I think because he was so poor earlier in the season people are acting as if these recent decent performances are something special. He's been better than his early season form but he's hardly pulling up any trees. Just an improvement on woeful.
Marouane Fellaini | 2013/14 Performances
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Agreed. He controls the ball better with his chest than with his feet. Played well yesterday but we shouldn't start pretending he played like Yaya Toure.
De Gea? I don't think being the best of an awful bunch means much (which I don't think he was anyway).
Liverpool were able to play straight through Fellaini with ease, as do most teams with a bit of energy and technical ability. Fellaini looked fine against West Ham because they have exactly zero interest in ever playing the ball through the middle so his lack of mobility, poor positioning and general clumsiness is rarely exposed (although he still looked clumsy yesterday).
As soon as we play a side who like to play it through the centre and have players who like to occupy that space between defence and midfield he's going to be found out again. Just like he was at Liverpool.
City are up next with Silva, Nasri, Toure and maybe Jovetic all liking to play in his area of the field. I predict he'll look equally as out of his depth as he did vs Liverpool.
He's started to put himself about a bit more since his return from injury - it's actually nice to go to West Ham and dominate against a side of their size and style.
City's an acid test, if Moyes picks him. He was dire at the Etihad when they hammered us.
City's an acid test, if Moyes picks him. He was dire at the Etihad when they hammered us.
That last bit is plain wrong. Improvement on woeful implies mediocre, at best. I'm in a minority who think he wasn't all that great yesterday but the performance against WBA was a solid 7 or 8 out of 10, judged in isolation.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/motm-vs-liverpool-h.386574/
Small sample size but not many (if any) thought he was the outright MotM vs Liverpool.
Small sample size but not many (if any) thought he was the outright MotM vs Liverpool.
Agree with Pogue. That wasn't his best performance yet more people are coming out and noticing he's decent.
Still a few who won't change their opinions because of perceptions and the money but since returning he's probably been the most consistent outfield player for us.
Still a few who won't change their opinions because of perceptions and the money but since returning he's probably been the most consistent outfield player for us.
That's one player, which would mean he was one of our better players against Pool which is all that was said.
There were far worse performances than Fellaini's, who actually did alright.
Liverpool played through us with ease because Moyes was ridiculously naive in the way he set us up. Liverpool swamped the central area, while we played 4-4-2 with two 'wingers' who didn't really get through the requisite amount of work - Carrick and Fellaini were completely swamped.
Yesterday, Moyes got his tactics spot on.
I don't remember him specifically against WBA, but I've admitted he's been decent of late. I just think people are going over the top that he's been our best player in recent weeks or making out that his recent performances are anything special when they aren't. They're ok and better than his poor early performances but nothing to put fear into our rivals and he isn't Manchester United quality. That won't change because of a few ok performances. Best one of the lot was probably his cameo against Olympiakos.
I thought yesterday was his best performance. He's getting there physically - though still not at the level he was at during his Everton spell - but we need to try and add some polish to him.
Not sure if serious...
Anyway. He was a lot better than just "ok" against West Brom.
Tougher tests await, obviously.
Good avoiding of the question
Actually I thought that you are able to connect the dots. CM was our last year's achilles heel. You'll expect that Moyes would spend 27m to bring in a quality playmaker able to inject some quality to the side, not someone whose more suited for the physical and the hoof ball game which, thank god, hasn't been effective at the top level for the past 2 decades.
Anyway are rumours that we're set to spent 37m on Carvalho. Moyes is also targeting a quality playmaker with Kroos rumoured to be a hot favorite. Considering that we already have Mata and Rooney as no 10 and a RVP as the main striker then its an educated guess to think that 27 m rated Fellaini will probably end up on the bench. Such thing kind of speak volumes on how successful this transfer was.
I did read it but we played fine and if we take that confidence into big games we'll be fine.
Thought he was the best player we had on the day to be honest.
You're literally basing him not being a good player on transfer rumours for next year and hypothetical teams.
What I'm saying is since he returned to full fitness he's been our best outfield player and has done well. I'm dealing in what I have seen on the pitch. You're basing it on what if's and maybes.
I agree we played fine. However there's a huge gap between the likes of West Brom and the likes of Bayern.
He was class against West Brom. Probably the best midfield performance from a United player this season. Only thing missing was the polish of a goal or a delicious through ball assist.
I base on what I see. Thank god I have watch enough football to appreciate the effectiveness of having a team filled with technically gifted players. Football is usually won through ball possession and retention, creativity and technique and not how physical the player is and how good he is in aerial battles. That's a concept that British fans hasn't yet grabbed completely hence why their national side fail to win anything competition after competition.
I assume that 'returning to full fitness' mean the West Brom game. Since then we won two games against two clubs (West Brom and West Ham) who play a game which can barely be classified as football. We were literally thrashed by Liverpool in a game were we played (collectively) shite and we won just 1 game in a convincing manner were Fellaini barely played. If that should convince me that he's a good player then seriously, you have set very low standards for him.
If you ask my opinion about Fellaini, its very similar to that of Howard Kendall who shared my same concern about him. And we're talking here about a manager who went to Everton and actually won something there. An amazing feat which not even the chosen one was able to achieve. I also came with ideas on how we may get something useful about the player (read previous post) which was applauded even by the pro fellaini posters. However that would require a 3 men CM as honestly I cant see Fellaini having the positioning, pace and tactical discipline to be a DM or the creativity, technique and vision to be an AM. Alternatively (and probably) he'll be a squad player who will be used to counter the fantastic football the likes of Bolton, Stoke and West Brom play.
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/fo...prove-Manchester-United-blasts-Howard-Kendall
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Fellaini puts in good shift after good shift since his injury, yet still people come in to find the negatives of his transfer, his clumsiness, his hair etc. Just enjoy that he's actually playing well and providing for the team. This will never end will it?
Warming to him more and more,may not be the yaya type player i thought he would be.Great in defending set pieces and kept Carroll under wraps.
His dashboard shows he did a nice job on defense, and provided some link-up between defense and attackers.
His dashboard shows he did a nice job on defense, and provided some link-up between defense and attackers.
No relation to Fellaini's performance but I hate these kind of things so much. What matters is picking the right pass, not the direction of them.
For example Valencia's non pass to RVP against Olympiakos, wouldn't even show up on this map but a colossal error.
Nor does it show the significance of any failed passes, or whether it was a failed pass because the pass he received was a really crappy one.
Nevertheless, it counters the perception that some have that he's a big lump incapable of playing incisive forward passes.
Yep. His passing is generally pretty progressive, he looks forward a lot more than some give him credit for.
the yaya toure label was just made up by the media and in here. he doesn't play like yaya, he's not ever going to, different type of player. What we're seeing now is exactly what we bought him for, he's a monster in the air and did a huge amount to neutralise a very dangerous player yesterday, while getting right forward and contributing himself. We wanted him to be box to box, to help us dominate physical players, and to be tidy and dangerous in attack and that's what he's doing recently. Don't expect him to morphe into a brand new player, a skillful playmaker like yaya
EDIT: I actually am forming an opinion of him that won't be very popular, because it seems to make people's blood boil that we have a player for 27m who can't dominate City's midfield, but I think he's a player who's very useful vs weaker teams in the league (lets say 28/38 games of prem season and most of CL group stages/early rounds as well as most cup ties) but I don't like the idea of him playing CM vs the top, top sides that put huge amounts of pressure on you. There's scope for him to play in a different role in these games, or making an impact from the bench. People don't like the idea because they would say 'we payed 27m he should be able to dominate vs chelsea' or something, but realistically I think his value lies in slower paced but highly physical games versus the midtable and relegation fodder teams, which still makes up the majority of the calendar. And I don't think there's anything wrong with this at all
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I don't think anyone's saying he can't pass at all, he's not Wanyama levels of awful.
But I (and many others) can't help but watch Bayern, Barcelona and Real and get pretty envious that where they have Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets, Kroos, Thiago, Martinez, Schweinsteiger, Alonso, Modric and Di Maria we have Marouane Fellaini, a player who while not useless isn't in the same universe technically and one who cost us nearly £30m.
He was decent, he's decent. I hope we don't make the same mistake we did with Cleverley and elevate him to a higher level than he actually is after a few promising games. I think he could do alright in the big games for us provided he's playing with a couple of quality players. If we play Fellaini and Carrick against Bayern in a midfield 2 they're obviously going to get slaughtered.
Is he a significantly worse passer than Khedira, or Bender? I personally don't think so, and both of them have formed successful top level partnerships alongside more expansive CM's.
we are certainly lacking in the creative cm department, but we've seen its on the agenda and lets just hope to god it gets sorted this summer. But these players are hard to come by. Also, none of these teams play in the premiership, where strong players and good aerial players are so much more important
I think Khedira's better but he has quite a few others qualities Fellaini doesn't like being much mobile.
Bender's (I assume you mean Sven?) better defensively than Fellaini by quite a bit and Gundogan's has a really different skill set to Carrick.
I don't think Fellaini/Gundogan would be very solid defensively for example.
Fellaini's a player who (a lot like Carrick) has a skill set which doesn't match well with the skill set of many other midfielders. He's not solid enough positionally to be the sitting midfielder, or creative enough to be the box to box player. Not at a club of our level who's going to spend most of the game attacking. I can't think of many if any top midfielders in the game where you could partner them with Fellaini and end up with a really solid midfield two that cover all the bases you need from your midfield two. Even with a guy like Vidal, who's basically the best all rounder in the game at the moment, I think we'd be extremely exposed on the counter when Vidal goes forward.
I don't think they're that important. Do you think Barcelona or Bayern would struggle in the PL? They seem to make much easier work of top PL clubs than anyone in the PL does so I find it hard to see them struggling against the fodder.
they wouldn't struggle but that's not a question that proves anything. A better question to ask yourself is who should united sign, messi? iniesta? fabregas? they can't sign those players, so in absence of the best 10 players in the world or so, who are at clubs that won't sell them, physicality is often important. Look at City, spent nearly a billion on players and still need to be a physical team with good aerial players like kompany at the back. If they could just sign ronaldo, messi, iniesta etc then I'm sure they would, but since they can't get their hands on the best players in the world despite being billionaires they have to play the mortal game of football vs big, physical sides
Rather than arguing about what partnerships fellaini can and cannot form why don't we just wait and see. Plenty of people said he was a donkey before christmas and that he couldn't play in CM and look stupid now that he's playing well, maybe moyes knows more about him than we do and knows exactly what kind of partnership he can form
Judging anyone's performance is sort of like figure skating-we all see different things. The dashboard isn't perfect-but it establishes some objective basis, I think to evaluate his game. Moyes set up Fellani and Carrick to rotate at Center Half-looks like that's what Fellani did.
You're asking people to believe that Fellaini is not a donkey and that Moyes knows what he's doing. That might be a bridge too far.
I thought i'd make a quick list of pros and cons to Fellaini's game. Feel free to add your input or comment on what i've said. Just chose to do 5 each that i could think of:
Pros:
Pros:
- Fantastic aerial winner
- progressive passer
- good reading of the game (ie makes reasonable amount of interceptions)
- good tackler
- good target man
- decent technique which isn't bad but doesnt seem to handle being in tight spaces well and sometimes hinders him from moving the ball quicker (taking too many touches)
- easily drawn out of position
- foul merchant
- needs more work on weight of passing. like how he tries to be progressive with his passing but the weight on several of his passes this season, not very good.
- despite his size, struggles when being pressed (i.e. shaktar)
He hasn't preformed as a £27.5 million midfielder, the reason for that is that he isn't a £27.5 million midfielder but a £20 Midfielder at best for whom Moyes overpaid because he was too dithering to snatch him up early in the summer for his release clause of £21.5M and panicked at the end of the window because he wasn't going to land a single target. Once you get passed his ridiculous price tag you can see nothing else but a player that is putting in the best midfield performances of all midfielders we currently have at the club, is applying himself on the pitch, showing a good mentality and doing important defensive work while still contributing offensively. He is starting to look more and more like a proper United player and he deserves more support of some fans. I guess he will need to score a couple of important goals (he has had the chances to score quite a few already but been unlukcy in his finishing) to turn that negative image that is around him at this club.
The lad is a good player, I've always known that from the Belgian national team and his time at Everton. He isn't a worldbeater like Yaya Touré and paying £27.5 million was ridiculously excessive for him but he is a good lad, hard worker, proper footballer and he has physical aspects in his game that you won't find with many other midfielders. If you give the lad a chance he can be a good player for us. But if you wanted the next Scholes or a top 10 tier midfielder in the world you should gone for somebody else then Fellaini. Anyway I'am proud of him, he is applying himself, making himself usefull and making the best out of the situation, which is more than what can be said about our other midfielders so far this season (including Carrick) and it is no surpise that the performances and the results have been improving since he came back from his injurry. Our best games this season have also been with him on the pitch, that is no coincedence. He may not be putting in worldclass performances but he is putting in performances worthy of a proper United player which hasn't been the case for a long time already with for example Carrick (this season) and Cleverley and don't even get me started about Anderson.
The lad is a good player, I've always known that from the Belgian national team and his time at Everton. He isn't a worldbeater like Yaya Touré and paying £27.5 million was ridiculously excessive for him but he is a good lad, hard worker, proper footballer and he has physical aspects in his game that you won't find with many other midfielders. If you give the lad a chance he can be a good player for us. But if you wanted the next Scholes or a top 10 tier midfielder in the world you should gone for somebody else then Fellaini. Anyway I'am proud of him, he is applying himself, making himself usefull and making the best out of the situation, which is more than what can be said about our other midfielders so far this season (including Carrick) and it is no surpise that the performances and the results have been improving since he came back from his injurry. Our best games this season have also been with him on the pitch, that is no coincedence. He may not be putting in worldclass performances but he is putting in performances worthy of a proper United player which hasn't been the case for a long time already with for example Carrick (this season) and Cleverley and don't even get me started about Anderson.
Who even watches him and thinks, "wow he's not a 30 million player I hate him".
His price is redundant. He has been solid for us the last couple of games, and without him we sure would be in a worse scenario.
His price is redundant. He has been solid for us the last couple of games, and without him we sure would be in a worse scenario.
Most of the Caf.
I see Big Sam wants Fellaini banned for an alleged stamp on the useless Tomkins in Saturdays away game at the Hammers.. Sour grapes wanker!
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Marouane Fellaini faces derby ban as Sam Allardyce accuses Belgian of vicious stamp
MAROUANE FELLAINI could be ruled out of tomorrow's Manchester derby after West Ham manager Sam Allardyce claimed he should have been sent off for a stamp on defender James Tomkins on Saturday.
By: Matthew Dunn
Published: Mon, March 24, 2014
Marouane Fellaini is doubtful for the Manchester derby tomorrow [GETTY]
The incident happened in the 84th minute of United's 2-0 win at Upton Park and, although Match of the Day did not show the challenge on their highlights package, TV replays at the time showed the United player landing with his studs on the ankle of Tomkins, who left the ground at the end of the game with a pronounced limp.
Tomkins was given treatment at the time but referee Lee Mason restarted play with a dropped ball, indicating that he had not seen the incident. The FA will wait until they receive his report before deciding whether to put their case to their three-man refereeing panel later today.
"I thought Maraoune Fellaini was lucky not to get sent-off for his foul on James Tomkins," said Allardyce. "They've got to be good enough to spot it don't they? That's what their job is.
Manchester United celebrate Wayne Rooney's wonderstrike [GETTY]
I thought Maraoune Fellaini was lucky not to get sent-off for his foul on James Tomkins
Sam Allardyce
"Probably he wasn't in the right place and that's why if he has any doubt he can't give it. You've got to be absolutely certain if you're the referee that you've seen what has happened. Hopefully James will be OK for Wednesday."
If Fellaini is found guilty of a charge, he will face a three-match ban which will kick in instantly with no grounds for appeal.
As a result, as well as the game against City tomorrow he would be banned for the games with Villa and Newcastle to be played on the next two Saturdays.
His absence will be particularly sorely felt as manager David Moyes had been using him to provide cover in front of a defence that has been patched up with midfielders already due to a string of injuries.
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...am-Allardyce-accuses-Belgian-of-vicious-stamp
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Marouane Fellaini faces derby ban as Sam Allardyce accuses Belgian of vicious stamp
MAROUANE FELLAINI could be ruled out of tomorrow's Manchester derby after West Ham manager Sam Allardyce claimed he should have been sent off for a stamp on defender James Tomkins on Saturday.
By: Matthew Dunn
Published: Mon, March 24, 2014
The incident happened in the 84th minute of United's 2-0 win at Upton Park and, although Match of the Day did not show the challenge on their highlights package, TV replays at the time showed the United player landing with his studs on the ankle of Tomkins, who left the ground at the end of the game with a pronounced limp.
Tomkins was given treatment at the time but referee Lee Mason restarted play with a dropped ball, indicating that he had not seen the incident. The FA will wait until they receive his report before deciding whether to put their case to their three-man refereeing panel later today.
"I thought Maraoune Fellaini was lucky not to get sent-off for his foul on James Tomkins," said Allardyce. "They've got to be good enough to spot it don't they? That's what their job is.
I thought Maraoune Fellaini was lucky not to get sent-off for his foul on James Tomkins
Sam Allardyce
"Probably he wasn't in the right place and that's why if he has any doubt he can't give it. You've got to be absolutely certain if you're the referee that you've seen what has happened. Hopefully James will be OK for Wednesday."
If Fellaini is found guilty of a charge, he will face a three-match ban which will kick in instantly with no grounds for appeal.
As a result, as well as the game against City tomorrow he would be banned for the games with Villa and Newcastle to be played on the next two Saturdays.
His absence will be particularly sorely felt as manager David Moyes had been using him to provide cover in front of a defence that has been patched up with midfielders already due to a string of injuries.
http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...am-Allardyce-accuses-Belgian-of-vicious-stamp
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