And the party that got us into Europe. I cannot see them risking our international and economic status by leaving the EU, they were never this eurosceptic until UKIP came along.
Politics at Westminster | BREAKING: UKIP
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Whilst i may have voted for the Greens i couldn't help but find their representative on Fivelive just a tad annoying. The ease with which she resorted to cliches and generalities notwithstanding, what really ticked me off was that a leading figure of the Greens actually shrank from the prospect of defending environmental policies when challenged. Say what you like about UKIP but you would find Farage wilting in the face of opposition.
Half the tories were rabidly eurosceptic. Half weren't. They've papered over this division by claiming they can re-negotiate. Which they can't, or every other country would as well. It's a case of hoping to get past the next election without any infighting.
Yeh, but you probably vote Labour which is a massive demonstration of ignorance.
Why though? Scared of the Romanians?
Don't get me wrong, I like Europe and I like the EU, its obviously flawed but its about the only political body with jurisdiction over me that actually seems to give the slightest damn about my human rights and civil liberties. Yet the simple fact is, a vote for the Tories next election is the vote for a promise of an in out referendum on Europe. That will get you what you want, if you want to leave, voting for a bunch of knob jockeys who have variously showed themselves to be associated with all the worse kinds of right wing politics achieves nothing.
The only thing Labour have going for them is not being the Conservatives. I can't really stomach them either. Genuinely haven't got an idea who actually comes close to representing my views but its certainly none of the big parties.
Must the EU be the only means through which a European cooperative might manifest itself?
Politically speaking there exist serious divisions right across the continent, for the economic benefits to be felt we don't need all of the trappings of statehood and billions lost to corruption.
Let's not pretend "the economy" is constituted of homogeneous interests. The EU is more beneficial for capital than it is for labour.
It's also utterly undemocratic.
Why is it undemocratic?
[QUOTE="NinjaFletch, post: 15737395, member: 46569"
The only thing Labour have going for them is not being the Conservatives. I can't really stomach them either. Genuinely haven't got an idea who actually comes close to representing my views but its certainly none of the big parties.[/QUOTE]
Fair enough.
Agree that Europe's focus on civil liberties at least exists. Whether it makes up for the rest of the shambles is less certain.
The only thing Labour have going for them is not being the Conservatives. I can't really stomach them either. Genuinely haven't got an idea who actually comes close to representing my views but its certainly none of the big parties.[/QUOTE]
Fair enough.
Agree that Europe's focus on civil liberties at least exists. Whether it makes up for the rest of the shambles is less certain.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...t-nearly-everything-survey-shows-8697821.html
Have to say, on a partly related note, this article has me fearing for democracy. Perhaps the worst thing about it is that people will see things like this and still continue to hold their beliefs in the face of clear evidence to the contrary.
Have to say, on a partly related note, this article has me fearing for democracy. Perhaps the worst thing about it is that people will see things like this and still continue to hold their beliefs in the face of clear evidence to the contrary.
What is a good night for Labour so far the local elections go?
Labour are the incumbents and with luck they shall be removed from their position of control.
Labour are the incumbents and with luck they shall be removed from their position of control.
I didn't say anything about it being anything like that. Like I said, the economy as in money. Also I
ve more to fear from this government being undemocratic than the EU.
Also why is it undemocratic, they are having elections as we speak.
I would actually like to see these statistics of the money lost to corruption, you're just throwing a random number out there.
What divisions, be specific, as far as I know all these countries are benefiting from it more than they appear to be suffering from it.
I didn't say I was anti EU at all, why are you saying its what I want, I don't want it. Don't judge. I am actually pro-EU.
Shocking Breaking News 
Not only is Sunderland one of the first results out, but it is a Labour hold.
Not only is Sunderland one of the first results out, but it is a Labour hold.
No sorry, crossed wires. I know you weren't saying that I was using 'you' as in 'one' rather than directing it at you.
You coulda wrote one
The EEA works just fine. Anyhoo, the list of candidates in the MEP election was bonkers. On the Hammersmith & Fulham council vote though, we only had seven candidates for three seat. I guess the crazies only target areas where poor people live.
That is the usual strategy, shame it works sometimes too. Mostly in the places where there is very little actual diversity.
Its the current events thread! Be pretentious! Doesn't stop AlastairI didn't want to sound pretentious.
The Foreign Affairs department were reported as having lost £1bn in aid to Egypt alone. And you can't but be aware of the difficulty the EU has in getting its books audited.
As for divisions...CAP, fisheries, policy, foreign affairs, taxation, the ECB e.t.c
Since when does aid have anything to do with corruption. Again nothing, this isn't evidence.
UKIP to rip into the Tory share of the vote a lot more than their own, essentially. None of the three "main" parties will come out with much dignity I suspect. The main question is how this performance translates into 2015. Could go in any direction yet.
The trend is for a UKIP protest vote in the EU elections followed by a collapse to about 2-3% in the general election.
They've been getting massive vote shares in by-elections and council elections for the past couple of years though too, the trend is going to be bucked in 2015.
At the last European election i happily voted for UKIP, now when they are all the rage i go elsewhere. lol They were a more...centred party at previous elections mind, and the reasons people supported them being simpler too.
When it doesn't actually end up being aid?
When it doesn't actually end up being aid?
True, although come a general election Farage will find himself out in the cold when it comes to the TV debates. A likely fall in national turnout and exact state of the economy could be two other important unknowns.
There also remains the Scottish elephant in the room, and that's an issue that must leave many a Tory somewhat torn.
Not sure they'll be able to exclude him this time round, it would make them yet more unpopular to the voters they really don't want to alienate. Another hung parliament seems a good bet at this point, with no-one really emerging strongly from it. FPTP death rattles.
This year is looking pivotal in my opinion.
The smart money is now on
Scotland leaving the union this year.
The remaining UK will vote to leave the EU in 2017.
The smart money is now on
Scotland leaving the union this year.
The remaining UK will vote to leave the EU in 2017.
That would be shit for everyone. People suck.
Yes you are are right but it is your ignorance that it demonstrates.
It is a bit of a conundrum for Cameron i think, Farage's presence would confuse any any bounce he might gain in out-performing Miliband in the debates. I'd recommend that the PM try to dilute the future impact, offer Farage the chance of a one-on-one debate similar to which Clegg took part in. Such a course isn't without risk of course, for in doing so he'd be elevating UKIP's profile.
Listening to MPs from each of the main parties, they don't seem to comprehend why these defections are occurring. The Tories in particular can't attribute this to some temporary bout of frustration, they have policy battles to decide upon a strategy for.
I really do hope not.
Can you blame them if they chose to leave for 99% of the time no one gives two shits about them in England(Osborn's treats to Scotland were beyond pathetic) . Alex Salmond is clearly a arsehole and overall and I image the only real appeal he's got to give is independence, the only problem with independence is Scotland could be fecked for a very long time and then add to that the mess of sorting it all out but at the same time if your going to get shot in the head it's better to pull the trigger yourself then your arsehole neighbour next door.
The polls and the odds bookmakers are giving would suggest it really isn't.
I voted UKIP because I'm fed up of the lies and backpedaling of the main parties, and I want a vote on Europe [undecided on how I would vote in the referendum]. As far as general policies go, UKIP are probably close to the bottom in my book, but this isn't a general election. I expect I will vote differently again next year. I could have easily voted Greens yesterday, I find their general manifesto more appealing than UKIP's but I don't see a vote for them as forcing the referendum debate.
Judging by these early results UKIP have done damage across the board, and the Lib Dems are being annihilated. I think it will be an interesting year for the main parties, particularly the tories, every UKIP success must cause a clamour amongst the back benches.
Judging by these early results UKIP have done damage across the board, and the Lib Dems are being annihilated. I think it will be an interesting year for the main parties, particularly the tories, every UKIP success must cause a clamour amongst the back benches.
You're full of surprises
Well done to UKIP. Vital we see Labour's northern heartlands dismantled.