Louis van Gaal | Manchester United manager

[Glanville95]

Yep, that was the main delight for me when watching his Holland team completely dismantle Spain. The fact, that on paper the sides are barely comparable, with Robben and van Persie the only truly world class players in their team. Without any signings, van Gaal will at the very least extract so much from the team once his philosophy and system is fully established and adhered to in the team.

I definitely think we don't possess the quality in our current squad to reclaim a top four position, especially going off the assumption all our competitors will strengthen. We do have too many weaknesses and mediocrity that LVG cannot simply work an instant miracle on, but our signings don't necessarily have to be star-studded; preferable, but not essential.

I expect drastic improvements in Kagawa, Welbeck, Evans, Rafael and Mata next season, as well as possibly Cleverley if he stays. We still need about five players, but the outlook on our team if far more promising with a competent manager in charge.

 

[Rozay]

Also, watching his managerial masterclass reaffirmed my view that Giggs, or anyone else, should not be forced on him. He should be allowed to use his own people and do things his way.

I also appreciate that I am observing from a distance, but for those clamouring for Giggs to be fast tracked into United management, I reckon he's a long way from being able to pull off a performance like that.

 

[Y2A]

This is without any signings, looks good anyway on paper. RVP and Rooney don't have to start together.

5th place here we come next season.

 

[herokiller84]

Replace Rooney with Sanchez?

Reus.

 

[herokiller84]

5th place here we come next season.

More like 3rd minimum.

Look into the calibre of the manager weve appointed and the squad inherited from a past great.

Hed easily drive us forward with our current squad.

Just saying.

 

[Manucho the boss]

More like 3rd minimum.

Look into the calibre of the manager weve appointed and the squad inherited from a past great.

Hed easily drive us forward with our current squad.

Just saying.

But we found out last season that this squad of inherited players was being held together by Ferguson.

Do you honestly think we should stick with them after a season of absolute failure? What if Van Gaal takes time to get used to English football? What if it turns out that we were that bad despite Moyes, not because of him?

 

[Sherzad]

But we found out last season that this squad of inherited players was being held together by Ferguson.

Do you honestly think we should stick with them after a season of absolute failure? What if Van Gaal takes time to get used to English football? What if it turns out that we were that bad despite Moyes, not because of him?

We were bad because off Moyes. As you will agree VG is not some small time manager, he has managed big clubs and players so there is very small to no chance off hime needing time to settle in.

Weak defence or midfield but our attack ( RVp/Welback/Mata/shinji/Adnan/Rooney) is good enough for a top 4 finish, with the help off a top manager (VG) in charge.

 

[Igor Drefljak]

The thing I like about Van Gaal is, although it means missing out on very good players like Kroos and Fabregas, he wants two midfielders that will work up and down the pitch, but mainly supporting.
I've always said I want to sign a defender (I still would prefer someone, Garay seems the best option for realism and price), but if he can bring in some workaholic quality midfielders, with or without a new defender, our defence should tighten.

The formation what I expect him to play will give a freedom for Mata sat behind RVP, with two wingers also to do what they want going forward, and not have to do to much defensively.
That said, the creativity from Januzaj and Mata will be good, but I'd still like a winger to come in. Sanchez would be my choice if he really is available from Barca

 

[Manucho the boss]

We were bad because off Moyes. As you will agree VG is not some small time manager, he has managed big clubs and players so there is very small to no chance off hime needing time to settle in.

Weak defence or midfield but our attack ( RVp/Welback/Mata/shinji/Adnan/Rooney) is good enough for a top 4 finish, with the help off a top manager (VG) in charge.

We could go through this season after season looking for a manager that can do what Ferguson did with the current squad.

He's gone, get over it and stop trying to find the new Fergie, let our new manager build his own squad.

 

[Sherzad]

We could go through this season after season looking for a manager that can do what Ferguson did with the current squad.

He's gone, get over it and stop trying to find the new Fergie, let our new manager build his own squad.

Ok "boss" I don't think anyone is stoping VG from building his own squad OR we are looking for new SAF (not fergie)

 

[Ekeke]

More like 3rd minimum.

Look into the calibre of the manager weve appointed and the squad inherited from a past great.

Hed easily drive us forward with our current squad.

Just saying.

With Buttner you don't make the top 4

 

[Sherzad]

With Buttner you don't make the top 4

But, you shut down Bayern for large part off the game (with buttner)

 

[Ekeke]

But, you shut down Bayern for large part off the game (with buttner)

You also shut down your own team's possession and in a league season the majority of the 38 games are about being the better side and breaking teams down, not sitting in the backline and hoofing the ball away when you finally get it

 

[Sherzad]

You also shut down your own team's possession and in a league season the majority of the 38 games are about being the better side and breaking teams down, not sitting in the backline and hoofing the ball away when you finally get it

Chill chief, I thought it was a funny line - obviously not. We all know he is not up to the standards.

 

[Ekeke]

Chill chief, I thought it was a funny line - obviously not. We all know he is not up to the standards.

You can never be too careful on here, after his match against Bayern there was a lot of crazy stuff about him glad to see you're in touch with reality

 

[herokiller84]

With Buttner you don't make the top 4

Why not?

Hes a young fella with pace,a decent delivery we havnt seen a lot of but its in his locker.

Confidence wise Van gaal could gee him up to be a great second choice to Shaw.<hopefully>.
Could go the other way to and i understand your dislike for him,but as i said he hasnt got a rn and cold be a handy squad option if 3 5 2 becomes a system we switch to time to time.

And just to nark you i reckon your way off ripping him for next to nothing.

 

[herokiller84]

But we found out last season that this squad of inherited players was being held together by Ferguson.

Do you honestly think we should stick with them after a season of absolute failure? What if Van Gaal takes time to get used to English football? What if it turns out that we were that bad despite Moyes, not because of him?

Think your misssing my point mate sorry i should of been explained myself more clearly.

I was merely pointing out van gaal after fergie,with the team he inherited we wouldnt have finished lower than 3rd.

 

[Ekeke]

Why not?

Hes a young fella with pace,a decent delivery we havnt seen a lot of but its in his locker.

Confidence wise Van gaal could gee him up to be a great second choice to Shaw.<hopefully>.
Could go the other way to and i understand your dislike for him,but as i said he hasnt got a rn and cold be a handy squad option if 3 5 2 becomes a system we switch to time to time.

And just to nark you i reckon your way off ripping him for next to nothing.

He's 25 not young, has a lot less pace than Evra/Shaw, he has decent delivery every 3rd or 4th attempt, the others clear the box

 

[Y2A]

More like 3rd minimum.

Look into the calibre of the manager weve appointed and the squad inherited from a past great.

Hed easily drive us forward with our current squad.

Just saying.

Lets look at it objectively. There are 3 players minimum that are not good enough to start imo. Plus lets remember, we are not looking at it in the short term or just for a tournament.

 

[herokiller84]

He's 25 not young, has a lot less pace than Evra/Shaw, he has decent delivery every 3rd or 4th attempt, the others clear the box

Aye all right hes ancient.

All im saying is weve not seen the best of him as hes bit part,he has more to offer than people give him credit for.And about his crossing,look at valencia who hoipefully never gets a continual run in the team again as hes peaked in my opinion,then well see whos a better crosser.

My whole point that i may not have made crystal,is that instead otrusting in Moyes,hypothetically got van Gaal, id put my house on us finishing in the top 3,even before mata arriving.

 

[herokiller84]

Lets look at it objectively. There are 3 players minimum that are not good enough to start imo. Plus lets remember, we are not looking at it in the short term or just for a tournament.

Think your missing the point im making<and i may have mde it poorly> mate.

Go back to last year and we get someone like van gaal,we wouldnt have finished fecking 7th.

Well done david Moyes,muppet.

 

[herokiller84]

But we found out last season that this squad of inherited players was being held together by Ferguson.

Do you honestly think we should stick with them after a season of absolute failure? What if Van Gaal takes time to get used to English football? What if it turns out that we were that bad despite Moyes, not because of him?

Simply,yes.

 

[Y2A]

Think your missing the point im making<and i may have mde it poorly> mate.

Go back to last year and we get someone like van gaal,we wouldnt have finished fecking 7th.

Well done david Moyes,muppet.

Fair enough. Thats true. Thats why I said 5th place not 7th.

 

[northbynorthwest]

The thing I like about Van Gaal is, although it means missing out on very good players like Kroos and Fabregas, he wants two midfielders that will work up and down the pitch, but mainly supporting.
I've always said I want to sign a defender (I still would prefer someone, Garay seems the best option for realism and price), but if he can bring in some workaholic quality midfielders, with or without a new defender, our defence should tighten.

The formation what I expect him to play will give a freedom for Mata sat behind RVP, with two wingers also to do what they want going forward, and not have to do to much defensively.
That said, the creativity from Januzaj and Mata will be good, but I'd still like a winger to come in. Sanchez would be my choice if he really is available from Barca

I agree. Van Gaal fits the players to the system rather fit the system to the players. I predict rooney mata and RVP will be the creative talent and he will have two working MFS who can do average to good passing, who will go up and down the pitch and then the two FBs flanking up and down the wings, with three in defense. 5-3-2 or 3-5-2

Or else he will do 4-3-3.

He goes for big men as well. So if a player linked is slight, i would doubt he would buy him.

 

[Sunny Jim]

I remember Sir Alex Ferguson being asked about 3 at the back in a pre-match interview. Couple of years ago, when Juve won their first title with it, I think. Sir Alex said that he didn't really see the use of it, and sharp as he was he remembered that last time he applied three at the back must have been against Wimbledon in 1996 or something.

Same goes for Van Gaal, he wouldn't see why we should use 3 at the back at United. Because the system he played with Holland vs. Spain made sure Holland didn't give away much, it was the best system for the players available and is specifically useful against teams that play extremely attackingly, like Spain and later in the group Chile. He is already thinking about playing 4-3-3 against Australia.

In tournament football it's about not getting knocked out. The problem with three at the back system is that you lack inniative. Perhaps we could use it against City when they're on great form, or in a CL final against Bayern or something. But against most teams that are equal or just a little better than United, playing good posession football in a 4-3-3ish set-up would help create way more chances and dominate play, which is what Van Gaal always wants.

Why not?

Hes a young fella with pace,a decent delivery we havnt seen a lot of but its in his locker.

Confidence wise Van gaal could gee him up to be a great second choice to Shaw.<hopefully>.
Could go the other way to and i understand your dislike for him,but as i said he hasnt got a rn and cold be a handy squad option if 3 5 2 becomes a system we switch to time to time.

And just to nark you i reckon your way off ripping him for next to nothing.

Why not?? Because he doesnt know the off side rules. Becasue when defending one on one he loses most of the times. Hes postioning is bad.

 

[herokiller84]

Why not?? Because he doesnt know the off side rules. Becasue when defending one on one he loses most of the times. Hes postioning is bad.

Yeah in a back four sure.

As a wing back he seems to be an allright second/third choice over a season.
And im sure he familiar with the offside rule dont go all nancy i know his position can improve and need serious work.
Evra hardly looked the finished article when he cme first did he?

And im no way a fanboy i just reckon hes a player of ours that nurtured properly could look useful on the left in the right system,cos lets face apart from midfield we need to sort or leeft hands out.

 

[herokiller84]

Fair enough. Thats true. Thats why I said 5th place not 7th.

Someone seems to read up on our incoming Iron Tulip methinks.

 

[Stobzilla]

I remember Sir Alex Ferguson being asked about 3 at the back in a pre-match interview. Couple of years ago, when Juve won their first title with it, I think. Sir Alex said that he didn't really see the use of it, and sharp as he was he remembered that last time he applied three at the back must have been against Wimbledon in 1996 or something.

Same goes for Van Gaal, he wouldn't see why we should use 3 at the back at United. Because the system he played with Holland vs. Spain made sure Holland didn't give away much, it was the best system for the players available and is specifically useful against teams that play extremely attackingly, like Spain and later in the group Chile. He is already thinking about playing 4-3-3 against Australia.

In tournament football it's about not getting knocked out. The problem with three at the back system is that you lack inniative. Perhaps we could use it against City when they're on great form, or in a CL final against Bayern or something. But against most teams that are equal or just a little better than United, playing good posession football in a 4-3-3ish set-up would help create way more chances and dominate play, which is what Van Gaal always wants.

Didn't he come out after the game against Spain saying he had learnt that sometimes it is necessary to defend and that after 20 years or so he had relented and said it wasn't possible to attack all the time. Words to that effect anyway.

I feel that in the bigger games in the league next season it could be something he uses (5-3-2 that is), particularly in away games, home games I have no doubts he will use his standard 4-3-3, but the two are quite easily interchangeable.

EDIT: The exact Van Gaal was:

"We also have to play Chile. I said before we could beat Spain because they always want to attack. Spain always want to dominate.

"I wanted that also for 20 years. But you can't always attack. You must look at the players you have."

http://www.goal.com/en-sg/news/3999...van-gaal-no-one-would-have-dreamed-spain-rout

 

[northbynorthwest]

In tournament football it's about not getting knocked out. The problem with three at the back system is that you lack inniative. Perhaps we could use it against City when they're on great form, or in a CL final against Bayern or something. But against most teams that are equal or just a little better than United, playing good posession football in a 4-3-3ish set-up would help create way more chances and dominate play, which is what Van Gaal always wants.

I agree alright. But the three at the back is a bit of a misnomer. That system has the two full backs supporting the backs and the MF. hey act as sweepers between the CBs and MFs

so it veers between 5-3-2 and 3-5-2

The same with mata in the hole. He moves between the MF and the forward position.

The fullbacks would also venture up forward as well and have the two MFs and back three to watch for the counter. Its an interesting tactic. I am sure it has its flaws as any other system would though.

 

[Henrik Larsson]

Didn't he come out after the game against Spain saying he had learnt that sometimes it is necessary to defend and that after 20 years or so he had relented and said it wasn't possible to attack all the time. Words to that effect anyway.

I feel that in the bigger games in the league next season it could be something he uses (5-3-2 that is), particularly in away games, home games I have no doubts he will use his standard 4-3-3, but the two are quite easily interchangeable.

EDIT: The exact Van Gaal was:



http://www.goal.com/en-sg/news/3999...van-gaal-no-one-would-have-dreamed-spain-rout

Yep he said that, but it's not like he changed the system for Holland to 3 at the back because he believes you literally ''can't attack all the time anymore nowadays''. I think he said it to show that he's learned a lot and became more pragmatic if needed. During his AZ time he also changed his system after finishing 11th playing 4-3-3 and he won the league with a sort of 4-4-2 the year after.

I agree alright. But the three at the back is a bit of a misnomer. That system has the two full backs supporting the backs and the MF. hey act as sweepers between the CBs and MFs

so it veers between 5-3-2 and 3-5-2

The same with mata in the hole. He moves between the MF and the forward position.

The fullbacks would also venture up forward as well and have the two MFs and back three to watch for the counter. Its an interesting tactic. I am sure it has its flaws as any other system would though.

Yeah this system suits the Dutch players very well against an opponent like Spain. It's pretty simple to compare Holland to United and that's completely different. For example:

Rafael and Evra are way better defensively (and attackingly) than Blind and Janmaat. You don't need an extra 3th defender to cover for them.

Midfield for Holland in a 3-5-2 is the same midfield as in a 4-3-3 at Holland, or United for that matter, so that won't be affected by 3 or 2 central defenders in your line up.

Attack: Holland only has Robben and RVP as world class, next in hierarchy are Lens and Depay. So for Holland it's a question of do we play Depay/Lens with no extra defender at the back, or do we play with 2 attackers and extra cover at the back, obviously you chose defensive security over mediocre option like Depay or Lens in a tournament where every match is almost like a knock-out match.
While at United, if we would use 3 at the back, say Evans, Jones and Smalling, that would mean midfield and fullbacks stay the same, but up front there would only be Rooney and RVP. So you're choosing to play an extra defender instead of Januzaj or another great attacking option. There aren't many games where you need an extra defender more than you need a great player like Januzaj, I mean we did well against Bayern this season with Moyes in charge and only 2 central defenders, you don't need 3 to play very defensive or get a result per se.

Ferguson also said he didn't see the use in playing 3 at the back and he was right. If your defense is solid enough with two centre backs and two excellent fullbacks, it would be a waste to play that extra 3th man in defense instead of an attacker or a midfielder.

Three at the back limits your ball circulation and posession too most of the times. So in an ideal world you make sure your back 4 is solid enough to play against any opponent, like City's back 4 were this season, or Real's back four were. Then you have room for an extra attacking player, or a great midfielder.

 

[northbynorthwest]

Yep he said that, but it's not like he changed the system for Holland to 3 at the back because he believes you literally ''can't attack all the time anymore nowadays''. I think he said it to show that he's learned a lot and became more pragmatic if needed. During his AZ time he also changed his system after finishing 11th playing 4-3-3 and he won the league with a sort of 4-4-2 the year after.





Yeah this system suits the Dutch players very well against an opponent like Spain. It's pretty simple to compare Holland to United and that's completely different. For example:

Rafael and Evra are way better defensively (and attackingly) than Blind and Janmaat. You don't need an extra 3th defender to cover for them.

Midfield for Holland in a 3-5-2 is the same midfield as in a 4-3-3 at Holland, or United for that matter, so that won't be affected by 3 or 2 central defenders in your line up.

Attack: Holland only has Robben and RVP as world class, next in hierarchy are Lens and Depay. So for Holland it's a question of do we play Depay/Lens with no extra defender at the back, or do we play with 2 attackers and extra cover at the back, obviously you chose defensive security over mediocre option like Depay or Lens in a tournament where every match is almost like a knock-out match.
While at United, if we would use 3 at the back, say Evans, Jones and Smalling, that would mean midfield and fullbacks stay the same, but up front there would only be Rooney and RVP. So you're choosing to play an extra defender instead of Januzaj or another great attacking option. There aren't many games where you need an extra defender more than you need a great player like Januzaj, I mean we did well against Bayern this season with Moyes in charge and only 2 central defenders, you don't need 3 to play very defensive or get a result per se.

Ferguson also said he didn't see the use in playing 3 at the back and he was right. If your defense is solid enough with two centre backs and two excellent fullbacks, it would be a waste to play that extra 3th man in defense instead of an attacker or a midfielder.

Three at the back limits your ball circulation and posession too most of the times. So in an ideal world you make sure your back 4 is solid enough to play against any opponent, like City's back 4 were this season, or Real's back four were. Then you have room for an extra attacking player, or a great midfielder.

I understand.

But the three at the back means the two full backs have an incentive to get forward and support the two MFs and front three. The three at the back means that if the two full backs are caught too far forward, the three CBs and maybe one MF can cover.

Im not saying we should adopt it, but it is interesting. Does it work against teams that counter attack as well. It worked against spain who were pressing early on, but like you say, in england, we would be doing most of the pressing.

I think as well the two MFs are nearly identical and switch. If one goes forward the other stays back, so you will have four at all times back. Interesting.

 

[Bubz27]

You think LvG would watch a game like today to assess Nani to an extent?

 

[Revan]

But we found out last season that this squad of inherited players was being held together by Ferguson.

Do you honestly think we should stick with them after a season of absolute failure? What if Van Gaal takes time to get used to English football? What if it turns out that we were that bad despite Moyes, not because of him?

We found out last season that a mediocre manager will fail even with a good squad. This squad probably can't win the title without SAF (or someone as good as him like Mourinho) but with a decent manager like Van Gaal should be able to get into top 4 comfortably.

 

[Manucho the boss]

We found out last season that a mediocre manager will fail even with a good squad. This squad probably can't win the title without SAF (or someone as good as him like Mourinho) but with a decent manager like Van Gaal should be able to get into top 4 comfortably.

You might be right, and hopefully we'll be back in the top 4 even without additions but I think it would be a stupid risk to take.

I think the best way to ensure we're closer to top clubs is to add some genuine quality to the mix of top level stars (RVP, Rooney, Mata, DDG) the potentially good (Jones, Smalling, Januzaj, Rafael, Kagawa) then the rest are pretty much squad players.

Its absolutely vital that we get off to a good start next season as nobody wants to see planes flying over OT come early 2015. Van Gaal has the small matter of the World Cup to disrupt his planning and preseason so lets back him by getting the players he wants and not expect the miracles Ferguson pulled off with this squad.

 

[pseudo_canadian]

You think LvG would watch a game like today to assess Nani to an extent?

I was thinking the same actually. You would imagine that he'll be wanting to catch some of our other players perform while he's there.

 

[Adebesi]

If Van Gaal is going to make root-and-branch changes to the way we play I dont think people should hold their breath for a really strong start. Hopefully the adjustment wont take too long and we will at least see signs of improvement in the way we are playing, even if there is a bit of a lag time between that and the results following suit.

Obviously it would be great if we hit the ground running next season but I dont think it is absolutely vital. I think we're going to have to be patient a bit longer to be honest but such is the case with most of the best things in life.

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

I think the best way to ensure we're closer to top clubs is to add some genuine quality to the mix of top level stars (RVP, Rooney, Mata, DDG) the potentially good (Jones, Smalling, Januzaj, Rafael, Kagawa) then the rest are pretty much squad players.

This is done a lot, I've always found it strange as a few games seem to greatly impact peoples opinions. What has Kagawa done to deserve to be potentially good where Hernandez is not? I think it's not that simple, it's more like

WC talent (One of the best in world for position) - RVP
Top talent (Mature player, top 10 bracket for position) - Rooney, DDG, Mata
Players with potential to be top talents/ WC - Januzaj, Welbeck, Rafael, Smalling & Jones
Very good players - Valencia, Hernandez, Evans
Squad players - Cleverley, Búttner,
Not good enough - Ashley Young
Unknown - Bébé

 

[Adebesi]

And Kagawa is in which category? "Very good players"?

 

[NK86]

This is done a lot, I've always found it strange as a few games seem to greatly impact peoples opinions. What has Kagawa done to deserve to be potentially good where Hernandez is not? I think it's not that simple, it's more like

WC talent (One of the best in world for position) - RVP
Top talent (Mature player, top 10 bracket for position) - Rooney, DDG, Mata
Players with potential to be top talents/ WC - Januzaj, Welbeck, Rafael, Smalling & Jones
Very good players - Valencia, Hernandez, Evans
Squad players - Cleverley, Búttner,
Not good enough - Ashley Young
Unknown - Bébé

Seriously? When was he good last, let alone very good.

 

[AngeloHenriquez]

Seriously? When was he good last, let alone very good.

He's won player of the year and he was very good, but yea I suppose he shouldn't be there, where would u have him?