In multiple finals?
The only one where they ran Utd ragged was the 2011 final.
Pep is a good manager. But so overrated.
Varchester City 18/19 discussion
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The only one where they ran Utd ragged was the 2011 final.
Pep is a good manager. But so overrated.
They ran us over in both finals to be honest.
He just has massive respect for both Klopp and Liverpool. He devoted almost an entire chapter in his book about Klopp's Dortmund and why Klopp's philosophy is effective against his. He also has a horrible record against Liverpool (even as a player he lost there).
But I don't believe he's shitting himself. He's just playing his version of mind games. I think he knows he can figure them out (as evidenced by Bayern eventually outmaneuvering Dortmund) and feels he can beat them at Etihad. Arguably he got the better of Klopp in the match at Anfield in October.
I mean, the comments about Liverpool being the best team in the world makes it obvious to see. He obviously doesn't believe this. It's a psychological thing....mind games.
Also I believe Pep would still beat Man Utd to the title even if Ferguson was in charge. Ferguson won more but I believe Guardiola is a more competent manager at building teams and winning trophies. (Obviously he's younger and managed for less times so less trophies). I don't think Ferguson would ever have reached 100 points in a league with modern day Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs, Man City. It's my opinion.
Hope your right.
They might not be spending in January, but I think they will have a clearout in the summer. If City do not win the league this season, they will make sure they try to put it right.
From walking the league, still spending silly money and have gone backwards.
If they don't get to the semi or final of the CL surely big questions to be asked? (Not saying sacking, they're not that stupid) but surely they can't throw a couple hundred more million in to it at the summer?
And people say Pep is better at building teams? Of course he is with that kind of budget FFS.
If they don't get to the semi or final of the CL surely big questions to be asked? (Not saying sacking, they're not that stupid) but surely they can't throw a couple hundred more million in to it at the summer?
And people say Pep is better at building teams? Of course he is with that kind of budget FFS.
The 2009 final we were favourites going into that game. Fergie tactics cost us and the game was not one sided as the 2011 final. We lost both games, but to say we were played with in the 2009 final is a myth.
Yes, we were favourites but apart from the first ten minutes, we barely got a snif. The 2011 one was a masterclass though.
A masterclass like when Barca battered Peps Bayen 6-1 in the semi finals a few years later.
Maybe it wasn't Pep who was the reason, it was Messi.
According to MEN, Fernandinho, Silva and KDB started together 18 out of the first 20 league games last season.
This season, they haven't started a single league game together.
If City somehow manage to win vs Liverpool, they will be just 4 pts off with their big guns coming back for the second half of the season.
This season, they haven't started a single league game together.
If City somehow manage to win vs Liverpool, they will be just 4 pts off with their big guns coming back for the second half of the season.
I still maintain they’re a far superior team to Liverpool. They should win on Thursday, and that will be a significant hit to Liverpool’s confidence going into the second half of the season. Plenty of time left in this league. I still expect Liverpool to finish 2nd.
In terms of points per game this "bottler" of a current season for City would still rank top 3 in SAFs career, 0.04 ppg behind his all time best. Sometimes the hyperboles on the caf are just sad.
I too believe they will win it. Liverpool are a momentum side. I think the first rough patch they hit will prove costly. City will win most games through sheer quality.
Can't underestimate how important Thursday's game is. City win and I think they sail off.
Can't underestimate how important Thursday's game is. City win and I think they sail off.
Wow that is huge. It's like Liverpool being without Mane, Salah and Wijnaldum. So we'd be forced to play with Keita, Shaqiri and Lallana/Sturridge.
Whereas City have been 'forced' to play with Gundogan, B Silva and Sane/Mahrez.
Wow that is huge. It's like Liverpool being without Mane, Salah and Wijnaldum. So we'd be forced to play with Keita, Shaqiri and Lallana/Sturridge.
Whereas City have been 'forced' to play with Gundogan, B Silva and Sane/Mahrez.
KDB's absence didn't kill them because Bernardo was good. But Fernandinho and Silva being out vs Palace and Leicester plus KDB not being in form yet plus Mendy out and Walker being poor has ruined their their chances to a significant extent. Still, they win the game with you, they win the title imo.
Imagine if you miss out on the title after having by far the best league campaign in your history and being 7-10 pts clear off your rivals at the start of the 2nd half of the season. It would be funny.
Yeah but SAF was more interested in retaining titles, not breaking silly points tally records.
Yeah, SAF too had billions spent on his squad didn't he?
If you really want to make comparisons then let it be even on all levels...
I’d argue that Fernandinho is the key player in this City squad. His type of play is crucial in Guardiola’s setup (with similar roles being key in his Barcelona and Bayern sides). And look at the two losses they’ve recently suffered: Fernandinho was absent. Look at the other games in which City suffered: opponents were able to neutralise him.
Which makes it even more surprising: every single position in their squad is covered twice (or even threefold). Except Fernandinho’s. They had to play emergency solutions like Gundogan recently, who has a more attacking naturel. And that’s definitely their weak spot. No wonder they are chasing the likes of Frenkie de Jong, if those rumours are true. He could play in that role perfectly and add more depth to City’s squad in their most volnurable position.
Which makes it even more surprising: every single position in their squad is covered twice (or even threefold). Except Fernandinho’s. They had to play emergency solutions like Gundogan recently, who has a more attacking naturel. And that’s definitely their weak spot. No wonder they are chasing the likes of Frenkie de Jong, if those rumours are true. He could play in that role perfectly and add more depth to City’s squad in their most volnurable position.
Most Liverpool fans, as you will have seen, still don't believe we can do it. And if we don't then we will be sad but nothing can cut us like the 2014 season. That was the tipping point unfortunately.
Even if we win it I won't believe it until after the charity shield game. Just in case we're done for doping or fielding an ineligible player thus having the title revoked. That's how bad things have become.
Saying all that, having Klopp as our manager is what keeps us going. Serial loser or otherwise.
SAF didn't have a blank chequebook and you can't compare points tallies across seasons. United 98/99 was a better team than Chelsea 16/17 no matter what the points tally says.
As things stand it appears as though Pep can't even retain the PL despite having the deepest pockets let alone dominate it for multiple eras.
I see where you are coming from. Most Liverpool fans on here might be extremely cautious indeed but I'm not sure whether that's the case at rawk or similar places. Anyhow, you are clear favourites now. Win in 3 days and you'll be almost there.
All these Liverpool fans pretending they are being calm and cautious and playing it down are actually all giddy as feck deep down and just trying not to jinx it. You should all be buzzing ffs!
Looking forward to the game on Thursday but City have to win, even though clearly it's to reduce the points, they'll need to stop Liverpools momentum.
I don't agree about the last part. Fergie's biggest strength was adapting to the surroundings and winning vs whoever was the biggest opponent, also making a great team out of players who would be just average anywhere else. He would have adapted to Pep, Klopp and whoever is out there.
Agreed.
I agree that was his biggest strength but I still don't think he would have beat this Pep's City (I think what they're going through is a blip).
We were in a stronger position with three games to go in 2014, then we threw it all away.
This team looks far more solid than that one did, but this City squad/manager is better than the one from back then as well.
Avoid defeat on Thursday and I'll start to feel confident but I'm not making any assumptions.
We didn't spend silly money in the summer, comparatively. Our only first team signing was Mahrez for 60m, who has been very poor thus far and hasn't added anything we didn't already have (as well as hastening the departure of Diaz). We would've been far better served spending that 60m on cover for Fernandinho and cover for left back. As it is, we've again lost Mendy for most of the season and Fernandinho has missed a few games. At left back we've had Delph/Zinchenko to cover Mendy, neither of whom are left backs, and both of them have been guilty of giving away goals the past few games. In central midfield, we've primarily had Gundogan to cover Fernandinho, but he lacks the mobility to play the role, so we become a lot easier to play through. Generally I think we're a very well run club, but I think we planned poorly over the summer. There should've been another option on the table when Jorginho went to Chelsea, for example.
It's fair to say we've also been hit with injuries to other key players, notably KDB (he's started one league game), Silva. and Aguero. We've managed to carry these injuries pretty well in the circumstances due to the quality of the squad, but fair play to Liverpool they have been relentless so far.
And no, big questions won't be asked within City if we don't reach the semi-final/final of the CL. Clearly Guardiola is in a very comfortable position at the club, he's not going to get sacked if we don't reach the semi-final/final of the CL. The pressure for City to succeed in the CL always seems to be from opposition fans for some reason, it certainly doesn't come from City (though of course the club want to do well in the CL).
no pressure to do well in CL .
Do you think City will sack Guardiola if we get knocked out in last 16? I certainly don't.
As I stated, of course the club want to do well in the CL.
People saying that Liverpool have the title wrapped up is just being ridiculous.
I'm a Liverpool fan but a loss against City at their stadium (which is very likely) and a loss at Old Trafford (where Liverpool have a horrible record) is also likely.
That's 6 points already gone and if City go on another run then it's only 1 point separating the teams and it's all up for grabs.
Anything can happen at this point. It's still too early. Arsenal lead the table by a couple points at this point several times in the past couple years and also lost the league.
I still feel City are favorites but if Liverpool beat City on Thursday then they would be favorites.
I'm a Liverpool fan but a loss against City at their stadium (which is very likely) and a loss at Old Trafford (where Liverpool have a horrible record) is also likely.
That's 6 points already gone and if City go on another run then it's only 1 point separating the teams and it's all up for grabs.
Anything can happen at this point. It's still too early. Arsenal lead the table by a couple points at this point several times in the past couple years and also lost the league.
I still feel City are favorites but if Liverpool beat City on Thursday then they would be favorites.
No and he never said that either. You are the one who mentioned that there is no pressure.
In what world? Pep has never stayed long enough in one place to turn over a squad and rebuild it, which is one of the hardest things to do for a manager while still pushing for titles. Ferguson did this over and over again, at the highest levels all while adapting to new styles in the game throughout his career.
I don't even understand the basis for why he wouldn't be able to push the othe top-6 clubs (seriously you don't think he could keep up with Emery and Poch?) if he was handed the same type of resources United has handed to managers post-Ferguson. If he had that type of backing in the market, United would have continued to dominate the league until at least last season without a doubt imo.
Yea slightly crossed paths... in my original reply I was responding to "If they don't get to the semi or final of the CL surely big questions to be asked?" from Steeeb. For what it's worth, Khaldoon has consistently always stated in his end of year reviews that the club would like to do well in the CL, but the PL will always be the bread and butter. I think if City ever were to sack Pep, it would be for under-performance in the PL rather than the CL.
On my original comment, the point I was making is that the "yea but what about the CL?" is the comment often appended to any critique of City. I understand it's a trophy we haven't won, but I think its importance is over-emphasised by opposition fans more because it's an easy stick than because of it being a fair critique. Obviously the club want to do well in the CL, obviously the club have spent lots of money and so probably feel that they should do well in the CL. But at the end of the day, the CL is a cup competition. You need a great team and some luck along the way to win it.
That defence is there for a tearing on Thursday.
With an unlimited budget (as Pep has had) he would do.
My mate of 25 years is a genuinely level headed city fan none of this rag & swamp crap at least to my face anyway.
I like discussing football related matters with him.. However the recent dip and his reaction to it has been ridiculously dramatic.
They are so fickle them fans and even though he is a ST holder he isn't attending the Liverpool match as he "knows" that the premier league have an agenda against city and the referee will give them the 3 points
I laughed in his face about how stupid this is however he took offence and walked out the pub... Says it all.
I like discussing football related matters with him.. However the recent dip and his reaction to it has been ridiculously dramatic.
They are so fickle them fans and even though he is a ST holder he isn't attending the Liverpool match as he "knows" that the premier league have an agenda against city and the referee will give them the 3 points
I laughed in his face about how stupid this is however he took offence and walked out the pub... Says it all.
I think the Mahrez signing was a massive feck up from City. They had a perfect attack with settled players destroying the opposition. Now their new big money signing has to be played leading to Sane being on the bench and he can't be happy. That money should have been spent on a decent backup defensive midfielder. To think about it, they've spent all that money and don't have genuine central midfielder on the bench.
Bollocks. He beat Jose's Chelsea who were just as dominant, if not moreso than Pep's City - especially considering he was also up against an all-time great Arsenal side at the same time.