Mass shooting at Gay night club in Orlando

The usual conspiracy idiots are at it again with the usual variety of theories.....false flag....MKUltra....liberals trying to force gun control......conservatives trying to get Trump elected.....military industrial complex trying to prolong war on terror.
 
The usual conspiracy idiots are at it again with the usual variety of theories.....false flag....MKUltra....liberals trying to force gun control......conservatives trying to get Trump elected.....military industrial complex trying to prolong war on terror.
This reminds me.. I need to ask my conspiracy minded buddy at work if the Freemasons had anything to do with it.

Seriously, he's out there. Legitimately thinks the world is flat and outer space doesn't exist. Why? Because #theBible
 
I agree with him too. The only problem is that homosexuality is a grave sin in Islam, the punishment for which is the hellfire. I find the idea of encouraging to Islamic preachers tell their flock to let Allah mete out the horrific violence on the gays to be the kind of perverse and bizarre apologism we get from the liberal left in the West towards Islam.

The problem is in the doctrine and it isn't going anywhere soon.
I am not trying to defend Islam as I am not muslim but homosexuality is a grave sin in christiainity too, and in the bible there are as many horrofic verses as in Quran regarding gay people. There are some muslim countries where they don't have laws againist homosexuality from the very beginning. Even in many western countries there used to be laws prohibiting homoxuality but later they were repealed as society progresses. My point is lumping all shootings and sucide bombings into islamic doctrine as if other religions are pure of violence in their doctrine is wrong. Obviously accepting quran as a guiding principle in every aspect of life is one of the problems but imho there are also other factors.
 
Am I being cynical in thinking that Donald Trump must be rubbing his hands in sheer glee over this incident - in his warped mind, it justifies everything he's been spouting.

The ironic thing is, he is actually doing extremists' work for them - he's creating mistrust and division better than they can, with more and more Americans becoming paranoid and fearful of Islam.
 
Why? It would still be a terrorist group. Despite it's name ISIS is not a recognized as a 'state', so it still is a radical terrorist group, one of the numerous existing currently. Unless you are somehow implying ISIS is representative of the entire religion....



Surely that is a obvious and superfluous? Not as if anyone is trying to hide the fact.

you speak as much for Islam as every single other person who self-identifies as Muslim including the likes of al-baghdadi. Nobody claims, that all Muslims are intolerant or radical. It is such a annoying defence. Only bigots claim that, so you accuse everyone who criticises Islam to be bigoted.
A good amount of the Koran is literately backwards, crazy, violent and intolerant and some people act precisely on this dogma (to a different extend). It is your problem if you refuse to acknowledge the obvious.
Yes, the bible is equally bad, but far less Christians are actually violent. If Christians would kill sinners, we would talk about it. In fact politicians and intellectuals talk about the faults of the Christian dogma (e.g. opposing condoms in Africa; homophobia; inequality of women) all the time.
You are very much part of the problem, if you can´t do the same with your religion.
 
Am I being cynical in thinking that Donald Trump must be rubbing his hands in sheer glee over this incident - in his warped mind, it justifies everything he's been spouting.

The ironic thing is, he is actually doing extremists' work for them - he's creating mistrust and division better than they can, with more and more Americans becoming paranoid and fearful of Islam.
Oh, how can he not be? Anyone who actually tweets "People are saying I'm right, I didn't want to be right" or the like is definitely profiteering.
 
I still don't get why, John Kerry aside, US politicians still refer to the group as ISIL or ISIS. The proper term is Daesh. And it pisses them off when called it.
 
Am I being cynical in thinking that Donald Trump must be rubbing his hands in sheer glee over this incident - in his warped mind, it justifies everything he's been spouting.

The ironic thing is, he is actually doing extremists' work for them - he's creating mistrust and division better than they can, with more and more Americans becoming paranoid and fearful of Islam.
He's absolutely loving it, the sick feck.
 
I still don't get why, John Kerry aside, US politicians still refer to the group as ISIL or ISIS. The proper term is Daesh. And it pisses them off when called it.
The American people would be really confused man. We're talking about politicians talking to a population that cannot differentiate between state capitalism (USSR etc.) and social democracy (or actual communism for that matter).
 
The American people would be really confused man. We're talking about politicians talking to a population that cannot differentiate between state capitalism (USSR etc.) and social democracy (or actual communism for that matter).

It would be quite easy. Politicians set the tone during briefs and interviews by referring to Daesh, POTUS the same, the news channels the same. Come out with reasons behind it on news segments to educate the masses.

I think the biggest problem is the media and politics love the word Islamic included as it further drives home the "evil Islamic culture."
 
It would be quite easy. Politicians set the tone during briefs and interviews by referring to Daesh, POTUS the same, the news channels the same. Come out with reasons behind it on news segments to educate the masses.

I think the biggest problem is the media and politics love the word Islamic included as it further drives home the "evil Islamic culture."
In all seriousness, you're probably onto something there.

We need a new poorly named enemy since "communism" (cough state cough capitalism cough) died out in the USSR.

On a side note.. have you seen the conspiracies surrounding why Obama says ISIL instead of ISIS?
 
It would be quite easy. Politicians set the tone during briefs and interviews by referring to Daesh, POTUS the same, the news channels the same. Come out with reasons behind it on news segments to educate the masses.

I think the biggest problem is the media and politics love the word Islamic included as it further drives home the "evil Islamic culture."

I get the impression US national security apparatus likes its acronyms. I bet its how they speak and write internally. But you're right, they could do differently in briefings.
 
Isis actually despise being called daesh as they consider it derogatory, I'm all for referring them as such.
 
Probably already been mentioned, but how well did the police do? Making quick decisions to go straight in as well as taking out parts of the wall must've saved a good number of lives. Wonder if the wall thing was part of their training or decided completely on the spot?
 
isnt an AR15 the civilian version of the M16... ie you can switch the M16 to full auto but not the AR15 (both will fire semi auto also)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15
Sandyhook, San Bernadino and now the nightclub were undertaken with an AR15 I believe?
Yes they used the same kind of rifle, but if the guy had a shotgun with the extension for 10 shells then the carnage would be worst, so far they are using the rifle the news outlet keeps talking about.
 
Muslims don't execute them either aside from lone nuts like this guy. The key is to find out why so many Muslims can be incited to violence. Can't be education because a lot of these people are very well educated. Are they so in love with the quran that they discard logic or is it more economic or social?
I saw a video of Muslim gays getting executed by throwing them from tall buildings.
 
I think it's because things like that happens very, very, very, very rarely in Europe. Meanwhile there have been over 1000 mass shootings (more than 4 people injured or dead) in the US in the last 998 days. :annoyed:

I've seen several people mention France and Belgium in some vague attempt to show that people are killed in the same way here as they are in the US. What you seem to fail to realise though is that there's quite a big difference between shootings "once in a very long while" and "every single f*cking day".
http://crimeresearch.org/2015/06/co...m-mass-public-shootings-in-the-us-and-europe/
 
Turns out the shooter was using a gay dating app and had messaged people on it. Going to have to add suppressed homosexual onto the list of "issues" now as well
 
Turns out the shooter was using a gay dating app and had messaged people on it. Going to have to add suppressed homosexual onto the list of "issues" now as well
Source?

Can't say I'd be remotely surprised. First thing I thought when I heard his father's words was it sounded like he was struggling with his sexuality.
 
Source?

Can't say I'd be remotely surprised. First thing I thought when I heard his father's words was it sounded like he was struggling with his sexuality.



Just got it from Chris Hayes at MSNBC. Not surprised either, probably was gay but had been bought in a culture where being gay was bad and lashed out in a horrible way.

Edit: Additional article from the Orlando Sentinel says 4 regulars at the club recognised seeing him there before. If he was getting drunk and belligerent, I don't think he was simply scouting the place for what he did.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...tclub-omar-mateen-profile-20160613-story.html
 
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I saw a video of Muslim gays getting executed by throwing them from tall buildings.

You mean the ISIS videos? Yeah I've always wondered if those blokes getting chucked off were really gay or just guilty of pissing off the wrong people. I mean I can't see an underground gay nightlife happening in Raqqa at all.
 
If a "Christian State in ______" was committing acts of terror in the name of a perverted form of Christianity, would general Christianity not become a legitimate part of the conversation?

It most certainly would.

What ISIS are up to and promoting is as much about Islam as what Bush and Blair were up to was about bringing 'freedom' to the oppressed.

20 years ago we had lads in Ireland robbing banks and shooting (Irish) policemen in the name of nationalism... guess what... many of them are now involved in the drug trade and organised crime.

People will always dress their own vested interests up in one cause or another and, unfortunately, there are gullible people who will swallow any old shit,

If this guy wasn't using religion as his excuse he'd be using something else.

EDIT: Thats not saying the Islamic community don't have a responsibility to disown their actions, and discourage their young people from buying into the bullshit... which they do, a few loud clerics aside. Likewise the rest of us have to promote acceptance and not encourage further disfranchisement of muslims, thus providing credence to the bullshit ISIS etc spew.
 
You mean the ISIS videos? Yeah I've always wondered if those blokes getting chucked off were really gay or just guilty of pissing off the wrong people. I mean I can't see an underground gay nightlife happening in Raqqa at all.
Yeah, I wouldn't be remotely surprised if it was pretty much just akin to our prior policy of calling any woman who was annoying us a witch and chucking her in a lake.

I very much doubt all those in positions of power get thrown off tall buildings if they're caught having same sex relations.