Politics at Westminster | BREAKING: UKIP

alastair said:
I don't think there's any real ambition within the Conservatives to privatise the NHS. There's an ambition to trim it down and to make it sustainable though.

I don't see any reason why the policies to help the poor you have listen necessarily have to be unsustainable, but the way Labour run them, they are. The cost of the NHS balloons as the years go by, and the cost of welfare, you have to accept, had become uncontrollable.

The problem I have is that Labour very, very rarely come up with any policies that fit into the 'help the poor' agenda which don't involve creating huge, perpetual burdens on the state. All of the policies you have listed, with the possible exception of employment rights depending on how it's achieved, involve spending a massive amount of money.

This is justifiable money, of course, in the most part, but Labour never present anything that is self-sustainable. It's all based around taking as much as possible from the middle classes to fund it, and invariably, debts are run up.
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Trololol.
 
It's a nicely written article but makes absolutely no point about anything except some vague idea of 'cutting' which doesn't actually resemble reality.
 
50,000 people were marching in London yesterday(?) in protest against austerity. Not even the guardian covered it from what I can tell, I wouldn't even know about it if it weren't for fringe groups on Facebook. The BBC is spending all its time hyping a potential threat to the UK from ISIS which seems to have little basis in reality. It's just shoddy. It's no fun if there's no violence I guess.

edit; Managed to find one article http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/anti-austerity-protesters-gather-1.433804
 
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Silva said:
50,000 people were marching in London yesterday(?) in protest against austerity. Not even the guardian covered it from what I can tell, I wouldn't even know about it if it weren't for fringe groups on Facebook. The BBC is spending all its time hyping a potential threat to the UK from ISIS which seems to have little basis in reality. It's just shoddy. It's no fun if there's no violence I guess.

edit; Managed to find one article http://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/politics/anti-austerity-protesters-gather-1.433804
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The only reason it got any coverage at all is because Russell Brand turned up to spout his usual line of vacuous nonsense.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...fortless-joyful-revolution-again-9554651.html
http://news.sky.com/story/1287053/russell-brand-calls-for-joyful-revolution
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/48...revolution-as-protesters-march-in-Westminster
 
MikeUpNorth said:
The only reason it got any coverage at all is because Russell Brand turned up to spout his usual line of vacuous nonsense.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/p...fortless-joyful-revolution-again-9554651.html
http://news.sky.com/story/1287053/russell-brand-calls-for-joyful-revolution
http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/48...revolution-as-protesters-march-in-Westminster
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I wish he'd shut the feck up. Almost everything he says is designed to resonate with the sorts of people who want their celebs to tell them what to think politically. Most of it is thoughtless and based on, from what I can tell, an apathy towards politics, which is a pretty good indicator that he's not someone whose voice should be listened out for above the chatter.
 
Brophs said:
I wish he'd shut the feck up. Almost everything he says is designed to resonate with the sorts of people who want their celebs to tell them what to think politically. Most of it is thoughtless and based on, from what I can tell, an apathy towards politics, which is a pretty good indicator that he's not someone whose voice should be listened out for above the chatter.
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This. He's forging a career out of saying stupid things with a degree of eloquence that makes people who agree with his stupid things believe that he's saying intelligent things.
 
It's all very strange with Brand, on his old radio(worth listing to) he would talk about starting a revolution but it always came across as a bit of fun and Matt Morg(co presenter)would just laugh when ever Brand mentioned it. Bit scary that he was actually serious about it.
 
I don't mind Brand. I'd probably get annoyed if I came across people claiming him a visionary political genius but having been spared that, so far, I'm quite happy with some famous bloke talking about inequality.

Sweet Square said:
It's all very strange with Brand, on his old radio(worth listing to) he would talk about starting a revolution but it always came across as a bit of fun and Matt Morg(co presenter)would just laugh when ever Brand mentioned it. Bit scary that he was actually serious about it.
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The thought of someone wanting a revolution scares you?
 
DiseaseOfTheAge said:
I don't mind Brand. I'd probably get annoyed if I came across people claiming him a visionary political genius but having been spared that, so far, I'm quite happy with some famous bloke talking about inequality.

The thought of someone wanting a revolution scares you?
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No it's more of the idea that Brand was actually serious about him trying to start a whole revolution when he talked about it during the his radio shows. Maybe scary's not the right word but I just find strange listen back to the old radio shows and hearing Brand mentioning revolution (I always though came across light hearted and jokey on the shows)and then a few years years he's shouting down a microphone to a 50,000 people.
 
Sweet Square said:
No it's more of the idea that Brand was actually serious about him trying to start a whole revolution when he talked about it during the his radio shows. Maybe scary's not the right word but I just find strange listen back to the old radio shows and hearing Brand mentioning revolution (I always though came across light hearted and jokey on the shows)and then a few years years he's shouting down a microphone to a 50,000 people.
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Him genuinely wanting some ill advised, poorly thought out "revolution" isn't particularly worrying, but the fact he manages to convince others that he's got a plan and is worth listening to is pretty scary. Not his fault, I suppose. I'd question how much of what he spouts is genuine and how much is part of the act though, in all honesty.
 
Ryan's Beard said:
Him genuinely wanting some ill advised, poorly thought out "revolution" isn't particularly worrying, but the fact he manages to convince others that he's got a plan and is worth listening to is pretty scary. Not his fault, I suppose. I'd question how much of what he spouts is genuine and how much is part of the act though, in all honesty.
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In all honesty I don't know what Brand wants, he was at first saying the system as a whole doesn't work and then only recently he's doing work with the Green Party. In the talk he gave in London a few days ago (it's on youtube) he was talking about getting democracy for everyone and not the few at the top plus the general just be nice to everyone.

I guess with Brand his heart seems to be in the right place so I can't hate the guy. Also on the plus side anyone who go's around showing people what horrible bunch of cnuts the Tories are has to be doing some sort of good.
 
Ryan's Beard said:
Him genuinely wanting some ill advised, poorly thought out "revolution" isn't particularly worrying, but the fact he manages to convince others that he's got a plan and is worth listening to is pretty scary. Not his fault, I suppose. I'd question how much of what he spouts is genuine and how much is part of the act though, in all honesty.
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Does he? The only thing I ever hear about him is either criticism or vague praise for his eloquent anti-establishment rhetoric. I've never heard anyone suggest they thought he had a plan. I've never heard him suggest he had one either, to be honest. Most of the times I've seen him speak he's been quite open about the fact he doesn't have one.

My two word question at the start isn't rhetorical, by the way. I have no idea what he's said recently and the only reaction I've seen to it is in this thread, so I may well be considerably behind on all things Brand.

I blame Katy Perry, personally. Never trust a woman who can shoot sparks from her breasts.
 
Sweet Square said:
In all honesty I don't know what Brand wants, he was at first saying the system as a whole doesn't work and then only recently he's doing work with the Green Party. In the talk he gave in London a few days ago (it's on youtube) he was talking about getting democracy for everyone and not the few at the top plus the general just be nice to everyone.

I guess with Brand his heart seems to be in the right place so I can't hate the guy. Also on the plus side anyone who go's around showing people what horrible bunch of cnuts the Tories are has to be doing some sort of good.
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I think, by and large, he wants to stay in the public eye and be a controversial figure. The vague concepts he wants are sound, obviously we should all be nice to each other and the world should be a fairer place, but saying "feck it, don't vote kids!" isn't the best way to go about it.

DiseaseOfTheAge said:
Does he? The only thing I ever hear about him is either criticism or vague praise for his eloquent anti-establishment rhetoric. I've never heard anyone suggest they thought he had a plan. I've never heard him suggest he had one either, to be honest. Most of the times I've seen him speak he's been quite open about the fact he doesn't have one.

My two word question at the start isn't rhetorical, by the way. I have no idea what he's said recently and the only reaction I've seen to it is in this thread, so I may well be considerably behind on all things Brand.

I blame Katy Perry, personally. Never trust a woman who can shoot sparks from her breasts.
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He's spouted a fair amount of nonsense, it's built around a vaguely right set of ideals but it's still nonsense. By "plan", I meant more immediate plan of action, as in "don't vote" and "we need a revolution", not long term economic and social strategies.
 
hague is off to write a couple of books ,pick up a few more company directorships and generally earn a few quid and not have to bother to try to justify it to us plebs
 
Definitely weird. Spose he got in young though, another period of shadow cabinet politics probably doesn't appeal to him that much.
 
The Reshuffle: Live ~

"You people - you don't look very young, and we need to get the FaceTwit generation onside...so you're all fired."

"You there, you 'women' things - our focus groups tell me that we need more of you in the Cabinet...so help yourselves to a Ministry or two; only the young-looking ones amongst you, mind!"

That's about the size of it. What a bunch of incompetent twats.
 
Didn't see Hague's resignation coming. Sad about that, think he's been a very decent and moderate Foreign Secretary. Not too worried about Hammond taking over (though he is more hawkish) but slightly nervous about whoever the Defence replacement will be...
 
They coulda done worse than having Hague as leader, never mind 'resigning' him (IMO).
 
SteveJ said:
They coulda done worse than having Hague as leader, never mind 'resigning' him (IMO).
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I do think he will have gone of own volition rather than being 'resigned'. The fact he's standing down as an MP suggests he was ready for a wind down and more project focused (sexual violence in conflict)/election focused role (Leader of the House).

But yes I think as Conservative cabinet ministers go, he had a lot of cross-party appeal and respect
 
This is political suicide now. Gove has gone to Chief Whip.

Why are the Tories moving their best people away from their preferred roles? To lose Hague and Gove in one evening is just appalling carelessness.
 
Only the thick teachers will be rejoicing.

Gove's one of these politicians who history will judge very kindly indeed.

For anyone who agrees with parental choice, equality, high standards and academic rigour, this is a sad day.
 
Gove's position had become untenable. He'd lost all his support and looked weak in the extremist schools debacle.
 
Oh, today is a good day.

My Facebook newsfeed is full of very happy teachers, right now.
 
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Gove was responsible for getting the ball rolling on a project that will result in Britain having one of the most socially segregated education systems in the Western world. Good riddance.
 
rednev said:
Gove was responsible for getting the ball rolling on a project that will result in Britain having one of the most socially segregated education systems in the Western world. Good riddance.
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Aren't we already there?
 
Michael Gove was incredibly popular among Tory voters and I believe was first pick to lead the party among the public.

I wonder where this is going.
 
alastair said:
Michael Gove was incredibly popular among Tory voters and I believe was first pick to lead the party among the public.

I wonder where this is going.
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I'd love him to lead the party. You don't win votes with the mannerisms of a psychopath.
 
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