[haram]

I'm not daft enough to think we'll be a totally different team by the time the KO round arrives, so I can't say I'm too excited to get battered.

Well you need a little luck to win the CL. We saw what happened in Turin.

We will need a lot of luck though .

 

[Patrick08]

You nailed it. Maybe I don't know much about football but isn't it the player's job to put the ball at the back of the net when he has a chance or at least hit the target or make a simple pass that gives a team mate all the room needed to cause havoc?

It's getting ridiculous. Rashford misses a glaring chance, it is the manager's fault. Martial misplaces simple passes and loses the ball up to 10 times while trying to dribble through a wall, it is the manager's fault (meanwhile the manager takes no credit when Martial is playing like Ronaldinho). Top pro players are making poor decisions that academy players won't have a problem with, it is the manager's fault. I have no problem with firing Jose as long as the decision takes us back to glory days after all, United is bigger than any manager or player, but it is time we adopt a more balanced and fair approach to assessing performances and the squad.

How is that every player we buy, his performances and impact goes south? The coaching and tactics are directly responsible for repeated under par performances of the players and the team.

Even if Rashford scored, and we took the lead , our immediate response would be to absorb the pressure, concede the space and try to hit on the break rather than killing the game with second and third goal.

We create so little chances at goal, that players are under tremendous pressure to take the limited chances we create, and failing at those adds more pressure. Mourinho wants directness and ruthlessness as an attribute in forwards with the tactics he employs, and I wouldn't call all of them as direct players nor they are ruthless , if they are they are not so brilliant at it anyway, the result is all there to see for us, why continue to persist with it?

Adding a couple of playmakers in the middle, with willingness to win the ball high up the pitch would make us much more effective than continuing to pursue stuff which isn't getting pulled off even against poor sides we should beat comfortably.

 

[Casanova85]

Fellaini: unlikely hero.

This guy would score a dramatic goal in a ChL final.

That said, he should be a top sub for the last 20 min of a match.

 

[Patrick220571]

Going through now instead of dropping to the europa league probably means your best chance of playing CL football next year just evaporated.

Mourinho has already saved his skin once by winning the Europa. I am quite glad he won't get a second chance to do it.

 

[Casanova85]

. Matic should drop back to CB if he plays anywhere.

That's actually a good idea.

 

[Lash]

That's actually a good idea.

There's no reason he can't do what Blind did, he'd be better in the air as well.

 

[R'hllor]

He's been doing that for a number weeks. Deflection tactics for poor performances. Chelsea and Juve games was the 3 finger salute.

Yea i know was just wondering what question was before it, was it like "Jose nice shoes man", "Shoes? Let me tell you something, 14 times in CL..."

 

[UpWithRivers]

Manager and players all need to take responsibility. But sometimes it feels like we just need a bit of luck which we arnt getting. The team put out was enough to beat them and the style of play - we attacked and kept possession enough and had the players to do it. If we were in 'normal mode' and not 'we are in crisis' we would have walked away with an easy 3-0 win. But everything is made to look so hard - confidence, luck who knows. Its more than just formation and strategy at the moment

 

[Decomposing In Paris]

We won, and we're through to the last 16 (something even SAF didn't always manage) with a game to spare... beating Juventus away in the process. We all know we should be playing better, but it's 11 v 11 on the pitch. Some of the entitlement on the Caf is incredible.

 

[Kapardin]

We won, and we're through to the last 16 (something even SAF didn't always manage) with a game to spare... beating Juventus away in the process. We all know we should be playing better, but it's 11 v 11 on the pitch. Some of the entitlement on the Caf is incredible.

Comments like these make no sense. Nobody is complaining about the results, or even the fact we play poorly in cup competitions. Its' the fact that literally every game we play in the league involves this same tedious football, and the results match the mediocrity in terms of inconsistency.

There is a certain degree of luck involved in the CL, and our tedious football was enough to see off inferior teams like YB, while we couldn't beat Valencia at home and we achieved a freak victory against Juve. The rot is so deep that reaching Ro16 does not imply an iota of progress; that's why nobody is celebrating it.

I believe you know that too, because you surely don't think we should rejoice in the glorious football we are playing and the 7th position in the league?

 

[Sassy Colin]

Don't get the rating for Fellatio.

Worst player on the pitch, I literally had no idea what he was trying to do for the entire match. He then scored a goal after first controlling it with his hand.

I could not bring myself to give player ratings for the match, but he would have got a generous 2 from me.

 

[haram]

He's been doing that for a number weeks. Deflection tactics for poor performances. Chelsea and Juve games was the 3 finger salute.

Chelsea wasn’t a poor performance.

 

[Adisa]

We won, and we're through to the last 16 (something even SAF didn't always manage) with a game to spare... beating Juventus away in the process. We all know we should be playing better, but it's 11 v 11 on the pitch. Some of the entitlement on the Caf is incredible.

Utter tosh and a strawman. Games like yesterday have become the standard. Can't you get your head around people being upset about that?

 

[Buster15]

What I don't understand is, why are people blaming only Mourinho again. I didn't see the entire match but saw the highlights.
In those highlights there were enough chances for us to score .Rashford was dangerous but he was not clinical for the goal or key passes. Like the one where he cut back and should have played it straight to Fellaini who would have had a great chance to score or the one where all he had to do was put it past the keeper but put it over the bar.
Is it his fault that Lukaku is not scoring or the other players are not scoring from the chances they get.
We have been extremely wasteful with whatever chances we have got .
It's not Like Mourinho is the 800 Pound Gorrila, he has his flaws and he has not been upto the mark, but the players have not been upto the mark as well . To put the entire blame on Mourinho is not justified.

People nowadays always look for someone to blame and more significantly want instant fixes. All adds up to sack the manager.
He is after all the man in charge of the team.

I can well understand the frustration. We all in truth want the same thing, as does Jose.
If I really thought that replacing him would result in an instant solution to all of our problems then I would be happy for him to go. But I don't.

Our problems run deep and I do believe that Jose is really struggling to deal with them. For the same reason I believe that another manager would equally struggle.

As a club we urgently need clarity of thought and cool heads. Again, I will not seeing that.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

We won, and we're through to the last 16 (something even SAF didn't always manage) with a game to spare... beating Juventus away in the process. We all know we should be playing better, but it's 11 v 11 on the pitch. Some of the entitlement on the Caf is incredible.

Entitlement?

We've spent hundreds of millions and we have the highest wage bill in the entire league and yet we're fecking 7th in the table with negative goal difference. And it's almost December.

This season has been appalling, the fact you seem rather content with it is what's incredible.

 

[Kapardin]

People nowadays always look for someone to blame and more significantly want instant fixes. All adds up to sack the manager.
He is after all the man in charge of the team.

I can well understand the frustration. We all in truth want the same thing, as does Jose.
If I really thought that replacing him would result in an instant solution to all of our problems then I would be happy for him to go. But I don't.

Our problems run deep and I do believe that Jose is really struggling to deal with them. For the same reason I believe that another manager would equally struggle.

As a club we urgently need clarity of thought and cool heads. Again, I will not seeing that.

The problem is 20% players, 40% Jose and 40% Ed, if you want to give it a hypothetical split.

Bring in someone like Sarri, and he would probably get our players performing at a higher level. Of course, some problems will still persist since our players are mostly not elite and we have a dithering idiot running the club, but sacking the manager is a start, or a step in the right direction.

 

[Decomposing In Paris]

Comments like these make no sense. Nobody is complaining about the results, or even the fact we play poorly in cup competitions. Its' the fact that literally every game we play in the league involves this same tedious football, and the results match the mediocrity in terms of inconsistency.

There is a certain degree of luck involved in the CL, and our tedious football was enough to see off inferior teams like YB, while we couldn't beat Valencia at home and we achieved a freak victory against Juve. The rot is so deep that reaching Ro16 does not imply an iota of progress; that's why nobody is celebrating it.

I believe you know that too, because you surely don't think we should rejoice in the glorious football we are playing and the 7th position in the league?

You're first paragraph doesn't make sense to me, because people are complaining about results. It's results they're complaining about. Your paragraph even circles back around to it. 7th position is a reflection of results. You're then happy to dismiss our best result this season as a freak. Performances will always be 2nd to results in top level sport. You're happy to count luck as a factor in the CL, but in the group stages it's no more important than it is in the league. I'm not saying we're amazing, we're far from it ATM... but if we can't be happy about qualifying for the last 16, then we possibly don't deserve to be happy if we turn our season around.

 

[Djemba-Djemba]

The results this season have been dogshit.

The performances have been even worse.

We're probably lucky to be as high as 7th.

 

[mitchmouse]

It says a lot when I have to vote DDG MoM because he makes one fantastic save (by the way, the deflection may have taken the ball wider but it also took the pace off it). and this against a side that at best would be in League One here. As much as Jose does crazy things, you cannot blame him for Rashford's misses or Martial's numptiness at trying to run through players.. and when that fails, trying it again and again, match after match. Jose's comments about pundits amused me (he often does) but it does seem to hide that he still doesn't know his best XI. If he feels this way, he should drop the players he feels aren't good enough and bring in youngsters who might give more. But too much is being made of his reaction to Rashford's early miss: SAF used to haul off players unceremoniously if he thought they were having a horror and that is no more subtle than what Jose did

 

[Kapardin]

You're first paragraph doesn't make sense to me, because people are complaining about results. It's results they're complaining about. Your paragraph even circles back around to it. 7th position is a reflection of results. You're then happy to dismiss our best result this season as a freak.

I meant that nobody is complaining about CL results, not league results. As far as the latter is concerned, everyone is complaining about it.

And yes, over two legs, I do believe Juve is a better team than us. Spurs beat Real in the groups last season, does that mean they were better than the ChampioNs? BATE beat Bayern once in the groups too...

Performances will always be 2nd to results in top level sport. You're happy to count luck as a factor in the CL, but in the group stages it's no more important than it is in the league. I'm not saying we're amazing, we're far from it ATM... but if we can't be happy about qualifying for the last 16, then we possibly don't deserve to be happy if we turn our season around.

The performances are the reason we are 7th in the league, so not like they are helping the results, are they? I don't care about playing style in cup competitions so long as the league games are good. But they aren't. Its' the same crap week in and week out.

We aren't happy despite qualifying for Last 16 because it is not an indicator of any progress or standing in European football. Our qualification is about as meaningful as if the likes of Porto, Benfica or Shakhtar qualified -- also rans.

 

[Adam-Utd]

Utter tosh and a strawman. Games like yesterday have become the standard. Can't you get your head around people being upset about that?

Could you imagine Guardiola being happy with just winning?. Yes they've got all the money in the world but there's a reason why they're streets ahead of us on the pitch.

We talk about having pride and high standards but we don't keep to them. If we scrapped past YB 1-0 under Fergie with a performance like that he would be going mental.

 

[Ekeke]

There's no reason he can't do what Blind did, he'd be better in the air as well.

There are a few good reasons. 1) He's in his 30s and hasnt played there before unlike Blind who had already played at CB before 2) He doesnt read the game as well as Blind

 

[EwanI Ted]

People nowadays always look for someone to blame and more significantly want instant fixes. All adds up to sack the manager.
He is after all the man in charge of the team.

I can well understand the frustration. We all in truth want the same thing, as does Jose.
If I really thought that replacing him would result in an instant solution to all of our problems then I would be happy for him to go. But I don't.

Our problems run deep and I do believe that Jose is really struggling to deal with them. For the same reason I believe that another manager would equally struggle.

As a club we urgently need clarity of thought and cool heads. Again, I will not seeing that.

Problem with that argument is that he's been with us for three seasons now, so many of these are problems he created. We can't act like he's a new manager who's struggling to come to terms with what he's inherited.

And while few people think a managerial change will solve all our problems overnight, there are plenty of sins being commited on the pitch that a new manager could put right in a short period of time. A lack of basic shape, tempo and tactics don't stem from the malaise at the Board level, they're manifestations of the the coaches' work on the training ground.

 

[Buster15]

The problem is 20% players, 40% Jose and 40% Ed, if you want to give it a hypothetical split.

Bring in someone like Sarri, and he would probably get our players performing at a higher level. Of course, some problems will still persist since our players are mostly not elite and we have a dithering idiot running the club, but sacking the manager is a start, or a step in the right direction.

That is a fair point. Bringing in a new manager may well result in an improvement. My concern is that may not be sustained for very long as the current limitations would resurface.

I am open minded on this issue and maybe a replacement would do the trick. So far this season has been awful and like most I am becoming frustrated by the inconsistent performances and results.

 

[Buster15]

Problem with that argument is that he's been with us for three seasons now, so many of these are problems he created. We can't act like he's a new manager who's struggling to come to terms with what he's inherited.

And while few people think a managerial change will solve all our problems overnight, there are plenty of sins being commited on the pitch that a new manager could put right in a short period of time. A lack of basic shape, tempo and tactics don't stem from the malaise at the Board level, they're manifestations of the the coaches' work on the training ground.

That is understandable my friend. I am not sure who are responsible for the day to day coaching on the training ground.
Does Mourinho oversee this or does he actually take the sessions.

Either way, it is quite obvious that things are not right at that level.

 

[Drz]

There's no reason he can't do what Blind did, he'd be better in the air as well.

Hasn't it been tried already? His reaction time and lack of awareness makes him a poor choice accross the pitch for any team aspiring to be competitive with the best, let alone Young Boys...

 

[Sandikan]

Just home after staying over and driving back today.
What a poor performance. Didn't help having swathes of empty seats either. There were 12 in the row behind me! And you could see big strips of empties in all the stands too. I know the traffic and general Manchester congestion is appalling right now, but that was something else!

On another note, how did their fans sneak so many flares in! We weren't talking 1 or 2, we were talking tonnes!

 

[Lash]

There are a few good reasons. 1) He's in his 30s and hasnt played there before unlike Blind who had already played at CB before 2) He doesnt read the game as well as Blind

Fair points, I thought he had played there previously tbh. Probably just my desire to get him out of midfield, turning into wishful thinking.

Hasn't it been tried already? His reaction time and lack of awareness makes him a poor choice accross the pitch for any team aspiring to be competitive with the best, let alone Young Boys...

I'm not suggesting he should be our 1st choice CB anyway, I was just thinking of anywhere he could be in the team but midfield.

 

[Dr Fink]

How bad was Rashford's decision-making and more importantly finishing last night? He's so, so out of form. Even Martial looked lacking in confidence last night. At least Phil Jones' funny chested back pass lightened the mood at OT last night. A horrible journey in (twice as long with the roadworks) followed by 90 mins of horror - lots of huff and puff by no quality in the final third. Last night's game was a nil-nil; we got away with another one, just like Juventus away.

 

[minoo-utd]

I reached to a point IDK what is wrong with us! Is it players or managers or both? and really Dont know what could fix us?

 

[Turnip]

I feel like it says a lot of our recent performances that I actually thought we were pretty good in the first half. Awful wasted chances (been saying for a while that Rashford isn't good enough in front of goal to be a striker, he's proving it pretty well) and bad possession loses for sure, but over all we were creating chances and not conceding any.

 

[Sassy Colin]

What I don't understand is, why are people blaming only Mourinho again. I didn't see the entire match but saw the highlights.
In those highlights there were enough chances for us to score .Rashford was dangerous but he was not clinical for the goal or key passes. Like the one where he cut back and should have played it straight to Fellaini who would have had a great chance to score or the one where all he had to do was put it past the keeper but put it over the bar.
Is it his fault that Lukaku is not scoring or the other players are not scoring from the chances they get.
We have been extremely wasteful with whatever chances we have got .
It's not Like Mourinho is the 800 Pound Gorrila, he has his flaws and he has not been upto the mark, but the players have not been upto the mark as well . To put the entire blame on Mourinho is not justified.

Doesn't it click with you that Lukaku was a goal machine, and he was in his first season with us, that's why we spent all that money on him. He's Jose's signing but under Jose he has turned to shit.

Rashford couldn't stop scoring in his first season, under LvG, he had a laser guided shot into the back of the net and was brimming with confidence. Jose comes along and he struggles to get a shot on target and his confidence is shot. Look what he does for England.

Sanchez was scoring a goal every other game at Arsenal, he can't score hardly at all at United.

Martial scored nearly 20 goals in his first season, with LvG, not good enough for Jose until, oh wait he can score goals after all.

 

[Sultan]

Chelsea wasn’t a poor performance.

I was referencing the performance, buddy. Rather him bringing up his past achievements just as yesterday. The 3 fingers shown to the crowd at Chelsea was him winning the title 3 times. Juve was him referring to the treble he won at Inter.

 

[Smores]

Doesn't it click with you that Lukaku was a goal machine, and he was in his first season with us, that's why we spent all that money on him. He's Jose's signing but under Jose he has turned to shit.

Rashford couldn't stop scoring in his first season, under LvG, he had a laser guided shot into the back of the net and was brimming with confidence. Jose comes along and he struggles to get a shot on target and his confidence is shot. Look what he does for England.

Sanchez was scoring a goal every other game at Arsenal, he can't score hardly at all at United.

Martial scored nearly 20 goals in his first season, with LvG, not good enough for Jose until, oh wait he can score goals after all.

As you say poor coaching doesn't seem to have effected Martials finishing so why would it be to blame for Lukaku and Rashford missing chances?

I can totally get on board blaming the manager when opportunities are few as that's signings/tactics but when it's poor finishing it's on the players.

It doesn't make sense to think that Rashford has a couple of days training with England and can score and then when he comes back forgets all that and our training methods mean he's worse at finishing within a week

 

[haram]

I was referencing the performance, buddy. Rather him bringing up his past achievements just as yesterday. The 3 fingers shown to the crowd at Chelsea was him winning the title 3 times. Juve was him referring to the treble he won at Inter.

How was he deflecting from a poor performance if the performance wasn’t poor though?

 

[zenith]

By the sound of it , I didn't miss much. At this point one wonders about the erosion of your fan base worldwide. Cause this shit show has reached a point where fans would be apathetic about our results in general.

 

[Sied]

Doesn't it click with you that Lukaku was a goal machine, and he was in his first season with us, that's why we spent all that money on him. He's Jose's signing but under Jose he has turned to shit.

Rashford couldn't stop scoring in his first season, under LvG, he had a laser guided shot into the back of the net and was brimming with confidence. Jose comes along and he struggles to get a shot on target and his confidence is shot. Look what he does for England.

Sanchez was scoring a goal every other game at Arsenal, he can't score hardly at all at United.

Martial scored nearly 20 goals in his first season, with LvG, not good enough for Jose until, oh wait he can score goals after all.

To play devil's advocate, how do you explain all of Mourinho's success at previous clubs? All of the players who have improved under him during his career?

 

[Sassy Colin]

To play devil's advocate, how do you explain all of Mourinho's success at previous clubs? All of the players who have improved under him during his career?

Who cares what went before, it only matters what's happening now.

 

[RAVred]

Why do we actually play worse at home now, I seriously think these players have no back bone either

 

[Paul the Wolf]

Just watched it now.

Rashford so wasteful, Matic so slow, Lingard so pointless.

Had enough chances to win it easily but poor shooting, poor decisions and lack of width.
DDG had one thing to do all night and made a brilliant save.

We actually seemed quite lively early on but if Matic got involved it all slowed down.
Smalling and Jones had good games. Valencia seemed anonymous.
Fred gave us a bit of urgency but short of match sharpness.

Last minute goal to go through. So Mourinho carries on so he can pick Matic and Lingard forever.