@panz
I like his aggressive determination to affect the game. I feel our cbs are too passive
What I didn’t see from this video is his heading ability
Centre Back... Who do we go for?
- Thread starter Macern
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I like his aggressive determination to affect the game. I feel our cbs are too passive
What I didn’t see from this video is his heading ability
I don’t disagree with any of that, but if the chance to sign a top notch cb came along then we should try
Oh and I’m not convinced by Dier
Yeah I noticed that as well, was doing my nut in and against yeovil of all teams.
thats what I just said
I don't think Dier will ever be a Keane for us but that's not what we need. What we need are players who fit into roles we need. Currently we need
- a regista (or defensive deep lying playmaker). Herrera had failed to make that role his hence why we're relying on Fellaini (whose hardly great in the role either and will leave next summer)
- a cover for Matic. No player should be expected to play week in week out throughout the entire campaign, especially considering Matic role and his age (he still has 3 good years in him but he'll need rest)
Considering our 'luck' in defence we should have someone who can slot there and do the job too.
Dier might not be first team level yet but he covers all the three roles in a very decent way. His past experience as CB allows him not only to understand what CBs desire from their DM but also to slot in defence if needed.
If I was Mourinho and I'm forced to sign just 3 signings then my choice would be Jorginho (top quality regista), Dier and Tierney (a very talented but 'old fashioned' type of full back who would give us a different style of game to Shaw and can also slot as RB if needed)
I’d take Sandro over tierney, otherwise you may as well keep Shaw
The problem is that Bailly is a sick note. He hardly plays, so cannot be relied upon.
You then have Jones, who is also a sick-note, except, against elite level attackers, he gets bullied.
There were times during the Spurs match, where it was like Jones was a 12 year old boy, and Kane did as he pleased, uncontested.
In summary, relying upon 2 defenders who are inherently unreliable and/or not good enough, is a VERY bad plan.
Sandro would just stream roll over Shaw. Also the money needed to get Sandro could be better spent somewhere else. Tierney will provide competition without ruining Shaw's chance for a first team place. Unlike Sandro, Tierney offers something different to Shaw as he's more defensive minded and a typical 'old fashioned' full back. If Shaw and Mitchell do well, we can move Tierney on the right as well.
There are about 5-6 players I regard as the best young CB's in the world (I'm talking like 24 and under) and Skriniar for me is the only one who's really attainable. United have of the others I put in that group in Bailly, but I''m not sure what pairing them together would do. Both are very aggressive, 'stopper' type CB's who try and defend on the front-foot and impact the game which is great, but that might leave you exposed at times.
Both in a 3 with Lindelof however would be incredible I think. Lindelof isn't particularly physical but with two strong, aggressive CB's alongside him, he'd be free to play as a spare man almost in a way that Luiz did at Chelsea last season, and for all his flaws he's a good cover CB and a brilliant passer. Skriniar too can really knock a ball about and Bailly isn't too bad in that regard. Those 3 at the back between them would have everything and could provide United a rock-solid defence for 5+ years.
If there's a chance to get him I would say do it. Sell Smalling and probably Rojo, keep Jones who can cover all 3 positions and ease in Tuanzebe as cover for Lindelof and TFM as cover across all 3 as well.
Both in a 3 with Lindelof however would be incredible I think. Lindelof isn't particularly physical but with two strong, aggressive CB's alongside him, he'd be free to play as a spare man almost in a way that Luiz did at Chelsea last season, and for all his flaws he's a good cover CB and a brilliant passer. Skriniar too can really knock a ball about and Bailly isn't too bad in that regard. Those 3 at the back between them would have everything and could provide United a rock-solid defence for 5+ years.
If there's a chance to get him I would say do it. Sell Smalling and probably Rojo, keep Jones who can cover all 3 positions and ease in Tuanzebe as cover for Lindelof and TFM as cover across all 3 as well.
I disagree. Bailly is a potential top talent. So Is Lindeloff. We also have Tuanzebe coming through who falls in the same category. And two out of Fosu Mensah, Rojo, Smalling, Jones and Blind are competent squad cover. I honestly see no need to go out and spend on another cb. It's not like there are any outstanding candidates out there bar VDV who went to Pool and Laporte who is now at City. I'd rather we let Mourinho turn our potential into proven gems and spend on our weakest departments. Which are first attack and second midfield, as Carrick retires.
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Harry Maguire
I’d get Harry Maguire. He’s a proper PL centre half. If we are willing to be more patient I’d be very surprised if Axel didn’t become a top player.
Someone who can build up our attacking game from the back and who isn't injured half of the season would be hell of an improvement over anything we currently field.
Isn't Alderweireld stalling on a new contract? 
A partner for Bailly? If he gets injured again this season I'd actually be planning a CB partnership without him. Similar case to what Jones has been - Brilliant talent but just unreliable.
Jones had the worst game of his career on Wednesday. A rough night against a good team where Matic, Smalling and Young weren't doing him any favours either. I still think he's good enough but still not trustworthy to last the season. Rojo and Lindelof are adequate cover.
I'd consider investing in one at least - I think Smalling may be the one to leave. If Gimenez were available at Atletico I'd be all over that.
Jones had the worst game of his career on Wednesday. A rough night against a good team where Matic, Smalling and Young weren't doing him any favours either. I still think he's good enough but still not trustworthy to last the season. Rojo and Lindelof are adequate cover.
I'd consider investing in one at least - I think Smalling may be the one to leave. If Gimenez were available at Atletico I'd be all over that.
If we sign another CB we need to get shut of a couple. Let’s sell Smalling and cut out losses with Lindelof (he has no attributes that will make him great, at best he’ll be similar to what we already have), we need a CB with experience that’s top quality, so let’s try and get Bonucci.
Isn't he 33 or in Cafe terms 51?
Lol 30 but yes that’s 50 on the caf!
Unless we’re planning on selling 3 of our 7 centre backs that doesn’t include Jones, Bailly and Tuanzebe (preferably Lindelof, Rojo and Blind) then I don’t see why we’d buy another centre back.
I’d love to see us sign Umtiti and I think Umtiti alongside any of Jones, Bailly or Tuanzebe short and long term is potentially us completely sorted for the next decade but Umtiti is arguably the best centre back in the world now and seems to love Barca.
I’d love to see us sign Umtiti and I think Umtiti alongside any of Jones, Bailly or Tuanzebe short and long term is potentially us completely sorted for the next decade but Umtiti is arguably the best centre back in the world now and seems to love Barca.
Don’t need one.
Would take Raphael Varane.
We won't buy a centre back. We have fosu mensah and Tuanzebe, at least one should make it. We will buy a right or left back probably.
It would be nice if Bailly could get and stay fit..
No point in signing Varane. Yes he has some talent, but he is the weak link in the Madrid defence. He makes a mistanke in most matches, and can improve in his tackles & positioning.
Would rather we trusted Tuanzebe a bit more.
Would rather we trusted Tuanzebe a bit more.
Would absolutely love Toby Alderweireld but we all know about Daniel Levy and trying to get one of his players. His price would be insane considering the likes of Van Dijk are going for 75M+
I would take Maguire though and I feel like he is too good for Leicester.
I watch a lot of Italian football and Manolas and koulibaly are solid options as well along with the younger options like Rugani, Caldara, Skriniar and Romagnoli etc.
I would take Maguire though and I feel like he is too good for Leicester.
I watch a lot of Italian football and Manolas and koulibaly are solid options as well along with the younger options like Rugani, Caldara, Skriniar and Romagnoli etc.
Think it could be Varane.
Bonucci and Varane?
Both are trash this season, especially Bonucci who is already 31 y.o and will struggle against the pace of PL's strikers.
Back on topic, i dont think we need another centre back especially with another areas desperately need to be fix and we have great potential like axel tuanzebe?
Both are trash this season, especially Bonucci who is already 31 y.o and will struggle against the pace of PL's strikers.
Back on topic, i dont think we need another centre back especially with another areas desperately need to be fix and we have great potential like axel tuanzebe?
I'm concerned about the amount of sick time that Bailly seems to have...but I'm certain that he is our future CB for years to come.
Otherwise, we have a pool of Jones, Smalling, Lindelof and Rojo and I never feel particularly confident whichever combination of them we are playing, and I do think that we need to be more imposing in central defence.
I get the feeling that Mourinho has a soft spot for Varane and would love to get him to OT, but talking of imposing....Koulibaly..!!!
If we aren't spending money in the attacking 3rd, and can get the midfield sorted, then I'd definitely be looking at a long term CB partnership, and considering Tuanzebe, that department would be well taken care of for a number of years.
CB should be the least of our concerns, although it's amazing how Jones and Smalling have lasted at this club for so long. We can buy one in the summer of 2019. Until then, I expect Bailly to be back and improve us, Rojo is at an age where we can expect consistency from him, Lindelof himself will improve.
Also, we have still conceded the least goals in the league this season.
Also, we have still conceded the least goals in the league this season.
I'm happy to stick with the current batch and potential youth players.
The real thing I think we are missing is a leader. If we could get a player, even in the Bonucci mould who is a little on the old side, but that would absolutely lambaste the team when they start their rubbish with 5 minutes to go, I'd be a happy man. We need steel in the team, and someone to shout the odds when players aren't tracking back, or are making bad decisions.
We have plenty of great talent in the side right now, but we just need a general to dictate. Mou doesn't really do that from the sidelines, he's not a Dyche-type manager, so we need it coming from the squad.
Sadly I don't think you can really sign a player that will arrive and start shouting at people. Normally that's someone who has been at the club for a while, who has earned the right to do so. That's why I'm hoping one of our current batch of players will pull on his big boy pants and start marshalling the team.
The real thing I think we are missing is a leader. If we could get a player, even in the Bonucci mould who is a little on the old side, but that would absolutely lambaste the team when they start their rubbish with 5 minutes to go, I'd be a happy man. We need steel in the team, and someone to shout the odds when players aren't tracking back, or are making bad decisions.
We have plenty of great talent in the side right now, but we just need a general to dictate. Mou doesn't really do that from the sidelines, he's not a Dyche-type manager, so we need it coming from the squad.
Sadly I don't think you can really sign a player that will arrive and start shouting at people. Normally that's someone who has been at the club for a while, who has earned the right to do so. That's why I'm hoping one of our current batch of players will pull on his big boy pants and start marshalling the team.
As much as we'd all like a ball playing CB, even if we got one, I doubt Mourinho would allow him to do his thing, especially as how we're currently constituted. With only a 2 man midfield, Matic isn't fast enough to help cover for a CB who has gone too far upfield, so the CBs aren't going to be able to carry the ball too far and tend to be a bit too conservative for what we'd like to see. For the Spurs, you have Dier or Wanyama to cover while Dembele doesn't go too far afield when the ball is still in the defensive half, unlike Pogba.
Having said that, we really don't need to upgrade the CBs until we upgrade the midfield. There isn't enough defensive balance in the midfield to allow for a ball playing CB like Alderweireld to shine. Jose is more than happy with the current group, and I don't blame him, as they are all defensively solid and each has useful attributes. A 'general' who could marshal the back line would be helpful, but not necessary. It's possible Bailly could grow into that role. Smalling should be it, but seems to lack the personality to take over.
Having said that, we really don't need to upgrade the CBs until we upgrade the midfield. There isn't enough defensive balance in the midfield to allow for a ball playing CB like Alderweireld to shine. Jose is more than happy with the current group, and I don't blame him, as they are all defensively solid and each has useful attributes. A 'general' who could marshal the back line would be helpful, but not necessary. It's possible Bailly could grow into that role. Smalling should be it, but seems to lack the personality to take over.
Would love Alderweireld,he will have 2 years left on his contract in the summer with that 25 mill release clause getting activated next year. Levy wouldn't want to loose him for 25 mill, so maybe he will be open to selling Toby.
Will be costly though, 50 million at least.But we can sell a few if our CBs, Rojo, Blind and even Smalling can be sold which leaves us with Alderweireld, Bailly, Jones, Lindelof and Axel.Selling Rojo and Blind should fetch 30 mill pounds at least, so even if Levy asks for 60 mill, we can get him for about 30 mill net.But would have to be sure about his fitness though.
If we get him, it would be a great addition and he would compliment Bailly very well.Also I would love if we can get some first option on De Ligt, he is destined to become one of the best in the world.
Will be costly though, 50 million at least.But we can sell a few if our CBs, Rojo, Blind and even Smalling can be sold which leaves us with Alderweireld, Bailly, Jones, Lindelof and Axel.Selling Rojo and Blind should fetch 30 mill pounds at least, so even if Levy asks for 60 mill, we can get him for about 30 mill net.But would have to be sure about his fitness though.
If we get him, it would be a great addition and he would compliment Bailly very well.Also I would love if we can get some first option on De Ligt, he is destined to become one of the best in the world.
Not unlikely. I think Jose will be thinking about it. Bailly is good but let's face it, he's looking more and more like injury prone. We could have a Vincent Kompany on our hands and rumours have it that Jose is not particularly patient with players who stay too long injured. Smalling is a decent defender if you want someone who just hacks the ball away. Someone whose sole thought as a defender is to keep the ball away from goal. That's fine but only to an extent. Such players are very vulnerable when put under pressure by the opposition because they usually lack ball playing skills. They are also not particularly great in adding an edge to your attack. The modern day CB has moved away from being a Smalling to being a Ramos, a Pique, a Boateng or an Alderweireld. These are players who don't just work hard to keep the opposition from scoring or hack the ball away when under pressure but also move the ball well from defence to attack. Jones is very much like Smalling. You get the impression that he is decent when it comes to pure defending but average or poor when it comes to retaining the ball, combining well with the midfield and generally playing a key role in moving the ball from defence into attacking positions. Moreover, the jury is still out on his fitness. Lindelof has been shaky for too long. Maybe he will come good, maybe not. Very few people seem sure. Rojo was brilliant before his injury. He was arguably our most improved player. I think he has it in him to be a great CB although you tend to think he always has a red card in him. But can't the same be said about Ramos who is one of the world's best CBs?
So, when you look at our CBs carefully, they seem to flatter to deceive on paper but in reality, they don't fill me with much confidence. I have a feeling Jose might think the same. The league table seems to negate this viewpoint about our CBs but for a team seeking to get back to the very pinnacle of world football, we have to improve on those CB positions. The game at Spurs, could have been a harsh reminder.
Would try get Dier or Alderweireld, both improvements on what we have and good on the ball and played in the premiership so should settle in straight away. if going abroad always liked the boy Gimenez and also seen Skriniar at Inter, only seen him maybe 4/5 times but always impressed me, a real young player would be the boy from Ajax De ligt ? looked superb when seen him composure on the ball is fantasitic
I don't think we need one but our constant crumbling when our defenders are put under pressure is a cause of concern. Only Lindelof is comfortable with the ball but he hasn't adapted well yet.
Don't think we need to go for anyone, unless someone Mourinho always wanted, like Varane, is included in a deal. Lindelöf hasn't yet proven he's not fit for the Premier League and the other four are all capable of starting, including a dead starter for sure like Bailly.
Škriniar and Bailly would be a monstrous partnership. If there's anyway we can make it happen with De Gea behind them. We'd be a freakish side.
Honestly don't mind who we offload as a CB as long as we make the above happen. If we can't sign Škriniar don't bother buying another CB.
Honestly don't mind who we offload as a CB as long as we make the above happen. If we can't sign Škriniar don't bother buying another CB.
Bonucci or varane in. Jones or/and smalling out.
It will never happen..
It will never happen..
Jesus wept. We dont need a center back. Maybe a full back to replace valenica and maybe a MF or two depending on who leaves.
Is Škriniar that good? I have not seen much of him, in fact all I've seen of him is that scoutnation video and he looked really clumsy, not really agile.
I don't know how good he's on the ball but in that video he looked a bit panicky on the ball.
His defending seemed mostly dependent on his physicality rather than reading of the game but again that's the impression I got from a 10 minute video and I could be wrong .