Louis Van Gaal | 2015-16 Performance Thread

[RedDF]

you guys pretend like we never lost under fergie, swansea away is a tough game and many big teams have struggled there! we have 3 clean sheets and we're doing better than chelsea and arsenal i don't think he warrants this kind of criticism just yet.
Wait a bit more and see if things improve, we do have 4 new players playing everyweek after all.

 

[redindian1987]

Some of the stuff on here, I'm no doubt being very harsh but some of us are exactly what the ABU crowd claim us to be. Spoilt, with no perspective.

It's been 4 games. That's what, 11% of our league games and we're already calling for him to be sacked? Yeah, the start to the season has been underwhelming, it often is at United. I think it says a lot that the same lot who were calling him worse than Moyes after 4 games last season are the same ones doing so this season.

Any critical appraisal of Louis van Gaal, any manger for that matter, has to account for the background surrounding the appointment. We needed to get into the Champions League, we did that. With some more luck (and less shit performances), we could have even ended up second last season. By any sensible account, van Gaal did what was expected of him as regards last season. Onto this season, again, it's been 4 games. Despite that, let's have a look at yesterday's starting line-up:

Romero; Darmian, Smalling, Blind, Shaw: Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin; Mata, Herrera, Memphis; Rooney.

5 new players, half our team. To expect a team with such high player turnover to get off the blocks running is a tad optimistic; even more so when a crucial part of our attack is a 21 year old from the Dutch League.

The days of domination, thrashing teams 5-0 are over. United fans have to come to terms with this fact. The Premier League is getting more competitive. By the way, how many of the big clubs have started well? Chelsea drew at home to the same team to whom we lost away and got thrashed by their title rivals and Arsenal lost to West Ham and were dire despite being a man up against Newcastle. Only City have done well, in my view because the board stuck with their manager despite the knee jerk calls for him to be fired.

 

[Dans]

you guys pretend like we never lost under fergie, swansea away is a tough game and many big teams have struggled there! we have 3 clean sheets and we're doing better than chelsea and arsenal i don't think he warrants this kind of criticism just yet.
Wait a bit more and see if things improve, we do have 4 new players playing everyweek after all.

That things don't improve is what is concerning many. We created precious little in the 2nd half and what we did was squandered by Rooney. When we went down, we never looked like scoring a goal. LVGs "concede less than the opposition" thinking sits badly with me as I believe in scoring more than the opposition. Hey, how about that?

The win against second rate Club Brugge seems to have led to a mass donning of rose tinted spectacles, however there are many of us who resisted this because we believe what we see. What I see is a long, long way from being championship contender material. We are lucky that Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal have started badly - but there's another thing that grates - excusing our shite performances by referencing those three. City will have a "massive" lead before too long, one we will not have a hope of catching.

 

[Dans]

It's not about the players so much as the manager's tactics. I suppose we should be thankful for having those new players, because if we didn't, the group that finished last season implementing Louis negative tactics would have done even worse I guess.

 

[Wumminator]

People want him sacked already?

FFS, some of you are a joke!

 

[Bojan11]

City have done well because they have better attackers than us. All four of their attackers including De Bruyne would walk in our team. To be honest would Arsenal or Chelsea fans want any of our attackers?

Also their manager has a better style of football. They are far entertaining than us and it's sad to say that.

 

[Sultan]

5 good performances in nearly 50 games played under LvG. I'd say the United fans have been very patient.

 

[#07]

Club legends, and treble winners, saying what a lot of fans are thinking..

 

[RedOldBoy]

So, I haven't watched Bayern or Barcelona under LVG. But were the two clubs so dire to watch during that time? Or is it just with United? If so is it the pace of the Premier League that makes his tactics ineffective?
I know that Ajax played some brilliant football in the mid 90's under LVG and he did come to United with a reputation of attacking football. However for a year now I can't say I've been impressed with this brand of football and I know it's been said before but sometimes it's even worse than under Moyes at least performance wise. I hope this 'process' thing is coming to an end.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

We have solidified our midfield but our attacking options were as poor as when Moyes first came in. Heck, I'd argue we're worse off.

We still had RvP then who we presumed was going to be the title winning RvP, and a still pretty good Javier Hernandez, so yes they we decidedly better.

 

[RedOldBoy]

People want him sacked already?

FFS, some of you are a joke!

Only because changing a manager at this stage would be suicide. If we finish 4th again it wouldn't surprise me if he is sacked. I like the man's arrogance but he doesn't justify it like Mourinho does, and makes too many stupid excuses when we lose or draw (against the small clubs) i.e. luck, teams changed shape, 'process', the 'philosophy' etc

 

[legball]

If Guardiola or Klopp is available next summer then I'll call it a day if it was left to me. If we want to play possession football, then Guardiola is the perfect man to implement an actual watchable possession style, if we want Fergie style kitchen sink football, then Klopp fits that profile nicely. I like Van Gaal and want him to succeed, but, am not sure now, I mean, it can't be so difficult to get a team playing good football, or even your preferred possession football with reasonable efficiency, the same problems that we had last season are still there, and he's like Wenger, he won't change or bother to tweak things a bit.

 

[Bojan11]

If Guardiola or Klopp is available next summer then I'll call it a day if it was left to me. If we want to play possession football, then Guardiola is the perfect man to implement an actual watchable possession style, if we want Fergie style kitchen sink football, then Klopp fits that profile nicely. I like Van Gaal and want him to succeed, but, am not sure now, I mean, it can't be so difficult to get a team playing good football, or even your preferred possession football with reasonable efficiency, the same problems that we had last season are still there, and he's like Wenger, he won't change or bother to tweak things a bit.

The sad thing is even when we losing, we don't throw the kitchen sink. We just do aimless long balls to Fellaini.

 

[legball]

The sad thing is even when we losing, we don't throw the kitchen sink. We just do aimless long balls to Fellaini.

That's the worst part of it. A man of extreme, dump your reverred style and switch to a rock bottom 80s hoofing tactics at the slightest sign of adversary. Incredible.

 

[Sunny Jim]

you guys pretend like we never lost under fergie, swansea away is a tough game and many big teams have struggled there! we have 3 clean sheets and we're doing better than chelsea and arsenal i don't think he warrants this kind of criticism just yet.
Wait a bit more and see if things improve, we do have 4 new players playing everyweek after all.

The point is these 4 players are usually top performers. So what is your point.

Secondly, we are not looking at 1 game. Certain problems were here last year and they continue to appear.

 

[Robbie Boy]

I see some of the "oh we have such spoilt fans" brigade are out. I actually voted to keep him until the end of his contract but it was a toss-up between two and three. The lack of enjoyment watching us play these days is utterly depressing. I try my best to find positives and sure, there have been some, but the negatives are far more prominent.

I never really wanted LvG and I confess that I didn't know a-lot about his detailed history / 'philosophies' etc. But the main thing was that he was a proven winner and more importantly, he wasn't Moyes. Then I watched several videos of his interviews, read up on him along with Hollands good run in the WC and I started to get excited. Far more informed posters than myself that knew a-lot about LvG posted quite a-bit about him on here and their insights were intriguing to read. The common theme, though was that he was a stubborn man that stuck to his now famous 'philosophies'. We started last season looking clueless but again, we had a new manager with new ideas that bleated on about the 'philosophies' taking 3 months to implement. Here we are, some 13 months later and our football is soul-sucking with some utterly bizarre tactical decisions being made every single week. Forgive me, for being 'spoilt' , but I expected a-lot better by now from a supposedly 'world class' manager', a man by his own reckoning, that can do no wrong.

We are a day and a bit away from the transfer window shutting and the talk is that Hernandez will be off. What the feck are we playing at exactly. The general consensus a month or so back was that we would have signed one if not two attacking players by now. But instead, we look like losing one. I'm not bigging up Hernandez here, but feck me, letting him go without a replacement would be insanity. We are desperately short up front and Rooneys' form is gone beyond worrying. This team and our system, fills me with absolutely no confidence and every good performance to-date has pretty much been no more than a false dawn. People can refer back to 'that run' last season against Spurs, Liverpool etc, but it's clutching at straws. It's like the whole 'Welbeck once got 7 goals in 7 games up top' argument that used to be branded about on here. The thing is, 'that run' we had looks nothing more than an anomaly at this stage and one of the main factors of the run was Fellaini.

Yesterday we looked clueless when we went two down. I'm sorry but the second goal was Romeros' fault, another stupid situation we find ourselves in is the GK department. So for the last 15 odd minutes what did we do? We hoofed the fecking ball to Fellaini! I wouldn't mind but even the service from the hoofing was piss poor and the ball was generally just lashed in Fellainis' general direction. Forgive the 'spoilt' fans of Manchester United for expecting better. Swansea are a good side, a very decent side in fact, but we were absolute wank and ultimately deserved nout. Against Newcastle we can all say how great Coloccini was, which he was that day, but again, we had no clinical / cutting edge in the final third. People say Krul was great but he hardly had a Friedel(esque) performance against us. We didn't exactly bombard his goal and I can only really recall two very good saves. People can throw up the stats all they want but 1 point in our last two league games is the most telling stat.

I don't want LvG out at the minute and as I said, I voted option 3. I'm very divided on the man; 50/50. I'm glad he's cleared some of the dross out and he's made some good signings. The form of Smalling, Darmian and Shaw has also been a major plus. But Mata being continually deployed on the right, Rooney being undroppable and Blind at CB are just bemusing. I won't even start on Romero. I've generally been surprised and happy with Blind at CB but it's a definite gamble long term. City went out and tied up Otamendi even though they had a good youngster in Denayer there. Instead they loaned Denayer and brought in a top class CB. LvG has now sold Evans and is obviously very confident of McNairs' ability. I personally feel McNair should have been loaned out and we should have signed a CB, but there you go.

It remains to be seen what's going to happen before the window closes and a win against Liverpool in our next match will restore a-lot of good faith. I genuinely hope that LvG can turn this around and get us playing in an entertaining fashion but I won't hold my breath. I would have expected more than 7 points after these 4 games but I guess we are integrating 5 odd new players. If this 'brand' of football and the constant hit-and-miss results continue all season and we once again are fighting for no more than fourth, then serious questions will have to be asked.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

Some of the stuff on here, I'm no doubt being very harsh but some of us are exactly what the ABU crowd claim us to be. Spoilt, with no perspective.

It's been 4 games. That's what, 11% of our league games and we're already calling for him to be sacked? Yeah, the start to the season has been underwhelming, it often is at United. I think it says a lot that the same lot who were calling him worse than Moyes after 4 games last season are the same ones doing so this season.

Any critical appraisal of Louis van Gaal, any manger for that matter, has to account for the background surrounding the appointment. We needed to get into the Champions League, we did that. With some more luck (and less shit performances), we could have even ended up second last season. By any sensible account, van Gaal did what was expected of him as regards last season. Onto this season, again, it's been 4 games. Despite that, let's have a look at yesterday's starting line-up:

Romero; Darmian, Smalling, Blind, Shaw: Schweinsteiger, Schneiderlin; Mata, Herrera, Memphis; Rooney.

5 new players, half our team. To expect a team with such high player turnover to get off the blocks running is a tad optimistic; even more so when a crucial part of our attack is a 21 year old from the Dutch League.

The days of domination, thrashing teams 5-0 are over. United fans have to come to terms with this fact. The Premier League is getting more competitive. By the way, how many of the big clubs have started well? Chelsea drew at home to the same team to whom we lost away and got thrashed by their title rivals and Arsenal lost to West Ham and were dire despite being a man up against Newcastle. Only City have done well, in my view because the board stuck with their manager despite the knee jerk calls for him to be fired.

Neither of those clubs stifle the creativity of their players; it won't affect them in the long run. Also, none of them give up on playing football when they go behind, plant a target man and just mindlessly hoof balls into the penalty area. It's brainless, pathetic and smacks of a lack of character.

 

[milemuncher777]

As much as I hate Van Gaal, I don't think he was at fault yesterday. Our two most important players both at the opposing end of the pitch where it matters the most came up with practically 0/10 performance which effectively lost us the game.

 

[redindian1987]

Neither of those clubs stifle the creativity of their players; it won't affect them in the long run. Also, none of them give up on playing football when they go behind, plant a target man and just mindlessly hoof balls into the penalty area. It's brainless, pathetic and smacks of a lack of character.

This, this is the stuff I'm talking about. You would think that van Gaal tells his players to not be creative at all. Just because his game is controlled, isn't the anarchy of Sir Alex doesn't mean he's stifling creativity. It's another way of playing the game, why are people so allergic to it? This whole argument of how he stifles creativity has no basis, you don't win the stuff he's won in the game without trying to be creative.

Yeah, using Fellaini's strengths to get a goal when we're losing is brainless and pathetic, not a manger utilizing his resources to get a result

 

[Litch]

Sorry might be controversial but he plays not to lose, than to win. He's has no imagination and has changed the DNA of Man Utd to something that is methodical , slow and predictable. From a fans perspective is boring to watch win or lose. I worry for the club I love because with all the money spent we seem to address one problem but create others. We are still CB short, a least 2 forwards short and we all knew what was happening with the GK situation so why have the club left it and not resolved it? We are so far behind the top teams in the prem and Europe it's untrue....

 

[itso 7]

I don't want Gary Fecking Monk here but looking at how he's got Swansea playing and the difference between the resources available to both teams really magnifies the extent of our our failure in this post-Ferguson era. What is tying us back is not just the idiotic dream that our Captain will somehow match the one season that has so far proved to be an outlier in his career but our apparent inability to plan ahead in terms of recruitment, the players we release (how do you agree to sell Di Maria, Nani and RVP without any replacements lined up, how stupid can one actually get?) and the tactical inflexibility our manager has so far exhibited twelve months into the job - we are failing miserably to pass our way through packed defences and as a result we are dropping way too many points against teams we should be beating because you don't win titles by beating the likes of City and Arsenal alone. We should have a template that we follow when we play the big boys but we should be having another, one that allows greater creative freedom and higher tempo, against the likes of Newcastle. Then there is this weird obsession with player profiles that is stopping us from improving the defense until the right king of player becomes available, I could go on for ages.....

 

[gulli_G]

https://beyondthepitchblog.wordpress.com/2015/08/30/shaky-ground-for-louis-van-gaal/

Pretty much sums our situation up

 

[Bloxy]

Sorry might be controversial but he plays not to lose, than to win. He's has no imagination and has changed the D&A of Man Utd to something that is methodical , slow and predictable. From a fans perspective is boring to watch win or lose. I worry for the club I love because with all the money spent we seem to address one problem but create others. We are still CB short, a least 2 forwards short and we all knew what was happening with the GK situation so why have the club left it and not resolved it? We are so far behind the top teams in the prem and Europe it's untrue....

I do agree we are very boring to watch. I only managed the 1st half yesterday and thought it would end up 0-0 draw again, but it was dreadful to watch despite all the possession. I don't think LVG knows how to setup as an attacking team. He knows defensive possession football and his idea of all out attack is sticking the tallest fella in the team up front and play it long. ,

 

[Litch]

I do agree we are very boring to watch. I only managed the 1st half yesterday and thought it would end up 0-0 draw again, but it was dreadful to watch despite all the possession. I don't think LVG knows how to setup as an attacking team. He knows defensive possession football and his idea of all out attack is sticking the tallest fella in the team up front and play it long. ,

Lol DNA.....

 

[dustfingers]

As much as I hate Van Gaal, I don't think he was at fault yesterday. Our two most important players both at the opposing end of the pitch where it matters the most came up with practically 0/10 performance which effectively lost us the game.

Yeah, sometimes players have a mare performance and managers get blamed. But ffs we played Fellaini and hoof ball when we needed a goal most. That's what worried me. We have the problem of breaking teams for a while now and if LvG thinks hoof ball is the solution to that, then what's with all the philosophy and stuffs? That's the bigger picture which has me worried about LvG. We will at times and in crucial matches be in such situation like needing a goal and if we can't have a better plan than this, then the fault has to be on the manager.

 

[Lewis.no.9]

https://beyondthepitchblog.wordpress.com/2015/08/30/shaky-ground-for-louis-van-gaal/

Pretty much sums our situation up

This is an amazingly accurate review of our current situation. Very worrying times for our club

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

The end of the game yesterday, with the plan seemingly being give it to Ashley Young to cross it in for Fellaini was close to being embarrassing. When you think of the money we've spent, the players we have and this supposed modern new possession football we now play.

To resort to doing what fecking Moyes was doing, it was painful to watch.

I said before the season I didn't trust Van Gaal and to be honest this season ,early days though it is, has just reinforced that.

 

[K2K]

Perhaps that’s the price you pay when your football club is run as a business that happens to play football, unfortunately that’s the pecking order of importance at Old Trafford, more business men than football men.

That for me is damning but there is some truth in..You hear people clamouring for Marquee signings and galaticos and the reason for it is that it will boost our marketing image..We should have focused on getting sensible signings for our weak areas in attack and defense(More Herrera, Darmian and Schneiderlin signings and less ADM and Falcaos)..Yes, the marquee signings are nice, but those should be the cherry on the cake.

We need to get back this football club back to where it needs to be.

 

[LeftyBlaster]

This, this is the stuff I'm talking about. You would think that van Gaal tells his players to not be creative at all. Just because his game is controlled, isn't the anarchy of Sir Alex doesn't mean he's stifling creativity. It's another way of playing the game, why are people so allergic to it? This whole argument of how he stifles creativity has no basis, you don't win the stuff he's won in the game without trying to be creative.

Yeah, using Fellaini's strengths to get a goal when we're losing is brainless and pathetic, not a manger utilizing his resources to get a result

And yet we see us taking a bloody long time to find his magical philosophy. The problems are there on full display; lack of movement, lack of risk taking, not playing our creative players on a consistent basis, taking them off for mindless hoofball.

And yes it is pathetic and brainless. If you want to argue, "use his resources", you're a moron. There was no attempt to play football. We were hoofing it from the halfway line into their box for feck's sake. There was no thinking involved. And this is not the first time he's done it. If you want to argue using Fellaini as a resource, he should have come on for Bastian who wasn't having a good game so he could provide a platform for Memphis and Herrera and Shaw to play off him as we did well in the big games last season. Not planting him int he box for spray and pray tactics.

 

[Question234]

The problem with lvg is his obsession with keeping possession at all costs and the perfect performance.

He'd rather us win 1-0 than 4-2.

Just look at his post match conferences after the newcastle/swansea games, if we're able to maintain possession than in his eyes it's a good performance and we deserve to win.

 

[matt23]

Subs were ridiculous - he basically took off the players that were playing well, and let Memphis and Bastian continue offering us absolutely nothing. Bringing Fellaini on was was the end of the match.

We clearly lack a plan to penetrate, we're absolutely fine until we get to the opposition's box and then run out of ideas, almost as if we haven't been coached particularly well..

 

[Dans]

The sad thing is even when we losing, we don't throw the kitchen sink. We just do aimless long balls to Fellaini.

Exactly. Didn't Moyes do exactly the same too? Where's the progress?

 

[Question234]

The end of the game yesterday, with the plan seemingly being give it to Ashley Young to cross it in for Fellaini was close to being embarrassing. When you think of the money we've spent, the players we have and this supposed modern new possession football we now play.

To resort to doing what fecking Moyes was doing, it was painful to watch.

I said before the season I didn't trust Van Gaal and to be honest this season ,early days though it is, has just reinforced that.

It is not as bad as it was under the moyes reign but i agree that we're letting lvg get away with decisions we would of crucified Moyes for making. Because of his CV we give him the benefit of the doubt, deservedly imo as he has found some form of success at every club he has been at.

That being said he needs to bring results here or even just a more visible improvement in terms of performance. What was gutting about the swansea loss was it was a loss that came in the exact same manner the previous one did.

Play well for a brief spell, go a goal up, concede two due to mistakes and then spend the game lumping hail mary's to fellaini. That's 4 times swansea has beaten us in the last 2 years, 3 of the losses come under lvg

really unacceptable.

 

[Andy_Cole]

Feel like he's worse than moyes. Only difference is he has charisma and knows how to talk the talk. Not walking the walk though.

Also he's great in the big games. Still though. Been a poor manager for us.

 

[Woodenlung]

RVP, Falcao, Nani, Di Maria are all gone and it looks like Hernandez and Januzaj are on the way too. So 6 forwards out and all we've brought in is Memphis. How is that for squad building? Might be unfair to pin it all in Van Gaal. Feck it tho. I'm pissed off.

 

[m1tch]

As much as I hate Van Gaal, I don't think he was at fault yesterday. Our two most important players both at the opposing end of the pitch where it matters the most came up with practically 0/10 performance which effectively lost us the game.

He picks them and has decided they're bullet proof in their positions.

 

[m1tch]

RVP, Falcao, Nani, Di Maria are all gone and it looks like Hernandez and Januzaj are on the way too. So 6 forwards out and all we've brought in is Memphis. How is that for squad building? Might be unfair to pin it all in Van Gaal. Feck it tho. I'm pissed off.

It's awful business. Memphis should be getting introduced gradually. Instead of shielding him we're hanging him out to dry by pinning all of our attacking hopes on him when he's a 21 year old playing in a real league for the first time.

 

[milemuncher777]

He picks them and has decided they're bullet proof in their positions.

It has nothing to do with yesterday. Would you've dropped Rooney on back of the hattrick or *Romero who was faultless till yest ?

*I consider Romero to be a poor keeper but on the back of the start it'd be completely illogical to drop him suddenly yesterday.

 

[Kaos]

My faith in him will depend on how he handles Rooney. If he continues to pick him despite his awful performances, I want him and Rooney to bugger off come the end of the season.

 

[m1tch]

It has nothing to do with yesterday. Would you've dropped Rooney on back of the hattrick or *Romero who was faultless till yest ?

*I consider Romero to be a poor keeper but on the back of the start it'd be completely illogical to drop him suddenly yesterday.

Neither would have been in my team (or at the club) at the beginning of the season. Them performances haven't come out of nowhere. Romero wasn't good enough to be number 1 at his last club, Rooney hasn't been good enough for the premier league for a couple of years.