Don't have a clue why Leonardo Jardim isn't getting mentioned more as potential replacement. He would be my second choice after Pochettino and much prefer him to Zidane. Ticks all the boxes as he has won a league title with Monaco against a much tougher opposition in PSG like Klopp did with Dortmund and plays attacking football. Not like Jardim hasn't proved himself and won nothing like Pochettino. Also the argument about Monaco's current position in the table is irrelevant as he has lost his best players and Klopp was in a similar situation with Dortmund. If we use the same argument, Liverpool should never have hired Jurgen Klopp.
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
He's on my list:
Tuchel, Jardim and Poch are my top 3 picks with a special mention of Eddie Howe
Yep Tuchel is another good choice. Reckon Jardim could be the easiest to get if we put in a good offer. Just hope we don't go for Zidane if we could get any one of those three.
I feel for the next manager
A year and a half and no PL Title and he'll be up for the chop
A year and a half and no PL Title and he'll be up for the chop
If you think that's the criteria that Moyes, Gaal and Mou have been judged on then you have not been paying attention.
Do most of the posters here genuinely feel Pochettino's team plays great attacking football though I haven't watched Tottenham play regularly but most of time I have seen them I have been bit underwhelmed , yes they are well drilled,organised and aggressive but don't think they are quite the attacking force as they seem to be portrayed here.
If you think results are not an important factor in sport then you dont have a clue
Moyes wouldn't have got the sack if he got 4th.
Neither would Gaal.
Mou will get the chop when it's clear he can't turn this around. Probably after the CL groups if we're out and still poor in the league.
None of them were sacked for not winning the league.
Depends on the football and if it looks like they're going to achieve said target, isn't it obvious? We've never really looked like we're going in the right direction for years.
Yeah I think so too! His team are struggling right now so it might be easier to negotiate with Monaco
Jesus, just stop with this shit. It was never about the PL title.
Tbf to him you can't convince me that we will be totally fine if we're entering our 8th or 9th consecutive year without a league title even if the next manager plays good attacking football.
How would it be "good attacking football" and still be 9th in the league. No that's pointless football, just like the zombie football we played last year. Sure we had highest point tally since Fergie retired but the coward football we played against Sevilla at Old Trafford were pretty much summed up our & Mourinho's problem in the last few years.
I can take Mourinho's boring style as long as we win something because that's the point of his football but as the matter of fact, we isn't and no one should tolerate that kind of borefest just for that sake of it, he hasn't showed he could adapt to us either. If we were playing fluid football (not necessary attacking football) and be challenging title every year I could take few consecutive years (more than 1 and a half) without a title but not like this.
I guess my point is watching United nowadays feels like season is already over by December when it's clear we re not going to challenge for anything at least while playing pointless football without any sign of progression.
If Jose is to be sacked mid-season, it has to be Carrick and McKenna who take over til end of the season. It would be stupid to spend money hiring a interim from outside the club, let him implement new training methods, let players get used to a new set up, possibly spend more money to buy a player or two in January just to let him go and start again in the summer. Sarri and Emery had months to implement their methods and Sarri himself said that it's now that things start looking like he wants it. Nothing to suggest getting Blanc tomorrow would give us better chances against the upcoming Juve, City and Chelsea fixtures.
Since SAF retired we sacked 2 managers and we seem close to sack the third. All of those sackings were well deserved. Sure the board are all over the place and we need some solid reform on that part. Irrespective of that, what those 3 managers did was inexcusable. Moyes got the Champions to 7th place. LVG filled us with deadwood and played some of the most horrible football I've ever seen in my life. Mou seem to also lost the dressing room. A club like United who spends ridiculous money on fees and salary on a near year to year basis should at least make it to 4th place.
So lets analyse the rationale behind our choice of managers. First we went for the EPL proven option, someone who knows the EPL inside out and can appreciate the players we've got. That failed. Then we went for the proven WC manager who had lead teams in Spain and Germany with success. That also failed. After that we went for the combination of both. A WC manager who was a success everywhere he went and who also had EPL experience. That also backfired spectacularly.
What is the link between those 3 people? First of all they had to work with Woodward. As said that needs to tackled. However, SAF had to work with worse creatures then an overenthusiastic CEO with little idea about football. Edwards and the coolmore mafia were far worse then Woody is. The second characteristic is that they all had a squad that wasn't up for the task. There again, as said, the squad is good enough to make it to top 4. The third characteristic that links them all together is their lack of man management skills, which ironically was SAF's main strength. In fact all three managers seemed to have lost the dressing room something SAF wasn't able to do in more then three decades of management.
To conclude Woody is here to stay (at least at some capacity). Also the new manager will have to work with most of the current squad at least for the near future irrespective whether we keep the current system in place or bring the best people in the job. So great man management will be key between success or failure. So my advice is this. Track record, experience and tactics are important as a manager whose clearly out of depth will surely lose the dressing room. However, what's key is his ability to man manage people and persuade players to sweat blood for him. SAF was the don on that regard, Zidane can do it and Klopp can do it. That's the sort of manager we need.
So lets analyse the rationale behind our choice of managers. First we went for the EPL proven option, someone who knows the EPL inside out and can appreciate the players we've got. That failed. Then we went for the proven WC manager who had lead teams in Spain and Germany with success. That also failed. After that we went for the combination of both. A WC manager who was a success everywhere he went and who also had EPL experience. That also backfired spectacularly.
What is the link between those 3 people? First of all they had to work with Woodward. As said that needs to tackled. However, SAF had to work with worse creatures then an overenthusiastic CEO with little idea about football. Edwards and the coolmore mafia were far worse then Woody is. The second characteristic is that they all had a squad that wasn't up for the task. There again, as said, the squad is good enough to make it to top 4. The third characteristic that links them all together is their lack of man management skills, which ironically was SAF's main strength. In fact all three managers seemed to have lost the dressing room something SAF wasn't able to do in more then three decades of management.
To conclude Woody is here to stay (at least at some capacity). Also the new manager will have to work with most of the current squad at least for the near future irrespective whether we keep the current system in place or bring the best people in the job. So great man management will be key between success or failure. So my advice is this. Track record, experience and tactics are important as a manager whose clearly out of depth will surely lose the dressing room. However, what's key is his ability to man manage people and persuade players to sweat blood for him. SAF was the don on that regard, Zidane can do it and Klopp can do it. That's the sort of manager we need.
What makes you think that our current training methods aren't at least part of the problem? After all it all went to shit when Faria left.
I admittedly haven't watched anywhere near enough football from teams managed by the more popular candidates suggested in this thread to have an opinion on who should take the reins.
I just hope we hire someone who has a clear idea of how we should attack and has a style and manner that the players ( and us supporters,) can buy into.
Sidenote. Klopp was hired three years ago to this day and I hope we mirror Liverpool's approach and give the new guy the rest of this season to settle without any sort of top 4 make-or-break. From memory, Klopp's Liverpool finished the season in almost the same position on the table as they were when Rodgers was booted. Likewise our new Managers sole initial task should be to simply to make us fun to play for and watch again. Then 2019/2020 we go for it!!
I just hope we hire someone who has a clear idea of how we should attack and has a style and manner that the players ( and us supporters,) can buy into.
Sidenote. Klopp was hired three years ago to this day and I hope we mirror Liverpool's approach and give the new guy the rest of this season to settle without any sort of top 4 make-or-break. From memory, Klopp's Liverpool finished the season in almost the same position on the table as they were when Rodgers was booted. Likewise our new Managers sole initial task should be to simply to make us fun to play for and watch again. Then 2019/2020 we go for it!!
Eh what ? Did you build that long post based on misreading lol ? Read again.
Actually my point has nothing to do with Mourinho etc. My point is you can't convince me not winning the league isn't the issue. Easy to talk now but if we bring a manager that plays good football but still finishes 3rd or 4th like now etc, and we go on 8 or 9 successive years post SAF without league titles while City, Chlesea and Liverpool dominate the league, you can't simply convince me our fans would be completely fine and this place will be enjoying peace and happiness ?!
Spot-on. The Moyes experience should forever serve as the ultimate warning - and Moyes managed a much bigger club. Bournemouth? Really? Proof that some United fans have gone crackers.
Shouldn't Kovac current experiment at Bayern make people rethink several hundreds of times before suggesting Howe ?
Given they're a different club, in a different league, with different players, Different expectations and a different manager, no.
Kovac isn't doing great but that doesn't mean Howe wouldn't.
The job here is far harder than Bayern, so by saying you're proving my point actually.
Your point is a stupid one, it's that because Bayern hired an inexperienced manager and it isn't working right away nobody else should.
For every Kovac you have a Pochettino who everyone amusingly now seems to want.
Mourinho and Van Gaal have bags of experience, yet Van Gaal was hounded out and people seem to want rid of Mourinho ASAP as well.
A young upcoming manager like Howe makes far more sense than someone who went stale donkeys years ago.
Poch didn't manage a big team yet though. What are you on about ?
All I see about Howe is a wishful thinking based on nothing. You have to realize that not any manager wo manages midtable or bottom club and tells his players to pass forward is good enough for a big team. That's actually the real stupid idea.
If you want a young manager there's Jardim, 44, proved his ability with a team like Monaco and bringing up youth, winning the league and reaching CL semi final, not Bournemouth manager. There's a big chance Howe will be out of his depth here.
That depends what you class Tottenham as, but they're very certainly bigger than Monaco.
Howe currently has his Bournemouth team on 16 points, just 4 off Liverpool,Chelsea and City, did you know that?
That's not bad considering his only tactic is apparently telling his players to 'pass forward'
Jardim on the other hand is near the bottom of the French league currently isn't he? I suppose he musnt be telling them to pass forward enough.
Manchester United have shown with our past two managers that bringing in experienced winners doesn't always work, it's as big a risk as bringing in someone young and ready to prove themselves in a lot of ways.
First, Spurs are in a similar class to Monaco. Both aren't big clubs but pushed over their weight. Both Poch and Jardim did good there, yet to manage a team with big expectations to prove if they can take it next step but at least, at least their supporters will have reasons supporting their argument to want them here, unlike "oh we had terrible history with experienced managers so let's sign an unexperienced one, surely will be different" reason to hire Howe.
Second, what are we, 8 matches in the league ? Too early to start talking about standings. No one is saying he's a bad manager anyway. Learn to differentiate between a good manager in general or if he'll be good enough at a big club with big expectations and too much ego and top players with influence in dressing room for him to handle. That's Kovac problem at Bayern, not his managerial ability. To manage a big team you need several other qualities accompanied with your tactical ideas.
Last thing, how are you blaming people for stupid ideas when you're commenting on Monaco position in the league ? Their board fecked up the team by selling all their good players bar Falcao and hanged the team to dry. Klopp was exactly in similar situation at his last season at BVB when the board kept on selling their best players till the team collapsed and fought for relegation. Has nothing to do with the managers per se as Klopp and Jardim have proved their worth earlier.
Ah, yes, that's the only reason Howe would be seen as a good manager for United, because experienced ones have failed.
Not the fact that he's dragged a club from near liquidation in league 2 to being a top 10 side this season, making astute signings time and time again on a shoestring budget, whilst playing good football and regularly beating supposed top sides and managers.
How can we differentiate if Howe hasn't been given the opportunity to go to a big club? The fact that you write him off because he manages Bournemouth is laughable.
Oh so it's the boards fault Monaco are in that position? They have plenty of good players.
Falcao, Tielemans, golovin, subasic,Chadli, Glik, Sibide etc would all get plenty of game time for Bournemouth.
If Jardim thinks he's been hung to dry imagine how he'd to in Howe's position.
I didn't write him off though. Again I have never said he's a bad manager in general. Learn to read . I question his ability to handle big expectations and to have control over big players with influence in dressing room. Can you say anything to prove the opposite?. For Bournemouth, finishing 10th is great and their players will never find any better manager in their life than Howe. This won't translate when he manages United or any other big club. Whether he manages it or not is very big gample depending on wishful thinking ans nothing else while we have other good young managers that proved themselves at a higher step already to choose from..
Yes, it's definitely the board problem unless your view about Klopp was that he was/is crap when he was fighting relegation with BVB after winning the league and reaching CL final.
Can you please point me to all the big expectations Jardim has had to endure as a manager? He has no expectations of him, he's near relegation and you can't wait to jump to his defence and suggest that he will be able to handle big names. What would the likes of De Gea and Pogba say if they found out we were hiring a manager at risk of being relegated in a farmers league.
As for the learn to read comment, I've bolded all the parts in just one of your posts in which you write off Howe as a manager that would be a success at Manchester United.
I won't tell you to learn to read, because I'm not petty. but I will suggest you be a bit more well mannered to other posters who haven't said anything rude to you, it's just football after all.
Thanks for the info mate. Very worthwhile analysis. Howe is definitely one to keep an eye on.
It's really helpless if you want to concentrate all your current argument on the current season for Monaco and want to completely avoid the fact he won the league and reached CL semi final with Monaco about 2 seasons ago because it doesn't suit your narrative.
No I didn't write him off as a manager, I said it's a very big gample but you deliberately didn't put that in bold. Also, don't forget you're the one who started when you said my point is stupid, no ? If you say this, accept that I'll go the same route.
Winning the league was a big achievement, but it doesn't mean that this season he isnt failing Monaco.
You said it's a gamble yes, but the way you word the rest of your argument shows that you blatantly don't think it would work. Your original point was that Kovac shows that we shouldn't go for Howe.
Saying your point is stupid is a bit different than suggesting someone is unable to read, but that's getting away from the topic at hand, which is that Howe is no bigger a gamble than a manager who is currently a relegation candidate in France, a league often laughed at for its dearth of quality, despite having better players by name at his disposal than Howe.
Rafa won the Spanish league with a team that wasn't Real Madrid or Barcelona, huge achievement, I wouldn't want him over Howe either though.
I'd suggest you read the post @Will Dance For Chocolate wrote as its a far more reliable argument for Howe than I could ever write.
If a manager is having several good seasons at a good level, then have a poor season, you can't simply put it all down to the manager. If it's like that Klopp wouldn't have been managing a big club now.
Jardim has proven his worth in challenging and winning the league and reaching CL advanced stages when he had a good team in his hands while promoting youth and building team with no much financial power at all. You can't simply deny that he has far more reasons to support him for the role than Howe.
I don't think Howe will succeed at a big club or will be able to handle expectations but I'm not future teller. I didn't go on and said that's a fact. I said it's a very big gample, and imo it won't work. Hardly anything to look at here. My point is if you want Jardim and Poch you will have several reasons to support you wanting them far more than if you want Howe. Your problem is that you want to concentrate your whole argument on the current season alone, and ignore all the other reasons for their collapse.
Anyway, think it's time to agree to disagree, and sorry if I was aggressive somewhat but I was annoyed by your earlier post. No need to get personal grudges between us over football, as you said.
Agreed, apologies for calling your point stupid too, I hadn't had my coffee.
With Real Madrid and Bayern Munich going through a bad patch and their manager's future in doubt suddenly there might be 2 even bigger jobs available in market for the managers on free right now . Add to that Zidane agent confirming that he is not interested in managing our club and wanting to take a one year sabbatical. The available options for us will keep decreasing . I really hope our Board is planning something proper instead of waiting and giving more time to Mourinho .
Nothing wrong with Howe - he's a bright young manager doing well, is intelligent, believes in building a team and club up for real.
But referred to seriously as a possibility for Manchester United?
Come off it - it would be a repeat of David Moyes probably minus the sheer destructive qualities of Moyes' insecure ego. Except this time more out of his depth as Everton were way ahead of a club like Bournemouth given their history, supporter base and better finances.
But, but Alex Ferguson did it............Manchester United hadn't won the League since the 1960s, hadn't done much except for a few FA Cups and had some exciting teams. This is 2018 and Manchester United's success since the 90s has included league titles, FA Cups, League Cups, European Cups and the Europa Cup. The whole organization is a footballing and marketing behemoth.
The players are no longer English/Scottish/Irish plus some foreign signings, often relatively cheaply with no genuinely big names, big money signings. Can you imagine the present squad or the LVG/Sir Alex squads of the last 15 years or so willing to accept or taking seriously a young manager who has done nothing important with even a mid level club? Talk about losing your sense of perspective, common sense and understanding of Manchester United.
Even thinking of Arsene Wenger seriously as the next manager makes sense thought that would be a move from left field. But it could work - he has the football pedigree and the ability to connect with players. He stagnated at Arsenal but this could be a bold move and certainly one with a big chance of succeeding.
But referred to seriously as a possibility for Manchester United?
Come off it - it would be a repeat of David Moyes probably minus the sheer destructive qualities of Moyes' insecure ego. Except this time more out of his depth as Everton were way ahead of a club like Bournemouth given their history, supporter base and better finances.
But, but Alex Ferguson did it............Manchester United hadn't won the League since the 1960s, hadn't done much except for a few FA Cups and had some exciting teams. This is 2018 and Manchester United's success since the 90s has included league titles, FA Cups, League Cups, European Cups and the Europa Cup. The whole organization is a footballing and marketing behemoth.
The players are no longer English/Scottish/Irish plus some foreign signings, often relatively cheaply with no genuinely big names, big money signings. Can you imagine the present squad or the LVG/Sir Alex squads of the last 15 years or so willing to accept or taking seriously a young manager who has done nothing important with even a mid level club? Talk about losing your sense of perspective, common sense and understanding of Manchester United.
Even thinking of Arsene Wenger seriously as the next manager makes sense thought that would be a move from left field. But it could work - he has the football pedigree and the ability to connect with players. He stagnated at Arsenal but this could be a bold move and certainly one with a big chance of succeeding.
So PSG, a club who has achieved nothing in the CL the last years was much tougher to beat than Bayern, a club who has reached 3 finals in 4 years and won one in totally convincing manner and they were on the peak that time? The nonsense spouted out here is incredible. In addition, Klopp has won it two times in a row a did it with a budget close to zero (5m!! were available each season)
WTF do you know about the ability of Kovac? Countless of people have predicted that Kovac is a laughable appointment, cos he is tactically totally inept anf his way of football is all about running and fighting and not about possession football with providing offensive solutions. Kovac failed miserably with Croatia and even shy Modric was talking about how clueless he is tactically.
And guess what, if you cannot provide a functional tactic, then this Bayern team will roast you..they had Pep, who micromanaged every detail and now they have a clueless old school coach, hired by the clown Salihamidzic with his laughable analysis and the senile criminal was also totally happy, cos Kovac has the Bayern DNA
Only clueless idiots thought Kovac was a suitable appointment.
No one has any idea how successful, or otherwise, Eddie Howe would be as Man Utd's manager. I appreciate that you would prefer another man to take over at OT, but just to dismiss someone who has 'done nothing important', with his club is a bit of a slight on his ability, and I'm sure that as far as Bournemouth fans are concerned, getting the club from the fringes of relegation out the league, to at least mid table in the Prem, is quite an important feat.
Players generally respect a new manager, regardless of their previous experiences, and would initially go with what he was saying, but would be loathe to carry on with his philosophy if performances and results were not forthcoming, but conversely would take to his methods and ideas if the team were winning games with an enjoyable type of football, but I doubt if your view or other people's views on Eddie Howe will ever be put to the test as I can't see the board, as it is now, going with him. Big named managers in the past have not really been successful with our club, the type and standard of football played over the past 5 years has gotten worse. I started watching United because of their dynamic, exciting football, and I long for the day that happens again, I think Howe would do well here, and is one who certainly would look at the academy, as he has with Bournemouth, getting several of his own players on the fringes of the England team, but that is just my opinion. Whatever happens I hope they get the right man