What's Walker done to be dropped?
England squad (Games against Bulgaria and Kosovo)
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End of the day, he is just making up numbers. Doubt he will play any game, unless Southgate wants to give him some token mins. Maybe it's also to send message that if player is playing well, they will be called up no matter for which club they play. It should give lot of motivation for other English players playing for smaller clubs.
Have his best 8 months as a City player
. Excellent in the 14 game winning run at the end of the season and performing well early doors since the arrival of competition in Cancelo. Meanwhile, Gomez and the Ox have featured in 6 PL games since in the last 9
months between them (through injury), but waltz back into the squad at the expense of in-form players like Tarkowski and Barnes (who cannot represent Austria because his citizenship application was rejected).
And then there’s Lingard...
Found himself in breach of the 'no bald players' rule.
You can't possibly want Tarkowski in over Gomez. And Barnes isn't of much use to England. Were you calling for Glenn Murray to be included last season too?Have his best 8 months as a City player
Meanwhile, Gomez and the Ox have featured in 6 PL games since in the last 9
months between them (through injury), but waltz back into the squad at the expense of in-form players like Tarkowski and Barnes (who cannot represent Austria because his citizenship application was rejected).
And then there’s Lingard...
Agree about Walker and Lingard though.
Rickie Lambert got a call up in his 30s didn't he?
Mings has been a total revelation for us as CB since January. Some of the performances he's put in have been Laursen esque. Given it's a weak area for England don't see the issue calling up inform player who is reasonably flexible (play at Bournemouth as a LB and would probably be decent in a back 3 if England go back to that) and he's pretty solid in possesion.
Mings has been a total revelation for us as CB since January. Some of the performances he's put in have been Laursen esque. Given it's a weak area for England don't see the issue calling up inform player who is reasonably flexible (play at Bournemouth as a LB and would probably be decent in a back 3 if England go back to that) and he's pretty solid in possesion.
How he played in the nations league....
People talk shit about Lingard and Henderson, but they are an important element in an overall squad. You never have 11 full blown class players. It's how they function together.
I felt if he had good games Spurs, Arsenal, and Liverpool he would be a contender for making the squad for games against Czech Republic and Bulgaria. However, against Arsenal he had the lowest passing accuracy in his team apart from the goalkeeper, the second least amount of touches. Against Spurs not only did he have the lowest passing accuracy of any outfield player, it was lower than 60%. His midfielder partner managed more aerial duels, more tackles, and significantly higher passing percentage. Those that have actually watched him have stated some of his passes have been baffling even misplacing passes from 10m away, or struggling with passes under no pressure.
An England call up may be too soon for him at this stage. Afterall, his knee injury ruled him out of football for 120 days. It's more likely he'll even miss the squad to face Montenegro. He'll need time to play to the best of his abilities. With that being said, his work rate continues to be commendable. He gives James Milner a run for his money. Against Spurs he nearly covered 13km which was comfortably more than any player on the pitch, and this is a Spurs side managed by Pochettino here.
Walker is the best right-back out of all of them. Shocking he's not included.
Lingard? Haha
Lingard? Haha
Southgate said he's just experimenting and has explained to Walker why he's not in the squad.
Lingard based on form shouldn't be in the squad, but he's normally good for England. With the likes of Mount and Maddison coming through however, he may find it hard to get a spot if they continue to perform in the EPL.
We've got a good team and a good manager. Exciting times.
Mings and Lingard... Wow
I've seen 5 of 6 Villa halves so far, I think, and Mings has looked very good. Better than Keane.
No call-up for Walker makes still no sense 
No words to Lingard...just
Mings is actually a good decision.
But Wilson instead of Abraham makes me angry too.
No words to Lingard...just
Mings is actually a good decision.
But Wilson instead of Abraham makes me angry too.
First of all i have written that Foden hasn't played for Manchester City therefore he shouldn't get a call-up.
But we don't have a player like Foden in the squad.....Dier is a good player....Foden is a generation talent like Rooney.
He always picks three right-backs....this time i thought he would pick even four right-backs
I love how @Wumminator 's trolling hijacked the first page of the thread.
I must say it again..."No call-up for Abraham "
"No call-up for Walker makes still no sense
No words to Lingard...just
Mings is actually a good decision.
But Wilson instead of Abraham makes me angry too.
How quick we are are to ignore players, Wilson is only 27 and a much more rounded forward at this point than Abraham. Abraham continues to score goals for fun against championship standard defences, still very much question marks over his all round game and ability to play against the better teams.
I'm on the "Tammy Abraham train" since few years and Wilson will be never good enough to start a important game for England......just my opinion but if Kane and Rashford are injured then i would rather see Hudson-Odoi/Sterling/Sancho than Wilson in the team.
I know I am a little late in responding (especially since AWB has already left the squad in the time it has taken for me to respond), but here are my thoughts on the 25 that where orginally selected...
Overall I don't have any real objections over any of the players that have been picked. After all:
What I do have a major issue over is the players that Southgate has refused to call up (despite there being a case to do so). Especially when the rules allow him to pick a bigger squad than the 25 he has picked and the opportunity these games (because lets face it, we would have to be pretty bad to not make it to Euro 2020, considering the group that we have) are to experiment a little bit and thus encourage more competition for places (considering the players Southgate has at his disposal) to improve performances across the board.
I mean we are perfectly fine with the goalkeepers we have (Although Gunn & Henderson could be an option if they both end up having decent seasons this time round), LB's we have (since Shaw is injured) and the Attacking Midfielders we have picked (Although if Foden does get more game time, he should also be getting call ups, Alli the same is can get back to his best later in the season).
However I strongly feel that Southgate should have picked the likes of Tarkowski, Mee & Dunk over Mings since (alongside their greater PL experience) they all provide the proper competition Michael Keane needs to make sure he fights for his England Place (and not commit the sort of stupid mistakes he has commited at times in his career), that Walker should have also been picked (Especially now that AWB has left the squad)*, that Hamza Choudhury & Morgan Gibbs-White should have also been picked (Since the DM/DLP position is our weakest position in the current England squad) to see if they provide the needed competition for Rice/Winks for that role (Especially when they are clearly good enough to be picked) and finally that Vardy needs to be recalled out semi-retirement as well**
Likewise since we are lacking in backup wingers (Thanks to Southgate stupidly allowing Zaha to get picked by the Ivory Coast*** and even more stupidly refused to pick Leon Bailey, when he spent year after year refusing callups by Jamaica****), I also feel that Southgate should have called up the likes of Nelson & Calvert-Lewin to see how they would currently fare for England. Especially when they are our next best options on the wing now that Hudon-Odoi is still injured.
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*To be fair, we should see the abundance of decent RB's England currently has as a good thing and make the most of it (by encouraging competition for that position amoung the 4 who are good enough to play there). Even if it means regularly picking 3-4 RB's outside of major tournaments.
**Because outside of Kane, our striker options are rather lacking with Rashford still on bad form, Wilson not exactly on the same level as Kane, Wellbeck & Sturridge clearly not good enough and Abraham not yet ready to be picked just yet.
***Thanks to Roy Hodgson (A guy who infamously saw Roberto Carlos as a LW and actually spent money on Jordon Ayew) refusing to pick him for England.
****And being eligable to play for England. Regardless our last chance was for the Nations League Play-Offs and since then he has finally played for Jamaica in the recent Gold Cup Tournement, thus its too late to pick him now.
Overall I don't have any real objections over any of the players that have been picked. After all:
- Pickford, Pope & Heaton are our 3 best keepers at the moment so they should all be picked;
- Chilwell & Rose are our 2 best LB's that are currently fit;
- AWB (Who finally gets a call up, hopefully he will end up actually playing for the 3 Lions sooner rather than later), TAA & Trippier (Who I hear has done quite well in Spain) are amoung our best RB's;
- Maguire & Gomez are our best potential CB partnership (which we will likely have to play anyway with Stones being injured) while Keane (Despite playing has if he is on a one man mission to force Chris Smalling back into the England Team with his terrible performances for both club & country at times) is still better than Smalling, Jones & Cahill;
- Maddison finally gets a call up, Mount's form justifies one, Rice & Winks are our best options for the DM/DLP role, Oxlade-Chamberlain (if he can get to his previous form) is the sort of player our midfield needs while Barkley, Lingard & Henderson are decent squad options for England at least;
- Finally Sancho & Sterling are clearly our 2 best wingers, Kane is of course our best ST (When not trying to play while still injured of course), Rashford is the next best option among those that Southgate wants to pick for our ST position with Wilson being the next best option after him.
What I do have a major issue over is the players that Southgate has refused to call up (despite there being a case to do so). Especially when the rules allow him to pick a bigger squad than the 25 he has picked and the opportunity these games (because lets face it, we would have to be pretty bad to not make it to Euro 2020, considering the group that we have) are to experiment a little bit and thus encourage more competition for places (considering the players Southgate has at his disposal) to improve performances across the board.
I mean we are perfectly fine with the goalkeepers we have (Although Gunn & Henderson could be an option if they both end up having decent seasons this time round), LB's we have (since Shaw is injured) and the Attacking Midfielders we have picked (Although if Foden does get more game time, he should also be getting call ups, Alli the same is can get back to his best later in the season).
However I strongly feel that Southgate should have picked the likes of Tarkowski, Mee & Dunk over Mings since (alongside their greater PL experience) they all provide the proper competition Michael Keane needs to make sure he fights for his England Place (and not commit the sort of stupid mistakes he has commited at times in his career), that Walker should have also been picked (Especially now that AWB has left the squad)*, that Hamza Choudhury & Morgan Gibbs-White should have also been picked (Since the DM/DLP position is our weakest position in the current England squad) to see if they provide the needed competition for Rice/Winks for that role (Especially when they are clearly good enough to be picked) and finally that Vardy needs to be recalled out semi-retirement as well**
Likewise since we are lacking in backup wingers (Thanks to Southgate stupidly allowing Zaha to get picked by the Ivory Coast*** and even more stupidly refused to pick Leon Bailey, when he spent year after year refusing callups by Jamaica****), I also feel that Southgate should have called up the likes of Nelson & Calvert-Lewin to see how they would currently fare for England. Especially when they are our next best options on the wing now that Hudon-Odoi is still injured.
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*To be fair, we should see the abundance of decent RB's England currently has as a good thing and make the most of it (by encouraging competition for that position amoung the 4 who are good enough to play there). Even if it means regularly picking 3-4 RB's outside of major tournaments.
**Because outside of Kane, our striker options are rather lacking with Rashford still on bad form, Wilson not exactly on the same level as Kane, Wellbeck & Sturridge clearly not good enough and Abraham not yet ready to be picked just yet.
***Thanks to Roy Hodgson (A guy who infamously saw Roberto Carlos as a LW and actually spent money on Jordon Ayew) refusing to pick him for England.
****And being eligable to play for England. Regardless our last chance was for the Nations League Play-Offs and since then he has finally played for Jamaica in the recent Gold Cup Tournement, thus its too late to pick him now.
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There is never a perfect squad picked. That said I look at some of the names suggested and really....guys like Nelson and Morgan Gibbs White aren't starting and in any case they didn't set the world alight in the under 21 tournaments
James Maddison is the fresh call up that makes complete sense, time to get him involved with the seniors in an area where England struggle to create from open play against elite nations.
Still Gareth Southgate is getting results that eluded many previous managers. Cue the fluke draws posts but he is getting to semi finals when many in the past couldn't. Keep up the good work Sir.
James Maddison is the fresh call up that makes complete sense, time to get him involved with the seniors in an area where England struggle to create from open play against elite nations.
Still Gareth Southgate is getting results that eluded many previous managers. Cue the fluke draws posts but he is getting to semi finals when many in the past couldn't. Keep up the good work Sir.
@FootballHQ - For the record if Mings carries on his fine form thoughout the season, then he does deserve to be picked on a regular basis for England.
I have no problem with the players he has picked this time round (At least he has not picked Delph this time) and likewise he has a generally good track record at who he has picked while as England Manager, my problem rather is the players that he does not pick.
Nelson I suggested because he is literally the next best winger we have (A case could be made for Townsend, just not a very good one) with Hudson-Odi being injured. I mean if Southgate was not being such a fool over this he could have had the option of both Zaha and Bailey as well, but since he let those opportunities pass he is literally the next best option. Especially when putting Rashford/Lingard on the wing is a bad idea.
As for Gibbs-White (Although I think Choudhury is more deserving), well it is more of a reflection of the lack of quality options we have for the DM/DLP position at the moment. So we might as well try out the options we do have and see if it works out. Especially when Southgate foolishly let McTominay end up playing for Scotland...despite being from Lancaster of all places.
Agreed, he should have been called up for the Nations-League Play-Offs at the very least.
For the record; I felt that while they had an easier draw than most, that time around they capitalised on it (when in the past we have failed to do so) and thus performed far better than what we expected of that squad. Something that Southgate should deserve credit for, especially when Spain was also in the same position as we where, had a far better squad (on paper) and yet...they got knocked out by Russia of all teams...
So clearly Soutgate is on the right path and generally doing the right things (and thus hopefully he sticks around as long as possible, especially considering the potential alternatives for the job), I just feel that there are a few things he could do a little better, that is all.
I have no problem with the players he has picked this time round (At least he has not picked Delph this time) and likewise he has a generally good track record at who he has picked while as England Manager, my problem rather is the players that he does not pick.
Nelson I suggested because he is literally the next best winger we have (A case could be made for Townsend, just not a very good one) with Hudson-Odi being injured. I mean if Southgate was not being such a fool over this he could have had the option of both Zaha and Bailey as well, but since he let those opportunities pass he is literally the next best option. Especially when putting Rashford/Lingard on the wing is a bad idea.
As for Gibbs-White (Although I think Choudhury is more deserving), well it is more of a reflection of the lack of quality options we have for the DM/DLP position at the moment. So we might as well try out the options we do have and see if it works out. Especially when Southgate foolishly let McTominay end up playing for Scotland...despite being from Lancaster of all places.
Agreed, he should have been called up for the Nations-League Play-Offs at the very least.
For the record; I felt that while they had an easier draw than most, that time around they capitalised on it (when in the past we have failed to do so) and thus performed far better than what we expected of that squad. Something that Southgate should deserve credit for, especially when Spain was also in the same position as we where, had a far better squad (on paper) and yet...they got knocked out by Russia of all teams...
So clearly Soutgate is on the right path and generally doing the right things (and thus hopefully he sticks around as long as possible, especially considering the potential alternatives for the job), I just feel that there are a few things he could do a little better, that is all.
@Red Keane Rose and Chilwell aren't our best 2 left backs currently fit they are the best 2 left backs full stop
Agreed. Shaw is ridiculously overrated on here. Sloppy defensively and terrible going forward.
Deffo go with
Sterling Kane Sancho
Maddison Winks Chamberlain
Chilwell Maguire Gomez TAA
Pickford
@Red Keane Topic: Mings
With a bit of luck Tuanzebe or Tomori will be the fourth center-back for the Euros.....and in two years Godfrey, Panzo and T.Chalobah should be ready too.....so don't think too much about Mings
@Red Keane Topic: Bailey
It's better he plays for Jamaica for reasons on and oustide of the pitch.
With a bit of luck Tuanzebe or Tomori will be the fourth center-back for the Euros.....and in two years Godfrey, Panzo and T.Chalobah should be ready too.....so don't think too much about Mings
@Red Keane Topic: Bailey
It's better he plays for Jamaica for reasons on and oustide of the pitch.
Mount -> AOC for me
Mount for the Ox. Really not a bad side tbh
Im all for giving young players a chance. But Kyle Walker being dropped make no sense. AWB has bright future. But if he didnt move to United would he have been picked ahead of Walker? People now saying Tammy Abraham should be on the squad. But would they been saying that if he played 4 PL games for Brighton? The message is very clear for young English players. Move to a top 6 club if you want international career.
Is it, from the squad more than 50% were called up when they played for outside top 6 clubs.
Pickford - Everton
Heaton - Villa
Pope - Burnley
Trippier - Atletico Madrid
Keane - Everton
Maguire - was called up when he played for Leicester.
Chilwell - Leicester
Mings - Villa
Henderson - Called up when he was playing for Sunderland
Rice - West Ham
Barkely - called up when he was playing for Everton
Maddison - Leicester
Sancho - Dortmund
Wilson - Bournemouth
Also AWB replaced Walker, who plays for City, so it's not like he replaced non top 6 player.
Btw Mings who played 4 games was called up.
Tammy Abraham has nearly 50 caps for England from youth to senior level, he's already played for the senior team and already has more career goals than Callum Wilson despite being 6 years younger. I don't see anything controversial about people calling for his inclusion.
I think he'll start with Sterling - Kane - Rashford ... that 3 has served him well so far.
Sancho will come on at about 60 minutes.
Sancho will come on at about 60 minutes.
Aye so stupid not picking someone who isn't eligible for England. Sounds like someone actually knows the rules, and it isn't you.
Bailey isn't even that good. Certainly nowhere near Sancho or Sterling.
Might have been a decent squad option but that's all.
Might have been a decent squad option but that's all.
He also isn't English.
It would generally agree in light of Danny Rose's recent return to form, however when fit Shaw is definately good enough to be still selected for England.
I don't overrate him myself, but he was still one of our better players last season and if there have been times when he has performed badly (for example against Barcelona), it is a consequence of having only Young & Darmian (while he was still here) as competition for that LB position.
With a bit of luck Tuanzebe or Tomori will be the fourth center-back for the Euros.....and in two years Godfrey, Panzo and T.Chalobah should be ready too.....so don't think too much about Mings
Hopefully those 2 turn out good this season considering the chances they going to be getting under OGS (Unless he decides to give Jones & Rojo yet another chance to mess up) & Lampard, because as the dire Under-21 performance has shown, there does not seem to be too many decent CB's at youth level. Same goes with the other 3 as well.
Regardless I am guessing that come the Euro 2020 eventual squad, Maguire & Gomez (unless either of their form falls off) are definately in while Stones, Keane, Tarkowski, Mee, Dunk, Mings, Tuanzebe, Tomori, Godfrey & Panzo will all fight it out for the remaining 2 slots depending on form
That might well be the case (Personally I feel that playing for England makes more sense from a footballing perspective), but until he did finally decide to actually play for Jamaica there was an opportunity to select him that we should have capitalised on.
A lot of those have been recently selected in the last few years first got selected while playing for a Non-Top 6 side while even many of those who first got selected while playing for a Top 6 club only started to play on a regular basis at a Non-Top 6 club.
In fact out of all the players that have been selected since the World Cup; only Alexander-Arnold, Winks, Sterling, Rashford & Hudson-Odoi broke out into senior level football while playing for a Top 6 club. With the rest either breaking out into senior football and getting senior England caps at a Non-Top 6 club or breaking out into into senior football (and getting senior England caps later down the line) at Non-Top 6 club (at the very least while on loan to them).
When you also factor the lack of chances for youths playing for any of the Top 6 Club Academies generally get, the message to me (and one that I would pass to any aspring footballer) is that you are better off trying start off at a Non-Top 6, Lower PL or even Championship club rather than trying waste years unsucessfully trying to break into a Top 6 Senior Team.
As for your point about AWB though, its clear to me that there is a bias in The FA against picking Crystal Palace players (ironic since the current manager started off at Crystal Palace while the previous 2 England Managers would go on to manage the club later down the line) as shown by their refusal to pick Townsend (after his first season), Puncheon (before he commited career suicide), Zaha (who of course when on to play for the Ivory Coast instead) & AWB while all at the club. Despite the fact he was clearly good enough to be picked for the Nation's League Play-Offs if not earlier.
To be fair, he did start getting callups while playing at Spurs. However one would also argue that he only started playing senior football on a regular basis while at Burnley. Thus putting him as one who developed his craft outside the Top-6.
Surely Sancho would start ahead of Rashford? Who in turn should not be playing on the wing in the first place.
Some of Leon Bailey's Grandparents (at the very least) have British Citizenship while all of them (assuming they where all born in Jamaica) where born on a territory that was under British Rule at the time of their birth. So while it would cause problems under the Home Nations Agreement (which does not seem to cover British Citizens and their decendents of such that where born overseas), under FIFA rules he would be eligible to play for England right up to his call up for Jamaica for the Gold Cup matchs
We do actually need to have decent squad options on the wing rather than resort to shoehorning Rashford & Lingard on the Wing. Because other than Sancho & Sterling, the only other decent options we have are Hudson-Odi (who is out for quite some time) and that's pretty much it. Otherwise the next players down the pecking order are Nelson, Townsend, Calvert-Lewin & Gray, not helped by the fact The FA pretty much disregarded Zaha (and let him play for the Ivory Coast) despite the fact he was undisputingly eligible to play for England (and in fact did so on 2 occasions).
That is the reason why I was strongly in favour of a Bailey callup. Especially when the likes of Wales have a more pro-active policy when it comes to this area (As shown by their willingess to pick James, Brooks & Ampadu before The FA realised they missed the chance).
Didn't stop us calling up both Barnes & Hargreaves though. Neither of which was a bad thing either.
Pickford
TAA Gomez Maguire Chilwell
Henderson
Maddison Mount
Sancho Kane Sterling
TAA Gomez Maguire Chilwell
Henderson
Maddison Mount
Sancho Kane Sterling
Mings is a good defender. He had a massive last season for Villa and has started this season decently well. His inclusion seems justified when you consider the competition. Southgate seems to base his decisions on merit and England fans should be happy about it.
I'm neutral about it, is that OK too?