with this place? Majority of the country has become so right wing, (this forum wasn't as right leaning years back and all). Thanks to the media, the sentiment has changed but I suspect it was always there anyway. But yeah political correctness gone mental.
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I hate Greater Manchester nazis.
 
VorZakone said:
Seems like the guidelines encouraged not to use the words. So while technically not a ban, they did seem to take issue with the words "mom" and "dad".
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MU655 said:
Maybe not banned perse, but it is leaning towards it. Even as guidance, it is ridiculous.
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@Wolverine made this point, but my problem with publications like the daily mail is that it does its best to sensationalise a story to promote outrage. The daily mail continuously frames things in a disingenuous way. More often than not when I read up on what actually happened, it’s pretty different to how the mail has portrayed things.

There’s a big difference between words like mom and dad being banned at a school, than there is a guide recommending teachers use inclusive language when possible. I don’t think words like mom and dad will particularly affect any child negatively, but I also think that promoting inclusive language is harmless and potentially beneficial.
 
nimic said:
Why would you ever tell a pupil his family raised him badly? I hope you're not a teacher. There's no positive outcome there, even if you happen to be correct.
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You probably wouldn’t tbf but it was just a speculative example. I’m sure worse things have been said than that though by teachers.
 
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