Martial has got to remain at United | No, he hasn't been unfollowing United players on Instagram

[Roeindo]

Since some poster trying to compare C. Ronaldo development with Martial, why dont we just take a look at who was behind this succes beside the player himself. The manager.

C Ronaldo grew himself into the game because he was constantly put in the first 11 to help him understanding his teammate and english game. He has Manager and Club to protect his development. The manager never openly critized him despite some fans or even his teammate (RVN) didnot like the way he played. Even when english press attack him, the manager kept protecting him. This condition help him to develop his talent. He believed in the managet and club.

While in Martial case, he has Manager that continously practising his Though Love policy over his player and likes to throw his own player under the bus. The club and manager decision to give his number and his role to the new comer will surely affect his confidence.

He carried the team in first season yet he lose his shirt number the following season.

He played well and made a good understanding with Pogba and Lukaku then the next game he was sent to the bench again. How this condition could help him?

 

[FrenchRed]

Since some poster trying to compare C. Ronaldo development with Martial, why dont we just take a look at who was behind this succes beside the player himself. The manager.

C Ronaldo grew himself into the game because he was constantly put in the first 11 to help him understanding his teammate and english game. He has Manager and Club to protect his development. The manager never openly critized him despite some fans or even his teammate (RVN) didnot like the way he played. Even when english press attack him, the manager kept protecting him. This condition help him to develop his talent. He believed in the managet and club.

While in Martial case, he has Manager that continously practising his Though Love policy over his player and likes to throw his own player under the bus. The club and manager decision to give his number and his role to the new comer will surely affect his confidence.

He carried the team in first season yet he lose his shirt number the following season.

He played well and made a good understanding with Pogba and Lukaku then the next game he was sent to the bench again. How this condition could help him?

Couldn't disagree more tbh - Ronaldo was in the team as he deserved to be in the team. He was a very special talent, with a way better attitude and work ethic than Martial.

He improved so much as he was dedicated to making the very maximum of his talent - he worked and worked.

In terms of the manager helping him, it was more Carlos Queroz who guided Ronaldo day to day.

 

[Micky Targaryen]

Is there anything to suggest Martial has some kind of a serious attitude problem aside from people micro analyzing games with preconceived notions?

Unless he's a real bad apple or something, we should not even consider selling him. It feels like people are looking for reasons to justify Jose's inability to get the best out of most of our attacking players.

No, there's nothing to suggest that Martial has a serious attitude problem. But there's also nothing to suggest that Martial is impressing in training either. That's the whole point, we as fans, don't know much about what's going on behind the scenes. And I definitely wouldn't believe all the tabloid reports as well.

What's baffling for me is that why some people are so adamant that Martial will be a huge star in the future. I'm struggling to see this inevitability, it's certainly not as obvious as players like Ronaldo and Messi. I think it stems from the tumescent LVG days, when our football was boring as feck, and Martial was one of our more exciting players, and that's how fans started to grow attached to him. Like how Januzaj was for us during the Moyes days. I agree Martial has bags of talent but I don't see anything extraordinary about him which makes him stand out among the rest of our squad, let alone the league. He's young, he has a potential, he has flair, will be great if he stays. IMO, it wouldn't be a great loss to the club if he leaves. Especially if we could get a very good price for him.

 

[togg]

No, there's nothing to suggest that Martial has a serious attitude problem. But there's also nothing to suggest that Martial is impressing in training either. That's the whole point, we as fans, don't know much about what's going on behind the scenes. And I definitely wouldn't believe all the tabloid reports as well.

What's baffling for me is that why some people are so adamant that Martial will be a huge star in the future. I'm struggling to see this inevitability, it's certainly not as obvious as players like Ronaldo and Messi. I think it stems from the tumescent LVG days, when our football was boring as feck, and Martial was one of our more exciting players, and that's how fans started to grow attached to him. Like how Januzaj was for us during the Moyes days. I agree Martial has bags of talent but I don't see anything extraordinary about him which makes him stand out among the rest of our squad, let alone the league. He's young, he has a potential, he has flair, will be great if he stays. IMO, it wouldn't be a great loss to the club if he leaves. Especially if we could get a very good price for him.

It's kind of a pointless discussion to get involved with on here about Martial in my opinion. He has his out and out fanboys who see him as son sort of football messiah whereas the reality is that he's been pretty underwhelming since those heady days when he was new and unknown during those tumescent LVG days. If he doesn't become a huge world star, then his aficionados will just say that all the managers didn't play him enough/treat him right/played him out of position etc etc. Some minds will never be changed and you can twist any discussion to suit your agenda.

 

[The_Order]

Under a less Conservative coach he'd be tearing up the league, but our football is so slow and tumescent that I doubt the world's best would struggle to find consistency. You've seen us play, we look like strangers out there. And when the team starts to settle, José throws a stone at it.

 

[JMack1234]

This might be pie in the sky thinking but if Jose really doesn't fancy Martial and Shaw why don't the club hierarchy take the decision to loan them out? We loan them out, if next season Jose has a 3rd season meltdown we have two good young players that are new manager can work with and if Jose is vindicated and builds a title winning Mourinho machine then we can revisit this issue and move them on if we need to.

 

[Cassidy]

Couldn't disagree more tbh - Ronaldo was in the team as he deserved to be in the team. He was a very special talent, with a way better attitude and work ethic than Martial.

He improved so much as he was dedicated to making the very maximum of his talent - he worked and worked.

In terms of the manager helping him, it was more Carlos Queroz who guided Ronaldo day to day.

He still had help though, Martials first season where the manager trusted him was superb.

 

[Peanut Butter]

I think I’m one of the tiny minority that actually wouldn’t mind seeing Martial leave. Or at least, I wouldn’t lose any sleep over it.

He’s a sulky character and doesn’t give 100% in every game, which is why Jose doesn’t fancy him i’d imagine.

No offence Tony but you’ve achieved sweet FA in the game as of yet, put in the hard graft please.

 

[Mr PG]

It's dangerous to develop ball reliance like Martial has. We've seen it with players like Ben Arfa and Queresma. They have a bag of tricks, and take the piss out of the other team with the ball, but lack footballing fundamentals.

The vast majority of a player's success comes from working on off-ball qualities both in attack and defense. An attacker that is always on the move, making the defenders second guess themselves, that is what all world class attackers are.

Martial is probably as talented as Mbappe, but Mbappe's game intelligence is so good. You can't pin him down, and if you gave him an inch of space he'd kill you. Martial seems quite easy to pin down, due to him coming short all the time and having a low work rate. It's a strange one because Martial is lightning quick, but it might just be that he doesn't see the game that way.

I have always thought they should make Martial train as a midfielder for a while so he can grasp the importance of movement

 

[The_Order]

peace out, lad, hope you find a manager that will appreciate you more.

 

[Peanut Butter]

Martial would never have worked as hard as Sanchez today. He would have sulked about at 1-0 down.

 

[Rightnr]

I think I’m one of the tiny minority that actually wouldn’t mind seeing Martial leave. Or at least, I wouldn’t lose any sleep over it.

He’s a sulky character and doesn’t give 100% in every game, which is why Jose doesn’t fancy him i’d imagine.

No offence Tony but you’ve achieved sweet FA in the game as of yet, put in the hard graft please.

He was just sensational in his first season when he was trusted. He just scored on his debut against Liverpool. He also just scored the winner in the SF of the FA cup that put us through to the final which we won. He was also just having a great season before Sanchez arrived and scored and won us the previous games before Sanchez joined. He is also our most clinical and most efficient finisher.

But yeah, continue on with your 'he doesn't try' nonsense. It's not like we paid stupid money for him as well. The dude's going to go and be a super star under the right manager.

Btw, I'm a Mourinho supporter but he's flushing the future of the club down the pan. He'll fill us with a few 29/30-year-olds, win the league and then feck off and the next man will have to rebuild again.

The board should not allow this approach to drive our strategy.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Under a less Conservative coach he'd be tearing up the league

peace out, lad, hope you find a manager that will appreciate you more.

Imagine watching your team just play a cracking semi final and winning, yet all you want to do is come into a thread and have another cry about your favorite player not playing. His ”replacement”, was once again in a big game, just as he was versus City, the best player on the pitch.

Are you even a United fan?

 

[togg]

Martial would never have worked as hard as Sanchez today. He would have sulked about at 1-0 down.

Agreed. Sanchez might have had an indifferent start to his United career (today definitely an exception) but no one could accuse him of not working his balls off for the team. I really hope this a positive leap for him here.

 

[breakout67]

He was just sensational in his first season when he was trusted. He just scored on his debut against Liverpool. He also just scored the winner in the SF of the FA cup that put us through to the final which we won. He was also just having a great season before Sanchez arrived and scored and won us the previous games before Sanchez joined. He is also our most clinical and most efficient finisher.

But yeah, continue on with your 'he doesn't try' nonsense. It's not like we paid stupid money for him as well. The dude's going to go and be a super star under the right manager.

Btw, I'm a Mourinho supporter but he's flushing the future of the club down the pan. He'll fill us with a few 29/30-year-olds, win the league and then feck off and the next man will have to rebuild again.

The board should not allow this approach to drive our strategy.

Martial is not the future of this club! Rashford, Lingard, McTominay, Pogba are the future of the club. Then we have Fosu-Mensah, Tuanzebe, Gomez, Chong.

Martial is an expensive young player that could potentially be a flop signing.

 

[Judas]

After a performance today by Sanchez, it really makes you realise how much improvement Martial needs to do. He's nowhere near that level of hard working, and it's costing him his place in the side, rightfully so on todays evidence.

 

[Gordon S]

Martial would never have worked as hard as Sanchez today. He would have sulked about at 1-0 down.

Why would he sulk? He ran his socks of to help us defend after 90 minutes three days ago, and was one of the best players on the pitch that night as well. And even if Sanchez is a top player, he's only had two really good games for us, so to use him as a bat to beat the crap out of Martial is a bit weird.

 

[Silas]

Martial is not the future of this club! Rashford, Lingard, McTominay, Pogba are the future of the club. Then we have Fosu-Mensah, Tuanzebe, Gomez, Chong.

Martial is an expensive young player that could potentially be a flop signing.

Only academy players can be the future?

 

[Peanut Butter]

Why would he sulk? He ran his socks of to help us defend after 90 minutes three days ago, and was one of the best players on the pitch that night as well. And even if Sanchez is a top player, he's only had two really good games for us, so to use him as a bat to beat the crap out of Martial is a bit weird.

I’m not using him as a bat. I like Martial. But the Martial fanboy nonsense in here is weird.

He’s a talented prospect but he’s not Neymar.

 

[Rightnr]

Martial is not the future of this club! Rashford, Lingard, McTominay, Pogba are the future of the club. Then we have Fosu-Mensah, Tuanzebe, Gomez, Chong.

Martial is an expensive young player that could potentially be a flop signing.

Err, when he plays, he performs. He links up well with Lukaku and gives us that something else. I wish people saying he might be a flop admit that this is based on wishful thinking, as opposed to observed performance.

Martial performs as well as Pogba when given the chance and Pogba links well with him besides.

Btw, if Lingard (and to some extent McTominay) is the future of this club, we'd be right in the Arsene Wenger's Arsenal bin of winning FA cups but never being close to winning the league. Apart from those two, I have seen no evidence Mourinho will develop our young players - Rashford doesn't even play striker (his best and proper position) even in the less relevant games.

Mourinho is too rigid to give some of these kids a proper chance. He hasn't settled on a solid first 11 and still youngsters don't get a look in. Where has Rashford been since that performance against Liverpool?

 

[JohnnyKills]

I’m not using him as a bat. I like Martial. But the Martial fanboy nonsense in here is weird.

He’s a talented prospect but he’s not Neymar.

Is Neymar your benchmark for a young player worth keeping?

 

[Damien]

Err, when he plays, he performs. He links up well with Lukaku and gives us that something else. I wish people saying he might be a flop admit that this is based on wishful thinking, as opposed to observed performance.

Martial performs as well as Pogba when given the chance and Pogba links well with him besides.

Btw, if Lingard is the future of this club, we'd right in the Arsene Wenger's Arsenal bin of winning FA cups but never being close to winning the league.

I think he's saying that from the perspective that Martial will probably be sold this summer so would go down as a flop as he didn't succeed here for whatever reason.

Word 'flop' is a bit too harsh in my opinion. He's still our second top scorer in his time here but I can see where he's coming from.

 

[breakout67]

Why would he sulk? He ran his socks of to help us defend after 90 minutes three days ago, and was one of the best players on the pitch that night as well. And even if Sanchez is a top player, he's only had two really good games for us, so to use him as a bat to beat the crap out of Martial is a bit weird.

I think you might have forgotten his performance against West Brom where he sulked over and over. He lost the ball and watched the West Brom player run at our defence and was walking back. Martial's tracking back is like he is doing the manager a favour, it's not something he actually wants to do to help the team.

Err, when he plays, he performs. He links up well with Lukaku and gives us that something else. I wish people saying he might be a flop admit that this is based on wishful thinking, as opposed to observed performance.

Martial performs as well as Pogba when given the chance and Pogba links well with him besides.

Btw, if Lingard is the future of this club, we'd right in the Arsene Wenger's Arsenal bin of winning FA cups but never being close to winning the league.

No he does not perform when given the chance. He is inconsistent when starting games and his best period came when he was rotating with Rashford as a sub.

The only attacker that has performed is Lukaku, who matches the productivity of other top attackers in the league when starting games.

The future of our club is from the academy. If Martial becomes a world class player, chances are he's not going to stay with us forever.

 

[Rightnr]

I think he's saying that from the perspective that Martial will probably be sold this summer so would go down as a flop as he didn't succeed here for whatever reason.

I see. I have a slightly different definition of a flop in that case.

I certainly don't want to come across as a Martial fanboy (although him and Herrera are my fave players atm - one embodies skill and flair and the other drive and passion) but I am just not confident we're building for the future, as opposed to building for next season.

I guess we'll see one or another.

 

[JohnnyKills]

Imagine watching your team just play a cracking semi final and winning, yet all you want to do is come into a thread and have another cry about your favorite player not playing. His ”replacement”, was once again in a big game, just as he was versus City, the best player on the pitch.

Are you even a United fan?

While today was great, I think a lot of people are concerned that we're sacrificing a precociously gifted young player in favour of someone who is more complete now but will be 30 in a few months. Seems to go against the grain of United's tradition.

Are you even a United fan?

 

[Rightnr]

While today was great, I think a lot of people are concerned that we're sacrificing a precociously gifted young player in favour of someone who is more complete now but will be 30 in a few months. Seems to go against the grain of United's tradition.

Are you even a United fan?

Thank you. Some people just love shutting down debate because they don't want to or cannot argue their point. I was very happy we won but this short-termism allowed Wenger to stay in charge at Arsenal (as an example) for way too many years. The complaints here are not something new and have been expressed on multiple occasions.

 

[Kapardin]

While today was great, I think a lot of people are concerned that we're sacrificing a precociously gifted young player in favour of someone who is more complete now but will be 30 in a few months. Seems to go against the grain of United's tradition.

Are you even a United fan?

Yet Martial wouldn't have done half as much as Sanchez did on the pitch today. And I actually like Martial. But this effort, or lack thereof, has nothing to do with Jose or his tactics or his coaching -- it is everything to do with Martial's mentality.

Let's face it, we wouldn't have won the SF if Martial started, as even if he scores, he doesn't do much for the team like Sanchez. Of course, its' a shame losing one of our potentials, but not all of it is Jose's fault alone since his job demands instant success.

 

[el3mel]

Imagine watching your team just play a cracking semi final and winning, yet all you want to do is come into a thread and have another cry about your favorite player not playing. His ”replacement”, was once again in a big game, just as he was versus City, the best player on the pitch.

Are you even a United fan?

It's like Martial has his own fans here. Bailly hasn't played the previous games despite being fit and no one cared much about him, 2 or 3 posts at max. Martial FC is a real thing.

 

[hasanejaz88]

United throwing Martial away would be equivalent to Chelsea throwing De Bruyne away. There is just so much obvious talent in his shoes that you have to try and work for him, if United do sell him then they'll soon regret it.

Or okay, I guess you already have a better player right now in his position. Let's just play him for a couple of more seasons till when he eventually will get old and then you can buy back Martial when he becomes one of the best in his position for 200 MP? Not like they've never done this before.

 

[haram]

We beat City, Liverpool and Spurs without him I think? Rashford and Sanchez who play in his position were key in all three of those games.

People need to realise the team is fine without him and that he isn’t the only young talented footballer on this planet. If he stays he stays, if he goes he goes.

 

[Judas]

His performance in midweek was really ordinary, bemused at it being praised. Some of you fanboys are wild. I like the lad, but some of you are so blind. Can't imagine being an adult and getting so caught up in individuals.

 

[Rightnr]

It's like Martial has his own fans here. Bailly hasn't played the previous games despite being fit and no one cared much about him, 2 or 3 posts at max. Martial FC is a real thing.

Although slightly off-topic but I love Bailly as well. The difference in his case is that he's been injured a hell of a lot this season and has played almost immediately after recovering, so it's obvious Mou trusts him. Some dodgy performances of late might have left him out of favour but I am pretty sure he'll be back next year if he's fit.

 

[Peanut Butter]

Is Neymar your benchmark for a young player worth keeping?

Of course not. But my point is: the Martial fan boys behave as if Martial is Neymar in his prime. He isn’t. He’s an incredibly inconsistent player. United comes before a player, always has, always will.

 

[el3mel]

Although slightly off-topic but I love Bailly as well. The difference in his case is that he's been injured a hell of a lot this season and has played almost immediately after recovering, so it's obvious Mou trusts him. Some dodgy performances of late might have left him out of favour but I am pretty sure he'll be back next year if he's fit.

It's not that I want people to care much about Bailly playing or not, it's that it feels quite funny at the moment once Martial doesn't play a match, even when we win, some run out immediately to talk about him being wasted ..etc, like why should all your concern after reaching a cup final be a player played this match or not ? We're supporting a club not individuals.

I said that I want Martial to stay, even with flaws he's a great talent and has loads of potential and will feel bad to lose, but some are clearly going the fanboyism route now with him.

 

[Member 5225]

Imagine watching your team just play a cracking semi final and winning, yet all you want to do is come into a thread and have another cry about your favorite player not playing. His ”replacement”, was once again in a big game, just as he was versus City, the best player on the pitch.

Are you even a United fan?

Yes this! Martial mentality, always sulking!!

 

[Akshay]

Or okay, I guess you already have a better player right now in his position. Let's just play him for a couple of more seasons till when he eventually will get old and then you can buy back Martial when he becomes one of the best in his position for 200 MP? Not like they've never done this before.

Actually, we have never spent 200m pounds on a player before.

 

[Kapardin]

United throwing Martial away would be equivalent to Chelsea throwing De Bruyne away. There is just so much obvious talent in his shoes that you have to try and work for him, if United do sell him then they'll soon regret it.

Or okay, I guess you already have a better player right now in his position. Let's just play him for a couple of more seasons till when he eventually will get old and then you can buy back Martial when he becomes one of the best in his position for 200 MP? Not like they've never done this before.

Well, that ain't a bad idea if he really goes and becomes a superstar. Atleast we would have him back. But 200 mil is likely to fetch you no more than Lord Bendtner in another 4 years, considering the way the market is going.

 

[breakout67]

Thank you. Some people just love shutting down debate because they don't want to or cannot argue their point. I was very happy we won but this short-termism allowed Wenger to stay in charge at Arsenal (as an example) for way too many years. The complaints here are not something new and have been expressed on multiple occasions.

Your concerns are valid, just not for Martial. Non academy players very rarely stay for their whole careers. If you get a player in at 19 years old, chances are he will leave for another top club in his prime. Ronaldo left for his boyhood club, and Rooney was angling for a move and was being pushed out by SAF because of it.

Players like Scholes and Giggs were more important for our long term health as they saw through multiple generations of players through the club.

 

[Fortitude]

Of course not. But my point is: the Martial fan boys behave as if Martial is Neymar in his prime. He isn’t. He’s an incredibly inconsistent player. United comes before a player, always has, always will.

By the same token, United traditionally nurtures and develops those with obvious talent and perseveres with them until they come good or are definitively a lost cause.

Inconsistency is part and parcel of being the age Martial is; the onus is on the management to develop him as he was never the finished article coming here at such a young age.

 

[Handré1990]

Would have scored given Rashford’s chance, wouldn’t have done the same job chasing down the spurs players and thus helping pin them further up the field. Starting to think he will be gone, which is a little sad.

Excellent talent, but I suspect his languid style and lack of application on the field will always have him at a disadvantage under Mourinho. I think he is more skilled than Rashford, not necessarily a better player though. Must say the way Herrera, Rashford and Sanchez especially were chasing spurs players like they were possessed was invigorating, Martial should take note, even if he won’t be here next season.