Still don't buy the absolute refusal to consider Tony as part of a front 3. We constantly underestimate the man.
Shinji Kagawa
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Exactly. The lad has basically never let us down. With his no-nonsense, as well as ability to make a 5 yard pass we can be sure Kagawa will see as much ball as possible. Apart from that he did prove last year he's not as dimensional as some had thought beforehand.
I don't know what he has to do really, show a few fancy tricks or what? Play players at their best position and use them to their strenghts. He's the best at the club at what he's supposed to do as a right winger.
I don't know what he has to do really, show a few fancy tricks or what? Play players at their best position and use them to their strenghts. He's the best at the club at what he's supposed to do as a right winger.
Yeah I think that's the obvious solution. Rooney loves pulling out wide left anyway, many of the best playmakers of the last two decades have excelled coming in off the wing and Van Persie and Nani are perfectly comfortable providing that width on the left when needed.
Even then you're leaving Valencia, Young and Welbeck and Hernandez out. Fecking mental attacking options at this club right now.
I'd buy the argument in a 4-4-2 but there is no debate in that Nani is more suited to the system we're talking about. That's not to say Valencia can't work at it and show us all he's fully capable of playing there and interchanging, but Nani is the obvious choice, it's a role he already fills for his country and he was superb at it in the euros.
And by the way, I completely disagree that Tony is our best winger.
You're perfectly entitled to, Nani vs Valencia was always going to divide opinions. I simply trust him more, and I've always had to trust wingers at United. Keep the ball moving, don't let yourself lose it easily. Now that we've got Kagawa it's even more important.
EDIT: For the record I said RM not a winger as it is. Then Nani would edge it seeing that he can play on both flanks.
EDIT: For the record I said RM not a winger as it is. Then Nani would edge it seeing that he can play on both flanks.
Valencia is the best suited to playing in a 442 than our other wingers but I think Nani and to a lesser extent Young are better suited to more advanced roles such as a 433. Tbh though if we do go 433 I think there's an argument to be had between whether Rooney can offer more from a wide position than nani, valancia and maybe Young, whether it's a 433, 4231 whatever.
Personally I don't think he's able to beat players well enough to compete with what someone like Nani can offer there or has the same level of consistent delivery that Valencia has, particularly when valencia's ability to beat his man down the right and then fizz a ball right across the box is one of our big weapons.
Personally I don't think he's able to beat players well enough to compete with what someone like Nani can offer there or has the same level of consistent delivery that Valencia has, particularly when valencia's ability to beat his man down the right and then fizz a ball right across the box is one of our big weapons.
Valencia is the steady reliable option, nani is the win a match out of nothing type player.
Some prefer certain types, but we have enough steady players in the team, valencia needs to step his game up and become more confident.
Some prefer certain types, but we have enough steady players in the team, valencia needs to step his game up and become more confident.
I'd back Valencia to beat his man in the easiest manner out of these three. Unless Nani is in top top form. Tony would be the last man from our team I'd like to face if I was playing as a full-back, put it this way.
He certainly wasn't steady when he was carrying us at times last season, people have short memories. I'd think we've already put that myth to bed by now.
Well at the risk of yet another valencia nani debate I would say that whilst Valencia might beat his man in a more simplistic manner than say Nani it is also easier to stop by better opponents by forcing him inside. You can't do that with Nani where his bad games a more a result of his own play than something the opposition are doing imo.
Yep, best way to go really.
We'l see a lot of Kagawa in midfield with Carrick though i feel.
Not really, you'd make a list of 3 or 4 high-profile games where Nani was just shut by his man, not himself, before Valencia came with his steadiness and won us games or enabled others to do so. City at home along with Milan away is what I've got from the top of my head.
You rarely see Valenciaa being dominated by opposite full-back, can you say the same about Nani? when nothing's coming off for him?
We should be fecking happy to have both and there are areas where Nani's better, but for God's sake, don't use Valencia's advantages as his drawbacks.
I've definitely seen plenty of games where Valencia hasn't performed or not been able to beat his man often enough. First half of last season for example he struggled. If we're gonna name games then I can think of some Arsenal games where Nani was brilliant, against Bayern even when we lost the tie he was great. Chelsea last season etc.
I'm not trying to take away from Valencia but imo although his best ability is his reliable play from the right and makes him a top player it also is the thing that limits him. Nani's strength is his willingness to take people on both on the inside and outside and ability to try something tough. This is also what people will slam him for when it doesn't come off.
As you said we should be grateful we have both. Found a good article on them here http://www.eplindex.com/17188/real-number-7-step-nani-vs-valencia.html
Dunno if it's been posted before. Pretty much level with Valencia edging it defensively and Nani edging it in attack. But either way in a more advanced role such as a 433 I would prefer Nani everytime.
Easy hard man, I didn't even start the bloody thing.
Yes you did.
As I said, it's for another thread.
The point I made was simply that Nani is more suited to a wing-forward role, that's just a given, he plays that role for his country. Valencia would obviously have chances to prove he can do it too, as I said in my first post on the matter.
Taking it back to Kagawa, the left-drifting role similar to what David Silva plays at City is also one he's accustomed to at International level. If we're planning on changing system, Kagawa left, Nani right, and Rooney in the hole behind Van Persie is the most obvious (note: not correct/right) way of doing it.
I responded to your comment, unless you're the only one who can voice personal opinion. Put that to bed, I've just done it.
Then let's debate that point.
"IN THIS SYSTEM."
How can you not see that Valencia is the more obvious one to miss out in that system? Nani actually plays that role for his country.
As I said in response, I'd respect your argument in a 4-4-2, there are certainly good arguments for both players. But in the mentioned 4-2-3-1 or 4-2-1-3, Nani is the obvious one to play wide-forward, that aint up for debate.
Once again, I bolded the obvious so that you understand I mean "obvious", not correct/right.
See, it wasn't that difficult. Next time just ignore others' opinion you don't agree with before jumping on them. If you really have to - be consistent about it, I wasn't the only one who continued the discussion. Can we now put this to bed and focus on potentially the best PL signing this season?
What are you on about?
It's pretty obvious you came in here, totally missed the fecking point and started posting nonsense that wasn't related to what we were talking about.
FWIW, I'd never say that either Nani or Valencia is the obvious player to play on the right in a 4-4-2, cause I don't think there is an obvious choice.
Next time, try to actually understand what you're posting about before jumping in. As I said, a little time to actually read and understand and you'd have posted differently I'm sure. I mean, surely no-one with half a football brain actually thinks Valencia is a more obvious choice as a wide-forward in a 4-2-1-3? He may well be a better choice, but the obvious one is the guy who just had a cracking Euros playing in the exact position.
The reason Kagawa is the more obvious choice than Rooney/RVP on the left is because he also plays it for his country. Once again, it may not be the best choice, Kagawa in the middle and Rooney out left may end up the best alternative, but I can't say that, I can simply say what is "obvious", a word you need to start comprehending.
You really can't let it go.
This is quite spot on, actually. What I liked about Kagawa in the last game is that he always looked like he had much time on the ball which is a good sign if you've just come to Premiership. So much reminiscent of Silva, I won't be surprised if he becomes as good.
We have to give him the ball more often, it looked as if we were scared at times he would lose it, i.e if there were Everton players around him. The thing is he only needs half a yard gap to create something or at least keep the possession of the football. I'm looking forward to him linking up with Van Persie.
EDIT: and actually I don't think he'll need to bulk up, not much anyway. I'm sick of this old English bullshit. Ball players in his position don't need much muscle.
Yep, Gary Neville did a big piece on this on Sky Sports yesterday, our reluctance to use Kagawa enough.
I can recall a few high profile games, when he was awful e.g. Wembley 2011.
Who weren't awful in that game?
Rooney played ok. Giggs, Vidic, Rio more than decent. Valencia was purely awful.
its clear, 3-4-3 is the way to go.
DDG
smalling vidic ferdinand
valencia carrick kagawa nani
welbeck rooney rvp
DDG
smalling vidic ferdinand
valencia carrick kagawa nani
welbeck rooney rvp
Looks shit Adam.
Clear as swamp water.
Clear as swamp water.
We're going to have a smashing team when Rooney, RvP, Kagawa and either Nani/Valencia are up front, with a settled back 4, and someone good to partner Carrick (and Kagawa) in midfield. Oh, and one of our best players, De Gea.
Kagawa could be our POTY.
The Fifa 13 possibilities will be endless, after my exams finish late November (and my first year of uni'll start mid-late February!)!!!!!
Kagawa could be our POTY.
The Fifa 13 possibilities will be endless, after my exams finish late November (and my first year of uni'll start mid-late February!)!!!!!
Nein
No hes number 7 now.
I think he meant Berbatov is our best RM.
and what does a poor joke deserve? yep, a poor one in return 
Kagawa also covered more ground than any other player for United (vs everton) with 6.11 miles, ahead of the evergreen Paul Scholes with 5.68 miles.
www.byfarthegreatestteam.com/posts/...ered-the-most-ground-put-in-the-most-tackles/
www.byfarthegreatestteam.com/posts/...ered-the-most-ground-put-in-the-most-tackles/
You mean to say Scholes was 2nd in distance covered? That might embarrass some players. I suggest if anyone but a center back or goalkeeper fails to cover more ground than Scholes he should be flogged.
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