I agree with the rest of what you say, but this isn't right. Goetze is easily on Neymar's level in terms of hype, Neuer was the star German keeper and clearly going to be at least one of the best in the world, if not the greatest. Lewandowski was arguably the most complete striker in the world at Dortmund. Ribery was an extremely good, many-capped French international wanted by all the top clubs. And regarding Robben, Madrid do some very strange things in their fire sales.
Pep Guardiola's Bayern
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As a Bayern-Supporter, i disagree. Neymar was a worldwide attraction, Götze is at least one step below him on terms of star quality. Lewa may be as much of a player, but not as much as a star as for example Zlatan. Ribery was one among many promising players when Bayern hired him, and one with a shaky reputation after his Galatasaray adventure.
On the other hand, i think it was quite close Bayern didn't approach Neymar when Pep arrived.
The whole discussion about Peps standing is a bit irrelevant. Most top coaches move between top clubs (duh!), or what did Mou do the last couple of years?!. The trick is to aquire the status of a "top coach" in the first place, and that can't be all that easy, or more folks would do it.
So far, Pep invented Messi as a "false 9" which should earn him a spot in the sports history books alone. He also took over a team at the height of its success and managed to do so not only almost without bumps, but also by evolving that team even more. Ask Mr. Moyes how easy that is.
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Maybe we shouldn't forget that Pep is only 43 years old, he's still incredibly young and learning. He also has one thing going for him that managers like Ferguson or Mourinho don't have, an influence on the tactics in the game in general in a way we haven't seen since Sacchi. There will be a lot more to his legacy than just the trophies at the clubs he managed once he retires. That doesn't necessarily make him a better or greater manager, but he most certainly is a different one.
Carlo Ancelotti has won I think it's four domestic titles in 20 years as a manager which I'm sure he'd admit is too low, although three European Cups to his name is great. As for Pep and his impact at Bayern, I'll judge him at the end of the season. The Champions League is very difficult to win, so I won't label him a failure if he doesn't win it this season. If Bayern feck up massively again, then questions can be asked.
As i said even going to one of the Italian giants would've sufficed. These struggling clubs have the same ambitions as Bayern they just seem incapable of doing it atm. That's why it would be such a great challenge for him. The reason why Bayern isn't the environment is because of when he took over. The team was already the best club in the world, so wheres the challenge in that? The challenges you mention in your post about players are those that Jupp and Van Gaal already sorted out. Mate gotze, lewa, and martinez are some pretty massive signings(bigger than the recent alonso signing) so lets not act like this is a club relying on second rate players. Only 2 clubs have Messi and Ronaldo and well all know that football is a team sport. surely you can see the diference in the conditions between when he took over at Barca to when he's taken over at Bayern, the level of the challenge is worlds apart.
The notion that keeping a top club at the highest possible level for 3-4 years isn't a huge challenge is absurd.
Another 26 yrs Fergie style tenure won't happen, there are many variables that made it possible, Pep didn't have that at Barca [where there's a high level of politics, so he didn't "bolt"]. Aside from that, If he or any managers wins a lot of stuff and does it consistently, they'll go down as one of the greats.
He tore up Rijkaard's team [taking out top players like Eto, Dinho etc] and built his team at Barca, with his own players, most of whom were lads he coached during his stint as B coach. And another point to note is this, the very best managers usually go to the top teams, and the top teams usually have money, meaning that they can sign top players - so, if Pep goes to United, City, Chelsea or any big team, he'll be given money to spend and rightly so, and with that money he can identify players that can do what he wants. So, he's never really going to be in a position where he won't have top players to work with. Ferguson winning only 2 UCL titles isn't anything special. I'll back Guardiola to win double of that.
It's not even worth discussing why Fergie is a better manger than Pep.And if we are going to talk about European success look at what Fergie with Aberdeen.
That alone out weights anything Pep has done SO FAR.
Again I think Pep is a great manger but he's still got a long way to go.
Your basically a giant "mou" fan aren't you? His jobs have included endless riches at Chelsea, an aLready serie a dominant inter, and Real Madrid. So much for taking difficult jobs.
No I'm not but surely his resume is without doubt atm. That Inter side wasn't getting close to winning the CL before he got there(hence mancini got fired) and he lost the most influential inter player through that era and still managed to win everything.
The Chelsea job was a bit easier considering the funds but they were also far from being a supreme team at the time and he turned them into one of the best prem teams ever.
At Porto he managed to win the CL with a bunch of no names and a team that had no right reaching so far in such a competition. When people speak about him always having big funds they conveniently forget about what will always probably be his biggest achievement.
Madrid will always be an asterisk on his CV but even then he managed to win a title wrestling it from what many view as the greatest club side of the past 2 decades.
Now look what he's already done at chelsea this time around, they look a dead cert for the title and already look any elite team.
The degree of difficulty for the jobs these elite managers get is obviously not going to be on the too heavy side as they are very much in demand but the Bayern job that pep took was the easiest possible one going.
Surely getting them there is a much bigger challenge, surely?
Keeping a team hungry that has won all... Getting them to run 115 km and more each match twice a week and not to relax?
The Bundesliga is a pressing and counter attacking league - maybe a lot teams do not do it to the level of Dortmund but it is not that mistakes etc. will not be punished. Look at the other big teams who lost points against minors...
I know that the Bundesliga is so easy... - for this being easy Bayern in the last season has put a lot of effort in every win...
Let's not ignore the most important factor, the brand of football Barcelona played under Pep, it was not only the success but the fact that he achieved probably the most impressive football performances in the history of sport during 4 years non-stop. To think that's an easy task is ridiculous.
Mate, winning a league with a club that broke all possible records the season before isn't the toughest thing to do especially when the said clubs squad is streets ahead of anyone in the league.
Come on mate, let's be honest with ourselves here. The bayern job was about as easy as it comes in terms of job opportunities at the time. Pep couldn't have picked an easier job if he tried.
As I said, surely its more difficult building this juggernaut than it is maintaining it, surely? If you disagree with that then I really won't know what to tell you.
He is somebody driven. That is what everybody always tells. Robben told in an interview that he even might phone in the night at 3am when he has an idea... He plans every match very intensive - has a plan A, B, C and D available - shifts them around after minutes. He has very smart and versatile players - but he needs them, too, to follow his ideas.
How often do you watch the Bundesliga or especially Bayern matches?
But we can say the same about Mourinho. Excluding the Porto job where he was quite lucky in the Cl and couple of referee decisions helped him win, he has gone to clubs that have way more financial resources than anyone else in the league - Chelsea, Inter, Real. I can also say it's not very impressive to take over teams that can buy anyone he wants. It's not easy to motivate players who have won it all and Moyes proved it. We were by far the best team in the league when we won the title by 11 points and got kicked from the CL because of a ridiculous referee decision, yet next season we found ourselves in 7th place. I'm not trying to compare Moyes to Guardiola, but you should take that into account. The pressure is immense when you take over that kind of job, especially when the club just won all the possible titles and the expectations from the manager are unreal.
SAF is in a league of his own - he won it all which various clubs and made them dominant - Aberdeen, St. Mirren, Utd, but you could also argue that back then there wasn't such a big gap between the teams as it is now.
Look, Guardiola doesn't have anything to prove, he can take any job he wants to because he already proved himself. And the notion that his Barcelona job was easy is ridiculous - he removed Deco, Ronaldinho (a guy most thought was untouchable, to remove him from the team was mind-blowing) and couple of other players and nobody considered him a top manager back then. To do something like that requires serious confidence. He replaced them perfectly and the team when on to win the treble in his first season. They had finished 4th, I think, in the season before he took over.
Now, you'll say he had an amazing squad, and while that's true, Xavi and Iniesta were good players, but nothing comparable to what they were under Guardiola. He elevated them massively. Then you have Busquets who he introduced in the first team, he brought Pique and Henry (I think), moved Messi to the center and they all had an amazing season. If you think that's only down to his amazing squad, then you're sorely mistaken.
Bayern is the same - he is replacing their aging players which absolute quality and he can continue to do so until he tires of the job.
Keeping a team at the top for a prolonged time is what separates the truely great managers from the good ones. Many managers had short term success, but few kept teams performng at the highest level. How many teams actually kept challenging for the CL title after 3 CL finals in 4 years or something comparable to that? That's already a highly successful cycle for a team. Getting the same team to a 4th CL final without a rebuild surely would be something very special? Your whole argument is built on the idea that this kind of success is normal, when it's obviously not.
At Bayern I think he's improved a lot as a coach, this was one of his "weakness" at Barca, he relied too much on one (fantastic) way of playing football. He tried to bring variety with Zlatan but it didn't work in the end because their personalities weren't compatible. Now with the players he has and he's gotten, he can play many different systems.
How else would he have won the CL with Porto? Of course he was going to have to be lucky to have won it with them. He was hardly going to be outplaying the big teams with them. Him winning the CL with Porto is a bigger achievement than anything that Guardiola or Ancelotti and a lot of other coaches have done. And you saying that Madrid have way more resources than anyone in the league is a weird argument against Mourinho when Barcelona are amongst the biggest spenders in the world along with Madrid, Chelsea and City in addition to them having Messi, Xavi and Iniesta who came through their youth system (these great youth systems that clubs have cost a lot of money to run too and involves the poaching of a lot of players at a very young age from other teams so youth systems are not such a noble way of providing players for your first team either). Barcelona were basically the Spanish national side (the best national team in the world at the time and one of the best ever) with Messi, Alves, Alexis Sanchez etc. Who could Mourinho have bought who was better than Messi, Xavi, Iniesta and some of the other players that they had? The Madrid job was not an easy one at all as he was up against the best team in the world and one of the best ever and if you could name me a coach who could have done a better job than what Mourinho did then I would love to hear who it is.
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While he did undoubtedly improve all those barca players they were already there. During his stint at barca it was obvious that they had the best individuals in the world. Xavi and iniesta had just won the euro 08 and were both in the team of the tournament with xavi winning the player of the tournament. Messi was already a ballon d'or runner up at the time, henry was there before him and eto'o was a legend of not. The job he did though was amazing but no club boasted those sort of resources. He put it together wonderfully well and managed to take them to amazing heights.
As I said this is a matter of legacy not him proving he's a great coach. We all know he's exactly that. He's one of the few individual coaches that have it in their reach to go down as the greatest ever. However that is not gonna be achieved by coaching a well oiled machine and achieving less than what they had done before him.
The CL title porto won will always be one of the greatest managerial club achievements of all time regardless of those referee decisions. Fact is even in Peps CL wins he got a fair few lucky calls from the ref.
How was the inter job easy? Inter didn't have the best of squads and were incompetent in the CL. They also managed to lose their most influential player after his first season. They were an ageing squad and he managed those lads to the treble at a time when no one thought possible considering the esteem that the pep barca side was being held at. How many of the players in that team are going to go down as legends? They weren't even spending ridiculous amounts of money and he still took them to the promise land. If he had just won the Serie A then your point would stand but instead he took them to the peak of club football.
Please don't mention moyes ever again when we're discussing elite coaches. It does nothing for your argument. Many coaches have taken over from ones that have been successful and did extremely well.
How's he rebuilding the side? Those players that accomplished so much at bayern under jupp are still key players there and pretty much all of them played in the important games last season. They'll probably do the same thing this season too unless they remain injured. Plus we all know that the transfer dealings at bayern aren't all the coaches work.
Anyways this argument is becoming a bit tedious as you people don't wanna concede simple points. Pep has achieved nothing special at bayern so far. He led a team that was obviously going to win the league title, to a league title and led them to a disastrous end in the CL at the hands of madrid. Would you say he's added anything to his CV worth mentioning when the time to analyse his legacy comes by?
That Barca side pep took over wasn't looking like becoming possibly the greatest ever club team before he joined.
You're basically viewing everything mourinho has done in the best light possible and pep in the worst. Your spin on the job at Chelsea is odd. With united in a lull he was given a blank cheque to spend whatever he wants to spend. That's why I say you sound like a fan.
At the end of the day Mourinho consistently wins with grit whereas guardiola consistently wins with style. I too felt that he should have takena tougher assignment when he chose bayern, but germany is a great footballing country with an improving league, and I think pep is a very diffiferent coach in that he looks for more than results which is what moueinho is all about. I think there will be more considerations for pep to feel he's been successful at Bayern than winning the bundesliga. And that's I think where he's quite different from the results only approach we usually see. Whether that's your cup of tea is a different matter. I think it's refreshing to see this managers who are really quite visionary in their tactics, try new and interesting things.
come on. It was an open cl that year with a fluke win against United helping them along the way. Didn't they beat Monaco or someone like that in the e final? Would it have been "one of the greatest club achievements EVER" had they won it? They also weren't exactly Greece. They had the likes of deco in their team.Compared to atletico winning la liga, it's not even near. Heck, I'd say getting a team to reach the levels pep got barca to is a much bigger achievement, and I bet it's a more rare occuranxe.
Nope, my argument is built on the FACT that this is not a team that Pep built. Building and maintaining success for a substantial cycle is what separates the good from the great, not just maintaining. He did both at barca but its impossible for him to do the same at Bayern considering the team he took over. Unless of course he hangs around long enough for this current teams level drops and he makes his own bayern side.
Nobody, who watches Bayern frequently, would diminish what Guardiola is doing. He took over a fantastic team, but wasnt willing to just administer it, but is ambitious enough to make drastic change. Pep is building his own team, even so he uses the same players. I cant think of any other (active) manager who would have tried that. It surely not the easy way to manage a club and to some extend he paid the price for that (loss vs madrid). Still Bayern is becoming an even better team in the process; at least he is heading in this direction.
The rest of this discussion is just tedious, because everybody has different criterias. trophies; revolutionising tactics; longevity; having success with different teams/in different countries. All these things matter, but it comes down to personal preference how to offset them against each other.
The rest of this discussion is just tedious, because everybody has different criterias. trophies; revolutionising tactics; longevity; having success with different teams/in different countries. All these things matter, but it comes down to personal preference how to offset them against each other.
I've told you before, you need to start watching games instead of just reading up on them. Guardiola didn't take over and just kept ticking what he inherited, he clearly changed a lot and is building his own team. Surprise, surprise, it isn't finished yet after only 16 months at a new club. Maintaining such a high level during a period of transition is pretty sensational work though.
Each year the odds have been roughly 50% for Bayern to win the league. This rule applies for the last 40(!) years. So, the only thing that counts if you are a Bayern manager it's the CL. Everything else is not much more than a formality.
And what has that to do with what I wrote?
No, it was far from obvious. Barca didn't win anything the season before he took over and they finished fourth in the La Liga... Fourth. If Barca had such amazing players before Guardiola took over, then why did theyfinish fourth? There was no Atletico back then, only Real.
Well, you can't expect him to go and take some hard, but small jobs just because he needs to prove himself. Obviously, he is going to take the best jobs possible, any manager would. That's like saying Mourinho should take Everton to prove he can win the PL with them. Bayern offered him a job, he took it because it's the best one available and the job that paid most. Wouldn't you?
Bullshit. The CL win with Porto was a total fluke, as amolbhatia100 said. Monaco was in the final so that should give you a clear indication of the CL that year. Not to mention Porto didn't face any tough opposition until United when they won because the referee was a clown and basically gifted them the victory. Also, the Porto team was by no means weak.
The Inter job was quite easy, actually. They had amazing players back then and Mancini won three consecutive titles before Mourinho came and replaced him. After that, they continued their dominance. They were full with money and Zlatan Ibrahimovic was playing for them also. His CL win was impressive, but also quite lucky and with disgusting football. It's definetly nothing impressive, although a CL win in itself is impressive, I would give him that.
I think I told you I wasn't comparing Moyes to Guardiola in any way, I'm just saying it isn't always so easy to take a dominating team and keep them at the top.
I'm willing to agree on this.
And yes, I would say his time at Bayern has added to his CV. He has won four trophies already and broke some records at Bayern which is impressive. The whole argument is about Pep proving himself, so count not only his Bayern job, but his Barca B and Barca job also. If you read about his Barca B job, you would see what he had to deal with.
Since 92/93 the Bundesliga has had 6 different winners to 5 from the Premier League. United have won 13 league titles and Bayern have won 12. As an aside, Bayern have made 5 CL finals in this period compared to Uniteds 4. The Bundesliga is not as bad as certain media outlets make out and Bayern have not being the only strong team in the competition over the years. They are similar to United in the sense that they are always competing and there is always another challenger but in the end Bayern (like United) keep competing and the challenger changes. Right now they are in a very dominant period and would win probably every league in the world. The only one I would not be 100% sure about them winning this season is La Liga as Madrid look to be quite strong atm (and hopefully that continues) and Barcelona are not as bad as people are making out. I would be extremely confident of them winning the Premiership though.
A bit of an exaggeration. Any Bayern manager is generally going to have a side that's favourites for the title, however it's not like this is what it was with Celtic/Rangers in the SPL where one of them was guaranteed to win it. Yes, Bayern are the biggest team and favourites, but a shite manager would probably still struggle to win it considering there's some decent competition in the Bundesliga.
These changes he's making aren't necessarily making them better. Plus this bayern team still has the soul of the old one, it isn't a totally different proposition. They were already a possession based team under Jupp and clearly have become more so under pep. Since when do we give managers props for drastically changing winning formula's? If it makes them better then fair enough, I've seen nothing of the sort though.
Didn't claim it was looking like becoming one of the greatest sides ever just said the material was there. Eto'o and henry were already both legendary forwards, xavi and iniesta were immense in the euro 08 and they had puyol at the back. He then sorted them out and created the monster it became. But the material was there. Remember that the same disjointed barca the season before was the same team we basically parked a bus against and they only came 3rd in their league! Look it was a great effort and that was solidly his team.
The first chelsea job is probably the least impressive on the mou CV due to money but it was still a great effort. City have had more money and with 3 coaches and the whole league in a lull and still haven't had a team that good. Probably with better individuals as well.
Then why bother arguing with me if you agree with me? Don't think he looks for anything more than results to be honest, he just thinks his way is the best way to go about it and why wouldn't he. He's already been amazing successful doing what he has been doing. Similar to how Mou doesn't change his approach. This trying of new and interesting things is to win, nothing more nothing less.
You must be really young cause you don't seem to remember those days too well. They finished 3rd not fourth. They reached the semi finals of the CL where they lost to us(the eventual winners) in a scrap two legs separated only by a paul scholes screamer. Why did they finish 3rd? Rijkaard is the answer. That squad was great, the coaching was terrible. Eto'o spent a lot of the season injured and he along with messi were basically the attack as dinho and deco were on the wane. Henry, messi, xavi, iniesta, yaya, eto'o, puyol and you don't think that squad had amazing players? Deary me.
Did I say he should take a small job? why are you making arguments for me that I haven't made? Do you think coaching an english giant or an italian giant is a small job? What does everton have to do with anything?
Nope, inter was dire in the CL, nothing close to a great side. The italian league was dead(still hasn't fully recovered) and they had some of those titles because of the italian scandal. The money you talk about wasn't really spent too much on the team. Ibra wasn't there in the CL run because Pep took him. In fact we beat them in mou's first season. Mou's first season at inter wasn't much of an accomplishment as inter were basically in their own world in serie cause of the crisis the other teams had, but the second one is the one that really hits the point home of how good he is. Pray tell what was so lucky about that CL win as I'm really intrigued...they played something like 60 mins iirc with 10 men at the camp nou and still managed a victory. Disgusting football doesn't change scoreline at the end of matches. This is sport and ultimately the aim is to win, and they did that.
For someone as incompetent as Moyes? Of course its rocket science. For managers worth their salt it isn't all that difficult really(look at how easy tito won the title at barca after pep left). All united fans knew our team despite having won the title had issue and all he did was bring in fellaini and implement some stone age tactics. That united team walked the title but to suggest it was some type of all time great side like the bayern side pep inherited would be close to blasphemy. We played with 1 midfielder the whole season ffs.
We're talking top level sports here so barca B stuff gets discounted. What he did at barca was very impressive, could he do it again is the question. He's won 2 major trophies and took the defending CL finalists to an embarrassing 5-1 agg defeat to madrid in the semis. Last season really wasn't much of an accomplishment considering what he inherited.
Did you know that at the his old job he basically didn't have a period of transition? As in he came in and after a few matchdays things started to get ugly for opposition teams. Koeman isn't having a transition period either. That transition stuff makes sense mostly when the quality of players is there to be questioned.
I watch bayern games and see the difference and it isn't as much as some make it out to be. As I've said before its barcaball with less technically gifted players and more wingplay. Bayern has been a possession based team for a while so it wasn't going to be all that different. The major difference though is the high line(something aguero exposed and earned his team a pen and the opposition a red card a few days ago) the pressing is more intense and the team keeps the ball more. Alonso though this season has added more long passes from the back to the wingers and the team passes the ball out of defence in almost every situation. Don't see what you think I don't see.
He's making changes alright but are they the right changes? That remains to be seen. 16 months is a long time and I suppose his final product is somewhat held back by the constant midfield injuries but you can already see what he's doing. Regardless the base of this team is the Jupp team.
Of course there was a period of transition at Barca, the treble winning team was just a first step and only in 2011 the transition came to an end, not that he stopped changing things after that. He was always developing the team further.
The base of the team at the moment are much more van Gaal's ideas than Jupp's. Not sure what that has to do with the challenge of the job or the work he does at the moment though. No one is saying that Guardiola built this team from scratch.
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it's also pretty absurd that you use the second game against City to criticise Guardiola's tactics. It was a dead rubber game for us after already securing the top spot with flawless performances so far, in which one player made a stupid mistake that lead to a red card. Blaming Guardiola for Benatia's red card makes as much sense as blaming Jupp for Boateng's red card against Bate in the treble winning season. Like someone else mentioned, you're seeing only the worst in Guardiola and come to some ridiculous conclusions based on a very selective choice of examples.
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You are heavily downplaying Guardiola's role in the way he has reshaped the Bayern team. You make it sound like as though he picks the best 11 from LVG/Heynckes batch of players and just passively sits on the sideline waiting for the team to win.
You can't deny that Guardiola has made a huge impact on the way Bayern are playing right now and his unique input into the team is there for all to see. IMO the team has progressed from Heynckes era and is arguably playing better football.
It would be simplistic to measure a team's progress from trophy count alone. After all how many teams manage to defend a CL win, let alone a treble? Even then, Guardiola did the double and went to the semifinals of the CL. The Real defeat was a disastrous one no doubt but you have to acknowledge certain factors which ultimately culminated into the defeat.
First, they won the Bundesliga in an unprecedented record setting pace which probably left a few players complacent and made them lose their drive and focus temporarily. Their form in the league dipped soon after, losing 3-0 to Dortmund, a 2-1 defeat to minnows to end their unbeaten run albeit fielding a weakened side and other average results.
They were rather unlucky in the first leg but Real deserved their one goal win in the end. The build up to the second leg was the worst Guardiola could have possibly imagined. The death of Vilanova did make an understandably negative impact on him. There is a good excerpt from Pep's biography on the net, chronicling the build up to the match.
Edit: Here you go
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1717/ed...of-my-life-how-guardiola-got-it-all-wrong-in-
That freak result wasn't a fair reflection of the Bayern team or Guardiola's coaching credentials. Make no mistake about it, Real were the superior team and deserved the 4-0 victory on that day. There just couldn't have been a worse time for Bayern and Guardiola to play that second leg though. It must have been a good learning experience for those players and Guardiola himself.
Guardiola has done a great job at Bayern so far and I can hardly think of anyone who could have done a better job thus far. He has managed to win a double and mould the team to his philosophy, thereby ensuring that the team is progressing and not stagnating or depreciating, which most outrageouly successful teams tend to do after a certain period. No easy task if you ask me. Let's also not forget that he has managed to do a brilliant job despite persistent injury troubles suffered by integral players such as Schweinsteiger-Martinez(Jupp's first choice midfield pairing), Ribery(arguably their best player in 12/13) and Thiago to a lesser extent.
You don't have to give Guardiola credit for that but the least you could do is not to blatantly downplay his tenure so far.
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Nope. The focus at Bayern is/was always to win the league as first and most important goal. Success in the other competitions is/was seen as a bonus. There are multiple quotes from Hoeneß and many players that proof that.
Robben gave an interview for Bundesliga.de, which was quite interesting in that regard and is a good way to describe what Guardiola brings to the team and the players more than any other coach I've seen at Bayern (and that includes greats like Lattek, Heynckes, Trappatoni, Hitzfeld, Van Gaal).
I'll try to translate, because there isn't an official translation on the English version of the bundesliga.de website:
Under van Gaal Robben reached his individual peak, but he really was just that, an individual player with barely any connection to his teammates. Lahm overlapping or Müller making off the ball runs were just dummy runs for him to do what he wanted. Under Heynckes he learned workrate, was forced to contribute in defense. But he's a different beast at the moment in my opinion, he's really a part of the team for the first time, respects all his teammates as equals and shares the ball like never before. His individual stats went down a lot, but he still has the same impact in the team as before, probably an even bigger one.
I think it's a bit similar with most of our players. The way the 'in game intelligence' of players like Boateng, Alaba, Götze and even squad players like Rafinha developed in the last year is pretty exceptional.
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