Would it have been a better ending if Jon had died again? His resurrection now just feels a bit pointless.
Television Game of Thrones (TV) • The watch has ended
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Unless he was resurrected for the sole purpose of murdering Dany.
The acting, production values, score etc were quality throughout, it's what makes the rushed ending so frustrating.
Sure they will end the same way, but the journey will be better.
Yes but he had died and came back to life since so all bets are off on what affects him now
Should have ended with the dragon carrying Daenerys to the far north and stabbing her with a dragonclaw (an alternative to dragonglass) and making a new nightking, restarting the story. She could open her eyes, light blue, and then credits.
That will kill any motivation for me to read the book. I am still hopeful that there won't be such glaring plot holes.
Yeah, he only took back Winterfell for the Starks, united everyone except the Lannisters and lead the fight against the army of the dead and killed the dragon queen. Might as well not have come back at all really
Worst episode of the show. Terrible ending. The last episodes were bad, but at least stick to it and go out with a bang. That was just silly.
Really happy for you to have your favorite character in the show rule the six kingdoms in the end.
Sure there won't be. You can do so much more with a book. Meant more character ends will be the same, Jon off with the Wildlings etc. Although if we are to see them, grrm may change now seeing the reactions!
mods please change his username to Bran the Broken or Greyworm.
Of all the moments they needed to timeskip, the Jon reveal to the Starks and post-Dany were the worst. Agreed. Just shoddy shoddy work. I don't mind cutting it down to 6 episodes, but they could have done so so much better with what they had by just tweaking a few things here and there.
the KL episode:
- Have Arya's cool scene by having her use some dead faces to wipe out the Kingsguard, before she reaches the Mountain with the Hound, and then Cleaganebowl. Also give her more cool scenes by wiping out the leader of the Golden Company instead of an OP dragon.
- keep Rhaegal alive till ep 5 and have him killed by Euron's scorpion just after the bells to drive Dany over the edge. Let Euron die in her revenge dragonfire.
- Jaime does to Cersei what Jon did to Dany, before letting the rubble kill them both. Since Euron is already dead, he doesn't need to be injured when he dies and we can let that shitty fight scene not exist
- Dany killing: suggested above
- post-Dany: the Dothraki and Unsullied want to fight, but stop when Jon summons Drogon, gets on top of him and tells them who he truly is. Some try to attack, but are instantly barbecued by Drogon. The rest get the message. Greyworm insists on fighting and is captured. Later he is set free on the condition that he leads his men to Naath.
- Jon pardons Tyrion and calls a small council to elect the king. When they want to choose him, he says he will no longer take part in the politics and go North of the Wall, where he truly felt at home. Gendry is then elected king, with Bran his hand. Sansa remains Queen in the North, and chooses Tyrion as her hand, because Tyrion no longer wishes to stay in KL where his family all died. Arya goes back to Braavos to lead the Faceless Men.
I made this up in 5 min, and it is still a better ending than what D&D did.
The episode was fine. Although I’ve been somewhat numb to the pain/letdown that seemingly 75% of the fan base is now enduring as I saw it decline in the latter half of Season 5. The actual ending makes sense to me and of how Bran would be chosen as King and it felt like that early season writing crept back in, like Tyrion had found his personality again.
I noticed that too. I get that she’s part of the kings guard but they don’t always have to wear it.
Well if only that was our only gripe with the show.
Via peer pressure, I’ve blasted the entire series out in about five weeks. On the whole, I loved it, in spite of it (*what I’d usually call pure fantasy shite) being so far away from what I’m usually into. Agree with the general consensus, though. It was all far too rushed in the end.
That said, the actual end game for lots of main characters was fairly true to the writing that preceded it. The issue was, ultimately, with its execution. Characters were moving from Winterfell to King’s Landing in ten minutes. In the earlier seasons, this would take a full season. I mean, how jarring was the sequence straight after the iron throne last night? It was like something out of a Star Wars prequel.
Daenerys was always going to turn. The character was on the edge of destroying enemies the entire series. Again, with an extra half a season to set the pieces this would have worked well. Jon’s ending was fine. Beyond the wall is always where his character belonged. Likewise Sansa and Arya. The Stark’s ‘winning’ was always going to be the pay off for everything they had endured. Tyrion was always going to be the last Lannister standing.
Lots of issues with how the minor characters were handled in the last two seasons, though. Baelish and Varys were written out terribly, nothing like the earlier seasons. Bronn was turned into some sort of wally. The Clegane *’thing’ was pure fantasy shite (the entire Mountain storyline was preposterous, even in this sort of genre). The entire Dorne plot line was always fairly terrible and Euron Greyjoy is probably the poorest character throughout the entire run.
Had they binned off some of the above, spent two seasons developing chemistry between Jon and Daenerys and watching her descend into madness (as well as giving more time to the White Walker plot) this would have been far more popular.
That said, the actual end game for lots of main characters was fairly true to the writing that preceded it. The issue was, ultimately, with its execution. Characters were moving from Winterfell to King’s Landing in ten minutes. In the earlier seasons, this would take a full season. I mean, how jarring was the sequence straight after the iron throne last night? It was like something out of a Star Wars prequel.
Daenerys was always going to turn. The character was on the edge of destroying enemies the entire series. Again, with an extra half a season to set the pieces this would have worked well. Jon’s ending was fine. Beyond the wall is always where his character belonged. Likewise Sansa and Arya. The Stark’s ‘winning’ was always going to be the pay off for everything they had endured. Tyrion was always going to be the last Lannister standing.
Lots of issues with how the minor characters were handled in the last two seasons, though. Baelish and Varys were written out terribly, nothing like the earlier seasons. Bronn was turned into some sort of wally. The Clegane *’thing’ was pure fantasy shite (the entire Mountain storyline was preposterous, even in this sort of genre). The entire Dorne plot line was always fairly terrible and Euron Greyjoy is probably the poorest character throughout the entire run.
Had they binned off some of the above, spent two seasons developing chemistry between Jon and Daenerys and watching her descend into madness (as well as giving more time to the White Walker plot) this would have been far more popular.
Also, why would you actually want Tyrion as your right hand man when you could have lovely beardy Davos instead?
Yes true, I like that ending better. Or even just the Night King ending it all with eternal winter would have been bold and unpredictable.
Also, Butterfly Fever will kill any non-Naath native who goes to Naath. So we can only assume that Greyworm led the unsullied to an early grave and extinction (in your version and according to the show).
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Butterfly_fever
I honestly forgot about Daario
.They somehow turned an interesting, mysterious character in to the dullest most generic character ever.
A very meh ending to a very meh last couple of seasons. Shame really.
Amazing how Samwell Tarly just gets to quit The Nights Watch.
Argh feck... what a mess.
Argh feck... what a mess.
He organised the forces of Westeros against the WW threat (without that, everybody dies) and led them in to battle. That was the point of his resurrection, Beric got resurrected literally just to rescue Arya so there doesn't need to be some incredibly interesting reason, you just had to serve some sort of purpose .. which he did.
Yeah, he only took back Winterfell for the Starks, united everyone except the Lannisters and lead the fight against the army of the dead and killed the dragon queen. Might as well not have come back at all really
Yeah he really took a leading role in that fight with his sage tactical acumen and scene stealing actions
He lost the battle of the bastards until Sansa/Littlefinger saved the day, Arya killed the Night King after he 'lead the fight' and he then decides he doesn't want the throne after the revelation of his birthright. Sending him back to the wall after murdering Dany is just a bit lame, and why would him being the one to kill the dragon queen be important to the supernatural being that brought him back? His character was lost just as much as Dany's to be honest.They didn't really give us much to go on with the point of the white walkers and the Lord of Light which might have helped things out a bit.
More like he fecked off from The Citadel. The Night's Watch needed a new Maester and everyone knew Sam was the best person to do it, but then he did it himself and went to The Citadel with woman and child. Not a problem with that, but then he just leaves The Citadel after stealing a few books. However, he did it because there was a greater cause/for the Realm. So can't fault him too much.
Him organising the forces was important of course but with the way the battle planned out it was Arya that was the killer of the night king and also most of the warriors fighting there were Dany's so.... you know, he wasn't exactly the great saviour. You can argue no Jon=white walker win but the same is true for Arya and Dany and Melisandre etc etc.
I just feel his character ending wasn't befitting of the big set up.
Think they could’ve made the Bran thing work a lot smoother if they added some nuance to it. Something along the lines of him ‘playing the Game of Thrones’; intentionally telling Sam/Jon to cause distrust in Daenerys, and the political players like Tyrion and Varys to see her flaws. Maybe it wasn’t even true? That would’ve made it interesting.
Maybe they don’t kill the NK so early in the season? Maybe he was working alongside Bran? Controlling him?
I don’t know, something more than robot kid.
Maybe they don’t kill the NK so early in the season? Maybe he was working alongside Bran? Controlling him?
I don’t know, something more than robot kid.
Yeah he really took a leading role in that fight with his sage tactical acumen and scene stealing actions
They didn't really give us much to go on with the point of the white walkers and the Lord of Light which might have helped things out a bit.
Jon Snow was the only person in Westeros who had any chance/hope of "uniting" against the the army of the dead. He may not have played the most central role in the "final match", but without him, there would have been no "final match"...WW would have killed everyone while everyone was killing themselves, etc.
He was losing the Battle of the Bastards, but again, it shows the the fact that the characters all had their flaws and it didn't hide that. Him going to battle against Ramsey was important because it galvanized the houses that supported the Stark family and then showed the growth of Sansa's character. Who then turned everything, rightfully so, against Littlefinger. Jon Snow never wanted to be King, never.
It really is a colossal shame.
I implore anybody who hasn't to go back and watch scenes from the earlier seasons, particularly some involving some of the elder statesmen in the cast (charles dance in particular) and quite honestly if you put it side by side to episodes from S8 you would feel like you were watching an entirely different show. Scenes between Tyrion and Oberyn, Jaime and Brienne, Tywin and Arya are simply breathtaking television. I've decided to start from the beginning personally but stop at S7 to try and blow away the feelings of disappointment that *this* is what the ending is.
The final couple of seasons got the only things the early ones lacked - the big set pieces and hollywood effects, but the show completely lost its heart along the way, and lost what really made it the most enjoyable show on television, a fantastic combination of excellent writing and stunning acting performances backed up by genuinely good dialogue.
S7/S8 weren't bad really, not by normal television standards, and a lot of aspects were very impressive. But you can't expect people not to complain when a shows best features suddenly becomes its weakest. The people who just watched for the tits and dragons are obviously still going to be satisfied, but I really don't think that's why a majority of people were dragged in by Game of Thrones.
I like that Brienne filled in Jaimes section in the book of brothers, which is a S4 callback to when Joffrey read the book and said ‘Someone didn’t write down your great deeds’ and then mocked Jaime.
I believe that was around about the time of Jaimes redemption arc starting and him replying with ‘There’s still time’ is now poignant.
I believe that was around about the time of Jaimes redemption arc starting and him replying with ‘There’s still time’ is now poignant.
I quite liked that episode. It was alright. It's not the best episode ever but it tied up all the thread into a nice ending.
Was Edmure promoting himself?
Jon was destined to stab Dany. All the other shit he did was important, because it allowed him to get where he needed to be, but him driving the dagger into Dany was his true purpose and the reason the Lord of Light allowed him to be brought back.Yeah he really took a leading role in that fight with his sage tactical acumen and scene stealing actions
They didn't really give us much to go on with the point of the white walkers and the Lord of Light which might have helped things out a bit.
Wasn't he always.
Arya killed the Night King but Jon was the one who set up the defences. He was just a piece in the puzzle, you don't need to be the main man to get resurrected, as Beric showed. Everything had to be set up that way for the Night King to die so anyone who was vital to that process would have been resurrected if they had died. Without Jon, the White Walkers 100% rip through the North with no problems before anybody even knows what is happening.
I don't mind that he wasn't the big ol' Azor Ahai hero that it seemed that he was set up to be, his arc is actually one that I'm pretty comfortable with. He lives, but he loses what is most important to him (his honour) when he kills Daenerys and will have to deal with the guilt from that decision for the rest of his life. Characters didn't need fairytale endings or to be the great stereotypical fantasy heros, Jon was never really that, it's just what everybody wanted him to be.
They did a lot wrong in the final 2 seasons, but Jon is actually the character whose ending I am most satisfied with. If Kit Harrington had one acting bone in his entire body it would be even better.
Should be reek
Again you could say that, without a lot of characters (Dany, Arya, Melisandre) they would have lost the battle but your point is correct, he did unite the army and the resurrection was pivotal in that regard. Given his rather poor performance in the battle itself, and the fact that he spent most of this season telling Dany she was his queen or he didnt want the throne, I found his role just very reduced and the ending of going back to the Wall (for which there now is no use for) was ...anticlimatic. I just didn't feel the tragedy of it.
Probably. No reason for him to do that other than D&D wanted a cheap laugh. He's been in captivity for years and would likely be a broken man.
They basically undid all the good work they did on the character during Jaime's siege. He was a serious character then and not just a buffoon they could use for laughs in the finale.