Paul Pogba

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Er... Chris Smalling had played for Fulham's first team 13 times, in the Premier League and en route to the Europa League final. Pogba played half a Carling Cup game and 20 minutes in a single PL game.

Not to mention, why are people assuming his initial contract with United was better paid than the offer on the table for Pogba?
 
If he is that good rite now we should pay him 20-25 k if he is asking?

But those suggesting that we pay him what he ask because he "might" (though there is good chance) become very good is not very smart.

Its like buying a land for double the price right now because you know the the price will become double after 2-3 years.
 
Hasn't this guy captained France at almost every level so far?

Would have expected more maturity from someone with that pedigree of leadership growing up.
 
The point here is not what we're ready to pay for him but what others are ready to pay for him and what will be the cost to replace him (a reserve with great potential playing in a position which is our achilles heel). At the end of the day if Pogba is running after a big salary then that is what truly matters.

Rumors say that he's close to Juventus.....well Juventus don't pay players like Real or Shitty do.
 
Walrus said:
As usual Joga makes some excellent points.

The problem however (as I highlighted in a previous post) is that by making an exception for one player, you open the floodgates for a domino effect of players demanding higher wages, and the overall cost becomes far greater than simply replacing the original greedy player with a more established "star" for whom the higher wage is accepted by the rest of the squad.

Having said that however, it is true that by signing players at a young age BEFORE they have become established first teamers (here or at another club) we then seem to be essentially punishing those players for NOT signing for a lesser club where they would get first team action from an earlier age.

Ultimately, the only question that matters is do united think Pogba is worth breaking policy for? I think that factor in itself may be just as important to the player as the actual wage - for the club to show that level of trust to be WILLING to break policy for him.
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That's a risk. However with every young 'Paul Scholes' you'll have 100 Gibsons. Is it worth losing a 'Paul Scholes' to keep 100 Gibsons happy?

PS I am not comparing Pogba with Scholes in any way.
 
pocco said:
I'm of the opinion that had Pogba played for another club this season, he could have, at the very least, put in some good cameos as Smalling had done. I think we have tried very hard to involve Pogba more but he has been really unlucky with the games in which he was on the bench. If things had gone to plan then he could have had 5 or more appearances now in the league. Unfortunately it didn't work out as the first team wasn't getting the job done.

Although Pogba wasn't involved on the tour, I remember Fergie mentioning him in particular as one that he wanted to take but the numbers weren't right. He was involved in two friendlies once we had returned however. All in all, he has been unfortunate when you think about it.
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That's a fair argument that he hasn't had as much chance due to the situations we've been in. However I would also say that if he had been showing enough then fergie would have found time for him more often. For example in the two cup games he played he was poor. You can argue that in the second a lot of players were but at least they were mostly all returning from injuries. Pogba looked of the pace and you can contrast his performance to morrisson who to me looked at home straight away and looked a cut above the other players. Pogba didn't show anything to me. Had he performed better i'm sure fergie would have given him more time as a result. Same with in training. Now I'm only speculating but I'm sure if Pogba was impressing against the first team players enough than he would have played more. Fryers hasn't played much but he did well in the cup games more or less and the. For minutes in the league and looked decent.

At the end of the day you have to earn your contract. As I said this policy might see us lose some players but I'd rather take that hit then just give in to someone who's earned nothing yet. Sure other clubs might poach some players but they won't get all our good players.
 
Fergie has never held a young player back if he felt that they were ready
 
golden_blunder said:
Fergie has never held a young player back if he felt that they were ready
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And why would he?

Why the feck would anyone on here know more than Fergie about how much first-team football Pogba was ready to play this season? Mental.

Apart from anything else, when he did get his chance he didn't make the most of it. A very poor display in the Carling Cup ended up with Fergie taking him out of central midfield within minutes of coming on as a substitute.
 
I truly admire the attitude and dedication shown by Cleverley and Welbeck. They were not ready for our first team but they had bags of potential. When SAF challenged them by sending them out on loan spells, they took them on with good response. Eventually they came back and SAF gave them the nod with plenty of first team football - and the money that comes with it.

There's a lot Pogba could learn from those two - or any other of our youngsters who has made it here - and how things work around this club. You'll deserve your contracts well and truly here. Until that day comes, you keep your head high and fight on. That is, if you really want to be here.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
And why would he?

Why the feck would anyone on here know more than Fergie about how much first-team football Pogba was ready to play this season? Mental.

Apart from anything else, when he did get his chance he didn't make the most of it. A very poor display in the Carling Cup ended up with Fergie taking him out of central midfield within minutes of coming on as a substitute.
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Thats what i am saying

If Fergie thought that the lad was ready, he'd play a lot more
 
Skywarden said:
I truly admire the attitude and dedication shown by Cleverley and Welbeck. They were not ready for our first team but they had bags of potential. When SAF challenged them by sending them out on loan spells, they took them on with good response. Eventually they came back and SAF gave them the nod with plenty of first team football - and the money that comes with it.

There's a lot Pogba could learn from those two - or any other of our youngsters who has made it here - and how things work around this club. You'll deserve your contracts well and truly here. Until that day comes, you keep your head high and fight on. That is, if you really want to be here.
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They are the perfect example of the saying "patience is a virtue". They went out on loans and paid their dues before getting regular first team action. Proved themselves at a lower level and worked their way to the top. It must take a great mentality to go from playing for a huge team with out kind of training and facilities to teams at a much lower level (obviously a step up from the reserves but in terms of coaching etc a step down.

Players need to realise that getting regular match time at a big club at 18-20 very rarely happens.
 
Colin129 said:
I think we all agree he needs to play more to prove himself.
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When though? Our early exits from the Cup tournaments hasnt been ideal when it comes to giving youngsters game time. Pogba isnt really ready for matches in the league, so he'l have to wait. Cant just throw him in the mix and hope for the best in the league.
 
RedRonaldo said:
This is not my intention for setting up such hypothetical question about the young Messi situation. Someone here mentioned before we should not break our wage structure for any young player (who hasn't proved himself in the team yet), but I think there should be some exceptional cases, whether justified or not. Yes changing the structure would means we could overpay for many nobody, or worst we could keep losing the best young talents.
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I kinda agree you but in this case I have seen nothing "THAT" special about Pobga.The club hasn't deemed enough to offer him a better contract cause that's not what he'd be truly worth.
Messi at Pogba's current age was something else, his talent was there to see.
 
So the supposed 48 hours is up! I guess he will be on his bike so. You would think Fryers will be sticking around though as he is a local bloke!
 
I have seen Pogba play on several occasions this season and,
He is obviously a special talent, but he is NOT ready for a midfield role in our 1.team yet. His style of playing is also not to his advantage, as his eminent technique is often combined with high risk, and too often without adequate respect for less technically gifted players with good work ethic/ physical attributes. The number of ball loss in critical zones are quite high. At a higher level, this could be fatal to the game result, and thus not optimal for his confidence and further development imo.

Diamonds are developed on the basis of long-standing and well known processes, and impatience will instead lead to ...... asphalt.

I really hope he stays with us, because this kid has I really hope he stays with us, because this boy has "brilliant" potential
 
IL_DUCE said:
I have seen Pogba play on several occasions this season and,
He is obviously a special talent, but he is NOT ready for a midfield role in our 1.team yet. His style of playing is also not to his advantage, as his eminent technique is often combined with high risk, and too often without adequate respect for less technically gifted players with good work ethic/ physical attributes. The number of ball loss in critical zones are quite high. At a higher level, this could be fatal to the game result, and thus not optimal for his confidence and further development imo.

Diamonds are developed on the basis of long-standing and well known processes, and impatience will instead lead to ...... asphalt.

I really hope he stays with us, because this kid has I really hope he stays with us, because this boy has "brilliant" potential
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More often then not he played on the wing.

I think there are a ton of issues that get ignored. People come up with all sorts of things but the boy can play. The fact is though, we're at the bad end of the season now. We need to win every game. If you're Pogba you might be despite to make it before Sir Alex retires..I mean there's no certainty the next manager will see your potential so there's so many things here that make it complicated. I hope he stays. It will be of benefit to him and the club but it's important to get separate him from his agent.
 
Manchester United starlet Pogba wants first-team football

Manchester United starlet Pogba wants first-team football > Manchester United > Sport | Click Manchester

The agent of contract rebel Paul Pogba has revealed that the youngster wants to be playing first-team football.

Mino Raiola admitted that the Frenchman has become frustrated with the lack of opportunities at Old Trafford.

Pogba has been given a deadline for Friday to accept new terms offered by United.

Raiola said: "Before anything, I’ll discuss the possible renewal with United, then the case will be to speak with other clubs.

“If he arrives in Italy, however, it will be to play immediately and not to develop."


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These youngsters who've barely warranted us even knowing who they are demanding money when they could play for Manchester fecking United under Sir Alex Pissing Ferguson really does feck me off. They have zero right to ask for more money.
 
Red Dreams said:
Manchester United starlet Pogba wants first-team football > Manchester United > Sport | Click Manchester

The agent of contract rebel Paul Pogba has revealed that the youngster wants to be playing first-team football.

Mino Raiola admitted that the Frenchman has become frustrated with the lack of opportunities at Old Trafford.

Pogba has been given a deadline for Friday to accept new terms offered by United.

Raiola said: "Before anything, I’ll discuss the possible renewal with United, then the case will be to speak with other clubs.

“If he arrives in Italy, however, it will be to play immediately and not to develop."


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I agree Pogba needs more first team experience, but right now he's not ready to play regularly, especially not in our current lightweight midfield. The problem is City are going to compete with us for the next few years. The circumstances are a bit unfortunate. Because of this, youngsters will see fewer first team action.
 
He's not going to start playing immediately for Juventus. This Ravioli greaseball is talking absolute bollocks. (assuming these are actually real quotes)
 
Red Dreams said:
Manchester United starlet Pogba wants first-team football > Manchester United > Sport | Click Manchester

The agent of contract rebel Paul Pogba has revealed that the youngster wants to be playing first-team football.

Mino Raiola admitted that the Frenchman has become frustrated with the lack of opportunities at Old Trafford.

Pogba has been given a deadline for Friday to accept new terms offered by United.

Raiola said: "Before anything, I’ll discuss the possible renewal with United, then the case will be to speak with other clubs.

“If he arrives in Italy, however, it will be to play immediately and not to develop."


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My response to that is "feck off."

Demanding first team football is worse than demanding more money. You want first team football? Go follow Morrison to West Ham
 
IL_DUCE said:
I have seen Pogba play on several occasions this season and,
He is obviously a special talent, but he is NOT ready for a midfield role in our 1.team yet. His style of playing is also not to his advantage, as his eminent technique is often combined with high risk, and too often without adequate respect for less technically gifted players with good work ethic/ physical attributes. The number of ball loss in critical zones are quite high. At a higher level, this could be fatal to the game result, and thus not optimal for his confidence and further development imo.

Diamonds are developed on the basis of long-standing and well known processes, and impatience will instead lead to ...... asphalt.

I really hope he stays with us, because this kid has I really hope he stays with us, because this boy has "brilliant" potential
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I dont agree with this. We have played Carrick - Giggs in central midfield this season with good effect, and Giggs is a very high risk midfielder with lots of ball losses. It works with Carrick on the pitch and that style in itself shouldnt be a reason for him not to play. Pogba also seems to have a good cross on him, so he could play as a winger tucked in and adding men to the midfield (as Giggs has also done on many occasions).

I really hope he stays, but if he leaves because of unrealistic wage demands then its his loss first and foremost. We will cope.
 
It's embarassing how many pages this thread has. If he doesn't want to play for United then feck him, good riddance.
 
FreakyJim said:
He's not going to start playing immediately for Juventus. This Ravioli greaseball is talking absolute bollocks. (assuming these are actually real quotes)
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No one likes to admit he s a greedy bastard.. :)
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Er... Chris Smalling had played for Fulham's first team 13 times, in the Premier League and en route to the Europa League final. Pogba played half a Carling Cup game and 20 minutes in a single PL game.

Not to mention, why are people assuming his initial contract with United was better paid than the offer on the table for Pogba?
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Not when we signed him.
 
AlwaysRedwood said:
My response to that is "feck off."

Demanding first team football is worse than demanding more money. You want first team football? Go follow Morrison to West Ham
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Depends how he is going about it to be honest.

I want first team football here or I'll feck off somewhere else and they will appreciate me....

....Is one thing.

It could however be....

I feel at a stage in my development where first team football will be the best form of progress and I have been offered this elsewhere, I want to know if I am realistically in the first team plans in the near future or whether to pursue it elsewhere.


Rossi did exactly that and everyone wished him all the best.


Once again, I think people forget he's not a local lad and Manchester United has only been coaching him for 2 years so it's probably not the be all and end all just yet.
 
Pexbo said:
Depends how he is going about it to be honest.

I want first team football here or I'll feck off somewhere else and they will appreciate me....

....Is one thing.

It could however be....

I feel at a stage in my development where first team football will be the best form of progress and I have been offered this elsewhere, I want to know if I am realistically in the first team plans in the near future or whether to pursue it elsewhere.


Rossi did exactly that and everyone wished him all the best.


Once again, I think people forget he's not a local lad and Manchester United has only been coaching him for 2 years so it's probably not the be all and end all just yet.
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Why do you have to go and talk sense? Pogba is a money grabbing idiot that won't ever fulfill his potential because he isn't staying at Manchester United.
 
Brosstan said:
I dont agree with this. We have played Carrick - Giggs in central midfield this season with good effect, and Giggs is a very high risk midfielder with lots of ball losses. It works with Carrick on the pitch and that style in itself shouldnt be a reason for him not to play. Pogba also seems to have a good cross on him, so he could play as a winger tucked in and adding men to the midfield (as Giggs has also done on many occasions).

I really hope he stays, but if he leaves because of unrealistic wage demands then its his loss first and foremost. We will cope.
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I would argue that Pogba - still- make a lot more "rookie" mistakes than Giggs, and that experience-related factors further contribute to making this comparison unnatural and not very relevant.

I have no problem with his playing style. On the contrary...
 
Pexbo said:
Depends how he is going about it to be honest.

I want first team football here or I'll feck off somewhere else and they will appreciate me....

....Is one thing.

It could however be....

I feel at a stage in my development where first team football will be the best form of progress and I have been offered this elsewhere, I want to know if I am realistically in the first team plans in the near future or whether to pursue it elsewhere.


Rossi did exactly that and everyone wished him all the best.


Once again, I think people forget he's not a local lad and Manchester United has only been coaching him for 2 years so it's probably not the be all and end all just yet.
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Heh. If you think he's been given some sort of guarantee from Juventus about how much first-team football he'll get next season then you're very naive.

All that any footballer can do is look at the players ahead of him in his preferred position and have a bit of faith in his ability to displace them. Which is all any manager could ever offer them.

If he was primarily motivated by a chance to play football you'd have to say there's a central midfield slot or two at United just begging to be filled.

Of course, that's not his primary motivation. Which is something his agent has made crystal-clear on twitter.

As you say, he's not a local lad and juve are a club with a great tradition behind them. He doesn't deserve to be demonised for following the big bucks to sign for a world famous club. It's not like he's fecking off to Qatar. Equally, i don't see why people are desperate to defend him from accusations of being motivated by money.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Heh. If you think he's been given some sort of guarantee from Juventus about how much first-team football he'll get next season then you're very naive.

All that any footballer can do is look at the players ahead of him in his preferred position and have a bit of faith in his ability to displace them. Which is all any manager could ever offer them.

If he was primarily motivated by a chance to play football you'd have to say there's a central midfield slot or two at United just begging to be filled.

Of course, that's not his primary motivation. Which is something his agent has made crystal-clear on twitter.

As you say, he's not a local lad and juve are a club with a great tradition behind them. He doesn't deserve to be demonised for following the big bucks to sign for a world famous club. It's not like he's fecking off to Qatar. Equally, i don't see why people are desperate to defend him from accusations of being motivated by money.
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I'm just offering alternative to the scenarios presented. In all honesty, what the lad actually wants is secondary here, Raiola is chasing money for himself, that's the situation for me and I think it's the usual scenario of the agent telling the player he's "amazing" and "look at the clubs in for him", "why aren't United appreciating him?" We've heard it all before.

The fact is, players that stay at clubs for a long time don't earn agents much money. Ibrahimovic must have been a wet dream when he got him on his books.

Balotelli won't stay long at City for the same reason.

The simple fact is, if Cleverley is as good as he looks to be, he could be with us til he is 35 with no questions asked. Same with Welbeck. Players like Pogba are always going to move on at some point, you have to ask yourself who is worth investing in?
 
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