SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)

11101 said:
I do hope I am wrong but after being stuck in the middle of this for over a month now I have noticed that on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays there are lots more cases reported and a lot more ambulance sirens around. Today they have been fecking non stop.
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Am I being thick not realising the significance of the days?
 
DOTA said:
The new rule they brought in in the last couple days where families have to give consent before deaths will be added to the official figure. It's clearly designed to reduce the death toll. There is no issue regarding anonymity when we're talking about anonymous data.
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You have no clue what you are talking about. There's always issues around consent and ensuring that family members have been notified of a death, before making the figures public. Data can still be patient identifiable, even if no personal information is released, when dealing with low figures and you can work out who the person is and may be revealing information about them indirectly. See something like this: https://www.ons.gov.uk/methodology/...fidentialityintablesofbirthanddeathstatistics

No deaths will be swept under the carpet. It might just take longer for some to become reported for genuine reasons.
 
Drawfull said:
Am I being thick not realising the significance of the days?
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It has not been addressed by anybody that truly knows but i guess as there is a 4-7 day average incubation period that it comes from the preceding weekend.
 
11101 said:
It has not been addressed by anybody that truly knows but i guess as there is a 4-7 day average incubation period that it comes from the preceding weekend.
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I see. Thanks. Makes sense if people are flouting the rules more at that time. We're a day ahead of a fortnight in Spain, and as this week has gone on, there's been a few more people out working (construction, maintenance etc), which beggar belief. Especially since there's another 2 weeks coming up which will be certainly be extended. Although some parties are threatening to stop being so helpful if the Gov don't make changes. Because politics is so important now.
 
TMDaines said:
You have no clue what you are talking about. There's always issues around consent and ensuring that family members have been notified of a death, before making the figures public. Data can still be patient identifiable, even if no personal information is released, when dealing with low figures and you can work out who the person is and may be revealing information about them indirectly. See something like this: https://www.ons.gov.uk/methodology/...fidentialityintablesofbirthanddeathstatistics

No deaths will be swept under the carpet. It might just take longer for some to become reported for genuine reasons.
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I'm making the point made by many people very fluent in the workings in data protection. I guess I could be wrong but clueless, I am not. I've had to do courses in data protection, whilst working for the NHS.

Which bit of that link are you suggesting I read?
 
DOTA said:
I'm making the point made my many people very fluent in the workings in data protection. I guess I could be wrong but clueless, I am not. I've had to do courses in data protection, whilst working for the NHS.

Which bit of that link are you suggesting I read?
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The whole thing and then keep reading further.
 
TMDaines said:
The whole thing and then keep reading further.
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This response makes me wonder if you're actually taking this seriously. If you want me and others to be better informed, can you please point out the bits regarding anonymised data? This isn't a trivial thing.
 
11101 said:
I do hope I am wrong but after being stuck in the middle of this for over a month now I have noticed that on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays there are lots more cases reported and a lot more ambulance sirens around. Today they have been fecking non stop.
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I've heard alot today aswell. If you ring up and say you have all the symptoms of covid19 would they send an ambulance out? Or are these ambulances just for general emergencies?
 
predator said:
I've heard alot today aswell. If you ring up and say you have all the symptoms of covid19 would they send an ambulance out? Or are these ambulances just for general emergencies?
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I don't know. I'm in Italy near Milan so I'm assuming these extra sirens are all related to the virus.
 
DOTA said:
This response makes me wonder if you're actually taking this seriously. If you want me and others to be better informed, can you please point out the bits regarding anonymised data? This isn't a trivial thing.
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I'm being serious. Once you have read that, there is further relevant guidance to read on other considerations. Half the problem with online discussions online is that people are taken aback when they have to spend more than 30 seconds educating themselves on matters after being challenged.

There's a whole multitude of reasons why someone passing away with suspected COVID-19 will not necessarily immediately added to the death toll and may miss a daily deadline. The case of Chloe Middleton would be another good example, where now the family are in a bit of a mess and there's been some dire reporting around it.

Better to generate accurate data ethically, with a bit of a lag, than quick, suspect data that has little concerns for ethics.
 
So the PM and the Health Minister get Covid 19. It seems that the message to wash your hands and carry on might not have been enough. Who'd have thought.
I hope their ineptitude doesn't mean that I get it after having to go to work to do a job that isn't essential.
 
RobinLFC said:
Someone should tell him that it's 14 days, not 7.
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He's right. If he's symptomatic it is 7 days self isolation. 14 days for the rest of his household in household isolation, unless they become symptomatic themselves at which point they self isolate for 7 days.
 
TMDaines said:
I'm being serious. Once you have read that, there is further relevant guidance to read on other considerations. Half the problem with online discussions online is that people are taken aback when they have to spend more than 30 seconds educating themselves on matters after being challenged.

There's a whole multitude of reasons why someone passing away with suspected COVID-19 will not necessarily immediately added to the death toll and may miss a daily deadline. The case of Chloe Middleton would be another good example, where now the family are in a bit of a mess and there's been some dire reporting around it.

Better to generate accurate data ethically, with a bit of a lag, than quick, suspect data that has little concerns for ethics.
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For the love of god! You posted the link. Just tell me where it says things about anonymised data.
 
Fully Fledged said:
So the PM and the Health Minister get Covid 19. It seems that the message to wash your hands and carry on might not have been enough. Who'd have thought.
I hope their ineptitude doesn't mean that I get it after having to go to work to do a job that isn't essential.
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I think it could also be bad luck, maybe you touch a contaminated surface then absent mindedly rub your eyes. BoJo would have been exposed to many people as well. I can't comment on his hygiene but I don't think everyone who's caught it is a dirty fecker.
 
Drawfull said:
So why was my brother in law told by 111 to isolate for 14? I don't live in UK, but that's what he got told to do.
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No idea. No idea what your brother reported to NHS 111. Here's all you need to know: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-stay-at-home-guidance
The main messages are:

  • if you live alone and you have symptoms of coronavirus illness (COVID-19), however mild, stay at home for 7 days from when your symptoms started. See ending isolation section for more information
  • if you live with others and you are the first in the household to have symptoms of coronavirus, then you must stay at home for 7 days, but all other household members who remain well must stay at home and not leave the house for 14 days. The 14-day period starts from the day when the first person in the house became ill
  • for anyone else in the household who starts displaying symptoms, they need to stay at home for 7 days from when the symptoms appeared, regardless of what day they are on in the original 14-day isolation period. See ending isolation section for more information
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Here's a handy illustrated guide: https://assets.publishing.service.g...file/874011/Stay_at_home_guidance_diagram.pdf
 
Drawfull said:
So why was my brother in law told by 111 to isolate for 14? I don't live in UK, but that's what he got told to do.

Sorry, saw your reply above this one. Cheers.
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7 days if you're self-isolating due to onset of symptoms. 14 days if it's for other reasons, like return from another country, contact with someone who is positive or if you're living with someone who has started showing symptoms. In effect that would mean 7 for Boris, 14 for his partner - though she's self-isolating away from him we're told, for her own safety now, to avoid the natural tendency for everyone in the household to get affected.
 
horsechoker said:
I think it could also be bad luck, maybe you touch a contaminated surface then absent mindedly rub your eyes. BoJo would have been exposed to many people as well. I can't comment on his hygiene but I don't think everyone who's caught it is a dirty fecker.
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What I'm saying is that wash your hands and carry on was/is a crazy policy.
They are still making millions of us that are not in essential jobs interact in jobs where it's impossible to keep 2 metre distance.
 
Damn, Italys total increased by almost a thousand within 24 hours (to around 9k)
 
jojojo said:
7 days if you're self-isolating due to onset of symptoms. 14 days if it's for other reasons, like return from another country, contact with someone who is positive or for someone living with someone who has started showing symptoms. In effect that would mean 7 for Boris, 14 for his partner - though she's self-isolating away from him, for her own safety now, to avoid the natural tendency for everyone in the household to get affected.
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That might be it, he was in contact with a positive case.
 
I've not read all the replies, but do people realise you can get tested privately VERY easily, it's just the NHS don't have the time/funds to do it for the whole population?

Affluent people like Boris will pay about £300 to get tested. If you want to be tested you can happily pay that and get tested within a day.

I imagine most people will probably decline that offer and just stay isolated.
 
Adam-Utd said:
I've not read all the replies, but do people realise you can get tested privately VERY easily, it's just the NHS don't have the time/funds to do it for the whole population?

Affluent people like Boris will pay about £300 to get tested. If you want to be tested you can happily pay that and get tested within a day.

I imagine most people will probably decline that offer and just stay isolated.
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I can only speak for myself but no I didn't know the going rate for BUPA testing.
 
From BBC

"Why does severity of coronavirus symptoms vary?
Rebecca Morelle
Science correspondent, BBC News

Scientists are racing to find out how coronavirus is spreading so quickly and why the severity of symptoms varies so much.
Viral load is an important factor. It’s how much of the virus there is in your body at any point during an infection. The higher the viral load, the more virus you will potentially shed from your body, making you more infectious to others.

For coronavirus, the viral load is highest about five days after symptoms first appear. And some scientists think it’s the initial dose of virus you receive that’s important. If you’re infected with a small amount of virus, you’re more likely to develop a mild illness. But if you’re infected with a lot, you have a greater chance of developing severe symptoms.

It’s a major issue for health workers. They will be in very close contact with lots of infected people, raising their prospect of becoming infected when a patient’s viral load is at its peak. It’s why having access to protective kit is so important."

This my feeling on this since I heard the Chinese doctor who was exposed many times died and others since. Younger people might have received a high dosage, it might vary if it gets down to your lungs or stays in the throat area but perhaps a high dosage has a greater change to get into the lungs as well.

I'm hoping to keep any exposure to zero or tiny amount

Jacko21 said:
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Another one joining the herd.
 
Adam-Utd said:
I've not read all the replies, but do people realise you can get tested privately VERY easily, it's just the NHS don't have the time/funds to do it for the whole population?

Affluent people like Boris awill pay about £300 to get tested. If you want to be tested you can happily pay that and get tested within a day.

I imagine most people will probably decline that offer and just stay isolated.
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and Prince Charles will get shunted to the front of the NHS while other people who have worse symptoms are told that their symptoms are not bad enough to be tested.
 
Italy seems to be right at the top of the peak with the cases numbers staying consistent for a week now.

5909 new cases - a reasonable number all things considered
919 deaths - these are going to get big in the coming days as the case numbers begin to translate into deaths
 
There is considerable unease in the Spanish press over a speech by a Dutch minister, asking to investigate the deficit compliance and criticizing that we are treating too old people (in Italia too).
Apparently Germany and the Netherlands are exercising some blockade while Spain and Italy refuse to sign insufficient measures.
 
dumbo said:
99,198 negative.
14,579 positive.

Again, doesn't this seem to refute this novel idea that the virus has been widely circulating for some time, infecting half the population. If anything it suggests that the vast majority haven't yet had it and already it's hurting badly.

Edit: I suppose the figures don't actually account for those who have had it.
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No because this only tests if you have it right now. A lot could have already had it. We need the antibody test before we know the scale of contagion.
 
Adam-Utd said:
I've not read all the replies, but do people realise you can get tested privately VERY easily, it's just the NHS don't have the time/funds to do it for the whole population?

Affluent people like Boris will pay about £300 to get tested. If you want to be tested you can happily pay that and get tested within a day.

I imagine most people will probably decline that offer and just stay isolated.
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Boris claimed a remembrance day wreath on expenses once, hes paying for nowt.

He gets it quickly because he's PM.

The argument shouldn't be that he should not be tested, its that NHS workers should have the same access to testing.
 
Classical Mechanic said:
Think it was on the official briefing last night by the government from the health official but James O’Brien covered it on his show too

https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/present...-obrien-dispels-fake-news-around-coronavirus/

I may have been wrong to say in the morning, I think the death stats are now at 5pm but the case stats are in the morning?
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Thanks for the link. Regarding at the end of the clip in that link, it sounds to me like James O'Brien is just applying his common sense rather than relying on any information from a briefing or a government official? I may be misreading this. It would be good to find a source that actually puts it to bed.
 
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