Being the last group to be decided I can see the wierd scenario of scoring an own goal to finish second.
England Discussion | Finish 4th
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Or sub on Welbeck to get a sending off!
Could just have Nick Pope nut Martinez on the touchline.
England will absolutely want to win this game vs Belgium
They have an incredible amount of momentum and will not want to stop that by playing for a defeat or a draw + 5 yellow cards to finish 2nd.
Their mentality will be 'win every game, we don't care who we meet in the knock-outs' approach.
We as fans would love to see a tactical result to give us potential to get to the Semi's without playing any real quality, but you've got to understand the players/managers will to win every game.
They have an incredible amount of momentum and will not want to stop that by playing for a defeat or a draw + 5 yellow cards to finish 2nd.
Their mentality will be 'win every game, we don't care who we meet in the knock-outs' approach.
We as fans would love to see a tactical result to give us potential to get to the Semi's without playing any real quality, but you've got to understand the players/managers will to win every game.
Or imagine the scenario where Fellaini fouls Kane, injures him and gets himself sent off. England will face a tougher opposition in the next round without Kane.
That could get really messy, with both teams trying out-foul each other.
Would be a little bit like USA vs Italy in 2006 which ended up with three red cards and a few injuries.
It’s a strange situation England (and Belgium) are in. We are looking at the possibility of the of the brackets being
Win the group – Colombia in the last 16 – Germany/Brazil in the quarter final
Or
2nd in the group – Japan in the last 16 – Switzerland/Mexico in the quarter final.
On paper one is obviously a smoother route to the semi-finals.
To be honest though, I think we shouldn’t worry about who we’ll potentially play in later rounds we might not even get to, there are always surprising results in the World Cup & it’s risky doing that. Turn off the focus against throw the game against Belgium & we might not be able to turn it back on. Just think about every game as it comes, stay focused, and try to win it. Tunnel vision.
Win the group – Colombia in the last 16 – Germany/Brazil in the quarter final
Or
2nd in the group – Japan in the last 16 – Switzerland/Mexico in the quarter final.
On paper one is obviously a smoother route to the semi-finals.
To be honest though, I think we shouldn’t worry about who we’ll potentially play in later rounds we might not even get to, there are always surprising results in the World Cup & it’s risky doing that. Turn off the focus against throw the game against Belgium & we might not be able to turn it back on. Just think about every game as it comes, stay focused, and try to win it. Tunnel vision.
First time since 2004 we've been exciting in a tournament. Enjoy it, people!
How do we approach the Belgium game? I mean to me it's kinda like a free hit because if we pl
Bit like when we played Iceland. Many were thinking about the next game. Tournament football for England should be worry about what's in front.
Bit like when we played Iceland. Many were thinking about the next game. Tournament football for England should be worry about what's in front.
I remember seeing a long time ago about a match where teams were defending the other team's goal. Trying to score own goals. 
Cannot remember the scenario tbh. That is what this situation reminded me of.
But I know both teams in reality will be professional. Though I can see key players from both sides being rested.
This will in reality be a dead rubber.
Cannot remember the scenario tbh. That is what this situation reminded me of.
But I know both teams in reality will be professional. Though I can see key players from both sides being rested.
This will in reality be a dead rubber.
I remember seeing a long time ago about a match where teams were defending the other team's goal. Trying to score own goals.
Cannot remember the scenario tbh. That is what this situation reminded me of.
But I know both teams in reality will be professional. Though I can see key players from both sides being rested.
This will in reality be a dead rubber.
Agreed. Both teams will be professional, will attack at times, but also not leave themselves too open at the back. Neither wants a hugely open game in which they could concede a few goals and damage confidence.
Can see two or three changes being made rather than four or five. Rashford likely to start. Kane to be taken off after 60 minutes at the latest.
It makes no sense not to. As loads have pointed out finishing first could be a hinderence. Better off giving a few players a run out so that if they are needed they are up to full fitness.
Expect to see Jones/Cahill in for one of the centre backs, probably Stones.
Rashford for Sterling.
Rose for Young.
Vardy, Delph and 1 other for the substitutes.
EDIT: Dier for Henderson probably for the other change.
No need for that with Pickford on goal.
It makes sense to both rest players and keep a similar team. There are strong arguments for both. One keeps momentum going, one keeps the squad fresh. Seen both fans and ex-players on both sides of the fence.
I personally don't think he'll make as many changes as you're suggesting, but we'll find out I guess. A great situation to be in!
It helps that Vardy was a backup and Alli was injured most of the time
Interesting story about how Southgate adapt tactics from basketball
https://www.theringer.com/soccer/20...t=chorus&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter
https://www.theringer.com/soccer/20...t=chorus&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter
I know all that but I think Southgate will want to win the game, finish top and take our chances in the harder route.
First goal applies as well; Young screening Stones' marker
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbados_4–2_Grenada_(1994_Caribbean_Cup_qualification)I remember seeing a long time ago about a match where teams were defending the other team's goal. Trying to score own goals.
Cannot remember the scenario tbh. That is what this situation reminded me of.
But I know both teams in reality will be professional. Though I can see key players from both sides being rested.
This will in reality be a dead rubber.
This is what the bracket looks like:
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2018-world-cup-predictions/bracket/?ex_cid=rrpromo
Group G are the last group playing
I'd make a few changes, bring in Dier, Rashford and Rose and just play for the win. I think it seems too much of a gamble to play for 2nd. You do that and we get knocked out to Japan we'll look like fools.
If Walker or RLC get booked in this, will they miss the last 16 match? If so, maybe bring in Cahill/Jones and Delph too.
If Walker or RLC get booked in this, will they miss the last 16 match? If so, maybe bring in Cahill/Jones and Delph too.
Everyone was delighted, including the coaches and players apparently, when we got Iceland in the last Euros and look at how that turned out.
I think it's dangerous to start thinking about it being better to lose games to get the easier match in the quarters. We're not good enough to take anything for granted.
I think it's dangerous to start thinking about it being better to lose games to get the easier match in the quarters. We're not good enough to take anything for granted.
Everyone should stop with the finish 2nd conspiracy theories. Germany could still top their group and Brazil could finish second. At this level you cannot afford to give less than a 100%. For England I think it’s actually better to be the underdog.
Just woke up to see so many media outlets praising the "amazing" England team, with the hattrick hero, world class striker (mind you had 2 pens) that blew away Panama....Panama.
If Belgium or some other team do it, its like, meh, its just Panama.
That I think is were England's problem lies. They almost remind me of Liverpool in the boom bust cycle, the get worked up way too quickly and then boom...an actually test comes there way and they bottle it. I hope it's not the case this way, but they way the media is going on, its like they setting it up for the great depression 2.0.
If Belgium or some other team do it, its like, meh, its just Panama.
That I think is were England's problem lies. They almost remind me of Liverpool in the boom bust cycle, the get worked up way too quickly and then boom...an actually test comes there way and they bottle it. I hope it's not the case this way, but they way the media is going on, its like they setting it up for the great depression 2.0.
Of the starting line up yesterday v Panama only 3 players started the game against Iceland in Euro 2016. Kane, Sterling and Walker.
It was their highest WC win ever, they usually have problems with teams like that.
In 2006 England won 2:0 vs Trinidad & Tobago goals were scored in the 83rd and 91th minute
I know Panama is really, really bad, but getting a convincing win on the biggest stage and not struggling to advance to R16 for the first time since what feels forever is always nice.
Even though those teams are easily a tier or two higher England got draws against Algeria and lost to Iceland in recent WCs/EUROs.
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What should they do? Criticise the team instead?
I'm sick of miserable bastards putting England down at every turn. I spent a full day out in the sun yesterday, watching us score six goals at a World Cup on the big screen. That's what it's about. People are getting excited, so are the media and so they should. If sports writers catch a bit of that fever then bloody good on them.
England were very good against Panama but they're definitely gonna get dicked by Brazil.
That'll sell the news...
I'm not putting them down, i'm saying manage your expectations. For exactly the reasons we've witness tournament after tournament, this big hype is made when the entire qualifying games England go unbeaten, and there is an unrealistic expectation placed on it, only to be disappointed later.
I believe England can win the WC, and yes, I enjoyed the game too, great goals, lots of energy, but the way some are carrying on its like they going to blow all teams away.
Yes, 6 goals is a great achievement and we must give credit to where it is due, but my word, it is still Panama.
But it seems, too each their own.
But for me the media, just like the leak team news, doesn't help the team often with what they put out there, but why should they, then again, they just there to entertain, right.
I'm with you on that, but my concern is like with the euros, they qualified unbeaten, but when it came to when it mattered, how great they were during that qualifying period doesn't always help much.
But yes, if it gives the lads confidence going into the Belgium match, that hey, we scored 6 against Panama, we can do this, then fine, but I'd rather think, that was great, we were clinical, lets not get carried away just yet and keep our heads down and push on to the next match.
For me its like celebrating when you 1-0 up and there is still 30 minutes to go (aka Pardew style), yes be happy, but lets kick on and not get carried away.
Let the fans enjoy it and ignore the media. Southgate said we didn't play that great and the score flattered us. I very much doubt the England camp think they've arrived on the back of this.
If you can’t celebrate being 5-0 up at half time in a World Cup game (after enduring at least 10 years of soul-crushingly dull football), then maybe football is not the right sport for you.
Sure, everything is subject to the caveat that they have yet to play a decent side but, until then, we can just enjoy the national side not being a dysfunctional mess for once under a manager and a group of players who seem quite grounded and likeable.
Sure, everything is subject to the caveat that they have yet to play a decent side but, until then, we can just enjoy the national side not being a dysfunctional mess for once under a manager and a group of players who seem quite grounded and likeable.
Yeah okay, I get you.
Fans will always celebrate as they wish too, but I don't expect it from the experts and players to get carried away.
And I agree with you. It was great game, didn't say there was no enjoyment in it. A small slice of history was made, can be happy for that.
But I believe that, also as a fan, I'm able to enjoy it and at the same time manage my expectations till we face sterner opposition.
I mean its what some of us having been doing with United this passed season, not get carried away when we paste some team, cause we know we not the finished article yet. And so with the England team, it has a great potential and hopefully it can be fulfilled.
I don't think anyone was delighted, We messed up, we wanted to win the group then we would have been in the far easier half of the draw. But we drew our last game and Wales pipped us. Sure, we got one easy game against Iceland (well it was supposed to be easy), but we ended up on the same half of the draw as Germany, Slovakia, Italy, Spain, France & Ireland (plus Iceland).
While the other half of the draw consisted of Switzerland, Poland, Croatia, Portugal, Wales, Northern Ireland, Hungary, Belgium.
I would hope no one in the England camp was high-fiving each other after we failed to beat Slovakia in the last group game.
Which experts are getting carried away? Are any saying that we are now favourites to win the World Cup?
The experts can be fans too. They're allowed to get excited, cheer and say that we're doing well but have tougher tasks ahead.
Exactly, best to focus game by game. All of Group H will be no mugs and anyone on their day can beat England. I would make minor changes 3-4 against Belgium and keep the base of the team the same while giving others who may be used later games e.g Rashford, Dier game time.
We should rest a number of players such as Henderson, Kane, Trippier and replace with Dyer, Vardy and Walker. Keep Loftus Cheek in and if Alli is fit give him 30 mins. Before the world cup I wasn't that keen on Loftus Cheek but his strength on the ball and good feet make the team look a bit stronger. He holds the ball well in the last third. Alli probably has more of a goal threat but he's injured. Even if Alli recovers for the next match I would put him on the bench and give him a go if we need a goal. Although Sterling is playing badly I think he should start and if he's still bad bring on Rashford. Sterling doesn't seem to have got his world cup going and even his first touch is letting him down. Maybe he's getting the wrong kind of service but he needs to adapt. This is no time to go missing. He's a great player who can really hurt teams with his pace and at his best I would play him over Rashford. I'm of the view that Kyle Walker isn't suited to playing in a 3 so try Cahill. I'm not his biggest fan but you could look at Walker for the 2 goals conceded.
Make the changes and go for the win. Bring on Kane if we need a goal. I'm in two minds about not starting with Kane and Southgate will probably start him. Not that fussed as long as he gets a rest of some sort.
This tournament could be the making of Linguard. If he continues like this would Jose sell him?
Make the changes and go for the win. Bring on Kane if we need a goal. I'm in two minds about not starting with Kane and Southgate will probably start him. Not that fussed as long as he gets a rest of some sort.
This tournament could be the making of Linguard. If he continues like this would Jose sell him?
Panama did beat and draw against Costa Rica in qualifying and we all saw how Brazil struggled against Costa Rica, no games should be taken lightly. A number of stronger teams have struggled against so called weaker teams.
Walker's pace is essential in that back 3, he will not be dropped. He was at fault for the penalty however it was Maguire and Rose who kept the Panama players onside for their goal.