[Getsme]

As someone just reading through, you are arguing against valid points, and not convincingly.


in response to: You say Jonny's decision to pass the responsibility of marking Ulloa onto Rafael, in case he may be able to cut out a cross


Which is where he failed. Rojo and Blackett "covering the man with the ball, Jonny not recognising that he should be marking the centre forward (CB lesson 101)


Wrong


As I said, if Tyler has taken a look, he sees no immediate danger coming from midfield. His choice is to make up 3 men marking one in the box, or cover his fullback. He makes the right choice. Even then, by your standards for Jonny, he is in a position to cut out a cross, if he is fortunate enough for Vardy to hit it straight to him.


Rafael has the least blame in all of this, and this illustrates the first part of my post. You are willing to stretch opportioning the blame ridiculously, in an effort to exhonorate Evans.

You have an agenda, just as much as those who are slaughtering Evans, when it is a case of form being a good player's problem, and not "Evans is shit!"
You would be better arguing that, than trying to make excuses for an isolated incident, for which he is receiving warranted flack.

I’m giving my opinion, if you don’t agree with them then that’s fine. Yes he failed to read the game but that was mainly down to the quality of the cross, a cross that should never have been for more reasons than one.

You have yet to give me a valid reason as to why Evans was solely at fault for the goal, yet tell me I am wrong when I suggest that there are many reasons as to why Leicester scored that goal, yet I have an agenda?
You and others keep on going on that I’m trying to exonerate Evans from any blame, no idea why you’re saying that but I’m not surprised that you are.

For the last time, try reading this carefully. There are many errors that lead to that goal, one player wasn’t solely to blame, it was a fantastic cross and even better finish. IT’S THAT SIMPLE.

 

[Getsme]

That's why it gives me a headache. If we could field the same defence for more than a couple of games we would see improvements, then judge the players on their best standards and team effectiveness and cohesion.
Right now it is like a revolving door to a clinic's waiting room.

Yep, it’s more than frustrating, it’s hampered us for 3 seasons now. I’m hoping Rojo can become a constant alongside Shaw and not fall into the 'permanently injured' category. A solid back four would do wonders for us

 

[Getsme]

Evans was dodgy against Burnley. He even gave Burnley a 1on1 with his crap pass to de Gea. He has had a really bad start to the season, but I won't write him off after just 4 games. I always felt he couldn't be the #1 guy in defense though. He needs an imposing figure next to him.

I agree, he’s been far from his best. Injuries, new formation, added pressure have all added to that. I believe our defence don’t have belief in each other now Rio, Vidic and Evra have gone. That’s something for LVG to sort out, and I’m sure he will.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I agree, he’s been far from his best. Injuries, new formation, added pressure have all added to that. I believe our defence don’t have belief in each other now Rio, Vidic and Evra have gone. That’s something for LVG to sort out, and I’m sure he will.

Evans was one of the very few United players who looked good last season. In the early parts of it anyway. Then he got injured and never really found any form again. I've always thought he was at his best alongside Vidic. They work really well as a partnership. He's obviously not as adaptable as some CBs and can look really atrocious if he's not alongside the right player.

 

[REJE]

He looks genuinely terrified every time he's under the slightest bit of pressure, you can see it in his face.

 

[Getsme]

Evans was one of the very few United players who looked good last season. In the early parts of it anyway. Then he got injured and never really found any form again. I've always thought he was at his best alongside Vidic. They work really well as a partnership. He's obviously not as adaptable as some CBs and can look really atrocious if he's not alongside the right player.

Indeed, he started to form a good partnership with Jones last season if I remember correctly, before the inevitable happened and one of them got injured. I would like to see a CB pairing of Jones and Evans, unfortunately I’ve lost all hope of that happening.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Indeed, he started to form a good partnership with Jones last season if I remember correctly, before the inevitable happened and one of them got injured. I would like to see a CB pairing of Jones and Evans, unfortunately I’ve lost all hope of that happening.

Yeah, Jones is the only "alpha male" CB of the three of them. Hence, he could form a good partnership with either Evans or Smalling. Especially now he's going to get a run of games in his preferred position and started the season playing so well. He's been prone to brainfarts of his own but at his best he's a really dominant presence and is at an age where he might step up this year and become a really top CB.

The other two don't have the leadership skills to play alongside young, inexperienced players like Blacket and Keane (or each other) and we're invariably shite when that happens.

Unfortunately, we're at the mercy of Jones fragile body and reckless bravery if we want to build a defence around him. Which is not ideal. Unless Rojo is a like for like replacement?

 

[Getsme]

Yeah, Jones is the only "alpha male" CB of the three of them. Hence, he could form a good partnership with either Evans or Smalling. Especially now he's going to get a run of games in his preferred position and started the season playing so well. He's been prone to brainfarts of his own but at his best he's a really dominant presence and is at an age where he might step up this year and become a really top CB.

The other two don't have the leadership skills to play alongside young, inexperienced players like Blacket and Keane (or each other) and we're invariably shite when that happens.

Unfortunately, we're at the mercy of Jones fragile body and reckless bravery if we want to build a defence around him. Which is not ideal. Unless Rojo is a like for like replacement?

I’m going to reserve judgement on Rojo until he gets a good run of games in CB. He didn’t have a great game on Sunday and was easily bullied of the ball at times, but it’s not fair to judge when he hasn’t played a minute in his preferred position (in which I’ve never seen him play)

I said in a previous post that if he stays injury free and is half decent he will be first choice by default unless the other three can sort their injury issues out.

 

[Cutch]

That's why it gives me a headache. If we could field the same defence for more than a couple of games we would see improvements, then judge the players on their best standards and team effectiveness and cohesion.
Right now it is like a revolving door to a clinic's waiting room.

So frustrating when the likes of Chelsea seem to be able to play the same back 4 (Ivanovic-Cahill-Terry-Azpilicueta) almost every single league game. Everton also the last few years have always seemed to be able to field Coleman-Jagielka-Distin-Baines.

All the best defensive sides have the most settled personnel. Rafael, Smalling, Jones or Evans never seem to be able to play more than 4 in a row.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

So frustrating when the likes of Chelsea seem to be able to play the same back 4 (Ivanovic-Cahill-Terry-Azpilicueta) almost every single league game. Everton also the last few years have always seemed to be able to field Coleman-Jagielka-Distin-Baines.

All the best defensive sides have the most settled personnel. Rafael, Smalling, Jones or Evans never seem to be able to play more than 4 in a row.

At the very least, you'd expect 2 out of 4 to be more or less permanently available if you're going to have a crack at the title. City almost never play second choice fullbacks.

Evra's invulnerability to injury is a huge loss. We've fitness question marks over every single defender in our squad, bar Rojo and Blackett.

 

[Getsme]

At the very least, you'd expect 2 out of 4 to be more or less permanently available if you're going to have a crack at the title. City almost never play second choice fullbacks.

Evra's invulnerability to injury is a huge loss. We've fitness question marks over every single defender in our squad, bar Rojo and Blackett.

Shaw?
I know hes just come back from injury, but wasnt his record at Southampton quite good?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Shaw?
I know hes just come back from injury, but wasnt his record at Southampton quite good?

Yeah, I think so. Was going to leave him out but included him on the basis of "fitness" meaning stamina, after Van Gaal's comments.

 

[Getsme]

Yeah, I think so. Was going to leave him out but included him on the basis of "fitness" meaning stamina, after Van Gaal's comments.

True, but I suppose thats something that can be worked on. I've no idea how we can go about making the ususal 3 injury free. Saying that we managed to do it with RVP so you never know.

 

[Ramshock]

Evans can he a top defender but is prone to injury and glaring lapses in concentration. He needs to smarten up and toughen up or ship out IMO.

 

[KiD MoYeS]

He'll never be a top defender, but he is at the level below, he's just out of form.

 

[Bwuk]

Evans is never going to be the leader in the defence we need. I wouldn't mind him being sold in the summer. He's 26 now, and he looks out of sorts a lot. Compare him to a 26 y/o Ferdinand or Vidic, that is the standard of defender that should be starting for Manchester United.

 

[Getsme]

He'll never be a top defender, but he is at the level below, he's just out of form.

I'd go along with that.

 

[Kakeru]

Yeah, I think so. Was going to leave him out but included him on the basis of "fitness" meaning stamina, after Van Gaal's comments.

What the hell has Shaw done between the World Cup and his first inclusion into training camp to be such in bad shape? Unless you stuff yourself with burgers and beer, I don't see how a player can be deemed that much out of shape between a World Cup and the next club season.

End off-topic.

Evans will be nothing more than a Wes Brown at the most, and even then Wes knew how to make himself useful at some point.

 

[Loublaze]

MK Dons agreed. That was his worst performance since that 4-0 loss at West Ham a few years back.

Apart from his distribution not being up to his usual (high) standard I think he has been okay. It hasn't been his defending that has been much of an issue more lack of concentration in possession.

Most frustrating thing is these injuries. Would like to see him partnered with Rojo/Smalling/Jones for a few games when fit.

Personally I think we should sell while he's still young. We can squeeze about 8M for him

 

[ZDwyr]

He'll never be a top defender, but he is at the level below, he's just out of form.

I'd accept that. He's not as bad as he has been showing.

 

[kundalini]

Out for 4 weeks according to the Mail.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...Gaal-blow-defensive-injury-woes-mount-up.html

 

[Loublaze]

Mr Glass

 

[bugmat]

He's stagnated imo - still looks good as the junior in a pairing with a more senior CB eg Vidic, Rio - hasn't shown enough to prove he can be that senior CB to lead younger lads... the rooney of the CBs!

 

[ZDwyr]

If Smalling and Jones can stay fit, and Rojo plays well as a CB then I see Evans struggling to get back into the side to be honest.

 

[Ducklegs]

Which part of the Evans "Out of form, actually just a bit shit, catastrophic performance, Injured, we Evans to come back, he is our best defender, potentially worlds class, still young (26 going on 27) and can be potentially world class if given a run of games" cycle are we at now?

 

[Bwuk]

He isn't and won't ever be good enough to be the main man in our defence.

We wouldn't be having this argument if he'd been bought. But since he came through our academy people like to give him leeway. Fed up of him not showing any authority.

 

[Nighteyes]

I'd be quite happy if he performed to the levels he's shown before but he hasn't even come close to that level.

 

[Loon]

If Smalling and Jones can stay fit, and Rojo plays well as a CB then I see Evans struggling to get back into the side to be honest.

Not so sure. I don't think Jones or Smalling have a thought in their head between them. Yet to be seen if Rojo has a brain. Not one of them is world class, but what I wouldn't give to see any one of them become at least a reliable Steady Eddie.

 

[Loon]

Yep, it’s more than frustrating, it’s hampered us for 3 seasons now. I’m hoping Rojo can become a constant alongside Shaw and not fall into the 'permanently injured' category. A solid back four would do wonders for us

Agreed. Funny how we all laughed when 'mediocre' Cahill signed for Chelsea.

 

[Getsme]

Agreed. Funny how we all laughed when 'mediocre' Cahill signed for Chelsea.

Indeed, how we could do with him now

 

[Getsme]

I'd be quite happy if he performed to the levels he's shown before but he hasn't even come close to that level.

He hasn't had a chance to, none of our current CBs have.

 

[Ananke]

He isn't and won't ever be good enough to be the main man in our defence.

We wouldn't be having this argument if he'd been bought. But since he came through our academy people like to give him leeway. Fed up of him not showing any authority.

Bang on.

It's time for us to acknowledge that a lot of the academy players we have/had aren't/weren't good enough or simply weren't performing.

 

[Loublaze]

He hasn't had a chance to, none of our current CBs have.

Evans has had way more of a chance than the other two. We just need to sell this guy and accept that he's not good enough for United. We let Welbeck, O'Shea and Brown go, Evans wouldn't be a loss at all.

 

[Getsme]

Evans has had way more of a chance than the other two. We just need to sell this guy and accept that he's not good enough for United. We let Welbeck, O'Shea and Brown go, Evans wouldn't be a loss at all.

Ok, when has he had his chance to get back to his best?

 

[Loublaze]

Ok, when has he had his chance to get back to his best?

Come on he's had his chances to cement his place with both Ferdinand's and Vidic's poor fitness in their last seasons at United. He's not even at the level both of those players were and he'll never be, isn't that the United standard? Thats why Welbeck was let go. Evans will not be missed. Only United fans rate him very highly anyway, a team like Everton at best is probably his level and thats not an insult. He's been playing in the first team since his teens FFS

 

[DWelbz19]

I have always been a big fan of Evans' style in the past; an assured, classy-almost luxurious way of football. But recently he looks a complete shadow of his former self. He's too nervous, too weak, too easy to beat. He's always lacked physicality at the best of his game, but now it shows even more. I do agree with the sentiments that - at his best - he is a 'tier below' top, which is enough for a side aiming for top four or even a title challenge if the rest of the team is on song. But, with that said, he hasn't shown that side anywhere near enough recently, and I do feel he's too prone to injury to truly manage it. And it is for these reasons I think we may have to consider his depature - we cannot afford to have three injury prone CB's of whom we are sat twiddling our thumbs waiting to tap their potential. He is the oldest, and whilst most experienced, I feel weakest, and should be aptly replaced for this reason.

 

[Ananke]

Come on he's had his chances to cement his place with both Ferdinand's and Vidic's poor fitness in their last seasons at United. He's not even at the level both of those players were and he'll never be, isn't that the United standard? Thats why Welbeck was let go. Evans will not be missed. Only United fans rate him very highly anyway, a team like Everton at best is probably his level and thats not an insult. He's been playing in the first team since his teens FFS

This.

He's 26. He'll be 27 come January. Rio joined us at 23? Vidic joined us at 24? They probably started getting the best years out of themselves around the age he is now. If he doesn't pull his finger out his ass soon, he's not going to have many 'good' years left.

 

[Loublaze]

This.

He's 26. He'll be 27 come January. Rio joined us at 23? Vidic joined us at 24? They probably started getting the best years out of themselves around the age he is now. If he doesn't pull his finger out his ass soon, he's not going to have many 'good' years left.

I personally think he's done. If he wasn't a home grown player he'd be out the door by now in all honesty. Eyebrows were raised when we sold O'shea but in reality he was past his best. I don't see Evans having a miraculous turnaround, we're just delaying the obvious.

 

[Getsme]

I’m not being funny here but like many others, your mind is playing tricks on you. He has cemented his place over the last two seasons, I think Fergie even said that Vidic and Rio could no longer be considered first choice due to Evans. He was a regular last season ahead of players like Rio and Vidic and he has arguably been our best defender for the last two years.

On form, Evans is a great defender, yes he plays better beside Vidic or Rio but who wouldn’t, and it’s not talent that’s hindering Evans its injuries. He hasn’t had a good run of games this season thanks to injuries, so how on Earth is he going to rediscover his form?

Another thing that annoys me is people are saying he’s not Rio or Vidic, not many players are.

 

[Loublaze]

I’m not being funny here but like many others, your mind is playing tricks on you. He has cemented his place over the last two seasons, I think Fergie even said that Vidic and Rio could no longer be considered first choice due to Evans. He was a regular last season ahead of players like Rio and Vidic and he has arguably been our best defender for the last two years.

On form, Evans is a great defender, yes he plays better beside Vidic or Rio but who wouldn’t, and it’s not talent that’s hindering Evans its injuries. He hasn’t had a good run of games this season thanks to injuries, so how on Earth is he going to rediscover his form?

Another thing that annoys me is people are saying he’s not Rio or Vidic, not many players are.

Van Gaal basically said Welbeck is not Rooney or RVP and thats the United standard. Whats the difference in saying Evans is not Rio and Vidic? The United standard? The man only played in two games out of 8 against the top four contenders last season. He played Arsenal once and Chelsea once...Ferdinand/Jones/Vidic played all the other big games. Hope we sell him next season.