Paul Pogba | Undergoing Medical | Helping out the Laundry Ladies

Do you want Pogba for £100 million?

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Rado_N said:
Reasonable concern, but he'll probably only miss a couple of games (including the charity shield) so it shouldn't be too much of a drag.
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See I don't buy this argument at all. People talk about early matches as if the points are worth less come May or something. If we fail to beat Bournemouth and then miss out on the title / top 4 by a point or two, then that result is just as much the reason as any other.

It amazes me that while other sports are getting fully into the idea of marginal gains, in football we still don't seem to value such a major and tangible advantage as 3 points. Everybody just seems to have this blasé attitude of "oh, it's only one match".
 
Sir A1ex said:
See I don't buy this argument at all. People talk about early matches as if the points are worth less come May or something. If we fail to beat Bournemouth and then miss out on the title / top 4 by a point or two, then that result is just as much the reason as any other.

It amazes me that while other sports are getting fully into the idea of marginal gains, in football we still don't seem to value such a major and tangible advantage as 3 points. Everybody just seems to have this blasé attitude of "oh, it's only one match".
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No that wasn't my point, I agree entirely with what you're saying here in that every game is equally important, I'm just saying that in the scheme of things I'd rather he miss one or two games at the start of the season in order to have a proper break than come back early and end up suffering with fatigue later in the season and potentially either missing more games or being no use.
 
Sir A1ex said:
See I don't buy this argument at all. People talk about early matches as if the points are worth less come May or something. If we fail to beat Bournemouth and then miss out on the title / top 4 by a point or two, then that result is just as much the reason as any other.

It amazes me that while other sports are getting fully into the idea of marginal gains, in football we still don't seem to value such a major and tangible advantage as 3 points. Everybody just seems to have this blasé attitude of "oh, it's only one match".
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It's not that simple though, is it? Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.
Dropping points at Bournemouth isn't more or less significant to us losing the title by a point or two, considering there will be x amount of games we won/lost/draw throughout the league as well as x games our rivals win/lose/draw too.
 
Kaos said:
So the Telegraph were chatting absolute breeze then yesterday :rolleyes:

Sports Journalism is such a joke.
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Yeah.

Let's see if Sky Sources were right about him being in Manchester tomorrow.

I was labelled an attention seeker because I said it was more than likely BS...
 
Rozay said:
Well your supporting arguments, or forwarded rationale, was nonsense or at the very least, without logic.
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I've consistently put forward the 'logical' argument; he is not the type of midfielder we need. That is the logical argument. You don't have to agree with it.
 
Rory 7 said:
How is that shifting any goalposts? WTF? Shifting the goalposts :lol:.

If anything I've been more consistent in this thread than anyone. Consistent in arguing against the Pogba transfer.
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You've gone from saying Mkhi is a punt as opposed to an injury ravaged Gundogan and a raw Sane to saying who will be worth more in 3 years time.

That is shifting goalposts.
 
VanGaalEra said:
You've gone from saying Mkhi is a punt as opposed to an injury ravaged Gundogan and a raw Sane to saying who will be worth more in 3 years time.

That is shifting goalposts.
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Wrong again.

I've gone from saying Zlatan, Bailly and Mhki PLUS Gundongan, Sane & Kante combined would have been better business than signing Paul Pogba.

As opposed to siging Zlatan (free), Bailly (potential) and Mhki (IMO a bit of a puntish signing) PLUS Paul Pogba.

That is what I said. But of course to dismiss my anti-Pogba position you guys have to pick up on ONE word "Punt".

You're all punts. (or cnuts)
 
I don't think many people would say that Pogba is actually worth that much money. He's worth a lot, but not that much. The point is that this purchase is a pure expression of muppet mania. We're all muppets now.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
No need to be patronising. I get it. You think the Pogba money could have been better spent. I don't disagree because I think Kante is a terrific player. Pogba's a couple of years younger and obviously bought because Mou thinks he can kick on another level, to become a potential Ballon D'Or winner. II don't think that's out of the question. He's always seemed like not quite the finished article and is performing at a very high level with obvious room for improvement in a lot of elements of his game. I don't see the same potential in Kante. Hence I'm happy with our business.
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There's every need to be patronising mate. When you're being accused of talking 'nonsense' by the muppet brigade I've every right to be patronising.

That's fair enough if you're happy with our business. Personally I think the Pogba money could be better spent.
 
Rory 7 said:
Miki is a punt. In the same way as any signing is a punt. He's probably less of a punt that Gundongan, for example but his signing has less potential upside than Sane. The only reason I even mentioned Miki was to point out how we spent our budget versus the other options out there. To put it another way, for the clearly very very slow on the uptake. Answer me this question, which would be the better use of our transfer spend this summer:

A: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki & Pogba
B: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane & Kante
C: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane & Gundongan

And, potentially, seeing as money is no object at United

D: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane, Kante & Gundongan


I hate to have to point out the bleeding obvious but there you all are...
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D obviously is the best choice out of the lot. But A is the best out of the first 3 imo. But this list is somewhat absurd in that, even after all the spending, United could still spend more if needed. So if United wanted to move for Sane, they could have. So when you say Pogba costs £100m, so we could have got x, y and z for the same amount, you have to understand that Pogba was the last major piece in the puzzle for Mourinho and United had already strengthened in the areas your replacement players play. So ultimately, Mourinho feels spending larger on one player is better than spending smaller on more players that aren't quite of the same quality. Fair enough if you feel that was the wrong way about it, but LVG went for the latter shotgun type approach in focusing in quantity, rather than quality (ofc saying that Gundogan and co aren't the same quality as Rojo).
 
Rory 7 said:
A: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki & Pogba
B: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane & Kante
C: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane & Gundongan

And, potentially, seeing as money is no object at United

D: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane, Kante & Gundongan


I hate to have to point out the bleeding obvious but there you all are...
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A for sure.

Gundongen is another Hargreaves waiting to happen and Sane has potential only, as Memphis did last season.

Signing the Bundesliga PoTY + Pogba, Zlatan & Bailey is much "smarter". You have much more guarantee of success with option A.
 
Seriously... drop the city player comparison. They're playing for our rivals and ain't coming, if they weren't city players we might not have been interested anyway.

Yeah we're paying a lot. But it's like comparing to other stuff where cost/performance isn't linear.

If you pay 100 for something and 200 for another thing you don't get twice the performance. But it's a better performing thing and if you want it you're paying premium money...
 
£100m is a lot but Im happy we are getting a world class player so feck it. Simple as that really.

I don't know why Rory see's the need to compare money spent with City, Gunbdogan is a complete liability with his injury record and Sane could go either way just look how hyped Memphis was last summer, the Premier League is a completely different game to what he's used too.
 
Rory 7 said:
Wrong again.

I've gone from saying Zlatan, Bailly and Mhki PLUS Gundongan, Sane & Kante combined would have been better business than signing Paul Pogba.

As opposed to siging Zlatan (free), Bailly (potential) and Mhki (IMO a bit of a puntish signing) PLUS Paul Pogba.

That is what I said. But of course to dismiss my anti-Pogba position you guys have to pick up on ONE word "Punt".

You're all punts. (or cnuts)
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Those three players would not be available for the same money as Pogba is costing.

That's without even getting in to the wage differential.
 
Rory 7 said:
There's every need to be patronising mate. When you're being accused of talking 'nonsense' by the muppet brigade I've every right to be patronising.

That's fair enough if you're happy with our business. Personally I think the Pogba money could be better spent.
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Fair enough. It's a crazy sum of money on a player who isn't yet at a level to justify that spending. I'd say Woodward's arse will be clenched for a good while yet. I haven't watched many Juve games so my opinion is mainly based on Pogba at United, when I thought he had the most potential of any kid I've ever seen at the club (apart from, maybe, Morrison - the eejit) and he seems to be doing what it takes to fulfil that promise. Which isn't always the case. So I'm delighted he's back. Other opinions are available.
 
United Pro said:
D obviously is the best choice out of the lot. But A is the best out of the first 3 imo. But this list is somewhat absurd in that, even after all the spending, United could still spend more if needed. So if United wanted to move for Sane, they could have. So when you say Pogba costs £100m, so we could have got x, y and z for the same amount, you have to understand that Pogba was the last major piece in the puzzle for Mourinho and United had already strengthened in the areas your replacement players play. So ultimately, Mourinho feels spending larger on one player is better than spending smaller on more players that aren't quite of the same quality. Fair enough if you feel that was the wrong way about it, but LVG went for the latter shotgun type approach in focusing in quantity, rather than quality (ofc saying that Gundogan and co aren't the same quality as Rojo).
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Which is the nub of this whole argument. And essentially boils down to how good you think Pogba is, I don't think he's that good.
 
Sky1981 said:
I don't think Ed is that stupid, if there's no deal he would have gone out and squash the rumors (directly or indirectly). There's no way we let them sucker punch us like that, and it's not even sucker punch.
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Still, all PR is by some considered good PR. And there is no way around it, this saga has genereted a lot of hype around United. It wouldn't be any surprise that Woodie wants us to be viewed as able to make a world record transfer. It is fitting with the move towards a galactico-style club profile.

That being said i'd be very surprised if its all smoke and mirrors...
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Fair enough. It's a crazy sum of money on a player who isn't yet at a level to justify that spending. I'd say Woodward's arse will be clenched for a good while yet. I haven't watched many Juve games so my opinion is mainly based on Pogba at United, when I thought he had the most potential of any kid I've ever seen at the club (apart from, maybe, Morrison - the eejit) and he seems to be doing what it takes to fulfil that promise. Which isn't always the case. So I'm delighted he's back. Other opinions are available.
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That's refreshing!
 
United Pro said:
D obviously is the best choice out of the lot. But A is the best out of the first 3 imo. But this list is somewhat absurd in that, even after all the spending, United could still spend more if needed. So if United wanted to move for Sane, they could have. So when you say Pogba costs £100m, so we could have got x, y and z for the same amount, you have to understand that Pogba was the last major piece in the puzzle for Mourinho and United had already strengthened in the areas your replacement players play. So ultimately, Mourinho feels spending larger on one player is better than spending smaller on more players that aren't quite of the same quality. Fair enough if you feel that was the wrong way about it, but LVG went for the latter shotgun type approach in focusing in quantity, rather than quality (ofc saying that Gundogan and co aren't the same quality as Rojo).
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Agree, Pogba, Ibrahimovic and potentially Bailey are leaders on the pitch, we need that more than just the talent. We have become a bit of a soft touch lately, we need guys who can equally rough it up and pull something out of the blue when needed, mikhitarian can contribute to the latter.

We have enough potential in RashFord, Martial and Depay.
 
Rory 7 said:
Miki is a punt. In the same way as any signing is a punt. He's probably less of a punt that Gundongan, for example but his signing has less potential upside than Sane. The only reason I even mentioned Miki was to point out how we spent our budget versus the other options out there. To put it another way, for the clearly very very slow on the uptake. Answer me this question, which would be the better use of our transfer spend this summer:

A: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki & Pogba
B: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane & Kante
C: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane & Gundongan

And, potentially, seeing as money is no object at United

D: Zlatan, Bailly, Mhki, Sane, Kante & Gundongan


I hate to have to point out the bleeding obvious but there you all are...
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There is no guarantee that Sane, Gundogan or Kante would have joined us even if we had bid for them. But just for the sake of the argument, I would still choose A. Here are my reasons. I would not want us to sign Sane for 37m because we have already signed a better player who plays in that exact same position and has outperformed him in the same league. Frankly, I just don't rate Sane that highly. Gundogan would have been a wonderful player if had not suffered such serious injuries in the last few years. Even if he completely recovers from injury, I don't think he is better than Pogba who is younger and has a much higher potential. Kante is possibly the only player I would have liked us to sign. But our team needs a creative player like Pogba more than a player like Kante. If we could sign both, then yes. Otherwise, I would always choose Pogba over Kante.
 
Rory 7 said:
In summary I have a very clear and consistent point. WE SHOULDN'T SIGN PAUL POGBA.
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The question is why?

- The player is not good enough
- We do not have that kind of money
- The player is good, but will never be better
- There are better players in that position on the cheap, willing to be here
- The player is an ex-Utd outcast
- The player is arrogant, crazy and pompous

Please feel free to select multiple points from above or add your own reason.
 
Rado_N said:
No that wasn't my point, I agree entirely with what you're saying here in that every game is equally important, I'm just saying that in the scheme of things I'd rather he miss one or two games at the start of the season in order to have a proper break than come back early and end up suffering with fatigue later in the season and potentially either missing more games or being no use.
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I think the argument is the same both ways. 3 points in the beginning of the season are the same as 3 points at the end of the season (Charity shield is not included obviously). In summary, you are both right.
 
Regulus Arcturus Black said:
A for sure.

Gundongen is another Hargreaves waiting to happen and Sane has potential only, as Memphis did last season.

Signing the Bundesliga PoTY + Pogba, Zlatan & Bailey is much "smarter". You have much more guarantee of success with option A.
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You see that's the fallacy of the muppet (not necessarily calling you a muppet), this is idea of 'guaranteed' success. This idea that there is no risk in transfer.
One could argue that 100m for Pogba is the biggest 'punt' of them all.
 
Rory 7 said:
Wrong again.

I've gone from saying Zlatan, Bailly and Mhki PLUS Gundongan, Sane & Kante combined would have been better business than signing Paul Pogba.

As opposed to siging Zlatan (free), Bailly (potential) and Mhki (IMO a bit of a puntish signing) PLUS Paul Pogba.

That is what I said. But of course to dismiss my anti-Pogba position you guys have to pick up on ONE word "Punt".

You're all punts. (or cnuts)
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I wasn't talking about your stance on Pogba, saying 100M is too much for a player is fair IMO.

It was how you glorified Gundogan and Sane and put down Mkhi that I picked up on.
 
RedDevil@84 said:
The question is why?

- The player is not good enough
- We do not have that kind of money
- The player is good, but will never be better
- There are better players in that position on the cheap, willing to be here
- The player is an ex-Utd outcast
- The player is arrogant, crazy and pompous

Please feel free to select multiple points from above or add your own reason.
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Do I have to? Again? I've gone over and over this. My main reason is I don't like this style (footballing style) of midfielder. I'd prefer a more dynamic pacier all action midfielder than Pogba.
 
RedDevil@84 said:
The question is why?

- The player is not good enough
- We do not have that kind of money
- The player is good, but will never be better
- There are better players in that position on the cheap, willing to be here
- The player is an ex-Utd outcast
- The player is arrogant, crazy and pompous

Please feel free to select multiple points from above or add your own reason.
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I asked him before. The key point is he doesn't like his hairstyle.
 
Rory 7 said:
And as I asked earlier on. What if two of them had been available for the total cost of Pogba, including wages?
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What if the Earth was flat? What if we could sign Messi on a free? Equally pointless hypotheticals.

The minute we join a bidding war with City/Chelsea over a player the transfer fee rockets and there's no way you're getting any two of those players for combined wages of equal to or less than Pogba will be getting.
 
Rory 7 said:
Wrong again.

I've gone from saying Zlatan, Bailly and Mhki PLUS Gundongan, Sane & Kante combined would have been better business than signing Paul Pogba.

As opposed to siging Zlatan (free), Bailly (potential) and Mhki (IMO a bit of a puntish signing) PLUS Paul Pogba.

That is what I said. But of course to dismiss my anti-Pogba position you guys have to pick up on ONE word "Punt".

You're all punts. (or cnuts)
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In your opinion, who can we get with that amount of money? Who is better suited to us?
 
SammyUnited_83 said:
Rio doesn't seem to think it is a done deal.

Before I get hounded with 'how would Rio know', well he smiled when someone said Pogba's name and people on here took that as it was done.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...ve-adverse-effect-mentally-says-a7172446.html
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It makes sense that it's not a done deal. This idea that it's all done and we're waiting for the optimal day to make a big announcement makes no sense at all. Juve couldn't give a shite about what adidas or our PR team think. They'll announce the sale whenever they want. Just like Dortmund beat us to the punch with Mkitaryan. This ongoing delay is clearly because there are still negotiations ongoing. It has to be.
 
VanGaalEra said:
I wasn't talking about your stance on Pogba, saying 100M is too much for a player is fair IMO.

It was how you glorified Gundogan and Sane and put down Mkhi that I picked up on.
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I didn't 'glorify' them. I compared the three signings Gundgona, Sane and Kante to the one signing Pogba.

And I didn't 'put down' Mkhi. Calling him a 'bit of a punt' isn't a put down. Again, without de-railing the thread, I see Mhki as a bit of a punt in the sense that he is a 27 year old player who we probably won't sell on at a profit (so its a sunk cost from day one) and who really has only had one breakout season in Germany. I see Mhki as being a bit like Payet, now there is a 'punt' that worked out great. But I just hope he doesn't work out like Kagawa.
 
boxykronikle said:
In your opinion, who can we get with that amount of money? Who is better suited to us?
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I've consistently said I'd prefer someone like Kroos in midfield than Pogba. Again this thing of 'who can we get' with the money is what gets me. Sure we can throw money at Juve for Pogba but jsut because they accept doesn't mean he's the best option. Obviously Jose thinks he is. All I'm saying is I don't like Pogba's style and don't think I'd enjoy watching him as much as other players.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
It makes sense that it's not a done deal. This idea that it's all done and we're waiting for the optimal day to make a big announcement makes no sense at all. Juve couldn't give a shite about what adidas or our PR team think. They'll announce the sale whenever they want. Just like Dortmund beat us to the punch with Mkitaryan. This ongoing delay is clearly because there are still negotiations ongoing. It has to be.
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Or that there are formalities left to be completed, like newspapers are claiming. Although I have never heard formalities taking this much time!
 
Rory 7 said:
I didn't 'glorify' them. I compared the three signings Gundgona, Sane and Kante to the one signing Pogba.

And I didn't 'put down' Mkhi. Calling him a 'bit of a punt' isn't a put down. Again, without de-railing the thread, I see Mhki as a bit of a punt in the sense that he is a 27 year old player who we probably won't sell on at a profit (so its a sunk cost from day one) and who really has only had one breakout season in Germany. I see Mhki as being a bit like Payet, now there is a 'punt' that worked out great. But I just hope he doesn't work out like Kagawa.
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Each transfer can be called a punt, nothing is a sure thing in football. Gundogan with his injury record could be called a punt, as could Sane because he's so young.
 
Rado_N said:
What if the Earth was flat? What if we could sign Messi on a free? Equally pointless hypotheticals.

The minute we join a bidding war with City/Chelsea over a player the transfer fee rockets and there's no way you're getting any two of those players for combined wages of equal to or less than Pogba will be getting.
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Maybe. It is hypothetical. As are most discussions on here. Not sure why I'm so out of step by talking hypothetically.
 
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