Our Right Back Position

Darmian was pretty good in Italy and for the NT for some years now, started well last season but tailed of like most of our players did. People writing him off after one season under LvG need to take a chill pill. Imagine Pogba flops this season, I imagine the same people will want him sold too. In the right environment he can be a very good FB.

Valencia will always be a failed winger who is capable of doing the bare minimum at the RB. There is nothing that screams RB to me. He is no better than when Fletcher of Hargreaves played at RB on a few occasions for us. That said, his physicality gives him an advantage given that it's the PL.

Varela is gone on loan and I expect and hope that he will do very well as an attacking FB. I can even see another good team snapping him if we mess about and ignore him. He's only 22, a late developer and fairly new to the European scene.

I don't want TFM considered as a RB. He's only played a handful of games as opposed to being more comfortable in the middle where he should be competing. If he is not going to get games in the middle, he should get some on loan rather than 10min an month at FB.

That said I think we should be ok with Darmian, Valencia and Riley given that we might be solely focused on the PL.
 
pcaming said:
We won't buy a RB until Jose gets a chance to look at Darmian in training.
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Just tell him to watch the last 25 mins of the Spurs game - it will be quicker.

(And of course a much better way to judge than a training session)
 
Raees said:
It is a myth that Darmian is a good defender. It must be because he is Italian. He has shown nothing to demonstrate he is a world class defensive right back, or even premier league quality defensive right back good enough for United. He will be sold by January imo.

Valencia is a decent backup but doesn't possess natural defensive instints and is shite at crossing the ball. Our best bet for the short term mind but we should definitely use him as a backup right back.

TFM is not a right back. He is being shoehorned there but he can't really cross a ball, he can't really dribble well close to the touchline and defensively he is fine, but the other aspects mean he just isn't right back. Furthermore I feel it is a waste of the lads potential because even if he didn't make it at United, he could be a quality midfielder somewhere else. Has far too much going for him to be wasted as a right back.
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It's also because he's shit going forward, so people assume he must be good at the defending part. Gets ripped to shreds far too often for a good defender.
 
svn said:
Valencia has played as a right back for 5 years now. I think we can consider him a "proper" right back now.
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Nope

Credit to @Minkaro for these stats:

15/16 - 23 games (all as RB)
14/15 - 35 games (24 as RB)
13/14 - 44 games (8 as RB)
12/13 - 40 games (3 as RB)
11/12 - 38 games (5 as RB)
10/11 - 20 games (0 as RB)
09/10 - 49 games 0 as RB)

Before Van Gaals first season he had only played a handfull of games there. He's 30 and only started playing regularly as a RB 18 months ago, so it's safe to say he's not really a right back.
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
Just tell him to watch the last 25 mins of the Spurs game - it will be quicker.

(And of course a much better way to judge than a training session)
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And if he does that for every player who would we have left? Extremely harsh!
 
stevoc said:
Nope

Credit to @Minkaro for these stats:

15/16 - 23 games (all as RB)
14/15 - 35 games (24 as RB)
13/14 - 44 games (8 as RB)
12/13 - 40 games (3 as RB)
11/12 - 38 games (5 as RB)
10/11 - 20 games (0 as RB)
09/10 - 49 games 0 as RB)

Before Van Gaals first season he had only played a handfull of games there. He's 30 and only started playing regularly as a RB 18 months ago, so it's safe to say he's not really a right back.
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Have you forgotten, we are Shoehorn FC! Didn't LvG also say that McNair would be our RB for the next decade?
 
Mourinho wanted to strengthen the core of the team and he has done that now. Based on media reports, he is probably looking at another midfielder, an experienced backup CB and/or a right back depending on availability and outgoing players.

Valencia+Darmian aren't the worst possible RB options, especially if Jose wants to copy his Chelsea XI model where the RB was relatively conservative while the LB was the more attacking one.

Also who cares about the right side when we have Martial+Pogba+Shaw on the left:drool:
 
dichinero said:
Have you forgotten, we are Shoehorn FC! Didn't LvG also say that McNair would be our RB for the next decade?
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Yeah we were under Van Gaal who is a loon, i'm hoping those days are now behind us.

Because the next time i see something like this from a professional football manager i think i will have a breakdown:

Mata--Lingard--Martial
--------Young
 
stevoc said:
Yeah we were under Van Gaal who is a loon, i'm hoping those days are now behind us.

Because the next time i see something like this from a professional football manager i think i will have a breakdown:

Mata--Lingard--Martial
--------Young
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I think at one point we managed to get 9 players playing out of position in a game? It was pretty impressive.
 
It might sound silly, but I feel like RB is the least important position.

I'm of the opinion that we can make do until next season then get another CB and RB, even though I've never been a major fan of Valencia there.
 
LuisNaniencia said:
I don't think it's as big a deal as people make out. Tony is underrated and offers a lot going forward and Darmian is a good defender IMO. I think the pair can share the position quite effectively depending on the opponent.

Surely the talk of Jones playing there is just because he's similar build to Ivanovic? Can't see it happening.
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This.

Leicester won the league with Danny Simpson at right back. I don't think it has to be as much of a problem area as people make it out to be.

I a good motivator with defensive nous, ala Mourinho, should be able to restore Darmian's confidence - which appears shot - and get him performing at a higher level that he's demonstrated in the past.

As I've said many times, Valencia isn't without his flaws but isn't terrible like many make him out to be. What he brings to the table is in stark contrast to Darmian. Both are flawed, but both compliment each other well as two players vying for the right back position.
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
If you know anything about Jose, you'd know that he doesn't do rotation or sharing of positions - he prefers to have the same team every game barring injuries (which he doesn't get many of)

Who was Chelsea's second choice left back after Azpilicueta? What about second choice rightback after Ivanovic?
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Baba what's his name and Felipe Luis wasn't it? Granted they never played much.
 
Glanville95 said:
This.

Leicester won the league with Danny Simpson at right back. I don't think it has to be as much of a problem area as people make it out to be.

I a good motivator with defensive nous, ala Mourinho, should be able to restore Darmian's confidence - which appears shot - and get him performing at a higher level that he's demonstrated in the past.

As I've said many times, Valencia isn't without his flaws but isn't terrible like many make him out to be. What he brings to the table is in stark contrast to Darmian. Both are flawed, but both compliment each other well as two players vying for the right back position.
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Fullbacks at United see a lot of the ball, being able to use that ball is important. I think Shaw on one side will be fine, the RB spot is still up for debate. Even if I do want Darmian to be given another shot.
 
VeevaVee said:
It might sound silly, but I feel like RB is the least important position.

I'm of the opinion that we can make do until next season then get another CB and RB, even though I've never been a major fan of Valencia there.
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In the modern game, both full back positions are incredibly vital. The better your full backs, the more dangerous you can be in the final third as your widemen can make more runs inside, especially in the modern game where inverted wingers are all the rage.

The best teams in the world have had brilliant full backs, Alba/Alves, Lahm/Alaba, Carvajal/Marcelo. Even Juanfran and Felipe Luis are bloody vital for the way Atletico play.

We can't afford to have such a mediocre right flank. It makes us much easier to defend against, and score against for that matter. It needs to be made as strong as the left. Mkhitaryan (a guy who will always drift inside) needs a Maiconesque right back on the outside to bring out the best in him. I for one would have loved someone like Piszczek from Dortmund, he'd be perfect.
 
NinjaFletch said:
I think at one point we managed to get 9 players playing out of position in a game? It was pretty impressive.
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I'm not sure but that would not surprise me one bit, and probably 9 players who could have easily been moved around into a more sensible formation. But Van Gaal.
 
I thought Darmian started great, I hope Jose can get him back on track.
I also hope we never see Valencia play fullback every again.
 
Darmain is shite. Valencia is twice the player at the very least.
 
Trigg said:
Fullbacks at United see a lot of the ball, being able to use that ball is important. I think Shaw on one side will be fine, the RB spot is still up for debate. Even if I do want Darmian to be given another shot.
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Well Valencia isn't bad in that regard. Not a player that's easy on the eye, but ball-retention is one of his fortes. He seems to use the ball sensibly.

Agreed, that's it's one of Darmian's weaknesses though.
 
NinjaFletch said:
I think at one point we managed to get 9 players playing out of position in a game? It was pretty impressive.
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Dave
Januzaj Carrick Blind Rojo
Rooney Jones
Mata Young Lingard
Fellaini​
We could field a team like that and many United fans will be used to it. Only United!:lol:

​
 
Raees said:
In the modern game, both full back positions are incredibly vital. The better your full backs, the more dangerous you can be in the final third as your widemen can make more runs inside, especially in the modern game where inverted wingers are all the rage.

The best teams in the world have had brilliant full backs, Alba/Alves, Lahm/Alaba, Carvajal/Marcelo. Even Juanfran and Felipe Luis are bloody vital for the way Atletico play.

We can't afford to have such a mediocre right flank. It makes us much easier to defend against, and score against for that matter. It needs to be made as strong as the left. Mkhitaryan (a guy who will always drift inside) needs a Maiconesque right back on the outside to bring out the best in him. I for one would have loved someone like Piszczek from Dortmund, he'd be perfect.
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I'm all for that. It would benefit both our attack and defense. I'm fairly happy to wait until next year but would also be happy to see new players coming in, specially in to positions that we've been crying out for for ages.
 
Neither Darmian or Valencia are particularly great but I'm not really seeing any other alternatives at the moment.

I'd rather give Darmian another season as I think he's better than demonstrated last season. As for Valencia, while I don't trust his positioning against the better sides, he's a good option to have when we see lots of the ball. He's strong, quick and can be a good outlet for Mkhitaryan.

Give them a season and assess the situation next summer. Perhaps there will be a standout player in the market then.
 
It's imperative for us to get a right back that can provide an attacking threat, due to the acquisition of Mkhitaryan who invariably drifts into central positions, irrespective of the position he's deployed on paper. Without an attacking RB that can exploit the spaces he leaves on the right, it would position us to be lopsided, which was prevalent for us last season, and most notably when Mata was used on the right, which had implications on the performance of Memphis. However, if Rooney wasn't predominantly included in the starting berth, something I reckon would only happen due to extenuating circumstances, then we could afford to have a RB that is more defensively sound, than Darmian and Valencia respectively. Not only would this be in correlation with Jose's previous teams, with the most recent examples being Real Madrid (Marcelo - attacking full back, Arbeloa - defensive full back) and Chelsea (Ivanovic - attacking full back, and Azpilicueta defensive full back) it would allow us to play Mkhitaryan in the hole, concurrently, having a flamboyant attacker on the right. It is the case that Barcelona with Messi and Neymar, Real Madrid with Bale and CR7, and Bayern with Ribery and Robben all have players that have tremendous individual brilliance, a trait which is arguably disproportionate with the other "top sides" e.g. Chelsea have Hazard who has that individual brilliance, but Willian doesn't. Alexis Sanchez has, but Iwobi/Chamberlain don't. Martial has, Mata/Lingaard doesn't.
 
Sparky Rhiwabon said:
If you know anything about Jose, you'd know that he doesn't do rotation or sharing of positions - he prefers to have the same team every game barring injuries (which he doesn't get many of)

Who was Chelsea's second choice left back after Azpilicueta? What about second choice rightback after Ivanovic?
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Baba Rahman, they spent £20m on him.

They didn't need a second choice right-back seeing as Azpilicueta could move over and play there if Ivanovic was out, or Zouma if worst came to worst.
 
:lol: This thread. Valencia isn't a proper right back in the same way Bastian isn't a proper centre midfielder? He is one of the best right backs in the league.

A lot of people thought buying a 'proper' right back was good but Valencia (when fit) was so much better. The same thing will happen if we buy Fabinho (I'm not saying he'll be bad, just that the comparison between him and Valencia will be much closer than you'll want to admit). Let's be honest, most of you haven't even seen Fabinho play but just want him because he is a 'proper' right back.
 
Kag said:
Neither Darmian or Valencia are particularly great but I'm not really seeing any other alternatives at the moment.

I'd rather give Darmian another season as I think he's better than demonstrated last season. As for Valencia, while I don't trust his positioning against the better sides, he's a good option to have when we see lots of the ball. He's strong, quick and can be a good outlet for Mkhitaryan.

Give them a season and assess the situation next summer. Perhaps there will be a standout player in the market then.
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I tend to agree. I think Darmian's confidence was shot to pieces under van Gaal and still think he could develop into a good defender eventually - there was a time where he showed a lot of promise.

I really don't think it'd be disastrous if we didn't sign a RB this window. Until now, only Fabinho has been mooted and I'm not sure he'd be a shoo-in for success here either. It might be worth tracking the progress of someone like Cancelo from Valencia for another year instead.
 
I have fairly high hopes for Darmain under Jose... a lot of players struggle in their first season in the PL and yes at times he did struggle but equally at times he looked decent - if nothing else his versatility of being able to cover both full back berths is helpful but I'd feel ok going into the new season with him as right back
 
Sigma said:
:lol: This thread. Valencia isn't a proper right back in the same way Bastian isn't a proper centre midfielder? He is one of the best right backs in the league.

A lot of people thought buying a 'proper' right back was good but Valencia (when fit) was so much better. The same thing will happen if we buy Fabinho (I'm not saying he'll be bad, just that the comparison between him and Valencia will be much closer than you'll want to admit). Let's be honest, most of you haven't even seen Fabinho play but just want him because he is a 'proper' right back.
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To back up my point:

xCpwCKJ.png


The posts on here are even more laughable now :lol:
 
Sigma said:
:lol: This thread. Valencia isn't a proper right back in the same way Bastian isn't a proper centre midfielder? He is one of the best right backs in the league.

A lot of people thought buying a 'proper' right back was good but Valencia (when fit) was so much better. The same thing will happen if we buy Fabinho (I'm not saying he'll be bad, just that the comparison between him and Valencia will be much closer than you'll want to admit). Let's be honest, most of you haven't even seen Fabinho play but just want him because he is a 'proper' right back.
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Exactly this. Most folks just want Valencia to be replaced by an actual RB without even considering how good the available replacements are( there aren't many good RBs in the market currently who can outperform Valencia). It's the same desperation shown by those folks when they rate Darmian (who is supposed to be a proper RB but is simply shit) above Valencia who easily outperforms him. I don't think Fabinho is much of an upgrade either, and it's very likely Valencia puts him on the bench too.
 
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