Sergio Ramos | Signs new 5 year contract

[Alock1]

Wait, what?

I came here for Ramos talk not Pogba.

I can't see it happening. But would be great if it did. £28m + De Gea is crazy though but I don't really care how much we spend if we can get someone out of the deal.

 

[Dans]

He's not coming. Stop thinking he might.

 

[kafta]

I love the revisionism about pogba. He wasn't playing great for the reserves but Ferguson should have chucked him into a must win match. Right

Everyone is a scouting genius with hindsight

Worst part of the post. And if he did, same people would say we were playing reserves instead of going out and buying world class players.

 

[Mister Ed]

Honestly he's one of the worst posters on here. Always crying about something. Damn Fergie for giving us 3 title in those horrid last 5 years. Damn Fergie for spending more than £200m since he left, oh wait. We overpaid and spent badly since Fergie left. We haven't identified the right players at times too for us and that's our problem.

You call me a bad poster but your own post makes no sense at all...

 

[Mali_Zeus]

Same guy wrote we should have offered Cech 200k and he would probably then decide he doesnt want to stay in London after all.

Also all those exclamation marks. I hate them.

 

[Keeps It tidy]

I love the revisionism about pogba. He wasn't playing great for the reserves but Ferguson should have chucked him into a must win match. Right

Everyone is a scouting genius with hindsight

Yeah he should have obviously completely caved to the demands of a teenager who was under performing for the reserves.

 

[friendlytramp]

This is Ramos stitching us up. Barca bollocks blatant nonsense.

 

[Mali_Zeus]

Yeah he should have obviously completely caved to the demands of a teenager who was under performing for the reserves.

yeah but

Its Fergie's fault and Fergie's fault ALONE!

 

[Catt]

Saf last purchases for us have been horrible, almost every transfer decision he made has left us a step behind on everyone else atm.

Pogba not being here is his fault alone ! Nobody on here can understand or justify his decision to play Park and Rafael in the midfield instead of giving him his chances he clearly deserved.

He didn't want to pay the few extra millions to secure Hazard because of moral prciniples about agent fees. Well that turned out real good as Hazard is now worth more than double the fee Chelsea ended up paying for him.

He was not interested in Modric as replacement for Scholes or Bale for Giggs until it was royally too late and Real Madrid snapped up altough he has seen them more and longer than most managers. Fans we're saying he should have signed up those two for years and years or atleast invest in a midfielder like Scholes but he never did it !

Nani, Anderson, Bébé, Obertan, Hernandez, Valencia, Kagawa, Young, Smalling, Jones, Rafael, Fabio, Powell, owen, Zaha all overpaid signings he made for us that haven't worked out because they lack quality and simply aren't good enough (many of them also on ridiculously high wages). Smalling and Young have had their first decent season for a long while but the rest been crap with the capital letter C.

RVP worked out for 1 season. Than he has been no more than a hinderance for the team, a gruesomly overpaid and constantly injurred hinderance that we're struggling to sell now because nobody is interested in him due to the high wages. Berbatov been a similarly miserable buy from the club, so darn expensive and didn't work out at all.

Not to forget Cleverly and how long he kept giving that boy chances he never deserved in the first place.

I don't know why but in all decisions about which we players we should go for, how much we should spend on them, which players we shouldn't go for because they are too expensive, how much salary we should give them, who we should give chances in the team and who not, you just can't but say there is a severe lack of judgement and eye for quality. For the last part it is not only Fergies responsability and fault but also our scouting altough in the end Fergie has set up our scouting aswell and he managed them just like anyother sportive part of the club.

He is an amazing coach and probably one of the best if not the best people manager the game will ever see and he certainly earned his glory as a guy with an eye for talent when he brought Ronaldo to the club or Ruud, VDS, Ferdinand, Evra, Vidic, Carrick, Scholes, Giggs and Beckham from the youth to name just a few but those last 5 seasons, in fact starting the season after we sold Ronaldo have not been good in terms of transfers or general player based decisions.

Obviously he was still so good he won things but I think it was more despite the lack of quality player rather then because of the quality of his players.

The greatest legend this club could ever hope for and everybody owes him eternal gratitude and nothing but the utmost respect if you are a United fan yet despite all that we must not be blind for the shortcoming in the last 5 seasons in terms of player based decisions and the deterimental effect it has had over the last 2 seasons.

Only successtory from those last 5 seasons is DDG and now we have to see even that go to dust because the club didnt bother signing him up on a long term deal sooner.

The club apparently first offered a new contract in 2013. You can't seriously believe we just dumped a new deal on him recently?

 

[Mister Ed]

You actually make a fair point in that post, but parts of it are untrue.
For instance we were interested in Modric and we tried to sign Bale even before he even went to Spurs.
However for the most part you are correct with regards to our transfer dealings in general during the later part of Fergies reign.

I never said we weren't interested, I said the interest became concrete far too late. He had to be the best in the league and on Real Madrid radar before we actually wanted to make a serious offer to get him. Fergie should have identified him as an ideal replacement for Scholes years before that as he had been playing right under his nose. Same with Bale and I know we we were interested before he went to Spurs but that is a completley different interest because he was young and actually started out on the leftback. When I'am talking about being interested I'am talking about when he was already showing his great talent at spurs for being a winger before his 25+ goals season that made Real crazy about him.

Anyway the details of that post don't matter, it is the general message that matters and you seem to get it unlike some posters on here.

 

[Mojo_]

This is my favourite element of this site; someone dares to express an opinion in a well constructed manner and gets absolutely slaughtered for it in this way. Great stuff.

 

[Mister Ed]

Yeah he should have obviously completely caved to the demands of a teenager who was under performing for the reserves.

Oh yea nobody knew Pogba was a talented midfielder at the time.

We had no midfielders for that game, yet Pogba got no chance whatsoever. Pogba has already said a dozen times that he knew Fergie wasn't taking him seriously because he wouldn't give him a proper chance, often referring to that match and the fact Fergie preferred to bring back a 36 year old Paul Scholes before putting his trust in Pogba. He left for 300k to Juve and became one of the best midfielders in the game, well done !

Well to answer your question, yes he had to give in to the demands of a teenager that time. Because playing him made sense, it would have shown trust in Pogbas and affirmed to the player he would be getting chances at United. Player needs to get a chance, and having no midfielders anymore due to injurries is a good a time as it gets. He could have messed it up at the time and then Fergie would have had a valid reason to keep him out of the team for the time being or he could have taken his chance and shown his quality. Both would probably have resultated in him staying. But it is the fact he didnt even gave him a sniff at the time whilst everybody was certain he would have to give him a chance sooner or later due to the circumstances, is what broke the trust Pogba had in SAF and let to him leaving.

He either misjudged his talent and potential at the time because how in godsname could he not have been ready if he was ready the season after that for Juve...
Or he misjudged the effect his decisions would have on Pogba.

Either way Pogba left because he didnt felt appreciated by SAF and that is down to SAF. He should have known Pogba would turn out to be a special talent and he should have taken measures to sign him up on a longer contract.

The things he did concerning the midfielders that season might have been with winning the title in mind but they escalated into us losing one of the best players in a generation that could have been instrumental for us for years to come.

 

[Enigma_87]

I never said we weren't interested, I said the interest became concrete far too late. He had to be the best in the league and on Real Madrid radar before we actually wanted to make a serious offer to get him. Fergie should have identified him as an ideal replacement for Scholes years before that as he had been playing right under his nose. Same with Bale and I know we we were interested before he went to Spurs but that is a completley different interest because he was young and actually started out on the leftback. When I'am talking about being interested I'am talking about when he was already showing his great talent at spurs for being a winger before his 25+ goals season that made Real crazy about him.

Anyway the details of that post don't matter, it is the general message that matters and you seem to get it unlike some posters on here.

You contradict yourself with those posts.

When is it too early and too late to be interested in?

Also how do you know when our interest in certain players is genuine and how strong it is out of the hundred players we're linked with each Summer?

We were interested in both Modric and Bale. You say that the interest in both was late because other clubs came sniffing in, yet Real broke the Ronaldo record and in your previous post you said that we always overpay. In this case Real did.

Besides how can you be sure how different players would have developed at a given period of time. Pogba developed pretty good in another league being a starter yes, but there is no guarantee he would've been the same success at the time he was in Prem. And if you have seen him at the time in the reserves, he showed glimpses of quality but was nowhere near ready to be an automatic starter for the first team. He played in several games in the first team when he was 18-19 in the last year of his contract and I wouldn't say he impressed in either of them.

Fergie brought a lot of players before being developed that you say were overpriced, yet for some who we didn't sign for whatever reason he should be responsible as he waited too late.

In regards to Modric, how do you know Fergie didn't want him years ago before he went to Real? When Modric came to Spurs he signed a 6 years contract and he was sold at the 4th. As far as I can remember 1 year prior Chelsea wanted him bad and Levy didn't want to sell for whatever price. How would Fergie buy him prior when he's not available?

Truth is Fergie won a lot in that 5 years period. Whatever dross happened afterwards is something that > 200m pounds could've fixed.

 

[Mister Ed]

Winners should not be judged.

In the last 5 years Fergie won 3 titles(losing the other two by grand total of 1 point), 2 CL finals, 2 League cups. Whatever shit signings he has made he made it work. Since he left we spent north of 200m pounds.

Whoever still blames Fergie for things that happened after he left is off his mind.



I don't believe that. A bit scouse talk. We hit 89 points that year only eclipsed by us again in 09 in near past. We were clearly the best team that year and deservedly won.

Stupid thing to say

Everybody should be judged. And the good things don't erase the bad things nor do the bad things erase the good things.

Fergie was the best we could ever hope for, the things he won during in the last 5 years certainly outbalance the poor transfer decisions you could balme him for. So if you judge SAF the outcome is nothing but good, extrmely good in fact but he ain't perfect, nobody is. He made mistakes about the transfers in those last 5 years and he made quite a couple of them and do have an effect on our current situation. I don't see the point why any excuses should be made for that as the criticism is never meant as personal attack but just an assessment.

Many of the players he left us with have been found out in the last 2 seasons and the ones that are difficult to ship out due to high wages have been put on high wages under his management.

 

[golden_blunder]

This is my favourite element of this site; someone dares to express an opinion in a well constructed manner and gets absolutely slaughtered for it in this way. Great stuff.

You can flower it up grammatically or with fancy words but most of it is essentially a load of shite

 

[Mojo_]

You can flower it up grammatically or with fancy words but most of it is essentially a load of shite

For sure, it is opinionated, most things are but it doesn't mean it is wrong. I don't necessarily agree with all of it but there are some valid points and it is a view shared in certain quarters. It's the ad hominem responses that does the counter argument no justice.

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

So this announcement then...5 more minutes?

 

[dwd]

It will be that he's signed for Liverpool.

 

[Mojo_]

Red Cafe Goes Into Meltdown 15/16...

 

[Riz]

Red Cafe Goes Into Meltdown 15/16...

Of epic proportions..

 

[Enigma_87]

Stupid thing to say

Everybody should be judged. And the good things don't erase the bad things nor do the bad things erase the good things.

Fergie was the best we could ever hope for, the things he won during in the last 5 years certainly outbalance the poor transfer decisions you could balme him for. So if you judge SAF the outcome is nothing but good, extrmely good in fact but he ain't perfect, nobody is. He made mistakes about the transfers in those last 5 years and he made quite a couple of them and do have an effect on our current situation. I don't see the point why any excuses should be made for that as the criticism is never meant as personal attack but just an assessment.

Many of the players he left us with have been found out in the last 2 seasons and the ones that are difficult to ship out due to high wages have been put on high wages under his management.

According to who? In his late years (say 6) he won 4 titles and made it to 3 CL finals, winning one of them and 2 League cups to that tally. Show me a better period in our history. The players he bought did the work for him and brought him success. Those players you mentioned won a lot

When the change came and a new manager came, he had the financial power to build a whole new team. We bought like 10 players in 2 seasons for a lot, a lot of money. Fergie left a huge warchest along with a championship winning team. Every manager has his own style and players that compliment it. Why should Fergie be responsible for the failure of others?

Half of those you listed were brought in as youngsters with a potential, others(Owen) as a stopgap, who did not that bad of a job for the couple of games that he played. I wouldn't say Nani was a bad buy or didn't develop as the second coming of Ronaldo as probably you have hoped so.

Smalling came for 10-12m? Currently our best defender and still 25.

Obertan, Rafael, Fabio, Powell came for peanuts and Obertan was later sold for the same amount he was bought.

Saying that we overpaid for Hernandez is again huge exaggeration.

Valencia - 16m pounds, 6 years out of him, player of the year in 2012.

Kagawa was called a coup when he came at around 10m, everybody was excited.

We heard over the years how Carrick was shit, how Fletcher was useless, yet they were pretty important figures in our title runs in those years. With those hugely overpayed players we won a lot of titles. It clearly worked fine for Ferguson. So how come half of the team that won us those titles in those years can be called a bad piece of business?

 

[Mister Ed]

You contradict yourself with those posts.

When is it too early and too late to be interested in?

Also how do you know when our interest in certain players is genuine and how strong it is out of the hundred players we're linked with each Summer?

We were interested in both Modric and Bale. You say that the interest in both was late because other clubs came sniffing in, yet Real broke the Ronaldo record and in your previous post you said that we always overpay. In this case Real did.

Besides how can you be sure how different players would have developed at a given period of time. Pogba developed pretty good in another league being a starter yes, but there is no guarantee he would've been the same success at the time he was in Prem. And if you have seen him at the time in the reserves, he showed glimpses of quality but was nowhere near ready to be an automatic starter for the first team. He played in several games in the first team when he was 18-19 in the last year of his contract and I wouldn't say he impressed in either of them.

Fergie brought a lot of players before being developed that you say were overpriced, yet for some who we didn't sign for whatever reason he should be responsible as he waited too late.

In regards to Modric, how do you know Fergie didn't want him years ago before he went to Real? When Modric came to Spurs he signed a 6 years contract and he was sold at the 4th. As far as I can remember 1 year prior Chelsea wanted him bad and Levy didn't want to sell for whatever price. How would Fergie buy him prior when he's not available?

Truth is Fergie won a lot in that 5 years period. Whatever dross happened afterwards is something that > 200m pounds could've fixed.

It never is too early to be interested in a player. It is too late to be interested in a player if some other club wants him that you can't beat (usually when the players has an amazing season that puts him as nr 1 target on Reals or Barcas list). In case of Modric it might have been that Fergie was interested before Real but it never materialised into a serious bid until it was too late and he was already on Madrids radar.

We do overpay for players just look at the transfer fees for players like Jones and Zaha for example. It is not about breaking the transfer record or even about how much we spend in a summer, The more the better I say but what kind of price we end up paying for a player and if he is worth it or not. In my opnion we have often paid prices for players that are extremely high whilst the player in fact wasn't worth it, whilst for other players that were worth it we didn't want to pay up. I agree determining if a player was worth it is a bit hindsight but in case of somebody like Hazard it is was quite clear he was exceptional and we should have paid whatever was requirred to get him.

I never said Pogba should have been an automatic starter but he should have been given a chance especially because almost all our midfielders at the time were out injurred yet instead of doing that Fergie decided to play Rafael and Park in the middle and even to bring back Scholes from retirement for the rest of the season. I do think if a player has the quality like Pogba he can make it anywhere, not just in Italy. He was good enough and ready, maybay not to start all games but atleast to be given a proper chance which he didnt get.

On the last thing I agree, Fergie is brilliant and him winning so much clearly outweighs the negatives one can aim at him no doubt about that and indeed we have enough money to fix the issues and how that money is being used right now is not Fergies fault (never claimed as much).

 

[relx]

They are saying Florentino Perez is a llama

 

[Hernandez - BFA]

Apparently Perez is the problem for Ramos.

And yeah he's a llama.

 

[Bwuk]

Whilst we won't sign Ramos, I don't understand why we are letting him use us to get a new contract.

Simply tell him what we will pay him, and get him to agree or disagree with it, then it's just down to sorting a fee with Madrid. If he disagrees then move on.

Fed up people using our name for pay rises.

 

[BarstoolProphet]

They are saying Florentino Perez is a llama

How I read it aswell.

 

[VanGaalEra]

Cadena COPE are reliable, I'd believe that news tbh.

 

[#07]

 

[VanGaalEra]

That's probably a BS account/tweet.

 

[Enigma_87]

It never is too early to be interested in a player. It is too late to be interested in a player if some other club wants him that you can't beat (usually when the players has an amazing season that puts him as nr 1 target on Reals or Barcas list). In case of Modric it might have been that Fergie was interested before Real but it never materialised into a serious bid until it was too late and he was already on Madrids radar.

For Modric - Chelsea was interested before Real and they failed with several bids. Spurs may not want to sell to us or another English team before Real became interested you know, in that case it's nothing you can do.

We do overpay for players just look at the transfer fees for players like Jones and Zaha for example. It is not about breaking the transfer record or even about how much we spend in a summer, The more the better I say but what kind of price we end up paying for a player and if he is worth it or not. In my opnion we have often paid prices for players that are extremely high whilst the player in fact wasn't worth it, whilst for other players that were worth it we didn't want to pay up. I agree determining if a player was worth it is a bit hindsight but in case of somebody like Hazard it is was quite clear he was exceptional and we should have paid whatever was requirred to get him.

and you know that after it's certain he is not worth it? Jones and Zaha were both hot properties when we bought them. If they went to Real or Chelsea and were successful then again we would have missed then? Or we should've waited 3-4 seasons more and then Real would've been interested?

I never said Pogba should have been an automatic starter but he should have been given a chance especially because almost all our midfielders at the time were out injurred yet instead of doing that Fergie decided to play Rafael and Park in the middle and even to bring back Scholes from retirement for the rest of the season. I do think if a player has the quality like Pogba he can make it anywhere, not just in Italy. He was good enough and ready, maybay not to start all games but atleast to be given a proper chance which he didnt get.

Pogba got 7 or 8 games in that season. Again, I don't think he impressed in either of those. He became the player he is now playing more than 120 games in a different league to Premiership, and I don't think he's a finished article as well at the moment.

On the last thing I agree, Fergie is brilliant and him winning so much clearly outweighs the negatives one can aim at him no doubt about that and indeed we have enough money to fix the issues and how that money is being used right now is not Fergies fault (never claimed as much).

the players you mentioned were either gone or squad players at best, by no means they were obstacle for the new manager if we wanted to get rid - either by being sold or loaned (in the case of Hernandez, Nani)...

 

[.Rossi]

So yeah, Perez is his problem. He doesn't actually want to leave Madrid.

 

[SteveW]

OK. I don't like Real. So i don't watch Ramos that much. Couple of years ago I didn't think he was all that defensively. Has something changed?

 

[Enigma_87]

OK. I don't like Real. So i don't watch Ramos that much. Couple of years ago I didn't think he was all that defensively. Has something changed?

He grew a beard.

 

[Tompo]

If he has any choice or sense he should stay at Madrid where he rarely actually has to defend.

He would be mad to move to the premier league.

 

[Sam]

RamOFF?

 

[Drifter]

Good news.

 

[#07]

That's probably a BS account/tweet.

Lots of tweets about it

 

[Mister Ed]

According to who? In his late years (say 6) he won 4 titles and made it to 3 CL finals, winning one of them and 2 League cups to that tally. Show me a better period in our history. The players he bought did the work for him and brought him success. Those players you mentioned won a lot

It is the team that won those prizes and Fergie was excellent at people management and motivating his players. He could probably win the PL with a team consisting out of mostly championship players he is the best at getting the most out of the players he has. I only doubt his judgement about certain players he brought in over the course of his last 5 years.

Yes Anderson has more PL titles than most players in the league atm, we even make fun of that when we compare that to the number of medals Gerrard won but you seriously consider him to being a good player because of that ?

When the change came and a new manager came, he had the financial power to build a whole new team. We bought like 10 players in 2 seasons for a lot, a lot of money. Fergie left a huge warchest along with a championship winning team. Every manager has his own style and players that compliment it. Why should Fergie be responsible for the failure of others?

He is not an I never claimed he was. I just say he is reponsible for alot of dross in the team that was here pre moyes and also the fact alot of them are on ridiculously high wages (which makes it hard to ship them out).

Half of those you listed were brought in as youngsters with a potential, others(Owen) as a stopgap, who did not that bad of a job for the couple of games that he played. I wouldn't say Nani was a bad buy or didn't develop as the second coming of Ronaldo as probably you have hoped so.

In all those years he maybay had 1 good season or half a season for us. We have paid him a small fortune over all those years in very high wages and we practically have to give him away atm because nobody seems to rate him anymore.

Smalling came for 10-12m? Currently our best defender and still 25.

Overpaid massively for such a young lad that has need almost 4 years to finally have a good season for us and he still isn't all that good.

Obertan, Rafael, Fabio, Powell came for peanuts and Obertan was later sold for the same amount he was bought.

Saying that we overpaid for Hernandez is again huge exaggeration.

I was listing a number of players that didn't work out for United and than said a couple of things in general about them. When I was raving about the transfer prices obviously I was refering to players like Nani and Anderson and Zaha and Jones for example but not Herandez, Owen or the Da silvas.

Valencia - 16m pounds, 6 years out of him, player of the year in 2012.

The player everybody always complains about is a one trick pony and want to see out of the team

Kagawa was called a coup when he came at around 10m, everybody was excited.

Kagawa was 20m and never materialised into anything for us

We heard over the years how Carrick was shit, how Fletcher was useless, yet they were pretty important figures in our title runs in those years. With those hugely overpayed players we won a lot of titles. It clearly worked fine for Ferguson. So how come half of the team that won us those titles in those years can be called a bad piece of business?

Because most of the people on here do nothing but complain about them (rightly so), they get called average footballers by just about everybody (even when Fergie was here and winning the title with them) and most of them are being pushed out of the team now because LVG and Moyes didn't rate them and we are struggling to do so because hardly any team is seriously interested in them (which says enough doesn't it)

 

[.Rossi]

Someone is taking the piss right?!

I mean, I know our club is so blinded by their own bullshit that we neglected to replace a lot of players properly and overspend in the transfer market but, we aren't this stupid, right?!

 

[Sam]

I love this idea that we're so stacked, and in such a good position, that some of you would turn your nose up at Sergio Ramos.

I mean, its not like one of our starting centre backs right now is Phil Jones. Oh no, wait a minute...