Be careful what you wish for. A ref on anything right now could cause chaos. My opinion.
Brexited | the worst threads live the longest
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I’m fine with some chaos. Chaos is exactly what the country has been thrown into for the last 2 years, and a little more isn’t going to suddenly scare me off.
New question I presume so yes I think a minimum 6 weeks... Plus at least a couple of weeks to get the legislation done before that
So in truth there would need to be a new government in place in January
And as I say I find that timetable a push as let's assume may gets deal / no deal decision in mid nov... Presents it to parliament in late November... It gets rejected then it's 2 more weeks to try and get a vote of confidence thriugh... That fails and parliament is dissolved for an election... Again minimum 6 weeks plus there is Xmas .... Just don't see it happeneing
Unfounded rumours of a GE in Nov from the times today and a may resignation by the summer
Don't see how there will be a GE or a referendum before the UK leave.
What happens if Parliament do not accept "No Deal" - the government cannot say to the EU "We have to have a deal, parliament said so".
It's taken two years to negotiate nothing. 50 years of negotiations won't help much. The EU are not going to budge on the 4 freedoms.
Cancel Brexit seems the only solution.
What happens if Parliament do not accept "No Deal" - the government cannot say to the EU "We have to have a deal, parliament said so".
It's taken two years to negotiate nothing. 50 years of negotiations won't help much. The EU are not going to budge on the 4 freedoms.
Cancel Brexit seems the only solution.
The three realistic options (I think) are
1. Cancel Brexit (even this might not be possible).
2. Canada style trade deal.
3. Hard Brexit.
Yes agree but,
Cancelling Brexit may be possible but with certain stringent conditions.
Hard Brexit is no deal, but if parliament has refused, what then.
Canada deal is just basically a FTA which still means hard borders and ensuing chaos.
The only realistic option is Norway style. Solves many border problems and should be an easy political sell. You just have to keep shouting you’ve officially left the EU and nobody can argue
As said many times not being in the CU does not solve the border problems.
Ultimately if we're still in the customs union people will be outraged on the leave side and if we aren't it fecks the NI issue.
Well it will be amusing to see tories voted back in for a 3rd time by all the remainers
In theory, Brexit means completely leaving the EU, the SM & the CU. Thus No deal . Thus doing so means the GFA is broken.
Thus Brexit is impossible without breaking the GFA.
Now if Parliament reject No deal which is Brexit are they going against the "will of the people" and is parliament undemocratic?
What a mess.
Thus Brexit is impossible without breaking the GFA.
Now if Parliament reject No deal which is Brexit are they going against the "will of the people" and is parliament undemocratic?
What a mess.
It wouldn't surprise me, don't see many voting for Corbyn.
You said there won't be chaos, I suggest the next 9 months will be the most chaotic in recent UK history , whatever happens.
It goes a lot further to solving issues than anything else on the table. We’re not “cancelling brexit” so if you have any better ideas I’d love to hear them.
I think it’s an easy sell. If you’re officially out the EU nobody can really argue without having a proper debate, which we all know nobody in the media or government is capable of. Everybody ends up a little bit unhappy which unfortunately is the best case scenario
You need to stop deciding what everybody voted for. That is YOUR theory.
There is no solution, Brexit was impossible from day one as was said before the referendum. All the problems pointed out are now appearing and most were evident throughout.
Norway may be the one of the best of a bad bunch but the biggest problem still exists which is no solution to the Irish border and no solution to the chaos at the ports and airports.
But it means you can't reduce immigration which is what a lot of Brexiteers want. Getting the Tory party to support it is a difficult sell before even getting to the public.
No that's what the government has decided and as Leavers keep pointing out they all voted for the same thing and they all knew what they voted for and what's more they haven't the first clue as to what they voted for.
I know they voted for all different reasons .
Even those responsible like Farage can't remember what they said before the referendum.
Labour have left this all too late. If they took this stance from the get go then they could potentially have forced a GE earlier/won the last GE and changed the course of negotiations. If they're only considering backing Remain now, then let's assume there is a GE and they win, are they a) going to have the time to do anything about it anyway & b) have any coherent plan as to how they will prevent Brexit? Will UK not be too far down the line with the EU by this point in time, or would they freeze everything pending to outcome of the GE?
On the GFA I am under the impression that both sides of the border must share the same trading position, so if UK leaves EU and therefore free trade, then either Ireland has to leave too or the whole situation completely reneges the GFA? Plus if the GFA is reneged on, how in hell can the government actually monitor and control the borders?
On the GFA I am under the impression that both sides of the border must share the same trading position, so if UK leaves EU and therefore free trade, then either Ireland has to leave too or the whole situation completely reneges the GFA? Plus if the GFA is reneged on, how in hell can the government actually monitor and control the borders?
I've heard some idiotic things coming out of the UK in the last 3 years but this has to take the biscuit.
Len McCluskey, the Unite general secretary, has single-handed done his best to slam the brakes on Labour’s (admittedly, quite tentative) shift closer to backing a second referendum on Brexit. He has told BBC 5 Live’s Pienaar’s Politics that, if there has to be a referendum, voters should just get a choice between leaving the EU without a deal, and leaving with a deal.
OK I'll vote to leave with a deal, err which deal, there isn't one, oh.
Len McCluskey, the Unite general secretary, has single-handed done his best to slam the brakes on Labour’s (admittedly, quite tentative) shift closer to backing a second referendum on Brexit. He has told BBC 5 Live’s Pienaar’s Politics that, if there has to be a referendum, voters should just get a choice between leaving the EU without a deal, and leaving with a deal.
OK I'll vote to leave with a deal, err which deal, there isn't one, oh.
I heard the interview
Basically he said labour should (in his opinion) have the same stance to a general election and a second referendum
That the first referendum result will be respected and we will leave... But that the public should decide if to accept the deal on offer
The reasoning seeming to be that to offer the chance to stay in the EU may cost labour too many marginal seats in a general election
I think this seems to tie in with the perception that Corbyn would rather leave than stay
Wouldn't surprise me is this ended up as their position... Depends how it is spun (I predict very poorly) but could end up alienating both camps as it may be seen as not giving the 48% the question they actually want... But still undermining the original vote
I think the thread just proved Godwin's Law.
People will be outraged no matter what the outcome is. This is one of the most divisive events in the recent history of the UK.
Decent article ref the saltzberg "ambush / debacle" (depending on your pov)
https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-comment/2018/0921/995292-salzburg-chronic-misreading/
https://www.rte.ie/news/analysis-and-comment/2018/0921/995292-salzburg-chronic-misreading/
What I took from it as well.
Brexit has broken this country. Naturally Corbyn would try to avoid the topic but that would be impossible in a November GE. He'd be run out of town if it looked like he was trying to avoid discussing brexit. Both sides would take it badly.
Could be why they seem to be moving more towards a second referendum, perhaps deciding that if an election is looming they need to make the issue a priority and be seen to devise a clear stance.
I've been very critical of him but starting to see why he's been avoiding it like the plague.
As toxic as brexit is for the Tories, it's even more toxic for Labour.
In terms of sheer numbers, Labour members want to remain but those that voted out are spread across many seats.
It's a pretty fecked up situation.
The sad part is Tory voters wo desperately want to remain, will never vote for Corbyn, no matter how desperate they are. The propensity of losing voters depending on how the party goes is still significantly on Labour's side.
Nationalism is a like a drug that corrods the brain. The fact that there are some Labour voters prepared to vote Tory just for brexit and regardless of austerity is a tragedy .
Eh I dunno actually - the fact Labour won some fairly liberal Tory areas in London in the last election demonstrates there's room for them to pick up disaffected Tories who lean right but despise the more nationalistic elements of the party and who'll prop for Labour if need be, and if they've got a decent local candidate. Similarly there's an argument some Labour voters supported Brexit merely because they want change, and that Corbyn offering change, albeit of an altogether different kind, may allow some to remain with the party. There are still plenty of people out there who just plop for Labour no matter what. Albeit the party shouldn't allow room for complacency in that regard like in Scotland.
Agree with what you say other than the fact there is nothing for the public to have a referendum on.
There is unlikely to be a deal but even if there is it will be BINO so they may as well have the stay option in and if there is no deal there will be no referendum of that nature.
Then whoever in government has to implement what is voted for in the referendum and everyone starts going round in circles and arguing with each other again.
In the meantime the EU are getting on with life and will have new elections on 23rd May 2019 and the UK politicians will probably be still fighting with each other.
Concerning, the way a lot of people are now saying we should leave without a deal because of how the EU have tested May.
This country...
This country...
People actually said the Tories would spin it to make the EU look like the bad guys when negotiations failed and they were right.
Some people who voted remain are saying it too. Were fecked.
Yes
I wish all of you who are unaware about who the DUP are and how they are heavily influencing the whole Brexit process would read up on them. All their scandals and skullduggery that they get away with. Especially literally burning hundreds of millions of pounds of British tax payers money in a fraudulent heating scheme. Also Ian Paisley MP who got away with taking money and holidays from a genocidal regime in Sri Lanka in exchange for lobbying the UK government to not look into it. Not to mention their involvement in getting illegal dark money to help the leave campaign
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Arlene Foster looks like a bare knuckle boxer.
It was obvious and they left clues about that strategy from the beginning, just look at the "divorce" bill.
Has anyone else seen the rumour that Ted Heath was a strident supporter of the Common Market because German intelligence had dirt on him?