Of course there is some connection, but one gets the impression that all laws are concocted by the EU and nothing is decided by each nation's government, you and I both know it's bs
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
Of course there is some connection, but one gets the impression that all laws are concocted by the EU and nothing is decided by each nation's government, you and I both know it's bs
I am a bit lost about Gibraltar. For what I understood there is point in the conditions for which Gibraltar won't get any special treatment after the Brexit.
That special treatment should be signed later between Spain and UK.
The spanish press writes that for once we have a strong position to negociate a possible co-sovereignty.
I think that they won't close the gate,too complicate for the "llanitos" going to their residence in Spain and a mess for the spanish workers going to Gibraltar.
That special treatment should be signed later between Spain and UK.
The spanish press writes that for once we have a strong position to negociate a possible co-sovereignty.
I think that they won't close the gate,too complicate for the "llanitos" going to their residence in Spain and a mess for the spanish workers going to Gibraltar.
You can ignore the first part of my post if you want, oh wait.....
Well if EU stayed as an economic bloc and not political then I believe EU would survive but I can see another countries leaving soon after U.K. The idea of EU was great until the politicians saw an EU government means jobs for them and their friends.
Yes but some of the bewildering things they've discussed are not worth your money and you are happy to pay that.
If you believe eu budget surpless policy was concocted by someone outside the eu then tell me so
If you believe the eu were not prepared to fine countries 1bn euros for not meeting expected surpluses or deficits then show me
These were eu ideas not somalian or anywhere else
Let me see Stan, what has the EU done for you? Mmm.. like giving you the opportunity to work & live in the Netherlands?
Anyway, surely this thread should not be about the EU, but ratherabout Brexit and the bunch of lies we are still being sold, now by the government?
I was talking about unemployment, but whether I agree with all EU policy is highly unlikely , I shouldn't think anyone anywhere agrees 100% with any organisation or government, and if they say they do they're lying. It's a balance and they're are far more things I like about the EU than being outside it.
The few hundred pounds it may cost me a year I have no complaints about.
It would no doubt cost me much more if we weren't in it.
Hope the Brexiteers realise this. Wonder how many of them actually pay anything, that'd be interesting to find out.
The same as it has for my colleagues from serbia, israel, china,.khasakstan, russia,.Algeria, tunisia and Ghana
Quoted wrong post of yours, cnut, your fault
Well tackling unemployment was one of the eu's big things. Explain to me what they have done or what they have asked member states to do.
Unfortunately, 52% of people in the UK chose to believe the lies of Farrage and Johnson rather than the 48% who chose to believe the lies of Cameron and Osborne.
And both the UK Government and the EU are now telling lies - everything has just moved up to the next level of liers.
And you guys need to remember that there are plenty of people in Euope who are just as worried about will happen to their jobs and taxes if they can't export Tariff Free to the UK. This isn't a one way street - it's only the politicians who will have you believe it's a one way street.
Anyway, what is interesting, is that the Knuckleheads in Brussels / Luxemburg / Strasbourg have said that any differences during the negotiations must be settled by the ECJ. They seem to have forgotten that after 30.03.2019, the ECJ will have been written out of the UK's legislation and will have no precedence in UK Law. Any ECJ judgements, therefore, can be simply ignored by the UK without breaking any international laws, only EU laws. But as the UK will no longer be in the EU, etc.....
And you think it's only the UK that has idiots for politicians.
The recommendations were as follows:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32016H0220(01)&qid=1456753373365
Which brings me back to the point of individual nations
But they're recommendations.
I'd have thought that an organisation which takes the design of cigarette packets so seriously that it imposes legislation on each member for that might have realised the importance and found the time to impose legislation on its members NOT to have 20%+ unemployment rates.
It's not quite the same thing.
One minute the EU is supposed to impose so many regulations on countries that they are hamstrung, next minute they don't impose enough regulations, which is it?
As far as I'm aware France have indeed implemented those recommendations.
Impose as few or as many regulations as they want - it's their train set.
It's a question of importance - the EU appears to have a different mindset to the average EU man in the street. Ask the unemployed in Greece, in Portugal, in Spain which is the most important - design of cigarette packets or a job ?
The thing about France - don't understand, so again please.
Given how much money England's football makes do you think they'll provide exceptions for it? I don't see it happening because then everyone would be calling for exceptions. Could hurt the sporting culture.
How are the EU supposed to create jobs, the individual nations have to change their policies - we are not the United States of Europe but a union of nations.
In my earlier post today I outlined what I believe would enhance the chances of more employment in France and as I also said I don't know the policies of individual nations like Greece, Portugal or Spain, do you?
What don't you understand about what I said about France?
You are separating things to suit your argument.
If the eu don't force rules then stop paying them to think of ceilings and floors
If they do enforce laws then they are shit at it. I know they dont.
It all adds up to an entity that is a waste of money.
Agree with you about unemployment in France - and I'd lay it firmly at the door of the unions, who block every attempt to change Labour Laws to make it more attractive for employers to hire employees. Remember this ?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ory-country-stupid-labour-laws-communist.html
As for other countries - I'm like you. I don't know the laws in each individual country. But I'll give you an example that I do know of.
In Italy, major Logistics companies with big warehouses employing hundreds or thousands of people, hire their employees from the unions - not the temping agencies like Blue Arrow, Adecco and Ranstad as they do in the UK and down here. To me, it's so obvious that is a great idea. Unions and Employers working together to provide jobs. Why don't FO or CGT do that instead of non-stop confrontation ?
OK...I understand now. I thought you might have been talking about cigarette packets.
Yes, as far as I'm aware, the French Government are ' in the process of implementing ' the EU Recommendations, whatever that means.
Doesn't seem to be working yet, though, does it ? Maybe legislation would be more effective, but then again, quite a few countries in the EU have form when it comes to ignoring EU legislation if it doesn't suit them or they simply can't do it - France being one of them.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ory-country-stupid-labour-laws-communist.html
As for other countries - I'm like you. I don't know the laws in each individual country. But I'll give you an example that I do know of.
In Italy, major Logistics companies with big warehouses employing hundreds or thousands of people, hire their employees from the unions - not the temping agencies like Blue Arrow, Adecco and Ranstad as they do in the UK and down here. To me, it's so obvious that is a great idea. Unions and Employers working together to provide jobs. Why don't FO or CGT do that instead of non-stop confrontation ?
OK...I understand now. I thought you might have been talking about cigarette packets.
Yes, as far as I'm aware, the French Government are ' in the process of implementing ' the EU Recommendations, whatever that means.
Doesn't seem to be working yet, though, does it ? Maybe legislation would be more effective, but then again, quite a few countries in the EU have form when it comes to ignoring EU legislation if it doesn't suit them or they simply can't do it - France being one of them.
I've never quite understood the 'NHS will fall apart without immigrants' argument.
Just guarantee visas, residence, nationality, whichever it takes according to need, the UK need that is.
Sorted.
Just guarantee visas, residence, nationality, whichever it takes according to need, the UK need that is.
Sorted.
Ah...But EU money wasted by one person is easy money earned by another person. And you guys in the UK wouldn't even have to come over here to get it.
Secretary of State,
Dept. for the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (DEFRA),
Nobel House,
17, Smith Square,
London SW1P 3JR.
16 May 2013.
Dear Secretary of State,
A friend, who is in farming at the moment, has recently received a cheque for £3,000 from the Rural Payments Agency for not rearing pigs and I would like to join the ‘not rearing pigs’ business.
In your opinion, what is the best kind of farm not to rear pigs on, and which is the best breed of pig not to rear? I want to be sure I approach this endeavour in keeping with all government policies, as dictated by the EU under the Common Agricultural Policy. I would prefer not to rear bacon pigs, but if this not the type you want not rearing, I will just as gladly not rear porkers. Are there any advantages in not rearing rare breeds such as Saddlebacks or Gloucester Old Spots, or are there too many farmers not rearing these already?
As I see it, the hardest part of this programme will be keeping an accurate record of just how many pigs I haven’t reared. Are there any EU or Government or Local Authority courses on this?
My friend is very satisfied with this business. He has been rearing pigs for forty years or so, and the best annual return he ever made on them was £1,422 in 1978; that is, until this year, when he received your cheque for £3,000 for not rearing any.
If I were to get £3,000 for not rearing fifty pigs, will I be entitled to £6,000 for not rearing a hundred? I plan to operate on a small scale at first, holding myself down to about 4,000 pigs not raised, which will mean about £240,000 for the first year. However, as I become more expert in not rearing pigs, I plan to be more ambitious, perhaps increasing to, say, 40,000 pigs not reared in my second year, for which I should expect about £2.4 million from your department.
Incidentally, I wonder if I would be eligible to receive EU tradable carbon credits for all these pigs not producing harmful and polluting methane gases?
Another point: these pigs that I plan not to rear will not eat 2,000 tonnes of cereals. I understand that the EU also pay farmers not to grow crops, so will I qualify for set-aside payments for not growing cereals in order not to feed the pigs I don’t rear?
In order to diversify, I am also considering the ‘not milking cows’ business, so please send any information leaflets you have on that too, please. Would you also include the current EU advice on set-aside fields? Can this be done on an e-commerce basis of ‘virtual’ fields of which I seem to have several thousand hectares?
In view of the above, you will realise that I shall be totally unemployed and will, therefore, qualify for unemployment benefits over and above the monies that I shall receive from the EU via DEFRA’s Rural Payments Agency.
I shall, of course, be voting for your party at the next General Election.
Yours Faithfully
It's usually a response to the "they're a drain on our essential services and we can't cope" line.
Yes because that pesky EU is the root of all evil and Britain is much better off out, leading the rest of world into prosperity as we enter this glorious period of new British World domination and we negotiate those neoliberal continentals in to a pulp with our brilliant politicians. And Britain will show Europe how it's done with our state of the art infrastructure, technology, NHS and housing. Made in Britain will become the the standard of the World. Britannia rule the waves!
meanwhile, back on planet earth..
Have you ever tried getting a UK visa? I have. Our system is expensive and the forms complicated. We will also be competing with nations where the population isn't hostile to foreigners, and where the currency hasn't devalued by 15%
Oh noes, we'll be doomed. Desperate stuff. People will be able to enter the US, Australia etc ok, but not the UK, our requirements are impossible and can never be changed. Hostile to foreigners? Some people are of course, yet we seem to be one of the most successfully multicultural nations on earth, the mayor of our capital the son of a muslim immigrant. Currency is a good point, but it's fallen before, the rate of immigration hasn't.
Ubik was right, it generally is a response to "they're a drain on our essential services and we can't cope", I just get fed up of poor arguments on both sides.
Sadiq khan stood in London.
We have a people hostile enough to foreigners that they voted out of the EU to stop free movement, something that will undoubtedly hurt them financially.
lol
Just about sums the club up. One caf member receives thousands a year for just having a fence at the end of his farm. feckin joke
Cost you more? You simply don't know. Both the remain and brexit campaigns were full of spurious shit like this. You won't actually know until the deal is done, and the effects are measured over a period afterwards.
As to the last point, pure conjecture. It's like saying the poor working class don't contribute anything and therefore shouldn't have a voice?
As an immigrant myself, I think that the reality is somehow in the middle.
Immigrants take in consideration a lot of things and if things get messy then most skilled labour who want to settle somewhere else for good would rather go to Australia or Canada then the UK. Take doctors as an example (I happen to have many friends among them). The gold mine is Dubai and the best country in terms of standard of living/money is Australia.
However that's not the only things immigrants take in consideration.
a- the proximity between their home country and the country they moved into. The UK is just 3 hours flight from my country. Australia would take me a day
b- re-education. In Australia most docs would need to re-validate some of their qualifications. That's not an issue in the UK. At least for the time being
If you ask me, if things get tougher in terms of Visa then most Maltese doctors coming in the UK would come for short term, possibly to get that experience needed to return home. On the other hand those who had been here for ages will probably remain.
If the EU would stop interfering with national labour markets through the free movement of labour, it would be much easier for the member states to tackle unemployment.
Yawn.....
Rather than be concerned about legislation, which for good or bad, is there because a serious problem with over farming, maybe we should be more concerned about (for example) the state of the NHS which is in dire straits and hardly functioning properly anymore. ...oh hang, we're going to put all the money we've saved from our EU membership in the NHS and then all those pigs may fly.
The whole argument that we're better off without the EU is rediculous. You really are fooling yourselves. Brexit is bad for the EU and a disaster for the U.K. There are only going to losers here and Brexit will be all about damage limitation.
Why not write to the EU, yourself, and ask why it continues to subsidise farmers ( especially inefficient farmers ) if there is over production as you say, and instead use the cash it's saved to subsidise healthcare for sick people in countries whose governments don't have enough money for a fully functioning health system - apparently like the UK.
Part if the idea of free movement is to make it easy for people to move to where the jobs are
Fair comment.
But I wonder why there are plenty of jobs available in the UK, which just happens not to be in the Eurozone.
Coincidence ?
Because most don't have an NHS anymore because an NHS is not of this time and unaffordable. But rather than being honest about it British politicians don't dare to tell the public this because they're scared of fall out. The problem with over farming is one I'm not going to claim to be an expert on. But if you are going to use EU legislation on farming as an example of how terrible the EU is, at least be honest, paint the full picture and objectively explain why such legislation is made in the first place so that people can form balanced and well informed opinions!!