Shinji Kagawa

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Cina said:
There's a crazy amount of love for Kagawa in here despite him being very underwhelming at this club so far.

Maybe he just doesn't suit the PL and Moyes knows that? He wouldn't be the first talented player not to.
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I'm not sure you can say that when you look at the clubs around us. Silva at City, Oscar at Chelsea etc.

Definitely agree on the first part though. People seem to be rating him for his time at Dortmund (despite the fact that I'd bet half the people moaning about his lack of chances didn't watch him at Dortmund (many probably didn't even know of Kagawa before we signed him)) and the fact that Dortmund was so great last season, so Kagawa must've been brilliant there to be a key part of their team.
 
Ole's_toe_poke said:
Excited for Adnan. Had a feeling he'd play as Moyes seems to be a big fan.

Feel sorry for Kagawa. Don't think he deserved to be hauled off last week. Don't think Moyes has really given him a fair chance. Others have been afforded a lot more slack than Shinji.
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Is he on the bench?

I agree, we've been strangely harsh on him.
 
Cina said:
There's a crazy amount of love for Kagawa in here despite him being very underwhelming at this club so far. Maybe he just doesn't suit the PL and Moyes knows that? He wouldn't be the first talented player not to.
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He's not played worse than Valencia, Young, Anderson, Rooney in their difficult moments. There was a period of 9 months Rooney didn't score from open play for us, did we drop him to the bench and watch him rot? Kagawa can only get better with game time, not on the bench. Moyes' man-management needs help from the United Nations.
 
Wowi said:
I'm not sure you can say that when you look at the clubs around us. Silva at City, Oscar at Chelsea etc.

Definitely agree on the first part though. People seem to be rating him for his time at Dortmund (despite the fact that I'd bet half the people moaning about his lack of chances didn't watch him at Dortmund (many probably didn't even know of Kagawa before we signed him)) and the fact that Dortmund was so great last season, so Kagawa must've been brilliant there to be a key part of their team.
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Silva is a better player though.

Certain players adapt, others don't. It happens.
 
akash02 said:
I am saying they are overrating Kagawa. Quite simple really
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And lots of people overrate Rooney too. That's quite simple too.

Also your confusion over why lots want him to start ahead of Rooney is answered by the Rooney saga. If Rooney was loved like he used to be, less people would make that claim.
 
Hannibal said:
He's not played worse than Valencia, Young, Anderson, Rooney in their difficult moments. There was a period of 9 months Rooney didn't score from open play for us, did we drop him to the bench and watch him rot? Kagawa can only get better with game time, not on the bench. Moyes' man-management needs help from the United Nations.
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What matters is now. Rooney is playing better than Kagawa (and is a better player than Kagawa) which is why he starts. The logic is quite straightforward
 
Cina said:
There's a crazy amount of love for Kagawa in here despite him being very underwhelming at this club so far.

Maybe he just doesn't suit the PL and Moyes knows that? He wouldn't be the first talented player not to.
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Not sure about that. He seems to always show his quality in spurts. He just needs to show it more frequently in games. He's definitely shown enough for me to feel that he could really shine in this league.
 
Aboutreika18 said:
I find it funny that bigger Nani fanboys like Top and Orton are overlooked in favour of yourself.
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Well, let's be fair, Top has a far lesser personality than I do. He's super boring, he just sits there in Denmark eating pastries all the time.
 
Wowi said:
:lol: Why are you comparing him to a bunch of players that doesn't even play in his position? He's been wank when playing on the wing, so it's really about time that experiment was stopped. The only player ahead of Kagawa is Rooney.
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Because based on current evidence Moyes has primarily used him in a wide role, and through both those appearances and the manager's substitution policy up to this point Kagawa is seemingly out of favour in comparison to those players.

Yes i agree that he should be in competition with Rooney, however we are yet to see the new regime field him in such a role [whether Wayne is fit, injured or ineffective].
 
Cina said:
There's a crazy amount of love for Kagawa in here despite him being very underwhelming at this club so far.

Maybe he just doesn't suit the PL and Moyes knows that? He wouldn't be the first talented player not to.
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I think a lot of people are simply annoyed because he's clearly a talented attacking midfielder, but just hasn't really been given a chance as an attacking midfielder at all. Then, when he's not playing and we're getting shit results, people think that we'd improve with him in the side. Problem is though he's not really a winger.

I'd still like to see him tried out alongside Carrick at some point in a deeper role in midfield, but I doubt that'll ever happen.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
Not sure about that. He seems to always show his quality in spurts. He just needs to show it more frequently in games. He's definitely shown enough for me to feel that he could really shine in this league.
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In very very irregular spurts, I'd say. So have many players who failed in the PL.

I'm not writing him off, but clearly SAF and Moyes see something that his biggest fans cannot.
 
amolbhatia100 said:
And lots of people overrate Rooney too. That's quite simple too.

Also your confusion over why lots want him to start ahead of Rooney is answered by the Rooney saga. If Rooney was loved like he used to be, less people would make that claim.
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How is that even relevant? Whether people overrate Rooney or not he's proven himself to be a better player than Kagawa.

You start your best players and Kagawa isn't one of them. Thankfully Moyes is not as big a fool as some on here
 
akash02 said:
How is that even relevant? Whether people overrate Rooney or not he's proven himself to be a better player than Kagawa.

You start your best players and Kagawa isn't one of them. Thankfully Moyes is not as big a fool as some on here
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Although many would argue that even though he's not primarily a winger, he'd still perform a lot better for us there than someone like Young.
 
Cheesy said:
Although many would argue that even though he's not primarily a winger, he'd still perform a lot better for us there than someone like Young.
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Yeah I agree with that. Kagawa is infinitely better than Young even on the flanks and on current form even Valencia
 
Wowi said:
I'm not sure you can say that when you look at the clubs around us. Silva at City, Oscar at Chelsea etc.

Definitely agree on the first part though. People seem to be rating him for his time at Dortmund (despite the fact that I'd bet half the people moaning about his lack of chances didn't watch him at Dortmund (many probably didn't even know of Kagawa before we signed him)) and the fact that Dortmund was so great last season, so Kagawa must've been brilliant there to be a key part of their team.
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What point are you actually making here? He was excellent in a side that played great football and won the double over a strong Bayern team. Even from the beginning he looked like a player you'd want to sign.

Brwned said:
Shinji Kagawa anyone? 4 goals and 1 assist in 7 league appearances so far, in his debut season. Watching him for the first time for Dortmund v Cologne now and has looked very impressive to me. Typically tidy on the ball but he's shown a penetrative side to his game that's created the first goal and set up another sitter.

Could be one to watch out for.
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R.N7 said:
I've been following Dortmund this season and yeah, he's been quite impressive. Plays behind the lone striker (Barrios) and is a very quick, technical and direct player.
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Carl said:
Still not fit from the Summer... :wenger:

Also, Moyes is showing Kagawa that if you take your chance in the first team as Januzaj has done then you'll be rewarded for it.
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That's a big thing for me and in my opinion it's a necessary thing. Some players need time to bed in, and exactly the right setup to thrive, but if you've got a young player who comes in and impresses as soon as he hits the pitch then you can't ignore him. Otherwise you'd always pick the more expensive buy or the more experienced player.

It's a tough situation for Kagawa. At its bleakest, it's reminiscent of Sahin's problems with Madrid and Liverpool. He needed game time and the right structure, neither team could offer it. Hopefully Kagawa's made of sterner stuff, and will show us exactly why his fans see him as a key player. When he gets another chance of course.
 
akash02 said:
How is that even relevant? Whether people overrate Rooney or not he's proven himself to be a better player than Kagawa.

You start your best players and Kagawa isn't one of them. Thankfully Moyes is not as big a fool as some on here
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Again missing the point. Fans overrate their players all the time. It isn't a big deal so you should probably get used to it. That's how it is relevant.

Yes you start your best players. Which is why young starts so much. What a fool that moyes is.
 
Nick 0208 Ldn said:
You start your best team, what you are referring to i believe is England in the 00s.
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And Kagawa falls in neither category atm
amolbhatia100 said:
Again missing the point. Fans overrate their players all the time. It isn't a big deal so you should probably get used to it. That's how it is relevant.

Yes you start your best players. Which is why young starts so much. What a fool that moyes is.
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Young doesn't start 'so' much. Hasn't even been on the bench for a while
 
akash02 said:
And Kagawa falls in neither category atm


Young doesn't start 'so' much. Hasn't even been on the bench for a while
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He's started plenty in his time at united. You don't always start your best players. It's a squad game these days particularly at united.
 
Brwned said:
What point are you actually making here? He was excellent in a side that played great football and won the double over a strong Bayern team. Even from the beginning he looked like a player you'd want to sign.
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There's no doubt he was. The point I was trying to make was that some people on here seem to rate him based on his time at Dortmund rather than his time at United. My second point, which got quite murky, was that some of the people using that argument probably didn't even watch him at Dortmund.
 
Zen86 said:
This would be a great opportunity to stick him in the middle for a change.
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I was thinking this as well, Moyes doesn't want to use him out on the wing and prefers Rooney behind a striker so why not have him next to Carrick?

He has a nack of getting in the box and is always making himself available for the pass. No disrespect to Cleverly but I don't see what he would do any differently than Kagawa
 
Cheesy said:
I think a lot of people are simply annoyed because he's clearly a talented attacking midfielder, but just hasn't really been given a chance as an attacking midfielder at all. Then, when he's not playing and we're getting shit results, people think that we'd improve with him in the side. Problem is though he's not really a winger.

I'd still like to see him tried out alongside Carrick at some point in a deeper role in midfield, but I doubt that'll ever happen.
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Probably because he has never been a CM. Everyman and his dog knows he is not a winger as does Moyes and Fergie . That does not preclude him from playing on the left as he does for Japan, as Iniesta does for Barcelona or Silva does for City. What happens if Moyes gets a couple of top quality midfielders in the next 2 transfer windows? Are you going to suggest that Moyes play him at right back just to shoehorn him in the team?
 
Ole's_toe_poke said:
Kagawa, Januzaj, Rooney. Is there no way to fit the three of them in the same team?
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I personally would go with Nanuzaj as my starting wingers (although I'd like to see what Zaha has to offer) and then rotate the front two places between Kagawa, Rooney and RVP.

People will get injured/need a rest.
 
100 said:
When Robin isn't playing
Rooney
Januzaj Kagawa Nani

Easy
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This, I don't think RVP should be starting atm and I really want to see Kagawa in his best position.
 
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