Berbatov | Fulham player

Dans said:
He slowed the game down completely. I felt frustrated watching us change from a high octane attacking force to one that went forward only to retreat back because Berbatov has no pace and can only lay the ball off. I think his style of play quite obviously doesn't suit our new look team.
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Wasn't he brought on to slow the play and kill Chelsea's momentum though?
 
I was actually quite impressed with his pace before that missed chance. I realise it was late in the game and Cole was probably quite tired but Berba sprinted past him pretty easily. Seems to have put on a lot of muscle too.
 
Raulduke said:
I was actually quite impressed with his pace before that missed chance. I realise it was late in the game and Cole was probably quite tired but Berba sprinted past him pretty easily. Seems to have put on a lot of muscle too.
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Berba went Usain Bolt on him to be fair
 
Made sense for him to come on. He's like an extra defender at set pieces.
 
Dans said:
Not at all.
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The substitution was in process before Hernandez was pole-axed by Cole! So SAF didn't just bring him on because Hernandez was injured, SAF likes to bring Berba on when we're in a winning position because he gets stuck in defending set pieces and is adept at keeping hold of the ball. His style suits a patient build-up and the manager knows this, that can be used to our advantage when we're trying to see a game out.
 
Frankly I don't know why Berba's still at the club. His style simply doesn't fit the type of game we are playing now. To be sitting on the bench week in and week out with occasional sub appearances and with the promise of possible domestic Cup outings, for as long as we're in those comps, seems very odd when he could be elsewhere getting regular first team action.
 
Julian Denny said:
Frankly I don't know why Berba's still at the club. His style simply doesn't fit the type of game we are playing now. To be sitting on the bench week in and week out with occasional sub appearances and with the promise of possible domestic Cup outings, for as long as we're in those comps, seems very odd when he could be elsewhere getting regular first team action.
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We try to play a much faster, one touch passing game, and then he would fit in imo. He still lacks the drive and speed though on the other hand.

I dont mind having him, he is a brilliant 3rd choice striker. Question is whether he is happy with that role
 
Julian Denny said:
Frankly I don't know why Berba's still at the club. His style simply doesn't fit the type of game we are playing now. To be sitting on the bench week in and week out with occasional sub appearances and with the promise of possible domestic Cup outings, for as long as we're in those comps, seems very odd when he could be elsewhere getting regular first team action.
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Well surely that's his call?

I mean, are you an advocate of us having a weaker third choice centre forward on the basis of Berbatov getting more football elsewhere?

If he's happy playing the role he is, then we should be fecking delighted.
 
Escobar said:
We try to play a much faster, one touch passing game, and then he would fit in imo. He still lacks the drive and speed though on the other hand.

I dont mind having him, he is a brilliant 3rd choice striker. Question is whether he is happy with that role
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It's the "faster, one touch passing game" which he doens't fit into, surely?
I would say he's 4th choice behind Rooney, Chicha and Welbeck. Even Owen's more suited to the current set up - so perhaps make that 5th choice !

On the face of it, he's remarkably accepting of it all and Fergie likes that. I expect him to start tonight.
 
Feed Me said:
Well surely that's his call?

I mean, are you an advocate of us having a weaker third choice centre forward on the basis of Berbatov getting more football elsewhere?

If he's happy playing the role he is, then we should be fecking delighted.
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Of course we should . A player of his calibre who is also so uncomplaining is a very rare specimen indeed.
 
Julian Denny said:
It's the "faster, one touch passing game" which he doens't fit into, surely?
I would say he's 4th choice behind Rooney, Chicha and Welbeck. Even Owen's more suited to the current set up - so perhaps make that 5th choice !

On the face of it, he's remarkably accepting of it all and Fergie likes that. I expect him to start tonight.
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If our style is 'fast, one touch passing' then Berbatov ought to be second choice. Surely that game is reliant on technical ability in terms of sharp control and passing. Owen and Chica don't excel at this and Welbeck is quite hit and miss.
 
Feed Me said:
If our style is 'fast, one touch passing' then Berbatov ought to be second choice. Surely that game is reliant on technical ability in terms of sharp control and passing. Owen and Chica don't excel at this and Welbeck is quite hit and miss.
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Movement is important to open up options for the quick passing. And Berbatov is "lazy"
 
I would suggest tonight is one of Berbatov’s most important game for the club purely for his own future. If he fails to perform and Owen or Macheda impress and one of them get the nod over Berbatov for next Saturday against Stoke…

He really does have an amazing opportunity tonight though, and if he does perform could kick start his year against Stoke, Basle and Norwich
 
Justin said:
Movement is important to open up options for the quick passing. And Berbatov is "lazy"
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I thought the new game was premised on ball retention. Berbatov is brilliantly suited to it.

Sure, he can slow the game down, but Barcelona play slow tempo 95% of the time, before injecting pace into their play via a Messi, Villa, Pedro, Iniesta.

There's no reason Berbatov can't be our metronome, with the likes of Nani, Rooney, Young, Anderson and Cleverley providing the thrust at the right time.

Berba looks in incredible shape and he's not sulking. He'll get his chance soon enough.
 
Randall Flagg said:
I would suggest tonight is one of Berbatov’s most important game for the club purely for his own future. If he fails to perform and Owen or Macheda impress and one of them get the nod over Berbatov for next Saturday against Stoke…

He really does have an amazing opportunity tonight though, and if he does perform could kick start his year against Stoke, Basle and Norwich
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It's the sort of games where he does tend to fill his boots.
 
Yeah, I think Berbatov has a very strong chance to start four games in a row from tonight onwards, depending on his performances, the severity of Hernández's injury, and Welbeck's return to the first team.

If Berbatov has a good game tonight, we might go 442 at Stoke with him (his height is beneficial regardless, I'm sure most people would agree). However, Sir Alex may decide to let Welbeck back in, or go for a third midfield player instead (perhaps Fletcher - Carrick - Anderson). Or, if Hernández is fit he could well start (though I doubt this).

I'd love to see Berbatov start against Leeds, at least be involved at Stoke, start against Basle and start against Norwich (though I'd be happy for Hernández to return here so we smash them for 4+). There's then an international break where he wouldn't be involved so he'll be fresh while other players may not be. However, the game after the international break is at Anfield, and no matter how good his performances are I think he'd be dropped for that one.

Looking forward to seeing how he performs though.
 
Dans said:
Ah well, if it's so, it's so. I concede.
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It is so, I watched him be called up and prepare to come on a long time before Hernandez was injured.
 
Julian Denny said:
It's the "faster, one touch passing game" which he doens't fit into, surely?I would say he's 4th choice behind Rooney, Chicha and Welbeck. Even Owen's more suited to the current set up - so perhaps make that 5th choice !

On the face of it, he's remarkably accepting of it all and Fergie likes that. I expect him to start tonight.
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Well how would we know? We have certainly never employed him in such a system. If we look at evidence from elsewhere, he certainly did ok at Spurs playing that type of football, and he did extremely well for Bulgaria too.

I actually feel Berba would be better the faster the style of play around him. Many people are critical of him for how he has played in a slower system at Utd, and then use that as evidence he is unable to perform at a higher tempo.

Players like Berba play best off instinct, the more options he has, the better he will play. In previous years he has had very few options in terms of people getting past him as he receives the ball, so he had little choice but to keep the ball until support arrived.

Now we have Young, Hernandez, Nani, Anderson, Cleverley etc, all busting a gut to get forward as quick as possible. So playing as an alternative to Rooney, in Rooney's position, with so many options around him, why would anybody imagine he would deliberately slow the game down any more so than Rooney would?
 
apotheosis said:
Now we have Young, Hernandez, Nani, Anderson, Cleverley etc, all busting a gut to get forward as quick as possible. So playing as an alternative to Rooney, in Rooney's position, with so many options around him, why would anybody imagine he would deliberately slow the game down any more so than Rooney would?
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Because Rooney has a more expansive footballing mindset than Berba. Rooney slows the game down for a reason, while considering the options his sublime talent & imagination gives him; considering his undoubted skill, in contrast Dimi is all-too often content to merely lay-off an easy pass. With his gifts, Berba should be providing more, in a play-making sense; there's no good reason why he could not attain the heights of even a Cantona for us.

(I should mention that I'm actually a Berbatov fan. But, sadly, I just don't think he's truly risen to the occasion of playing for United, despite last season's goals. I mean to say that he could, with a little more imagination and effort, be one of the greatest stars the club has ever had).
 
Justin said:
Movement is important to open up options for the quick passing. And Berbatov is "lazy"
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Berbatov's touch still makes him a frequent option for quick passing despite only subtle movement. Cleverley and Anderson would do the same playing with Berbatov that they would with Rooney, carry the ball forward and release it to either Berba or the wingers.

Berba is lazier than Rooney, but that would not negate the movement of others, and once Berba has the ball at his feet, he is more than capable of bringing them into play. I think many would be very surprised by how effective Berba could be in a faster paced system, unfortunately many base their opinions of his capabilities on how he has previously performed in much slower paced systems, incorporating players who are not as well suited to his preferred style of play.
 
I hope Berba starts tonight and sticks four past those overboard, snivelling raucous tw*ts at Bellend Road !!!!

Despite the fact that he's deceptively slow, I think if we have kept him at OT we need to play him in a fair few games - hardly his fault he didn't fit in with our style...... he's no different than the player we bought ex spuds !
 
He's only deceptively slow if you don't watch him when he's sprinting. All of this talk about him not suiting is is complete nonsense.
 
Plechazunga said:
Today gave the lie to the notion that Berba is too sluggish for the new tika-taka United. He was working it around beautifully. It was always a daft claim. The man's touch is among the best I've ever seen.
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Brwned said:
I don't think he looked short of confidence at all, which was the pleasing thing. Would've been great if he'd got a goal so our first four strikers had all gotten off the mark early on, but it'll come. Wasn't a dreadful miss at all, out of our entire strikeforce I'd only have expected Chicharito to finish it. Rooney's pass was just that little bit off and it made all the difference, stopping him from running right onto it and tapping it in and forcing him to check. Showed a nice bit of pace to get there too, I thought.
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Great posts. I feel like I'm watching a different game to most people have the time.
 
misterredmist said:
, I think if we have kept him at OT we need to play him in a fair few games - hardly his fault he didn't fit in with our style...... he's no different than the player we bought ex spuds !
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Well it is really. He has never fitted in with any of our systems. Fergie loves players who are versatile, and when asked to be Berbatov was unable to deliver
 
SteveJ said:
Because Rooney has a more expansive footballing mindset than Berba. Rooney slows the game down for a reason, while considering the options his sublime talent & imagination gives him; considering his undoubted skill, in contrast Dimi is all-too often content to merely lay-off an easy pass. With his gifts, Berba should be providing more, in a play-making sense; there's no good reason why he could not attain the heights of even a Cantona for us.

(I should mention that I'm actually a Berbatov fan. But, sadly, I just don't think he's truly risen to the occasion of playing for United, despite last season's goals. I mean to say that he could, with a little more imagination and effort, be one of the greatest stars the club has ever had).
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So far Steve, this is my point, you are basing your assessment of his capabilities on his performances within a much slower system.

You have yet to see how he would perform in Rooney's current position within the current set up. The very criticism you cite of what he has provided for Utd so far, i am arguing is because of that slower system not suiting his strengths.

It is not simple a question of looking at what he has produced for us so far, the question shopuld be why has he not produced more? What has prevented him from being, at the very least, the player he was at Spurs?

Imo the system and personnel makes all the difference, look at Rooney's respective contributions first against Bulgaria and then against Wales. The contrast in performance with a player who we knew was in form, was quite staggering. The reason: The first game played a certain system that suited the players within it, and we saw the result. Whilst for the Wales game, we played a similar system only this time with players not suited to that system, and the contributions were negatively affected as a result.
 
I've stopped addressing RF in here now, he's become a complete joke in this thead.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
What are you on about now?

When was Berbatov ever asked to be versatile and failed to deliver?
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He has normally not done well when asked to play 4-5-1

He did not to very well when asked to keep dropping deep for his 1st two seasons

That is not very versatile.

Some will tell you he cannot play with Rooney too (I dont believe that)
 
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