Manchester City 17/18 discussion | "If you're here for the Champions clap your hands" (#6505)

RooneyLegend said:
We've spent an amazing amount of money ourselves, god knows we can't play football like they do. City have spent an eye watering amount of money since the Arabs came to town and yet have never played football at this level. Chelsea turned the market upside down when that Russian bloke shipped into town, yet they've never played football like this. PSG spent a fortune before this summer yet weren't elite, it really took them the sort of signing even city haven't made to be at the top level.
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We certainly havent done the money they have. Through enough shit at the wall and some of it was bound to get stuck on the wall. PSG were elite even without neymar and had they had a better coach or bit of a bottle they wouldnt have lost 6-1.
 
So
Maradona10 said:
We certainly havent done the money they have. Through enough shit at the wall and some of it was bound to get stuck on the wall. PSG were elite even without neymar and had they had a better coach or bit of a bottle they wouldnt have lost 6-1.
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We've spent loads in recent years, loads! Another thing is if you were to ask how highly rated some of thes players are before this season, no one would have said its a superstar squad. Don't know how the coaching being done here can't be recognised by some.
 
Maradona10 said:
Cant really believe i am reading "i was too young to remember time before takeover" how old are you 16?
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Massive Spanner said:
Adds up.
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Thunderhead said:
say's 22 in profile
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Where I'm from, football isn't something you grow up with, you just stumble upon it. I was 14-15 when I started taking interest in the sport. So it's obvious that I wouldn't know the type of football that City played before that, or any team for that matter. But all that is besides the point, I actually can't believe that I'm being called out here for saying that most City praise on here is a bit extra.
 
BlueSingh said:
Where I'm from, football isn't something you grow up with, you just stumble upon it. I was 14-15 when I started taking interest in the sport. So it's obvious that I wouldn't know the type of football that City played before that, or any team for that matter. But all that is besides the point, I actually can't believe that I'm being called out here for saying that most City praise on here is a bit extra.
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You are from india, punjab if i am not wrong.
 
TheGame said:
They are the team to beat in all competitions. If they stay injury free, they could win all the competitions they are in.
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Their main strength is that even their sub players have more or the same exact specifications as their starting players and injuries don't bother them that much , they can easily cover each other
 
I'm wondering how many City players would be firm starters for Jose's United.

I think that none of the defensve players would be guaranteed to start apart form Mendy who is unavailable. But even Mendy doesn't seem to be a Jose type of defender, maybe he's too attacking-minded and not defensibly reliable. I reckon Valencia would start over Walker, same with our main CBs.

Then Jose wouldn't replace Matic and Pogba for any City player. I reckon that Silva would probably replace Mata and KDB Mkhi. Which means that Silva may find himself on the bench for big games. Then Aguero is generally perceived as superior to Lukaku but Lukaku is more of a Jose player. Has Jose ever used as a main striker a smallish CF? Then it's Martial/Rashford vs Sane. Hard to tell, many United fans think that Martial has a higher ceiling than Sane and that Rashford is no less talented. And they may well be right.

Basically, only KDB would be a guaranteed starter in all (important) games for Jose. Is this right?

This post isn't an implicit crticism of Jose. He has a completely different understanding of the game compared to Pep and he is one of the smartest people in football, IMO. I'm just pointing out that comparing squads without taking into account the manager and his philosophy is largely pointless.

Btw, most City players wouldn't start for the biggest clubs abroad either. Probably only KDB would be a guaranteed starter for Madrid.
 
Treble said:
I'm wondering how many City players would be firm starters for Jose's United.

I think that none of the defensve players would be guaranteed to start apart form Mendy who is unavailable. But even Mendy doesn't seem to be a Jose type of defender, maybe he's too attacking-minded and not defensibly reliable. I reckon Valencia would start over Walker, same with our main CBs.

Then Jose wouldn't replace Matic and Pogba for any City player. I reckon that Silva would probably replace Mata and KDB Mkhi. Which means that Silva may find himself on the bench for big games. Then Aguero is generally perceived as superior to Lukaku but Lukaku is more of a Jose player. Has Jose ever used as a main striker a smallish CF? Then it's Martial/Rashford vs Sane. Hard to tell, many United fans think that Martial has a higher ceiling than Sane and that Rashford is no less talented. And they may well be right.

Basically, only KDB would be a guaranteed starter in all (important) games for Jose. Is this right?

This post isn't an implicit crticism of Jose. He has a completely different understanding of the game compared to Pep and he is one of the smartest people in football, IMO. I'm just pointing out that comparing squads without taking into account the manager and his philosophy is largely pointless.

Btw, most City players wouldn't start for the biggest clubs abroad either. Probably only KDB would be a guaranteed starter for Madrid.
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KDB,Sane,Mendy but I struggle with anyone else
 
BlueSingh said:
Where I'm from, football isn't something you grow up with, you just stumble upon it. I was 14-15 when I started taking interest in the sport. So it's obvious that I wouldn't know the type of football that City played before that, or any team for that matter. But all that is besides the point, I actually can't believe that I'm being called out here for saying that most City praise on here is a bit extra.
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It's OK, most City fans over here have just stumbled upon it too.
 
History has already shown Mou doesn’t count on a player of KDB’s caliber but in this hypothetical he’d be a regular starter?

Helluva fantasy
 
FCBarca said:
History has already shown Mou doesn’t count on a player of KDB’s caliber but in this hypothetical he’d be a regular starter?

Helluva fantasy
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Neither was Lukaku, Matic or Mata but now they're mainstays in our team. Just because a manager didn't think a player was ready years ago, doesn't mean his opinion is still the same.
 
FCBarca said:
History has already shown Mou doesn’t count on a player of KDB’s caliber but in this hypothetical he’d be a regular starter?

Helluva fantasy
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On current form, you'd thin he'd leave him out? You're living in fantasy land if you think not
 
Inigo Montoya said:
KDB,Sane,Mendy but I struggle with anyone else
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Maybe Aguero? He's an injury-risk for sure, but his movement, pace, technical ability and finishing would offer something different.

Just my opinion of course. And I guess this would only work if Jose goes to a 3-5-3 or 4-4-2. The above is based on the assumption that Mourinho wouldn't want his £75 million striker sitting on the bench or starting sporadically.
 
FCBarca said:
History has already shown Mou doesn’t count on a player of KDB’s caliber but in this hypothetical he’d be a regular starter?

Helluva fantasy
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Not defending Mou for selling KdB but you are spouting shite. KdB was not the same player he is today three years ago. Moreover, Mou has let go of players like Mata and Lukaku to then incorporate them into his team as regular starters.

Either you are ignorant or you're just a WUM.
 
JASR said:
Excellent.

Pep must be an absolute genius manager getting an entire squad of sub-standard players (bar the lucky KDB) to play so well...
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He absolutely is a genius manager - one of the best in the world. That being said, the underrating of the City squad is hilarious. As good as Pep is he can't make shit players look like worldies, he himself has said multiple times that it's down to the players. Kudos to him for finding a system that (so far) has gotten the best out of them, but let's not pretend this an average squad. It's a squad of some of the best youngsters in football, mixed with some experienced players who have been amongst the best the PL has had to offer over the past half a decade or so.

In fact most people on this forum were upset with City's squad before the season even started as it was obvious you guys were much stronger.

All I'm saying is, once Pep leaves - don't be surprised if City are still just as good.
 
RobinHood said:
Maybe Aguero? He's an injury-risk for sure, but his movement, pace, technical ability and finishing would offer something different.

Just my opinion of course. And I guess this would only work if Jose goes to a 3-5-3 or 4-4-2. The above is based on the assumption that Mourinho wouldn't want his £75 million striker sitting on the bench or starting sporadically.
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I think that Aguero doesn't quite suit Jose's ways of winning. He needs a beast up front or at least someone big and powerful enough to physically trouble the CBs.
 
FCBarca said:
I’m pointing out how poor a judge of talent he is
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The whole one example of Lukaku and KDB that everyone keeps recycling. When in fact it wasn't a poor judgement of talent, as he replaced them with players who were ready to play and won the league with those replacements. Similar to what Pep did with Ibra etc. Is Pep a poor judge of talent too, considering Bravo, Nolito, Affelay, Gotze, Benatia etc.?

Gotze went from one of the brightest talents in football, winning his country a world cup to becoming obese.
 
My comparison works both ways. Many firm starters for Jose wouldn't be such under Guardiola. He would probably find a place for Jones (ahead of Otamendi) and for Matic and Pogba. That's about it. And then Matic vs Fernandinho might be an open question (for Pep, not for Jose).
 
JASR said:
Excellent.

Pep must be an absolute genius manager getting an entire squad of sub-standard players (bar the lucky KDB) to play so well...
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You have an excellent squad in terms of depth for the attacking positions and for CMs if Gundogan manages to stay fit. But most of your first XI would stuggle to start for Madrid, Barca and Bayern. Think that is not very controversial. Things may change soon if Sane, Stones and Jesus continue to develop as players at the same rate. But right now only KDB would be a firm starter for Madrid (probably Edeson too?) and his compeition in Kroos would be quite strong.
 
Treble said:
My comparison works both ways. Many firm starters for Jose wouldn't be such under Guardiola. He would probably find a place for Jones (ahead of Otamendi) and for Matic and Pogba. That's about it. And then Matic vs Fernandinho might be an open question (for Pep, not for Jose).
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I think Jose would happily take both their fullbacks. Valencia is in the team to attack and Walker is just much more effective at it than he is. He's just as fast if not faster than Valencia, which is his best attribute and also has better delivery. Also it's a myth that he doesn't want both his fullbacks to attack. We just don't really have a LB apart from Young who can do that role and he's injured for the majority of the season. Whenever he's played Young and Valencia both have gotten forward, similarly to when Shaw plays (on the rare occasion). For that reason Mendy would have started for us too imo. Would explain why we are seemingly interested in a LB.

He'd also like Sterling imo. It's obvious he wants a proper right sided player, only opting for Mata as we don't really have an option there. Sterling would do what Lingard does for us, only much better.
 
podurban2 said:
Not defending Mou for selling KdB but you are spouting shite. KdB was not the same player he is today three years ago. Moreover, Mou has let go of players like Mata and Lukaku to then incorporate them into his team as regular starters.

Either you are ignorant or you're just a WUM.
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Even worst, Pepist.
 
cyberman said:
Pep and Ibra ring any bells? Selling Etoo?
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Your point being? Pep would play Lukaku ahead of Aguero/Jesus?

Eto'o was perceive as a trouble maker at Barca and Zlatan was regarded as one of the most capable at keeping possession CFs. It made sense but things spiralled out of control once Pep realised that Messi offers more as a false 9 than Zlatan as a proper 9. No place for both.
 
Womp said:
I think Jose would happily take both their fullbacks. Valencia is in the team to attack and Walker is just much more effective at it than he is. He's just as fast if not faster than Valencia, which is his best attribute and also has better delivery. Also it's a myth that he doesn't want both his fullbacks to attack. We just don't really have a LB apart from Young who can do that role and he's injured for the majority of the season. Whenever he's played Young and Valencia both have gotten forward, similarly to when Shaw plays (on the rare occasion). For that reason Mendy would have started for us too imo. Would explain why we are seemingly interested in a LB.

He'd also like Sterling imo. It's obvious he wants a proper right sided player, only opting for Mata as we don't really have an option there. Sterling would do what Lingard does for us, only much better.
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There is a reason why Valencia is our captain. Absolutely reliable soldier.
 
Treble said:
There is a reason why Valencia is our captain. Absolutely reliable soldier.
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Of course, I love Valencia but in terms of quality we could do better, that has to be said. His ability to beat his man turned to shite in SAF's last season, if anything it's regressed even further. His delivery has no real purpose and is just hopeful hits.

He's great defensively and has become very reliable in that position but Walker is no slouch defensively either.
 
podurban2 said:
Not defending Mou for selling KdB but you are spouting shite. KdB was not the same player he is today three years ago. Moreover, Mou has let go of players like Mata and Lukaku to then incorporate them into his team as regular starters.

Either you are ignorant or you're just a WUM.
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Of course not, it's always someone else's fault - he wasn't ready, he's matured yada yada yada. It merely attempts to deflect from the failure to identify talent & then use/develop

Mata is a great example, up until Mou was fired the Spaniard had to be sold due to not being counted on - you think somehow it's Mata that has changed, developed/matured? Same applies to Lukaku, how much do you think Chelsea hate the fact that the player is no longer there? Much more than having missed out on resigning him this past summer
 
Womp said:
The whole one example of Lukaku and KDB that everyone keeps recycling. When in fact it wasn't a poor judgement of talent, as he replaced them with players who were ready to play and won the league with those replacements. Similar to what Pep did with Ibra etc. Is Pep a poor judge of talent too, considering Bravo, Nolito, Affelay, Gotze, Benatia etc.?

Gotze went from one of the brightest talents in football, winning his country a world cup to becoming obese.
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Except Pep didn't rubbish Ibra's abilities, only that they didn't fit in how they played ultimately. It's easy to forget or be ignorant to it but Zlatan struggled mightily at Barcelona - he couldn't buy a goal for a long time, it absolutely was limiting the team. Zlatan is brilliant but it's his ego that is bruised

You think the German Krkic is somehow Pep's fault? Laughable, players who balloon and fail to take the game or the body seriously can't blame a coach
 
FCBarca said:
Except Pep didn't rubbish Ibra's abilities, only that they didn't fit in how they played ultimately. It's easy to forget or be ignorant to it but Zlatan struggled mightily at Barcelona - he couldn't buy a goal for a long time, it absolutely was limiting the team. Zlatan is brilliant but it's his ego that is bruised

You think the German Krkic is somehow Pep's fault? Laughable, players who balloon and fail to take the game or the body seriously can't blame a coach
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Yeah we all saw how Jose said KdB was poor man's Charlie Adam and Lukaku is glorified crouch.
 
FCBarca said:
Except Pep didn't rubbish Ibra's abilities, only that they didn't fit in how they played ultimately. It's easy to forget or be ignorant to it but Zlatan struggled mightily at Barcelona - he couldn't buy a goal for a long time, it absolutely was limiting the team. Zlatan is brilliant but it's his ego that is bruised

You think the German Krkic is somehow Pep's fault? Laughable, players who balloon and fail to take the game or the body seriously can't blame a coach
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Bit hard to take you seriously when you're spouting such obvious hypocrisies. You claim it had nothing to do with Pep identifying Zlatan's talent, but more to do with him wanting a different sort of player in that role. Yet ignore that was also exactly the case with Jose and the players you mentioned. (He came out and said he understood Mata was talented, he just preferred Oscar in that role)

Also the german Krkic is hilarious, for all the nonsense you speak about Pep, it must really hurt you that a maniac like Klopp was able to get him to a much higher level than Pep could. He got to a CL final and won the World Cup under one, became obese and warmed the bench under another.

Jose has made incorrect decisions when it's came to youth and talent, no doubt. The area you're struggling at is admitting so too has Pep.

Jose couldn't 'use' the talent he had with KDB, yet you completely ignore the fact that Pep couldn't 'use' Gotze. Keep being hypocritical to try and deflect all criticisms from your saviour though, still funny
 
roonster09 said:
Yeah we all saw how Jose said KdB was poor man's Charlie Adam and Lukaku is glorified crouch.
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Pep at least played and gave Ibra a chance to play, he couldn't do it. Romelu & KDB did not and forced leaving. If you can't appreciate that difference, you're only kidding yourself
 
FCBarca said:
Pep at least played and gave Ibra a chance to play, he couldn't do it. Romelu & KDB did not and forced leaving. If you can't appreciate that difference, you're only kidding yourself
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Lukaku was back up to Diego Costa, he wanted to leave. KbD wasn't happy with being on the bench and both wanted to leave. Pep sold Ibra as he didn't know how to use him after signing him for 60 plus million. Yeah difference is easy to see.
 
Treble said:
My comparison works both ways. Many firm starters for Jose wouldn't be such under Guardiola. He would probably find a place for Jones (ahead of Otamendi) and for Matic and Pogba. That's about it. And then Matic vs Fernandinho might be an open question (for Pep, not for Jose).
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Not a chance Jones gets in for Otamendi. Matic a big no no over Fernandinho too. These players are at the top of their game this season.
 
roonster09 said:
Lukaku was back up to Diego Costa, he wanted to leave. KbD wasn't happy with being on the bench and both wanted to leave. Pep sold Ibra as he didn't know how to use him after signing him for 60 plus million. Yeah difference is easy to see.
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Pep is such a good identifier of talent, he signed one of the best strikers of the modern day era for 60 million, then proceeded to realise he wasn't the right player for his system.

Great identifier of talent there. Also very good at 'using' that talent.
 
Womp said:
Bit hard to take you seriously when you're spouting such obvious hypocrisies. You claim it had nothing to do with Pep identifying Zlatan's talent, but more to do with him wanting a different sort of player in that role. Yet ignore that was also exactly the case with Jose and the players you mentioned. (He came out and said he understood Mata was talented, he just preferred Oscar in that role
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Samu was out and the preferred first choice was David Villa but Valencia weren't letting him go for anything resembling a reasonable fee - negotiations went on indefinitely. The Ibra pursuit came late in the window and only by chance, Ibra was never the first choice is my point. And from the start, he was given chances - over & over, in fact. And even the mighty Ibra's ego was clearly affected, his body language drooped and you could see a player truly lacking confidence. That's why I always say he is most emotional about that time because he had fulfilled a dream and then the realisation that while his quality was clearly there & in abundance, he could not execute like his teammates

Did Mou sell Mata after really limiting his minutes? Yet now a key part of the United squad? Same player


Womp said:
Also the german Krkic is hilarious, for all the nonsense you speak about Pep, it must really hurt you that a maniac like Klopp was able to get him to a much higher level than Pep could. He got to a CL final and won the World Cup under one, became obese and warmed the bench under another
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As I already pointed out, the player has only himself to blame - much like Bojan Krkic
 
Womp said:
Pep is such a good identifier of talent, he signed one of the best strikers of the modern day era for 60 million, then proceeded to realise he wasn't the right player for his system.

Great identifier of talent there. Also very good at 'using' that talent.
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Makes it even worse when Eto'o was sold in the package deal and he went on to win treble with Inter.
 
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