Not many people are going to admit to being racists so thats no surprise
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Not many people are going to admit to being racists so thats no surprise
The same is going to happen in the US, people calling trump supporters every name under the sun, we're going to see alot of votes for trump from people that we wouldn't have thought would vote that way.
What influenced the people that voted remain?
So despite statistical evidence suggesting that immigration wasn't their primary concern, you'd sooner trust your amazing psychic ability to read the minds and intentions of a massive group of people?
If so then it doesn't surprise me that leavers ignored any actual fact based arguments you presented.
I belive your basing your statement on the Ashceoft poll, and yes I do trust my reading better, based mostly on the governments response, they'll sacrifice everything for migration controls in the negotiations to come, they'll have done their polling and know what will win votes
Mixture of things. They believed Remain offered continuity, stability, economic security, and that it was a rejection of the rhetoric on immigration from UKIP and the more right-wing of the Tories.
February 1985 , but by June 1985 it was back above the level it is now and continued to climb. Not confident that the pound will improve like that again.
On the Euro front (that currency that's about to collapse) another 4.5 cents drop and it will be an all time record low
So, are you saying that they switched up their policy agenda later in campaigning, or that immigration was used to the exclusion of all else? It cannot be both.
I don't believe that even your quoted statement of mine supports that claim. Real classy of you by the way there Fletch, leaving out my response which included an official Vote Leave video using the £100m figure. Moreover, i can't recall that giving 350m solely to the NHS was a line i used excessively.
Perhaps when you have time, you can highlight other examples of my consistent lying throughout the discussion.
Out of interest, did you stand loyal to and support all that Cameron/Osborne said on your behalf as a Remainer?
Yes i have complained at times, but then a small number of Leave posters had no choice but to accept a rather unsavoury debate. here Irrespective of the referendum's outcome, it was one of the least enjoyable threads i have been a participant of in thirteen years on the Caf.
Based off any polls I saw then or now. I'd love to see one that even comes close to suggesting that immigration was the primary driver for 90% of the leave voters.
The move to dismiss the leave voters entirely is actually part of the problem as it prevents any discussion around the greater underlying issues.
Why is there a longstanding streak of Euroscepticism in the UK? Why do people fail to recognise what issues are actually the fault of the EU and which aren't? Why is there a rather unpleasant streak of nationalism in the UK? Why is the UK so divided geographically? Why do so many elderly people feel out of touch with the modern UK? Why do pockets of the UK feel so isolated and alienated from the rest? Why have some areas been so left behind economically? Why do some people link economic difficulties they experience to immigration and fail to link the economic support they receive to the EU? Why are there such concerns around the levels of immigration in the UK? Why is there a mistrust of mainstream political parties and the political establishment? Could more have been done to check the capacity of politicians to make decisions based on their own self interest? Why were the Tories elected in the first place?
These are all issues that were building long before the Brexit campaign was fought. You then have to examine the campaign itself. Did the Remain campaign really perform as well as it should have? If not, why not? Why didn't their economy based arguments resonate as much as they should have? Did remain supporters actually engage with the opposition or just dismiss them out of hand? Why wasn't there a greater turnout of younger voters?
The questions go on and on and on. "They're all racist" is a pretty crap answer, I think.
Not just about racism, is it?
The absence of clear and interesting exit plan and the contentment with the current relationship between the UK and the continent are probably the main reasons.
Agree with most of what you say but the Referendum was about the EU not how crap the UK governments have been - by voting Leave the points they were most concerned about have now probably been further aggravated
The Leave campaign couldn't spend a penny and everyone knew that. The Leave campaign were a group of people supporting leaving the EU, they weren't the government. As everyone is aware, only the government can spend the government's money. The point behind the "let's give" campaign was to show people the money could be better spent on the UK instead of giving it all to the EU. Which of course it can, can't it.
I said almost to the exclusion of all else
But what brought it down? You see we cant blame everything on a vote result but thats going to happen for the next x years. EUtopia is a rotten place full of pms that are poisonous and it disgusts me.
Contentment of trading with a flat economy while adopting its neo liberal policies. fun.
Like sticking with a boring job cos its easy and pays the rent.
You mean what's bringing it down now, it's the lack of confidence in the UK economy, uncertainty and when the dreadful deed hits this could only be the start.
If both the FTSE and the currency start sliding at the same time , hold on!!
We all know the EU is far from perfect but it is not the demon some make it out to be either.
I consider myself to live in France which is part of the EU.
I don't consider myself as living in the EU and happen to find myself in France.
You seem to have suffered a bad experience in Holland , is it because of the EU or because of the Dutch government - but Holland for me is a foreign country and I don't know what it is like to live there, despite having been there dozens of times.
France has a lot of faults as well but not because of the EU, but this is where I want to live.
Every country within the EU is different
You really think that the City is going to stop its neo liberal agenda lobbying when the UK are out of the EU? And you think that the EU controls your economy?
Thought I'd save the embarrassment of bringing up that sorry argument again when the Vote Leave twitter still displays the figure you stated that Vote Leave 'allegedly' said.
Besides, I never accused you of being a liar nor of standing 'loyally' in support of the Leave campaign I accused you of being a hypocrite and moaning about others doing what you have yourself done. Just like how you moaned about others 'politicising the murder of Jo Cox' whilst posting UKIP created propaganda in the same thread. Or how you complained, and still are complaining, about how 'irrespective of the referendum's outcome, it was one of the least enjoyable threads [you] have been a participant of in thirteen years on the Caf' despite 'freely admitting' you had been a 'tad acerbic at times and sarcastic at others' (and the exchange there was kicked off by a sarcastic comment you made).
Its one thing taking a holier than thou stance if you genuinely are rising above it and being holier than thou but you haven't done that. You were just as culpable for the unsavoury debate as anyone else, but yet, bizarrely, try and act like you aren't and weren't. You're trying to have your cake and eat it too which, ironically, is a general criticism of Leave voters.
My mrs is dutch and she hopes Holland leave the EUtopia. Lol
The pound is plummeting.....and the Euro may not be far behind.
Isn't this the central argument of leave. Get rid of the things you think you don't like, keep what you do and and pay for none of it?
If the pound falls much lower the Spanish will be buying holiday homes in Blackpool
So in her speech May was bragging about Britain being the world's 5th strongest economy. By the end of the day it had slipped to 6th.
Haven't we now slipped to 7th?
handy guide (courtesy of HSBC)
Lots of good points. The UK has an island mentailty - not surprising, but telling I think. I also wonder how much the idea of change is at play here and by that I mean I think a lot of people in the UK don't feel like voting in the Tories or Labour seems to bring about the change they hope(d) for whereas the Brexit absolutely will (bring about a change albeit perhaps not the one they hope for!).
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/oct/07/europe-hard-brexit-hurt-british-trade-deal
Its pretty much what I've been saying all along.
Its pretty much what I've been saying all along.
Heresy
Great victim mentality.The £ has fallen 22.5% against the € since November.
The country better be prepared for a new round of migration will be the UK pensioners who can no longer afford to live in Euro based countries.
Still at least they won't be a massive strain on the NHS.
The country better be prepared for a new round of migration will be the UK pensioners who can no longer afford to live in Euro based countries.
Still at least they won't be a massive strain on the NHS.
Just seen the exrate 
Even worse than predicted - €1.106/£1 and still at least months away from even triggering Article 50 let alone leaving.
Hope of parity after leaving looking too optimistic for the UK at the moment
Even worse than predicted - €1.106/£1 and still at least months away from even triggering Article 50 let alone leaving.
Hope of parity after leaving looking too optimistic for the UK at the moment
The thing I don't understand is that Hollande didn't say anything special. He basically said that the UK won't be pampered which isn't exactly a new revelation since that's how the EU have always acted, just look at the TTIP.
So they've now decided that no non-british economic experts will be allowed to advise the goverment on matters related to Brexit.
How the feck did we end up with this sorry state of a goverment.
How the feck did we end up with this sorry state of a goverment.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/oct/07/lse-brexit-non-uk-experts-foreign-academics
I hope the EU does the same and bar the UK from every research they do. Can you imagine if all research done by British Universities and all British education as a whole ends up non EU complaint?
I hope the EU does the same and bar the UK from every research they do. Can you imagine if all research done by British Universities and all British education as a whole ends up non EU complaint?
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For selfish reasons this is great! I live on the border to Derry so I can walk the streets feeling like the short, monocle laden man from Monopoly with my pockets full of Euros.
Edit: wow it didn't take much for Britain to turn into Trumps vision of heaven. If he was able to run for PM he would have a fantastic shot of being voted in.
Edit: wow it didn't take much for Britain to turn into Trumps vision of heaven. If he was able to run for PM he would have a fantastic shot of being voted in.