Ole Gunnar Solskjaer | W15 D2 L4

[RasTiaGba]

No transfers in 2 windows with a team that barely has enough depth and has been missing key players for long spells yet they are still in the title race. I think there is more going on that just being a financial mastermind not to mention that Spurs actually play good football and have a solid defense.

He should know as a manager that Kane was going to get injured one day

That's why he signed two back-ups; Janssen and Llorente, and both are arguably failures.

People say he's made no transfers as if that's a good thing. It's not.

He is linked with James Maddison for £50m, who is a poor man's Eriksen, and who didn't look better than any Celtic players when he was in the SPL. (Celtic recently sold a midfielder who looked a similar quality if not better when in the same league for 12 million)

So if he did make signings, there's an argument they're overvalued signings that don't improve the team.

If he was a true serial winner then he'd have signed squad players, so that he can rotate and keep his team fresh to fight on all fronts like City, Liverpool and United do. Instead of pretending the FA cup isn't success.

The clock is ticking on Poch bud, in his own words he said Spurs will be like Real Madrid in 5 years.
So in 4 years when he's still not won anything he could arguably be sacked from Spurs.

 

[Rish Sawhney]

No transfers in 2 windows with a team that barely has enough depth and has been missing key players for long spells yet they are still in the title race. I think there is more going on that just being a financial mastermind not to mention that Spurs actually play good football and have a solid defense.

But they don't do that with average players, they do that with top class players. Their backline is better than ours and so is their front 4 arguably. So I don't get this bending over backwards to show that Poch has done something above and beyond what a normal good coach could do. Winning something with that squad would be special. Poch hasn't achieved "special" yet. He's achieved "admirable" at most.

 

[Canagel]

 

[Mastadon]

He should know as a manager that Kane was going to get injured one day

That's why he signed two back-ups; Janssen and Llorente, and both are arguably failures.

People say he's made no transfers as if that's a good thing. It's not.

He is linked with James Maddison for £50m, who is a poor man's Eriksen, and who didn't look better than any Celtic players when he was in the SPL. (Celtic recently sold a midfielder who looked a similar quality if not better when in the same league for 12 million)

So if he did make signings, there's an argument they're overvalued signings that don't improve the team.

If he was a true serial winner then he'd have signed squad players, so that he can rotate and keep his team fresh to fight on all fronts like City, Liverpool and United do. Instead of pretending the FA cup isn't success.

The clock is ticking on Poch bud, in his own words he said Spurs will be like Real Madrid in 5 years.
So in 4 years when he's still not won anything he could arguably be sacked from Spurs.

Who said it was a good thing not to make transfers? It’s a huge disadvantage nobody in their right mind would think that Poch wouldn’t love to blow 200m in a transfer window as some kind of spending parity with the other clubs. Imagine how good Spurs would be with a proper transfer budget. Thankfully they don’t have one but if they did imagine how much better they would be.

 

[Amadaeus]

If we win the FA cup this season that's arguably better than anything Poch has done at Spurs.

Clubs like Man United would have a successful season (with the high standards you hold Ole to), by winning a FA cup and finishing top 4. Whereas the lower standards you hold Poch to, he doesn't need to win an FA cup or anything.

Both clubs have different ambitions. Staying top four and getting champions league football is more important to Pochettino than winning a competition that they don’t or barely even show on tv anymore. When Pochettino start spending like an elite club, then his priorities will differ.

You have said over multiple posts Poch is better with transfers, better tactically and better at man management (you said he'd get Sanchez and Lukaku looking like players), and to be honest after thats its not much left. Press relations? Talent development?. Also since you prefer him over a club legend, it is pretty evident you rate him higher as a manager

And that is all true, but I have never stated he is a better manager solely because of his league standings but moreso what he has accomplished tactical and interpersonally with Spurs over the past few season with barely the same level of support you see at a club like United, Chelsea, City, Liverpool and Arsenal. Anyone that don’t rate Pochettino higher than Ole must have red tinted glasses on as Ole career at a elite club is only down to ten games. In ten games Sarri was undefeated at Chelsea, now he looks like he might be getting the sack. In a whole season, ranieri won the league, but now he is irrelevant. When a manager has performed consistently season in and season out, that should earn a lot of praise.

When Pochettino got there is 2014 a lot of the groundwork was laid and continued to do good work there no doubt. In 2014 though we had Giggs as a manager at the time and Wenger had regular boos at Emirates, Chelsea had no less than 5 managers from then to now. In other words, things have not exactly been rosy at the other top clubs which has helped Tottenham climb the table. That bolded part though is exactly why i am a bit skeptical with Poch.

You can claim that things were not rosy, but in those years, we won the European cup, finished second and won few domestic cup. We were competitive then and not like we we struggled all the time. Same goes for the other top club. They had season where they were competitive. Spurs under Pochettino has been consistently good despite the competition and the amount of financial spending he faced from his rivals.

Despite being engulfed in chaos, the other top teams still have managed to pick up some silverware here and there and he has not. Poch is not doubt a fantastic team builder, but i dont think he has the bottle to get over the line when it matters the most.

Poch has done better than pick up silverware with what he had at his disposal. When you look at other teams outside the top 5 financial big spenders that have picked up trophies, they are either relegated or mid table clubs. These trophies have been dominated by the clubs that spend big so it is no surprise that he has not gotten a trophy yet. If he had that would have been an amazing achievement along with his domestic league performance.

So is OK for you if we beat Liverpool 3-0 on sunday? What if Wolves knock us out in the FA Cup or we get thrashed 4-1 by Man City?

Based on the performance, Ole will pass that criteria. Even if Wolves get us knocked out and we get thrashed by Manchester City, it shows to me that Ole is capable of making this United team once again part of the European elite. If he beats Liverpool like that, it is hard to believe that it was just luck and he should be able to do it again. However, I admit there are things such as fluke victories as such, I would not jump so quickly on the bandwagon. For that to happen, Ole will need to meet other criteria’s that admittedly will be very hard to overcome as just a temp manager. But regardless, as I stated before, I don’t think Ole would be a bad appointment. I just believe Pochettino will be a better one. After the psg game, I also believed that Tuchel and Zidane may as well be to.

 

[Aloysius's Back 3]

Ambitions of a club or a manger shouldn't get in the way of winning a cup - you beat the team in front of you when you can & if you keep doing so then you win a cup.

Problem for Pochettino so far is that there is always a loss somewhere in the mist of the wins.

 

[Tarrou]

so eloquently and perfectly put

can't believe we still have United fans who aren't convinced he should be given a crack

 

[Sandikan]

Say Ole does the job for the rest of the season. Gets you top 4, maybe the FA cup, and gets the job permanent. I imagine much gratitude must be shown to his former club Molde, to allow all of this to happen. Gotta be the first time ever a club lets their manager go on "loan" to another team. A very unusual situation.

They're getting a hefty wad of cash for it in fairness.

 

[Samid]

They're getting a hefty wad of cash for it in fairness.

Their annual budget is £9m. If the reported fee is correct they'll be laughing all the way to the bank. Not to mention potential friendly and also loan players.

 

[TCT]

It was weird when Ole got appointed before christmas, because I was somewhat sceptical, or if I'm more honest, afraid he would fail.

Norwegian media are terrible whenever some norwegian get some international attention, so I kept my enthusiasm on a minimum...until after his debut win, then I couldn't keep my joy to myself anymore. The only other big english following in Norway is Liverpool, and I love the fact that United get so much coverage here (compared to before) before and after each United game as it pisses my Liverpool mates off. Funnily enough my other mates who supports Chelsea/other clubs and others who dont even usually pay attention to football, have grown some sympathi towards United because of Ole, and the official norwegiean fanclub has grown too.

That effect probably doesn't translate to every nation on the globe (Norway has some inferior complex), but it is romantic and why most of us started following this club.

He's already proven his merit with his run, now let us see him having a real go. Every trophy he wins will be more magical. Imagine SAF watching Ole lift the PL compared to other managers at the helm. Fearing Ole will fail? Ole doesn't, and he's the kind of person that rather resign because he doesn't belive he can take the club further, than doing a Mou.

With that said, I wouldn't mind Poch.

 

[Gasolin]

If Eric is happy, so am I!

 

[Dve]

Agreed. Although if we got a top-class alternative you imagine they'd be happy with that too.

Their annual budget is £9m. If the reported fee is correct they'll be laughing all the way to the bank. Not to mention potential friendly and also loan players.

Negotiations. That´s why it´s still not announced.

(maybe).

 

[JohnnyKills]

If Eric is happy, so am I!

Agree. There's so much to like about Solskjaer. The fact that he's willing to promote youth is the best thing.

We just need to be double sure about this before we do it. If Solskjaer isn't the best available candidate we shouldn't hire him.

Tbh I'm a bit worried about him calling Fergie 'the Gaffer.' Fergie's the best manager there'll ever be but we need to move on and adapting with the times (as Fergie himself did so successfully).

Personally I'd still go Pochettino for his greater experience but if not him, then OGS. No other candidates.

 

[JohnnyKills]

They're getting a hefty wad of cash for it in fairness.

Molde would love this to happen. United (as far as I know) are the biggest club In Norway and it would be amazing publicity for them.

 

[jymufc20]

They're getting a hefty wad of cash for it in fairness.

Still, it's pretty awesome from them to let him go on loan like that.

 

[Dve]

Molde would love this to happen. United (as far as I know) are the biggest club In Norway and it would be amazing publicity for them.

For Molde, this is publicity not only in Norway (where everyone knows them anyway), but also world wide. For sure they are more know now as a club than a couple of months ago, which could help them on the player marked outside Norway (which to them means Scandinavia and Africa).

 

[FootyGirl88]

Agree. There's so much to like about Solskjaer. The fact that he's willing to promote youth is the best thing.

We just need to be double sure about this before we do it. If Solskjaer isn't the best available candidate we shouldn't hire him.

Tbh I'm a bit worried about him calling Fergie 'the Gaffer.' Fergie's the best manager there'll ever be but we need to move on and adapting with the times (as Fergie himself did so successfully).

Personally I'd still go Pochettino for his greater experience but if not him, then OGS. No other candidates.

Why is that a problem? All of his ex players call him that.

 

[Rish Sawhney]

I love the "We just need to be double sure about this before we do it" lines. Somehow they only apply to Ole and not to Poch, its great. I'm not even sure what this means. Wasn't pretty much everyone here double sure about Mourinho? How does one become "double sure" without giving him the permanent job and seeing how he does in 2 years? Is Poch a "double sure" candidate because he took a team from consistently 5th to consistently 3rd?

 

[JohnnyKills]

Why is that a problem? All of his ex players call him that.

One of them is now the gaffer himself though.

 

[Foxtrot]

If we actually beat Burnley which let's be honest we really should have, it's 12 straight domestic wins. Just incredible and unbelievable really.

 

[redmanx]

Agree. There's so much to like about Solskjaer. The fact that he's willing to promote youth is the best thing.

We just need to be double sure about this before we do it. If Solskjaer isn't the best available candidate we shouldn't hire him.

Tbh I'm a bit worried about him calling Fergie 'the Gaffer.' Fergie's the best manager there'll ever be but we need to move on and adapting with the times (as Fergie himself did so successfully).

Personally I'd still go Pochettino for his greater experience but if not him, then OGS. No other candidates.

Since Fergie we've hired 3 managers who all failed, 3 managers who each tried to rebuild United in his own vision, 3 managers each of whom had no feelings for our history, culture, beliefs and principles; if we hire Pocchettino we'll have exactly the same again, but unlike Poch, Mourinho, LVG and Moyes Ole is not simply a football mercenary, he understands what makes United special, he cares about our past, and our future, he loves the club and its supporters, and so far hes proved that its possible to rebuild Manchester United along the lines and principles set up by Matt Busby and enhanced by Fergie, I truly believe Ole is the one we've been waiting for, as Eric Cantona said, Ole is Feries natural successor. Give him the job NOW!

 

[RedMachine03]

 

[Rish Sawhney]

In that article:

"After last week’s Champions League defeat to Paris Saint-Germain, the one blot on his copybook in 13 games so far, the dressing-room door was shut for a quarter of an hour while Solskjaer addressed the players and their shortcomings on the night. As they emerged, one member of staff was heard to say, ‘now that’s what I call coaching a team’."

If thats true thats quite something. Sounds almost too good to be true though. And it is the Daily Mail.

 

[Tiber]

Ole has already moved out of the hotel. The Toxic One's entire reign feels so strange

 

[JohnnyKills]

Since Fergie we've hired 3 managers who all failed, 3 managers who each tried to rebuild United in his own vision, 3 managers each of whom had no feelings for our history, culture, beliefs and principles; if we hire Pocchettino we'll have exactly the same again, but unlike Poch, Mourinho, LVG and Moyes Ole is not simply a football mercenary, he understands what makes United special, he cares about our past, and our future, he loves the club and its supporters, and so far hes proved that its possible to rebuild Manchester United along the lines and principles set up by Matt Busby and enhanced by Fergie, I truly believe Ole is the one we've been waiting for, as Eric Cantona said, Ole is Feries natural successor. Give him the job NOW!

You could literally say the same about every single member of the Caf.

 

[Paul InceUlt]

You could literally say the same about every single member of the Caf.

In an article in Supporters Club Scandinavia they refer to him as a former player, now manager, but a man who first and foremost sees himself as a Manchester United supporter.... so that would explain it.

 

[Lj82]

One of them is now the gaffer himself though.

Only the insecure will have problems calling SAF the gaffer though. Ole seems perfectly comfortable

 

[redDNA]

I agree that we should wait till the end of the season.

We should stop using 13 matches as a sample size for Ole at United and many years for Poch at Spurs.

Ole's sample size at United is 13 matches ,while Poch's sample size at United is zero, no two scenarios are the same, LVG and Mourinho were successful elsewhere but failed at United. It's wishful thinking that since Poch. is succeeding at Spurs he will succeed at United.

At least we have seen what Ole's United is/will look like(and most of us like it), we don't know what Poch's United will look like.

It's like ignoring a high performing temporal staff who relates well with his superiors and colleagues, knows the company's culture, mission and vision for a good permanent staff at a smaller company who may or may not get along with his superiors and colleagues, may buckle under pressure, may or may not understand the company. The latter carries more risk than the former.

Ole is our man and our results against City, Liverpool won't change my mind.

 

[Chairman Steve]

Interesting how Carrick and McKenna were excluded from Jose’s last coaching meeting. I’ve suspected that they were not picked by JM and were possibly board picks to possibly get us to playing better. I’ve also wondered over Farias departure too. I don’t think it was voluntary on his part as it’s been made out...

 

[ravelston]

Both clubs have different ambitions. Staying top four and getting champions league football is more important to Pochettino than winning a competition that they don’t or barely even show on tv anymore. When Pochettino start spending like an elite club, then his priorities will differ.

You can claim that things were not rosy, but in those years, we won the European cup, finished second and won few domestic cup. We were competitive then and not like we we struggled all the time. Same goes for the other top club. They had season where they were competitive. Spurs under Pochettino has been consistently good despite the competition and the amount of financial spending he faced from his rivals.

This narrative - that Pochettino has done amazingly considering the impoverished quality of his squad - is starting to wear a little thin. Since he joined Spurs the club has spent £240m on players. That's in addition to the £80m spent on players that remain in the squad from before his arrival. So his squad has a cost basis of around £320m. But let's think about value. Spurs have done well by buying promising players and allowing them to develop at the club. Think about some of the costs and the players' possible current values:

Cost Value
Eriksen 11,000,000 50,000,000
Vertonghen 10,000,000 40,000,000
Alli 5,000,000 50,000,000
Dier 4,000,000 35,000,000
Son 22,000,000 35,000,000
Alderwiereld 11,500,000 35,000,000
Trippier 3,500,000 25,000,000

Totals 67,000,000 270,000,000

So, even with these conservative valuations, these players are now worth £200m more than when they were bought, giving a current squad value of £520m. But wait, that's without Kane. If Kane is worth £80m then the total squad value has to be at least £600m. For what it's worth, transfermarkt.com thinks they're worth €913m. And, for comparison, Liverpool's squad is valued at €926m - not much in it, is there. (And how's Pochettino going to do at United - our squad is only worth €759m?)

So what's the take away here. First: Pochettino and Klopp have very comparable squads in terms of value (they're both about €100m behind City) and neither of them has won anything yet. Second: if Ole can get what we've seen out of the current squad, imagine what he'd do with a squad as good as Klopp's or Pochettino's. Third: why would Pochettino want to come and struggle here when he's already got a good squad with a new stadium just around the corner.

[Edit: Keep forgetting that tables don't line up right. Anyway, I'm sure you get what I mean.]

 

[Aloysius's Back 3]

This narrative - that Pochettino has done amazingly considering the impoverished quality of his squad - is starting to wear a little thin. Since he joined Spurs the club has spent £240m on players. That's in addition to the £80m spent on players that remain in the squad from before his arrival. So his squad has a cost basis of around £320m. But let's think about value. Spurs have done well by buying promising players and allowing them to develop at the club. Think about some of the costs and the players' possible current values:

Cost Value
Eriksen 11,000,000 50,000,000
Vertonghen 10,000,000 40,000,000
Alli 5,000,000 50,000,000
Dier 4,000,000 35,000,000
Son 22,000,000 35,000,000
Alderwiereld 11,500,000 35,000,000
Trippier 3,500,000 25,000,000

Totals 67,000,000 270,000,000

So, even with these conservative valuations, these players are now worth £200m more than when they were bought, giving a current squad value of £520m. But wait, that's without Kane. If Kane is worth £80m then the total squad value has to be at least £600m. For what it's worth, transfermarkt.com thinks they're worth €913m. And, for comparison, Liverpool's squad is valued at €926m - not much in it, is there. (And how's Pochettino going to do at United - our squad is only worth €759m?)

So what's the take away here. First: Pochettino and Klopp have very comparable squads in terms of value (they're both about €100m behind City) and neither of them has won anything yet. Second: if Ole can get what we've seen out of the current squad, imagine what he'd do with a squad as good as Klopp's or Pochettino's. Third: why would Pochettino want to come and struggle here when he's already got a good squad with a new stadium just around the corner.

[Edit: Keep forgetting that tables don't line up right. Anyway, I'm sure you get what I mean.]

Bravo

 

[Tarrou]

This narrative - that Pochettino has done amazingly considering the impoverished quality of his squad - is starting to wear a little thin. Since he joined Spurs the club has spent £240m on players. That's in addition to the £80m spent on players that remain in the squad from before his arrival. So his squad has a cost basis of around £320m. But let's think about value. Spurs have done well by buying promising players and allowing them to develop at the club. Think about some of the costs and the players' possible current values:

Cost Value
Eriksen 11,000,000 50,000,000
Vertonghen 10,000,000 40,000,000
Alli 5,000,000 50,000,000
Dier 4,000,000 35,000,000
Son 22,000,000 35,000,000
Alderwiereld 11,500,000 35,000,000
Trippier 3,500,000 25,000,000

Totals 67,000,000 270,000,000

So, even with these conservative valuations, these players are now worth £200m more than when they were bought, giving a current squad value of £520m. But wait, that's without Kane. If Kane is worth £80m then the total squad value has to be at least £600m. For what it's worth, transfermarkt.com thinks they're worth €913m. And, for comparison, Liverpool's squad is valued at €926m - not much in it, is there. (And how's Pochettino going to do at United - our squad is only worth €759m?)

So what's the take away here. First: Pochettino and Klopp have very comparable squads in terms of value (they're both about €100m behind City) and neither of them has won anything yet. Second: if Ole can get what we've seen out of the current squad, imagine what he'd do with a squad as good as Klopp's or Pochettino's. Third: why would Pochettino want to come and struggle here when he's already got a good squad with a new stadium just around the corner.

[Edit: Keep forgetting that tables don't line up right. Anyway, I'm sure you get what I mean.]

That isn't a narrative I've seen at all. People recognise the quality of the squad and are praising Poch for building it, on a much lower budget than his rivals.

And I see lots of people criticise Poch here for not winning trophies despite having a squad good enough to compete.

 

[ravelston]

That isn't a narrative I've seen at all. People recognise the quality of the squad and are praising Poch for building it, on a much lower budget than his rivals.

And I see lots of people criticise Poch here for not winning trophies despite having a squad good enough to compete.

You haven't looked very carefully. There's a pervasive theme that, if he had the money, Pochettino will automatically be able to build a winning team at United (or, indeed, anywhere). One of the points I was illustrating is that he already has a very good team, and yet he still hasn't won anything.

 

[Tarrou]

You haven't looked very carefully. There's a pervasive theme that, if he had the money, Pochettino will automatically be able to build a winning team at United (or, indeed, anywhere). One of the points I was illustrating is that he already has a very good team, and yet he still hasn't won anything.

Fair enough, I disagree but we're in the Ole thread so will leave it there.

 

[Aloysius's Back 3]

Spurs had all this before pochettin0 - Lloris, Kyle walker, Rose, vertonghen, Dembele, Eriksen, Kane, Lamela, whilst having some players that were replaced like Sandr0, Sigurdsson, Paulinh0, bentaleb & Chadli. The year before that spurs sold Bale for a world record fee as well.

Spurs has added under pochettin0 -
1)good players like aldeweireld, Son, alli, Davies, Dier
2) average players that are rather inconsistent - sissoko, wanyama, Lucas, aurier, Sanchez, janssen, fazi0, Llorente, N'jie, Foyth, wimmer, vorm, N'koud0u.

Pochettin0 is a good coach but some of the love for him is seriously overrated. Spurs have always been a club that had the ability to find some really good players - we as a club used to buy their best players for stupendous prices or atleast target them. Spurs are a growing as a club and that is due to the stadium, Levy who is fantastic & pochettin0 being a decent manager.

Why people expect him to be this wonder manager though seriously deceives me - especially at a time when we have a United bred manager pulling out results with ease. Especially since he hasn't done anything all that special with spurs in my opinion.

Has spurs made this top 4 regular because they have been so great or because clubs like United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool have all been so inconsistent?

Why did Leicester win the league & not spurs? It was clearly not the money right? Its because Ranieri was a better manager than Pochettino that year.

Even if that's not important - Pochettino 's ability to get Spurs consistently in to Top 4 is just as much down to other clubs failing than it is just purely down to the managers ability.

Is it really that hard to get 3rd or 4th when

* A club Chelsea sack manager that won them the leagues & replace them with a manager like sarri

* a club like arsenal hold on to their legendary manager for far too long causing a serious level of stagnation at the club; allowing spurs to overtake them as the better club - SAF himself said that wenger staying at arsenal was not good for them

* a club like Liverpool had horrible average managers & players until Klopp - who is much more capable manager than Pochettino

* a club like ours literally until the last 3 months have been a shadow of our former selves - resorting to cheap tactics & managers that don't fit our ethos - only to feel the result of such poor decisions later on in the league & matches.


I just don't get it - why is Pochettino's spurs viewed as a complete result of his management when so many clubs have been underperforming around him.

I totally agree with you @ravelston

 

[CG1010]

With due respect to all posters in this thread, I wish all the Poch talk would be toned down here. Ole has done enough already to move out of Poch's shadows and the job is surely his to lose now. Would rather focus on Ole now and his achievements than any other opposition manager. Maybe a separate comparison thread can be made?

 

[RedMachine03]

 

[RasTiaGba]

Who said it was a good thing not to make transfers? It’s a huge disadvantage nobody in their right mind would think that Poch wouldn’t love to blow 200m in a transfer window as some kind of spending parity with the other clubs. Imagine how good Spurs would be with a proper transfer budget. Thankfully they don’t have one but if they did imagine how much better they would be.

Spoiler: Off topic; Why Poch isn't as good as made out in this thread

In the same post, you go on to make out as if Poch will be a guaranteed success in the transfer market when he spends. @Amadeus also implies this.

That's your opinions.

But mine is that Poch is linked with James Maddison for 50 million, who isn't good enough for United's bench. And hardly replaces Eriksen.

So clearly his transfers aren't exactly as good as Pep's, who signed Sane and Jesus for cheaper than Maddison (who isn't as good a player).

How can you or any other Poch supporters expect us to win leagues with a manager as unproven in the market as Poch

 

[RasTiaGba]

Spurs had all this before pochettin0 - Lloris, Kyle walker, Rose, vertonghen, Dembele, Eriksen, Kane, Lamela, whilst having some players that were replaced like Sandr0, Sigurdsson, Paulinh0, bentaleb & Chadli. The year before that spurs sold Bale for a world record fee as well.

Spurs has added under pochettin0 -
1)good players like aldeweireld, Son, alli, Davies, Dier
2) average players that are rather inconsistent - sissoko, wanyama, Lucas, aurier, Sanchez, janssen, fazi0, Llorente, N'jie, Foyth, wimmer, vorm, N'koud0u.

Pochettin0 is a good coach but some of the love for him is seriously overrated. Spurs have always been a club that had the ability to find some really good players - we as a club used to buy their best players for stupendous prices or atleast target them. Spurs are a growing as a club and that is due to the stadium, Levy who is fantastic & pochettin0 being a decent manager.

Why people expect him to be this wonder manager though seriously deceives me - especially at a time when we have a United bred manager pulling out results with ease. Especially since he hasn't done anything all that special with spurs in my opinion.

Has spurs made this top 4 regular because they have been so great or because clubs like United, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool have all been so inconsistent?

Why did Leicester win the league & not spurs? It was clearly not the money right? Its because Ranieri was a better manager than Pochettino that year.

Even if that's not important - Pochettino 's ability to get Spurs consistently in to Top 4 is just as much down to other clubs failing than it is just purely down to the managers ability.

Is it really that hard to get 3rd or 4th when

* A club Chelsea sack manager that won them the leagues & replace them with a manager like sarri

* a club like arsenal hold on to their legendary manager for far too long causing a serious level of stagnation at the club; allowing spurs to overtake them as the better club - SAF himself said that wenger staying at arsenal was not good for them

* a club like Liverpool had horrible average managers & players until Klopp - who is much more capable manager than Pochettino

* a club like ours literally until the last 3 months have been a shadow of our former selves - resorting to cheap tactics & managers that don't fit our ethos - only to feel the result of such poor decisions later on in the league & matches.


I just don't get it - why is Pochettino's spurs viewed as a complete result of his management when so many clubs have been underperforming around him.

I totally agree with you @ravelston

Top quality analysis from you and @ravelston in this thread bud

If LVG, Moyes etc. Walked into a squad as good as the squad that Poch inherited, they'd have been sacked within a few seasons of not winning anything.

But because Poch is at a provincial club who have historically been losers to Chelsea, they essentially don't require titles and that's part of the reason he's a success there.

It's like Marco Silva keeping Everton top 5 and abandoning the cups and people calling him a top manager.

 

[RasTiaGba]

This narrative - that Pochettino has done amazingly considering the impoverished quality of his squad - is starting to wear a little thin. Since he joined Spurs the club has spent £240m on players. That's in addition to the £80m spent on players that remain in the squad from before his arrival. So his squad has a cost basis of around £320m. But let's think about value. Spurs have done well by buying promising players and allowing them to develop at the club. Think about some of the costs and the players' possible current values:

Cost Value
Eriksen 11,000,000 50,000,000
Vertonghen 10,000,000 40,000,000
Alli 5,000,000 50,000,000
Dier 4,000,000 35,000,000
Son 22,000,000 35,000,000
Alderwiereld 11,500,000 35,000,000
Trippier 3,500,000 25,000,000

Totals 67,000,000 270,000,000

So, even with these conservative valuations, these players are now worth £200m more than when they were bought, giving a current squad value of £520m. But wait, that's without Kane. If Kane is worth £80m then the total squad value has to be at least £600m. For what it's worth, transfermarkt.com thinks they're worth €913m. And, for comparison, Liverpool's squad is valued at €926m - not much in it, is there. (And how's Pochettino going to do at United - our squad is only worth €759m?)

So what's the take away here. First: Pochettino and Klopp have very comparable squads in terms of value (they're both about €100m behind City) and neither of them has won anything yet. Second: if Ole can get what we've seen out of the current squad, imagine what he'd do with a squad as good as Klopp's or Pochettino's. Third: why would Pochettino want to come and struggle here when he's already got a good squad with a new stadium just around the corner.

[Edit: Keep forgetting that tables don't line up right. Anyway, I'm sure you get what I mean.]

You should post this in the Poch thread so it doesn't get lost bud, people who support Poch will just post on and bury your post in the back pages while their posts will be the most recent

You clearly spent the time with this post bud, so it's worth ensuring it doesn't get lost as people will argue walls of text over a fraction of the info you posted