Maybe they could develop a set of politics other than the one way they voted in the 2016 referendum ?
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Maybe they could develop a set of politics other than the one way they voted in the 2016 referendum ?
That’s the problem though ain’t it. Everyone is forgetting all the other national priorities apart from Brexit.
Boris tracking back:
How anyone would vote Tory after their record across all services is beyond me. They will try and make this about Brexit as much as possible as they are weak on other areas.
A number of fairly safe seats there ... Logical in the run up to the election if they are happy to sign up and vote for the Boris brexit plan
Because Jeremy is the enemy.
I'm sorry, I know I should be better than this, but people have proven themselves to be fecking idiots. The Tories under Cameron somehow managed to put all of the blame for the recession, started in the US by banks selling sub prime mortgage tranches that had been unlawfully labelled AAA by ratings agencies that were fighting one another for work and would label any dog shit banks put in front of them as brilliant, totally safe investments, which once variable rates went up and people defaulted on their loans caused a chain reaction that saw an entire global market brought to its knees, on Gordon Brown selling gold on the cheap.
People will just believe whatever is the simplest reason that they can find, because they don't want to admit to anyone that they're too fecking thick to understand anything that takes more than a sentence to explain. That's why Cameron and now Boris can stand in front of the press and say "x is because of Labour" or "y is because your immigrant neighbour on disability benefits got a new 65" 4k telly" and people will believe it. Because the truth would be too confusing to them and distracts their attention away from watching cat videos on Reddit or Celebrity Buttfeck Party Time Dancing Island 3000. Which is probably hosted by that annoying plastic faced cnut Rylan Whateverthefeck.
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Pretty difficult in an election that has been called only because of Brexit.
I think this wouldn’t work now as Corbyn actually wants an election. It only would have worked had Labour been consistent with their message from the start:
I agree but it’s not a referendum, it’s a General Election but don’t think the dim electorate will understand anyway.
Have to agree. The lack of voters understanding issues is the reason Boris has been coming up with the slogans for everyone to read. It’s the ‘Get on with it’ brigade. Voters are easily manipulated.
It's like when I voted Lib Dem with my first vote, and then Labour for about a decade and finally SNP because Brown retired and his Labour replacement in my constituency is absolutely useless compared to our Scottish Government MSP counterpart (who is SNP).
I'm easily swayed by party rhetoric - I think (hope) everyone is to some extent. But some of Johnson's work is so brazenly bullshit that it amazes me how his press buddies can keep a straight face when they say that are being balanced.
Don’t get me started on the press holding the politicians to account. It’s pathetic in this country. Channel 4 and a couple of other journalists aside, the journalists are a joke asking any tough questions. That’s why the politicians know they can get away with it.
This speaker has nothing on Bercow.
He is odds on favourite for the next speaker unfortunately.
9 December rejected. 315-295.
Can someone explain what a GE solves here? The UK press will start going on about how Corbyn wears his tie or something and blaming him for Brexit, and Boris will win. Then what?
San Corbyn eat a bacon sandwich? That's the real question!
If Johnson gets a decent majority in parliament its job done for him and we leave the EU under his terms. With the splitting of the remain vote between SNP, Lib Dems and Labour not knowing what they believe in that could well happen unfortunately.
The Uk are running out of excuses to give the EU - this buys another 3 months of procrastinating.
What if labour win the election? What exactly is their stance on brexit?
Renegotiate a deal and have a second referendum on said deal versus remain.
That really only applies to Labour, Johnson will certainly leave if he gets more MPs, the Libs and SNP are clearly for remain.
Well we've got til the 5th November when Parliament gets dissolves. MP's back on Friday 13th then off for Xmas, enter into the new year with 3 weeks to Brexit and back to where we were
Yeah basically
Not totally convinced that many of them actually want to leave, even some of the obvious suspects. If the Uk does finally leave, the last 4 years of fantasy ends and the real world re-starts.
Exactly and back to square one probably - only this time I think this is the last chance.
Mps back on 13th... I doubt that... Results usually don't come in from all.constituiencies till some time on 13th and MPs are usually in the constituiences for the results
And of course typically then you have a state opening and a queens speach .... If you factor in potentially messing around with a hung parliament and forming a government it could quite possibly be mid / late January...
Pay rises AND shit tons of holidays. And they say working in the public service has been nothing but squeezed wages, pulling back holiday weeks and taking a chainsaw to public pension. These folk prove that argument wrong.
Oh shit, wait, now that I look at my own job I realise thats bullshit. Hmm, maybe these public servants just got lucky....
Arseholes. Pee in their Cheerios.
Oh shit, wait, now that I look at my own job I realise thats bullshit. Hmm, maybe these public servants just got lucky....
Arseholes. Pee in their Cheerios.
bLiar is spot on here, totally agree with him. I've also thought the same for ages: Why not pin down BJ with this question on what is he so scared in a 2nd referendum? Actually, it's BJ who is the chicken. That should have been the narrative for a long time.
bLiar also right about the conflation of brexit and GE's, and the 2 newly created conflicted groups. Idiocy. And I know bLiar would have nailed BJ is this same exact situation.
So you were fine when we invaded Iraq?
I fear you are right and defending the status quo against meaningless promises is difficult but the ray of hope I cling to is that Johnson is a hopeless when faced with the public. Seriously though, and speaking as someone who grew up in the north west of England, if the people of the non-metropolitan north fall for his bullshit (after voting leave), they deserve what’s coming.
where did I say anything about Iraq? Are we not allowed to agree with bLiar on anything, because we despise him for Iraq?
And for the record, No I'm wasn't fine with Iraq, was at the protest march and did countless other things at the time.
None of that means he's wrong about what he said in this VDO: You can be the devil incarnate, and still be right about stuff.
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He wouldn't have but it's a useful narrative to use when it can't be tested.
What can be tested however is this idea of calling the Tories chicken because its been done a thousand times in parliament and TV interviews. Blair is not making some wise pitch no one else has thought of here.
There's not a person on these shores that doesn't understand the 2nd ref argument or the leave/remainers positions on it. Neither the public or MPs views are much swayed and parliament has not at any point had the numbers to pass it so it's irrelevant.
Surely we all know the Tory response to 2nd ref question verbatim by now?
IF you’re right, then I expect upcoming GE to be pretty identical to 2017 GE result.
You literally can’t say anything about Blair without some idiot screaming Iraq in your face.
I’d take Blair over any of this lot nowadays.
Which is exactly why this GE will be pointless.
I'm afraid you guys are being optimistic (or pessimistic depending on your own view).
Labour are going to have their working class vote squeezed by the Brexit Party and to a lesser extent the Tories, and their middle class vote sqeezed by the Lib Dems and Greens. Their attempt to placate both with their renegotiate then 2nd ref policy appeals to neither as it just proves they don't know, can't agree or won't admit what they want, so proving they can't be trusted to deliver for either and therefore driving those voters even further away.
Meanwhile the Tories have a clear message on Brexit which appeals to all but the craziest Brexiteers, and they have been positioning themselves for a GE by touting their new policies for months. Labour could win by attacking the Tories on the details of the deal, such as todays projection of the UK being £70bn p.a. worse off in 10 years, but not having a clear position themselves makes this much harder without drawing attention to their own weak position.
The only hope for a Tory defeat is a pact between the SNP, the Lib Dems, the Greens and Labour, but Labour will never do that.
I baffled anyone thinks this is going to be like the last GE. Labour are going to be hit badly. Last time they played the same line as the tories and promised to back the referendum result. No second Ref. They kept the vote in leave areas - This time well, for certain leave voters will not trust them, centrists don't like the direction Corbyn takes them in, Libdems are giving a clearer message for remainer's.
The only thing stopping the Tories gaining a large majority is if the Brexit vote is split in the same way Peterborough was, allowing Labour back in. I don't see that happening in the North East or Wales. Libdems might gain a few at Labour's expense too.
The only thing stopping the Tories gaining a large majority is if the Brexit vote is split in the same way Peterborough was, allowing Labour back in. I don't see that happening in the North East or Wales. Libdems might gain a few at Labour's expense too.