I've no idea what the big joke was meant to be - disabled, poor or black people are to be mocked and it's hilarious is what I got from it.
"Blackface" Discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) is joined by CEO Duncan Drasdo and Financial Director Andy Green from the Manchester United Supporters Trust for a special episode on all things behind the scenes at Old Trafford including a brief history of MUST and their aims today, views on INEOS and Sir Jim Ratcliffe so far, and the Old Trafford regeneration.
I've no idea what the big joke was meant to be - disabled, poor or black people are to be mocked and it's hilarious is what I got from it.
It's what Britain looks like through the lens of middle class bigots. Every sketch is the embodiment of a disgusting trope people genuinely have internalised which is why it resonated so much with many Brits.
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I think you're right on Walliams. He's always seemed a bit off to me.
He makes me want to vomit.
Whenever I've seen Lucas on interviews he seems like a nice bloke. I only really liked him as George Dawes though.
Yeah I don't mind him too much but Walliams I honestly feel a bit sick every time I see him because he essentially is the living embodiment of everything I despise. I can't abide watching him in anything or even hearing his voice - it's an instant change of channel from me no matter what he is in.
This is Nick Ferrari from LBC. Again the usual types are outraged at him telling a black woman to leave the country but he felt comfortable enough to say what he did and barring a couple of people on twitter getting mad I would imagine that his job prospects for his radio show are still secure.
I think the mildest redressing of the balance between left and right in terms of culture faces such a huge backlash that we can't see the woods from the trees.
This is still a country of Brexit, the Sun, the Daily Mail, the Telegraph, Nigel Farage, Guido Fawkes, Boris "picaninies with watermelon smiles" Johnson etc etc.
Cries of slippery slope and 1984 meme are hardly ever done to the same degree as when the right demonstrates it - e.g. Boris saying he'll pass laws against the BDS movement, banning ministers from appearing on shows critical of them or banning select journalists from press briefings.
I remember Nick Ferrari from The Sun, didn't he take over from Garry Bushell (christ, another grim name from the past). Just another massive cnut.
People are defending the movie white chicks in this thread. I think you’re good to promote Drugs. Fire away.
The whole clip is more explanatory towards my point
Afua was making a point that 4 out 5 of the other participants disagreed with in some way or another and had a platform to share their views freely
And also have a look at the comment section, its similar to what you'd find on twitter, the gammon to SJW ratio is also skewed heavily gammon. Yet they complain about their voices silent and claim to be the "silent" majority or that they are being silenced.
Incidentally when it comes to blackface I think there is a way it can/has be represented that warrants allowing its consumption in pop culture. E.g. when there is a subversive point made against it use, I'm think Bamboozled by Spike or even Tropic Thunder with RDJ which mocked and lampooned overly serious and pretentious method acting when you take into account also how the character's arc is in that movie.
If joke : Bravo
The fact that those 2 individuals state that it no longer bothers them does not discount the possibility of it having caused offense and distress to them at some point, not to mention the fact that they speak for themselves and not everyone that may have been offended/distressed by it.
I don't like when people basically say "he/she thought it was okay" as a means to hand wave something.
This is stressed a lot on here but in discussions like these people really must learn to read entire conversations before chipping in with their input. The poster I replied to told blatant lies about how those on the receiving end felt about it, presumably to make a point. Because apparently now; telling blatant lies just to back up a good cause is ok. I simply corrected them. If you look at my original post you would see I said these programmes can encourage bigoted views. But at the same time there was nothing ‘racially motivated’ by the Craig David and Mel B characters.
Unless you are whatever-his-name is, you wouldn't know that. You can hazard a guess, or form an opinion, but that's all you can do. You are basically arguing with the other poster (and now me) that you know his intentions (and Mel and Craig's feelings) better than either of us does....
Here's something for y'all to think about. Sometimes someone who has been abused, pretends that it's nothing for numerous reasons, such as not rocking the boat, not wanting to seem soft, etc... I saw your earlier post, but I'm commenting on this specific issue.
Alpa Chino is the only offending Black send-up in that movie. He’s a rapper with an energy drink line called Booty-Sweat ffs, he’s an absolute caricature.
Obviously that too was deliberate. The whole movie is great.
I just can’t even comprehend how stupid someone has to be to mention the blackface as offensive.
Couldn't find the original but this is just as good. Goodness Gracious Me was excellent.
Goodness gracious me is one of the best shows the UK has produced in the last few decades imo. The satire and the comedy in it is truly superb, even for someone not of south Asian descent. I think it is because, regardless of where you are from, many of the tropes and things they analyse and talk about, both about south Asian culture and their experiences within British culture, are very much transferrable over to other immigrants as well.
@Wolverine thanks for that link, I'll try to watch the full clip a bit later. From the short bit I've watched so far, Afua Hirsch speaks very well. And I know not related, but my god she is stunning.
Well yeah obviously it is an opinion, as I am not in their minds. But you can form a fairly decent idea by watching the show and by seeing what the victims said. The two characters being discussed haven’t been accused of being racist by Leigh Francis. The two characters didn’t adhere to any racial stereotypes and so it makes sense that neither did accuse him of such. The character in the show that did have racial undertones to it is the one I questioned and was the one where the victim spoke out about her feelings and the racial element to the character.
If you can't see the very obvious intersection between class antagonism and racism on Bo Selecta then you're either a bit dense or being wilfully ignorant. Neither is particularly helpful in the current climate.
That video made me really angry. Everytime she tries to speak she is met with exhasperation and interruption. Sat through and watched a couple of these videos and didn't even realise they were from 2018! Malone is a massive frothing closet racist.
You know what isn’t helpful in this current climate? Trying to constantly prove how anti racist and anti discriminating you are to the point that you create phantom arguments with people on the internet and are incapable of any form of reasonable debate or discussion. What makes this just really hilarious is my first post alludes to how shows like this did and encourage bigoted views, how I couldn’t believe the first show I mentioned managed to air only ten years ago.
BUT you became so fixated on the small print where I suggested two characters on one of the shows probably weren’t particularly racist.
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Anyway, I quit this thread a while ago for a reason.
There's a quote I read recently that was on point at the time, and is right now:
There's a quote I read recently that was on point at the time, and is right now:
No one owes you a dissertation explaining their humanity my guy.
Yes I think thats a fair point although I think that was a commentary on Hollywood's relationship with and exploitation of hip hop industry for commercialisation. Note that Alpa's interaction with Kirk Lazarus was as a "straight man" in comedy terms and throughout was horrified with Kirk staying in blackface character
"You're Australian! Be Australian! Excuse me, Kangaroo Jack!". I did enjoy that movie too yeah.
To be fair in Mel B's case i doubt she ever had a problem with Bo Selecta's parody of her. She was on the show when it originally aired and recently spoke of how excited she was to appear on a Bo Selecta special alongside Leigh Francis playing her with the mask on just a few months ago.
Ok, see my post prior to that one then....
What else would he do though?
Isn't the standard response from celebrities who have been called out to take to social media and issue a teary eyed apology, if some of their past work or social media posts are now considered problematic?
I mean he was still playing some of the characters (Mel B) in the mask for a Bo Selecta Xmas special just a few months ago.
And don't get me wrong fair play to him if the apology is sincere and he felt like he needed to make it. I actually like Leigh Francis but it seems like the vast majority of these apologies are down to PR reasons and/or social media pressure.
And what am i looking for? That it may have bothered her at some point? Well fair enough it may have, she was on the show in the early 2000's when it first aired so who knows.
I dont believe they are binning it, it will be unedited apart from a disclaimer like message at the beginning. I've seen it done I believe for plenty of cartoons, warner brothers and disney movies stating they might have outdated cultural depictions but the art is still there to consume.
Yeah I've seen that. It's a cop out. They could easily have put a similarly worded plaque in front of all the statues currently being torn down if you want to go down that route but they're not. You can't pick and choose at what is culturally acceptable otherwise it just becomes a joke....especially when it's old white guys making the decisions.
I mean its easier to digitally add a disclaimer before a movie I'd imagine compared to logistics of plaques for statues
And it sounds like whataboutery. Just because you're not righting all wrongs and can't do so doesn't mean you shouldn't right a few wrongs.
I think its a good thing that movies and art are being retained but private, independent platforms have decided that certain movies with their cultural depictions may not be in line with their ethos so they're saying this movie/TV series exists, this is the context we think it was made in. Some people might find it offensive but we think it has some redeeming qualities as art and still think its important to be shown despite having outdated humour etc.
I understand the concept of performative wokeness particularly because I doubt the execs at Netflix care much about being progressive but not sure I see why having that disclaimer is such an issue. Don't read it and just watch the stuff then.
And also these streaming platforms aren't a protective historical archive
This is a really good quote and it should give pause when going into a discussion about topics like this one.
Good post
There was a documentary on about it the other week and it was really good.
There were a lot of very good sketches in it, but the Delhi Mail was defo a classic.
nowt but a nice tile job
Where is this mosque?
Wow. That Nasir Al-Mulk mosque doesn't feck around.
I love arab architecture. there is more than one mosque converted to a church from inside like hagia sophia in istanbul or in cordova mosque in Spain. Not even the christian extremist from time ago could destroy such beautiful structures.
You’ve got Hagia Sophia the wrong way round. The few Christian mosaics you see today are all that’s left after the Ottomans conquered Constantinople and converted the main basilica into a mosque. They were uncovered during restoration work after Ataturk turned it into a museum in the 1920s. The other reason it might be confused for a (purpose built) mosque is that it was the inspiration for some of Sinan’s great mosques of the 16th century in the same city.
Oh my. You are right. Is an orthodox church. Not the most cultured guy around as you can see